• "I think women have vaginas; I think you call a person with a vagina a woman." Penny Arcade's Gabe s
    1,221 replies, posted
The guys getting death threats and the like over stating a simple opinion, and not even a discriminatory opinion. This social justice stuff is getting out of hand. If you can't peacefully coexist with someone who's opinion is different than yours, you need to get help.
[QUOTE=popbob;41121338]The guys getting death threats and the like over stating a simple opinion, and not even a discriminatory opinion. This social justice stuff is getting out of hand. If you can't peacefully coexist with someone who's opinion is different than yours, you need to get help.[/QUOTE] i'll be sure to tell the last part to the next person who kills someone due to transphobia
[QUOTE=Alex_DeLarge;41121095]Biological females have vaginas. You can identify with feminine traits and you can dress and act as a woman but it makes you a trans-woman. Not a woman. I fully support the trans-community and it sucks that people are really born as the wrong gender but this shit is getting out of hand.[/QUOTE] [sup][sup]It's[/sup] political[/sup] correctness[sub] gone[sub] mad![/sub][/sub]
[QUOTE=Skelmech;41121357]i'll be sure to tell the last part to the next person who kills someone due to transphobia[/QUOTE] Two wrong's don't make a right. Fighting extremism with extremism is about the stupidest thing possible and makes you look like a fool. The kind of people that would get violent over someone being gay/trans are slowly going away, but it takes time (and lots of it). The issue with racism (or women's rights) is a good comparison to make here, discrimination against these groups still isn't gone but is extremely isolated and very, very rare among communities. The same will happen with the LGBT movement in time.
[QUOTE=Skelmech;41121357]i'll be sure to tell the last part to the next person who kills someone due to transphobia[/QUOTE] "Hey these other guys do terrible shit, I guess that makes it completely okay for me to do terrible shit as well! Yay!"
[QUOTE=Skelmech;41121357]i'll be sure to tell the last part to the next person who kills someone due to transphobia[/QUOTE] How is sending death threats to random people on the Internet going to prevent murder?
[QUOTE=popbob;41121386]Two wrong's don't make a right. Fighting extremism with extremism is about the stupidest thing possible and makes you look like a fool. The kind of people that would get violent over someone being gay/trans are slowly going away, but it takes time (and lots of it). The issue with racism (or women's rights) is a good comparison to make here, discrimination against these groups still isn't gone but is extremely isolated and very, very rare among communities. The same will happen with the LGBT movement in time.[/QUOTE] you're right about that, two wrongs don't make a right, but your post seemed to imply that [QUOTE]If you can't peacefully coexist with someone who's opinion is different than yours, you need to get help.[/QUOTE] is just an issue that social justice people have. transphobes who hurt people are just as bad as any extremest
[QUOTE=Skelmech;41121414] is just an issue that social justice people have. transphobes who hurt people are just as bad as any extremest[/QUOTE] I didn't imply that at all, nor was I specifically saying it's only a problem among the people threatening this guy.
[QUOTE=mugofdoom;41121397]"Hey these other guys do terrible shit, I guess that makes it completely okay for me to do terrible shit as well! Yay!"[/QUOTE] Not what I said at all. [QUOTE=SPESSMEHREN;41121398]How is sending death threats to random people on the Internet going to prevent murder?[/QUOTE] It's not. Again that's not what I said
[QUOTE=Skelmech;41121357]i'll be sure to tell the last part to the next person who kills someone due to transphobia[/QUOTE] How often does that happen? Honestly. The majority of transgendered people are nice people that fit into society just fine. Then there's the extremely fucking loud and obnoxious minority that makes everyone look bad. I know many people (who I'd classify as friends of mine) who were born as men and identify as women and people accept their lifestyle. For the record, I live in Arizona, a red state where people are traveling all over and currently guarding a stain on the floor in an airport because apparently it resembles Jesus. [t]http://s1.ibtimes.com/sites/www.ibtimes.com/files/styles/v2_article_large/public/2013/06/17/jesus-face.jpg[/t] CD/TG people are just fine. The events you describe are few and far between.
[QUOTE=popbob;41121427]I didn't imply that at all, nor was I specifically saying it's only a problem among the people threatening this guy.[/QUOTE] Alright, Just came across to me that way then. My bad.
[QUOTE=Skelmech;41121428]Not what I said at all. It's not. Again that's not what I said[/QUOTE] Well, what did you say?
[QUOTE=Alex_DeLarge;41121095]Biological females have vaginas. You can identify with feminine traits and you can dress and act as a woman but it makes you a trans-woman. Not a woman. I fully support the trans-community and it sucks that people are really born as the wrong gender but this shit is getting out of hand.[/QUOTE] I know people seem to disagree here (makes sense since I imagine a thread like this is more likely to attract the 'supporters' in this case), but I have to agree with Alex's statement, from a purely technical perspective. I have no emotional or personal issues with people calling themselves what they like to undergoing any surgeries they feel they need to be comfortable with themselves, but biologically if you're born with a vagina, you're a woman. If you have your body modified to change from a male to a female, then yes you are technically a woman but still biologically a man. To say otherwise doesn't make it any less true, it just attempts to cover the fact. I would personally call a transvestite with a surgically enabled vagina a man still, and I would honestly expect them to be comfortable with that. I don't expect people to go out and wear a nametag that says "TECHNICALLY-WOMAN, BIOLOGICALLY-MAN" or anything silly like that, but I don't see any reason to have a go at Alex about affirming that clarification. Unless there's personal history between members here I'm not privy to?
[QUOTE=popbob;41121338]The guys getting death threats and the like over stating a simple opinion, and not even a discriminatory opinion. This social justice stuff is getting out of hand. If you can't peacefully coexist with someone who's opinion is different than yours, you need to get help.[/QUOTE] I seriously doubt he's going to be worried about the Tumblr social justice army having him killed.
noone even disagrees that biologically you are still a woman, we are talking about gender
[QUOTE=Skelmech;41121428]Not what I said at all.[/QUOTE] You defended the actions of people sending death threats by stating that transphobic people have killed transgender people in the past. I'm sorry if that's not what you implied, but you should really try to get your point across better if it isn't.
seems like a massive shitstorm in here. just gonna leave now.
[QUOTE=Alex_DeLarge;41121430]How often does that happen? Honestly. The majority of transgendered people are nice people that fit into society just fine. Then there's the extremely fucking loud and obnoxious minority that makes everyone look bad. I know many people (who I'd classify as friends of mine) who were born as men and identify as women and people accept their lifestyle. For the record, I live in Arizona, a red state where people are traveling all over and currently guarding a stain on the floor in an airport because apparently it resembles Jesus. [t]http://s1.ibtimes.com/sites/www.ibtimes.com/files/styles/v2_article_large/public/2013/06/17/jesus-face.jpg[/t] CD/TG people are just fine. The events you describe are few and far between.[/QUOTE] [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unlawfully_killed_transgender_people#2012"]T[/URL][URL="http://lexiecannes.wordpress.com/2012/12/15/trans-woman-killed-in-istanbul-street-suspect-taken-into-custody/"]r[/URL][URL="http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2013/mar/22/lucy-meadows-press-harassment?INTCMP=ILCNETTXT3487"]a[/URL][URL="http://lexiecannes.wordpress.com/2012/10/28/ten-trans-people-a-month-are-killed-in-brazil-the-stoning-of-madona-is-the-latest/"]n[/URL][URL="http://lexiecannes.wordpress.com/2012/11/18/lapd-says-western-bandit-killed-trans-woman-one-year-ago/"]s[/URL][URL="http://lexiecannes.wordpress.com/2012/10/25/another-trans-womans-throat-slashed-and-killed-in-antalyaturkey/"]p[/URL][URL="http://lexiecannes.wordpress.com/2012/03/28/transgender-or-perhaps-crossdressing-prostitute-killed-in-riviera-beach-florida/"]e[/URL][URL="http://lexiecannes.wordpress.com/2012/03/28/transgender-or-perhaps-crossdressing-prostitute-killed-in-riviera-beach-florida/"]o[/URL][URL="http://lexiecannes.wordpress.com/2012/05/01/kos-article-trans-woman-killed-in-oakland-no-one-cares-yup/"]p[/URL][URL="http://lexiecannes.wordpress.com/2012/05/01/kos-article-trans-woman-killed-in-oakland-no-one-cares-yup/"]l[/URL][URL="http://lexiecannes.wordpress.com/2012/03/14/mexican-transgender-leader-agnes-torres-tortured-killed/"]e[/URL] [URL="http://www.kctv5.com/story/16391527/violence-claims-lives-of-2-on-christmas-eve-night"]die[/URL] [URL="http://www.metroweekly.com/news/?ak=6435"]all[/URL] [URL="http://www.gayrva.com/news-views/councilman-murder-of-cleveland-transgender-woman-should-be-investigated-as-hate-crime/"]the [/URL][URL="http://www.advocate.com/news/news-features/2011/11/18/memoriam-2011s-transgender-murder-victims"]time[/URL]. (each letter of transpeople is a link, try them all out for yourself) [editline]20th June 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=mugofdoom;41121460]You defended the actions of people sending death threats by stating that transphobic people have killed transgender people in the past. I'm sorry if that's not what you implied, but you should really try to get your point across better if it isn't.[/QUOTE] Man apparently I have just fucked up getting my point across all day today No, I meant the last line could apply to either the radical extremeists sending him death threats or to transphobes who DO kill people. Sorry for the confusion [QUOTE=SPESSMEHREN;41121437]Well, what did you say?[/QUOTE] Above your quote would be my awnser
I am just going to ignore the shit-fuck of an argument in this thread and say that I would love an lp of this game with Stoya. Face cam bonus.
-automerge ffs-
[QUOTE=Sobek-;41121445]I know people seem to disagree here (makes sense since I imagine a thread like this is more likely to attract the 'supporters' in this case), but I have to agree with Alex's statement, from a purely technical perspective. I have no emotional or personal issues with people calling themselves what they like to undergoing any surgeries they feel they need to be comfortable with themselves, but biologically if you're born with a vagina, you're a woman. If you have your body modified to change from a male to a female, then yes you are technically a woman but still biologically a man. To say otherwise doesn't make it any less true, it just attempts to cover the fact. I would personally call a transvestite with a surgically enabled vagina a man still, and I would honestly expect them to be comfortable with that.[/QUOTE] Please see [URL="http://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1280420&p=41120377&viewfull=1#post41120377"]this post I made[/URL] for why that's wrong, IMO.
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;41121451]I seriously doubt he's going to be worried about the Tumblr social justice army having him killed.[/QUOTE] you seriously keep mentioning some stupid, metaphorical 'army'. at this rate, no one literally cares, stop parroting it
[QUOTE=Skelmech;41121509]Man apparently I have just fucked up getting my point across all day today No, I meant the last line could apply to either the radical extremeists sending him death threats or to transphobes who DO kill people. Sorry for the confusion[/QUOTE] No big, I actually completely agree with that now that you took the time to explain. Sorry if I came off as a dick.
[QUOTE=Alex_DeLarge;41121430]How often does that happen? Honestly. The majority of transgendered people are nice people that fit into society just fine.[/QUOTE] You do realize we have an entire day dedicated to counting the number of dead we have, right?
Sad to see misfits being taken in by a community of misfits, and then antagonizing misfits of another kind. Pathetic.
[QUOTE=mugofdoom;41121622]No big, I actually completely agree with that now that you took the time to explain. Sorry if I came off as a dick.[/QUOTE] Nah you're alright :)
[QUOTE=Skelmech;41121509][URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unlawfully_killed_transgender_people#2012"]T[/URL][URL="http://lexiecannes.wordpress.com/2012/12/15/trans-woman-killed-in-istanbul-street-suspect-taken-into-custody/"]r[/URL][URL="http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2013/mar/22/lucy-meadows-press-harassment?INTCMP=ILCNETTXT3487"]a[/URL][URL="http://lexiecannes.wordpress.com/2012/10/28/ten-trans-people-a-month-are-killed-in-brazil-the-stoning-of-madona-is-the-latest/"]n[/URL][URL="http://lexiecannes.wordpress.com/2012/11/18/lapd-says-western-bandit-killed-trans-woman-one-year-ago/"]s[/URL][URL="http://lexiecannes.wordpress.com/2012/10/25/another-trans-womans-throat-slashed-and-killed-in-antalyaturkey/"]p[/URL][URL="http://lexiecannes.wordpress.com/2012/03/28/transgender-or-perhaps-crossdressing-prostitute-killed-in-riviera-beach-florida/"]e[/URL][URL="http://lexiecannes.wordpress.com/2012/03/28/transgender-or-perhaps-crossdressing-prostitute-killed-in-riviera-beach-florida/"]o[/URL][URL="http://lexiecannes.wordpress.com/2012/05/01/kos-article-trans-woman-killed-in-oakland-no-one-cares-yup/"]p[/URL][URL="http://lexiecannes.wordpress.com/2012/05/01/kos-article-trans-woman-killed-in-oakland-no-one-cares-yup/"]l[/URL][URL="http://lexiecannes.wordpress.com/2012/03/14/mexican-transgender-leader-agnes-torres-tortured-killed/"]e[/URL] [URL="http://www.kctv5.com/story/16391527/violence-claims-lives-of-2-on-christmas-eve-night"]die[/URL] [URL="http://www.metroweekly.com/news/?ak=6435"]all[/URL] [URL="http://www.gayrva.com/news-views/councilman-murder-of-cleveland-transgender-woman-should-be-investigated-as-hate-crime/"]the [/URL][URL="http://www.advocate.com/news/news-features/2011/11/18/memoriam-2011s-transgender-murder-victims"]time[/URL]. (each letter of transpeople is a link, try them all out for yourself) [/QUOTE] That's a lot of people and I feel bad for every individual case. Surprising because I would think if people were that bigoted, it'd be happening here but these cases are one of a hundred thousand. When I say that's a pretty good ratio, I am not discrediting any of these stories. They're all awful tragedies but the reality is people are going to be killed when they're different from everyone else. Most we can do is educate people about gender identity and maybe in a hundred or so years, things like this won't happen but the social justice blogs on tumblr aren't going to make a difference, Patricia Hernandez' articles on Kotaku and bitching on twitter won't either.
[QUOTE=Alex_DeLarge;41121656]but the reality is people are going to be killed when they're different from everyone else. [/QUOTE] Do I even need to say anything when you've reached this point? Do you not realize how fucking terrible that sounds? I've had friends who have been assaulted for who they are, and you [b]dare[/b] to dismiss this stuff because "lol shit's gonna happen".
those are terrible morals to go by almost as bad as saying we should just 'abort' newborns. What the hell is wrong with you?
[QUOTE=QueenSasha24;41121684]Do I even need to say anything at this point? Do you not realize how fucking terrible that sounds? I've had friends who have been assaulted for who they are, and you [b]dare[/b] to dismiss this stuff because "lol shit's gonna happen".[/QUOTE] I'm not dismissing it. I'm being realistic. Now you can continue making me to the bad guy for saying what no one wants to hear or you can accept the reality of the situation that there are bigoted assholes out there and posting on Facepunch/Tumblr/Twitter isn't going to do a goddamn thing to stop it. Also thanks for taking that snippet out of my post where I'm supporting TS/CD people.
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