[QUOTE=proch;47243212]Your view of the world seems to be a bit narrow :v:[/QUOTE]
Not really, there are good and shitty places in Russia just like there are good and shitty places everywhere else in the world.
It only irks me because this forum is full of pseudo intellectuals who laugh at Russian website commentators and similar people while not realizing they're literally their mirrored version. Russophobia on this forum and intolerance of anything apart from extreme liberalism is astounding.
[QUOTE=Explosions;47243218]Instant whataboutism: brought to you by your local Facepunch Russia supporter.[/QUOTE]
Instant not knowing what's the purpose of whataboutism: brought to you by another armchair intellectual. Whataboutism would be a fallacy if I actually claimed that Russia wasn't corrupted, my stance is that US is just as shitty as Russia.
Whatever, I might as well stop posting because FP has proven time and time again that it's not a place for discussion; it's a place for bandwagoning and circlejerking.
[QUOTE=Spirit_Breaker;47243225]Not really, there are good and shitty places in Russia just like there are good and shitty places everywhere else in the world.
It only irks me because this forum is full of pseudo intellectuals who laugh at Russian website commentators and similar people while not realizing they're literally their mirrored version. Russophobia on this forum and intolerance of anything apart from extreme liberalism is astounding.[/QUOTE]
Im not Russophobia, its more of the fact that your President is a complete Douche bag and your government at the moment is really sucking, i would actually love to go to Russia someday,
[QUOTE=Deathtrooper2;47243241]Im not Russophobia, its more of the fact that your President is a complete Douche bag and your government at the moment is really sucking, i would actually love to go to Russia someday,[/QUOTE]
The stereotypes are real
[QUOTE=Spirit_Breaker;47243199]I never claimed that so stop putting words in my mouth because[/QUOTE]
So why did you make a point of stating that the protestors made up 0.15% of Moscow's population?
[QUOTE=Spirit_Breaker;47243199]you have such a huge [b]Putin[/b] hate boner.[/QUOTE]
Fixed.
[QUOTE=Spirit_Breaker;47243199]Read above, it still doesn't change the fact that his approval rate is huge[/QUOTE]
[citation needed]
[QUOTE=Spirit_Breaker;47243199]and not like there are any better solutions for the Russians when they're being pressured from all sides anyway.[/QUOTE]
Such as?
[QUOTE=Spirit_Breaker;47243225]Instant not knowing what's the purpose of whataboutism: brought to you by another armchair intellectual. Whataboutism would be a fallacy if I actually claimed that Russia wasn't corrupted, my stance is that US is just as shitty as Russia.[/QUOTE]
No actually you don't understand what the word means. I guess that you're correct in that you didn't technically use a whataboutism because you didn't point to an asinine and unrelated issue in the US or Europe. Instead, you just went with a straight tu quoque by saying "the US is also corrupt." My bad.
[QUOTE=Spirit_Breaker;47243225] US is just as shitty as Russia.[/QUOTE]
While US is no heaven, it is a thousand times better than Russia. To say they're equally as bad is the same ignorance you seem to claim upon others.
I don't understand what Obama had to do with this thread to begin with tbh.
[QUOTE=Spirit_Breaker;47243225]my stance is that US is just as shitty as Russia.[/QUOTE]
Which is why people are immigrating to the USA, while people are emigrating from Russia?
[QUOTE=Snickerdoodle;47243266]I don't understand what Obama had to do with this thread to begin with tbh.[/QUOTE]
Because the only way people have been able to defend Russia for decades is to fallaciously draw comparisons to other countries/situation in order to make Russia look not as bad, rather than actually defending Russia outright. So rather than defend Putin, Spirit Breaker brings up Obama to deflect attention and make Putin look less worse by comparison.
[QUOTE=Snickerdoodle;47243266]I don't understand what Obama had to do with this thread to begin with tbh.[/QUOTE]
Nothing spiritbreaker was just making pointless diversions
[QUOTE=Explosions;47243218]Instant whataboutism: brought to you by your local Facepunch Russia supporter.[/QUOTE]
I knew someone would start carping about this.
He said why do people find it hard to believe Putin has high approval ratings.
Someone said it is because Russia is corrupt.
How does that make it hard to believe? Does a corrupt government mean the people are more likely to report that they approve of their government?
He said there are other countries just as corrupt, they don't have the same patterns of approval rating. Why then is corruption being cited as a reason for his high approval rating.
"whataboutism" has become a meme here, repeated by every brain dead poster who thinks they know about politics and the world. Truth is if the news didn't tell you to dislike Russia and instead the US/your self own self serving government endorsed them chances are you'd be singing a whole different tune.
Merkel had an approval rating of 64%. The Levada (which reported Putin's popularity to be 80+) recently reported his popularity to be 61%. Do you doubt the 61%? If so, then do you doubt the 64%? If yes then why? because its Russia and you've failed to discard your bias.
It has dropped from the recent events and the level reported is BELOW that of a politician in a country, I assume, you won't question the approval rating for. Putin did lots of his country when it was on the rise.
When capitalism was brought to Russia people lost jobs or worked for no pay, they went hungry, they saw assets being robbed they saw gangsters take over and oligarchs rule the stage, Putin has at least made the living conditions better, increased average pay, higher GDP, higher growth. Sure it might be from oil but it gets attributed to him, that only with a pretty heavy PR campaign of him on a horse with a rifle/doing sports stuff/cuddling animals has helped push his approval super high.
Just because they are corrupt doesn't mean 80+ approval isn't a possibility.
Will you please shut the fuck up chirping and quoting other peoples posts and make up something original. Someone should be a "facepunch" circle jerk bot. Sampled from posts like yours.
Whataboutism is pretty much referring to the long and old argument that "criticizing what this country does is bad, because all of these other places are bad/just as bad".
When people criticized the Soviet Union for cracking down on free speech, a common rebuttal would be "what about racism in the USA". When criticized for invading Afghanistan, a counterargument would point to the bay of pigs or Pinochet or Nicaragua. People with low living standards? Just point to the homeless in America. It didn't work out in the end, because when push came to shove, nobody was shot trying to climb over the wall into East Berlin.
Today, the intervention in Ukraine and annexation of Crimea is justified because "The Americans/EU supported a coup", or that NATO is expanding east and hemming in Russia. In the end it's still a bullshit argument. Just because America are imperialistic, does not justify Russia being imperialistic.
[QUOTE=Deng;47243414]Whataboutism is pretty much referring to the long and old argument that "criticizing what this country does is bad, because all of these other places are bad/just as bad".
When people criticized the Soviet Union for cracking down on free speech, a common rebuttal would be "what about racism in the USA". When criticized for invading Afghanistan, a counterargument would point to the bay of pigs or Pinochet or Nicaragua. People with low living standards? Just point to the homeless in America. It didn't work out in the end, because when push came to shove, nobody was shot trying to climb over the wall into East Berlin.
Today, the intervention in Ukraine and annexation of Crimea is justified because "The Americans/EU supported a coup", or that NATO is expanding east and hemming in Russia. In the end it's still a bullshit argument. Just because America are imperialistic, does not justify Russia being imperialistic.[/QUOTE]
Absoluetely. The best argument against this whataboutism is this: yes, the US is imperialistic and corrupt and has oligarchic influence. Guess what? That's bad too! So why the fuck would anyone offer that up as a comparison that somehow absolves Russia? If anything, bringing up that comparison is an admission of Russia's problems, not a defense.
nah
call me when it's "millions in Moscow chant"
[QUOTE=damnatus;47243573]nah
call me when it's "millions in Moscow chant"[/QUOTE]
There could be, but most won't dare to do so.
[QUOTE=Deathtrooper2;47243579]There could be, but most won't dare to do so.[/QUOTE]
tbf while most of what spirit_breaker says is garbage, putin does really have a high approval rate and many supporters among the general population because he fixed the absolute disaster that was the russian economy after yeltsin.
but now that he's running russia's economy back into the dirt you can bet many russians will start changing their minds.
[QUOTE=Dr. Gestapo;47243634]tbf while most of what spirit_breaker says is garbage, putin does really have a high approval rate and many supporters among the general population because he fixed the absolute disaster that was the russian economy after yeltsin.
but now that he's running russia's economy back into the dirt you can bet many russians will start changing their minds.[/QUOTE]
And some have. The same poll which reported 80+ popularity is now reporting 61. Less than Merkel had at one point.
Which is why the idiot quoting "corruption" as the reason for it being 80+ (how?) is wrong.
Rather convenient that CCTV cameras and the OMON guards on the bridge were gone when he was killed.
[url]https://news.vice.com/article/russia-says-security-cameras-werent-pointing-at-nemtsov-shooting-but-bloggers-photo-suggests-they-were[/url]
[QUOTE=Dr. Gestapo;47243634]tbf while most of what spirit_breaker says is garbage, putin does really have a high approval rate and many supporters among the general population because he fixed the absolute disaster that was the russian economy after yeltsin.
but now that he's running russia's economy back into the dirt you can bet many russians will start changing their minds.[/QUOTE]
Well yes, because during the mid 2000's, he actually recreated the Russian economy and basically helped improve it over all. But like what you said, he is basically turning it back into the dirt like it was before. It looks more like the corrupt politicians want it to go back to the 90s where they controlled almost everything.
Why do you even care about this. Parading and chanting won't change anything.
I don't get how Russian posters can claim the USA is just as corrupt as Russia. I don't remember the last time an opposition politician got murdered in the streets of DC, do you?
Dont get the wrong idea here guys, It was clearly an CIA Coup !!
[QUOTE=Kybalt;47243784]I don't get how Russian posters can claim the USA is just as corrupt as Russia. I don't remember the last time an opposition politician got murdered in the streets of DC, do you?[/QUOTE]
I mean it has definitely happened before (MLK) but that's hardly a representation of modern America.
[QUOTE=antianan;47243782]Why do you even care about this. Parading and chanting won't change anything.[/QUOTE]
Bullshit ya it will.
[QUOTE=OvB;47243090]Thousands in Moscow die in random murder.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Lordgeorge16;47243104]No, that's too obvious.
They all become unpersons and get deported to Siberia. Any trace of news of the event in Russia is deleted. Nothing ever happened, life continues as normal in glorious motherland.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=draugur;47243118]Next week: Russia Today reports largest counter terrorism operation in Russia a success over a thousand terrorists arrested.[/QUOTE]
No no no, you've got it all wrong. I can see it now: "Unprovoked airstrike kills 1000. Satellite photos show Ukranian fighter in action."
[img]http://i.imgur.com/MboGeNV.png[/img]
[QUOTE=antianan;47243782]Why do you even care about this. Parading and chanting won't change anything.[/QUOTE]
So be silent and just accept the way things are? What?
[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;47243651]And some have. The same poll which reported 80+ popularity is now reporting 61. Less than Merkel had at one point.
Which is why the idiot quoting "corruption" as the reason for it being 80+ (how?) is wrong.[/QUOTE]
they were saying it was corruption that caused the high approval rating because the approval rating was faked, not that the people love the corruption
Putins popularity is more down to luck than actual ability I think.
Given that all of the shit that happened with Yeltsin before he drank himself to death, it wasn't exactly hard for Putin to look better by comparison, sell off the oil and natural resources, etc. As long as commodity prices were high, things are looking good.
Unfortunately he didn't do any really deep reforms to make the economy robust, and now it only takes a few limp wristed sanctions and the price of oil to drop for Russia to enter an economic crisis.
as a russian this makes me so fucking happy
maybe things ARE going to change after all
[QUOTE=Spirit_Breaker;47243086]Hundreds of thousands of Americans have been chanting "USA without Obama" for years. Doesn't really mean a fucking thing.[/QUOTE]
Weird how being publicly against Obama (who hasn't been exploiting loopholes to stay in term longer than legally allowed) doesn't result in being murdered in the street.
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