[QUOTE=Ond kaja;35469547]Finland is in the process of restricting its gun laws since they've had a couple of public shootings.[/quote]
They have still had more lax gun laws than Sweden.
[quote]Even if you find an article that still doesn't prove that you can't defend yourself, or are you claiming that the law of Sweden does not apply?[/Quote]
I have found it and edited my post accordingly; why don't you read through it and form something to say about that? Or can't you? wouldn't surprise me.
[quote]Because the right-wing government we currently have want to lower the taxes, which means they have to cut down on the welfare.[/quote]
There are no true right wing parties in the riksdag, except perhaps SD, but even then, that's a stretch.
Even so, the UK has [b]FREE[/b] health care, something which we have always had to pay for here, irregardless of the government, and they also seem to be able to take care of things far better than they do here.
[quote]Yes, firstly there is this WHO report that indicates that alcohol consumtion in countries with more restricted alcohol laws (Sweden/Norway) is less. ([url]http://www.who.int/substance_abuse/publications/global_alcohol_report/msbgsruprofiles.pdf[/url])
A research group sponsored by the WHO concluded that government monopsony and taxation on alcohol reduced its consumption. (Babor et al., 2003)
Your statement about the government losing "billion" of money from the monopsony is far from a fact (source, by the way? Billions, really?). And even if it were true, monetising on people's addiction to alcohol is very destructive. Systembolaget was not founded to bring in money to the state, that's quite far from its purpose.[/quote]
You still fail to take into account all alcohol that gets taken in from other EU countries. Let us do some quick math;
Let us say that 10,000 people, a rough estimate but conservative, buy 300 cases of beer on each trip to Germany. 10,000 * 300 = 3,000,000 cases of beer; one case of beer at Systembolaget costs about 400 SEK, 3,000,000 * 400 = 1,200,000,000 SEK in lost revenue. You are already over a billion SEK, and that is not even counting the hard liquor, which ups it even more. This is cash that the state never sees anything of; but that they still feel the effect of.
[quote]Lagrådet did reach the conclusion that neither of those laws are against the constitution, I wonder who has more legitimacy in this issue, some random neo-liberal on an internet forum looking for evidence to back up his claims in evening newspapers or a congress of educated jurists.[/quote]
And here we go, starting with assumptions. First up; you assume that these are actually un-biased, which I sincerely doubt they are as they are a branch of the government = they want to push through the laws the government wants.
Second up, I am not a neo-liberal, I am more Center-Right wing if you absolutely need to know. All you need to do is read through the constitution of Sweden; And your precious EU regarding human rights and so forth.
[quote]I was thinking that maybe you should move to the middle of nowhere? You won't have to worry about taxes, strict gun regulations, strict regulations on alcohol and tobacco ever again.[/QUOTE]
I am moving to the UK because I like the country; the fact that they may have high taxes also means that they can at least provide a proper health care in which you do not have to pay for, unlike here, amongst other things. You're just starting to sound desperate with your personal attacks, so I do not see any reason to continue arguing with you, as you are clearly incapable of keeping personal attacks out of this. I also have by far better things to do than to sit here and argue about just how bad the country is.
[QUOTE=The fox;35469944]They have still had more lax gun laws than Sweden.[/quote]Guns were too easily accessible, even mentally unstable people such as Pekka-Eric Auvinen could get a gun. That is a consequence of lax gun legislation and something I don't want to see coming to Sweden.
[quote]
I have found it and edited my post accordingly; why don't you read through it and form something to say about that? Or can't you? wouldn't surprise me.[/quote]Are you seriously basing your claim that you will be charged for assault if you defend yourself on an article that is five sentences long? Honestly, the article does not even inform the reader what the rationale the prosecutor had for indicting the defender. And most importantly, [b]according to the article this is a processing case, meaning that no sentences has been given yet, the court has yet to decide if the man who defended his wife is guilty or not[/b]. Yeah, I have something to say about that; it's an astoundingly pathetic attempt to back up your claims.
[quote]
There are no true right wing parties in the riksdag, except perhaps SD, but even then, that's a stretch.
[/quote]I didn't say right wing as in socially conservative. The parties' stance on social issues is irrelevant in this context, we have an ECONOMICALLY conservative government, meaning they endorse economically conservative measures to economical problems, such as lowering taxes, downsizing welfare, privatising companies etc.
[quote]
Even so, the UK has [b]FREE[/b] health care, something which we have always had to pay for here, irregardless of the government, and they also seem to be able to take care of things far better than they do here.[/quote]That might be true, however it does not combat my point. Nowhere did I say our welfare systems are impeccable in any way. More importantly, how would lower taxes fix our problems with health care (which have increased since the shift of government in 2006)? I would advocate other measures ensuring the quality of general welfare.
[quote]
You still fail to take into account all alcohol that gets taken in from other EU countries. Let us do some quick math;
<baseless assumptions; ironically coming from the person who criticised me for making assumptions>[/quote]
Yet another pathetic attempt trying to justify your points. [b]This equation assumes that running Systembolaget is completely free;[/b] no costs for personell, no costs for buying the alcohol which they then sell, no costs for hiring premises etc. This equation also fails to back up numbers presented, you're just assuming that 10,000 people buy 300 cases of cheap beer somewhere else in Europe, no sources presented; completely unbased.
[quote]
And here we go, starting with assumptions. First up; you assume that these are actually un-biased, which I sincerely doubt they are as they are a branch of the government = they want to push through the laws the government wants.[/quote]Lagrådet [b]does not push laws, they review them[/b]. Furthermore, Lagrådet is apolitical, meaning that the members aren't appointed politically (via parties), and lastly the government does not have to follow Lagrådet's advice since it's not binding in any way. Yet again you're criticising me for making assumptions but you make them yourself, you assume that Lagrådet is corrupted, again without any backing.
[quote]
Second up, I am not a neo-liberal, I am more Center-Right wing if you absolutely need to know. All you need to do is read through the constitution of Sweden; And your precious EU regarding human rights and so forth.[/quote]I don't care about your self-identified political stance. And I won't guess what you may or may not mean when you say that the laws the government has passed is breaking the constitution, you have to argue for that yourself.
[quote]
I am moving to the UK because I like the country; the fact that they may have high taxes also means that they can at least provide a proper health care in which you do not have to pay for, unlike here, amongst other things. You're just starting to sound desperate with your personal attacks, so I do not see any reason to continue arguing with you, as you are clearly incapable of keeping personal attacks out of this.[/QUOTE]Good. I can't be bothered arguing with someone that seldom backs up any claims he does, and when he does he throws an irrelevant five sentenced article at me. I'm glad we could mutally agree to not discuss this any further.
[QUOTE=johan svensk;35468297]You are not racist just because you want your government to accept less immigrants into the country. For Sweden it's just common sense.[/QUOTE]
[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malm%C3%B6_shootings[/url]
The Swedish Democrats, which hold seats, are pretty famous for refusing to condemn these shootings. They also are social conservative, racist pricks who want to deport all the Sami.
The Swedish Democrats also participate in fascist Salem March, which, every year, is outnumbered by Antifa.
[QUOTE=The fox;35467709]We also take in 100,000 immigrants each year, and can barely give work to 10% of them all.[/QUOTE]
uh but sweden has a 7.5% unemployment rate.
and apparently 5% of Swedes are unemployed since 2006 which means 341,830 swedish people (non-immigrants) are unemployed, and that's all based on numbers given by your own government.
[QUOTE=The fox;35469944]They have still had more lax gun laws than Sweden.
I have found it and edited my post accordingly; why don't you read through it and form something to say about that? Or can't you? wouldn't surprise me.
There are no true right wing parties in the riksdag, except perhaps SD, but even then, that's a stretch.
Even so, the UK has [b]FREE[/b] health care, something which we have always had to pay for here, irregardless of the government, and they also seem to be able to take care of things far better than they do here.
You still fail to take into account all alcohol that gets taken in from other EU countries. Let us do some quick math;
Let us say that 10,000 people, a rough estimate but conservative, buy 300 cases of beer on each trip to Germany. 10,000 * 300 = 3,000,000 cases of beer; one case of beer at Systembolaget costs about 400 SEK, 3,000,000 * 400 = 1,200,000,000 SEK in lost revenue. You are already over a billion SEK, and that is not even counting the hard liquor, which ups it even more. This is cash that the state never sees anything of; but that they still feel the effect of.
And here we go, starting with assumptions. First up; you assume that these are actually un-biased, which I sincerely doubt they are as they are a branch of the government = they want to push through the laws the government wants.
Second up, I am not a neo-liberal, I am more Center-Right wing if you absolutely need to know. All you need to do is read through the constitution of Sweden; And your precious EU regarding human rights and so forth.
I am moving to the UK because I like the country; the fact that they may have high taxes also means that they can at least provide a proper health care in which you do not have to pay for, unlike here, amongst other things. You're just starting to sound desperate with your personal attacks, so I do not see any reason to continue arguing with you, as you are clearly incapable of keeping personal attacks out of this. I also have by far better things to do than to sit here and argue about just how bad the country is.[/QUOTE]
I personally think you should keep quiet and drop the topic. You are arguing about gun laws that are designed to [B]protect[/B] people not harm them. You are criticizing the country based on it's alcohol laws, gun laws and surveillance laws. To be honest I think you are over-reacting. Systembolaget has one of the largest variety in the world when it comes to alcohol. Like I said before, the gun laws are supposed to [B]protect[/B] you. What if Sweden made guns easier to obtain and some psychopath gets hold of one and shoots innocent people? The whole point of the laws is to prevent crime and make people stop worrying about being mugged on the streets or something. Sweden does not want it to become like America where in some areas you have to walk around with a gun in fear of being jumped. And you are talking about the surveillance here and you want to move to the UK because of it? You are seriously retarded, the UK has security cameras [B]everywhere[/B], in fact, there is 14 CCTV cameras per person in the United Kingdom.
You sound like a typical SD idiot to be honest. You're taking your facts from evening newspapers like Aftonbladet and over-exaggerating them. You say that the police is under-staffed, you know why? Because we have the gun laws in place that regulate the guns so that the police don't have to. You are living in the safest country in the world due to these laws so I suggest you shut the fuck up and take your stupid opinions to a forum that is centered around these kind of things like Flashback.
Guns, guns, guns, guns... learn martial arts and quit depending your life on guns/knives.
[QUOTE=johan svensk;35468297]You are not racist just because you want your government to accept less immigrants into the country. For Sweden it's just common sense.[/QUOTE]
What about Britain? Or am I now suddenly racist?
[QUOTE=LeonS;35469099]hi im an immigrant in sweden :)
and you SD voters can go suck a fuck[/QUOTE]
How about giving them a good argument instead of personal attacks?
Hating people based on what political party they vote for is one of the stupidest things I have ever seen. I personally think that SD has many retarded views and that they are highly unproffessional( seriously they should reeeeaaaalllyyy fire their PR guy) but, personal attacks and hating on them because of their political opinions are not going to change anything.
There's a bunch of countries unwilling to cut 3rd world development money. It's pretty weird because while their economy suffers they send billions to some faraway land in which not even half is used properly.
If you're Swedish and you want a party that has your views to win i recommend not voting for any party in the current Riksdag. Unless if you vote for SD.
Pretty much if you vote for any of the two real liberal parties in the riksdag you're either gonna get socialists or conservatives actually controlling the country.
Seems like Miljöpartiet would be the way to go though, soon they might even become one of the biggest parties.
[QUOTE=FPChris;35473799]If you're Swedish and you want a party that has your views to win i recommend not voting for any party in the current Riksdag. Unless if you vote for SD.
Pretty much if you vote for any of the two real liberal parties in the riksdag you're either gonna get socialists or conservatives actually controlling the country.
[b]Seems like Miljöpartiet would be the way to go though[/b], soon they might even become one of the biggest parties.[/QUOTE]
Ha!
[QUOTE=FPChris;35473799]If you're Swedish and you want a party that has your views to win i recommend not voting for any party in the current Riksdag. Unless if you vote for SD.
Pretty much if you vote for any of the two real liberal parties in the riksdag you're either gonna get socialists or conservatives actually controlling the country.
Seems like Miljöpartiet would be the way to go though, soon they might even become one of the biggest parties.[/QUOTE]
Well Miljöpartiet already is the third biggest party, and them overtaking the Social Democrats or the Moderates is not very realistic, at least not in the near future.
[QUOTE=FPChris;35473799]If you're Swedish and you want a party that has your views to win i recommend not voting for any party in the current Riksdag. Unless if you vote for SD.
Pretty much if you vote for any of the two real liberal parties in the riksdag you're either gonna get socialists or conservatives actually controlling the country.
Seems like Miljöpartiet would be the way to go though, soon they might even become one of the biggest parties.[/QUOTE]
Doesn't sound that bad if you're Socialist or Conservative. Sure you might not have government control but at least you're represented rather than herded into some big tent party.
[QUOTE=ZombieDawgs;35473129]What about Britain? Or am I now suddenly racist?[/QUOTE]
ugh
if you have to assert how racist you aren't, you're probably racist.
[QUOTE=Ond kaja;35469547]Finland is in the process of restricting its gun laws since they've had a couple of public shootings.[/QUOTE]Incorrect. Constitutional law committee determined no additional legislation is required. Police shouldn't have given them licences in the first place i.e. there were clear signs they were batshit crazy (almost certainly in Matti Juhani Saari's case, can't remember if that was the case for Pekka-Eric Auvinen off the top of my head) even before shooting that the police missed.
Finnish government has dropped objections to a potential EU directive of restricting all firearms to 18 and above, whereas in Finland someone of the age of 15 and above can shoot with parental observation. The shooters were 18 and 22, so I personally don't see that change making a difference.
[QUOTE=Sgt Doom;35480181]Incorrect. Constitutional law committee determined no additional legislation is required. Police shouldn't have given them licences in the first place i.e. there were clear signs they were batshit crazy (almost certainly in Matti Juhani Saari's case, can't remember if that was the case for Pekka-Eric Auvinen off the top of my head) even before shooting that the police missed.
Finnish government has dropped objections to a potential EU directive of restricting all firearms to 18 and above, whereas in Finland someone of the age of 15 and above can shoot with parental observation. The shooters were 18 and 22, so I personally don't see that change making a difference.[/QUOTE]
Okay, I was a bit unupdated then. Fact is still that tighter gun laws were being pushed for prior to the Constitutional Law Committee's decision.
[QUOTE=gamefreek76;35468611]All the beer and tits you could ever want.[/QUOTE]
More liquor than booze I reckon, Scandinavian countries in general tend to drink a lot more liquors than beer, although we enjoy that a lot too.
[editline]8th April 2012[/editline]
Politics these days confuse me, I have absolutely no idea what parties are actually trying to make our country better and what parties are just trying to fuck over as many people as possible.
[QUOTE=FPChris;35473799]
Seems like Miljöpartiet would be the way to go though, soon they might even become one of the biggest parties.[/QUOTE]
not really
rich people vote moderaterna to get more money
not so rich people vote socialdemokraterna to get more money
they're both shit
[QUOTE=FPChris;35473799]If you're Swedish and you want a party that has your views to win i recommend not voting for any party in the current Riksdag. Unless if you vote for SD.
Pretty much if you vote for any of the two real liberal parties in the riksdag you're either gonna get socialists or conservatives actually controlling the country.
Seems like Miljöpartiet would be the way to go though, soon they might even become one of the biggest parties.[/QUOTE]
Miljöpartiet are a bunch of fucking ingrates who have never been outside Södermalm, which is why they earnestly advocate shutting down the nuclear power plants, dismantling border security and building an economy around the self-described "creative class", journalists, artists, writers et al.
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