Veteran Zoo director defends killing his gorilla Harambe, says he would "still kill Harambe" today - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Yahnich;50429916]you'd be surprised how much kids want to kill themselves, it can take literally 3s of looking somewhere else and the spawn of your loins is sticking its fingers in an eletrical outlet[/QUOTE] As a father of two I can vouch for this.

The mother did indeed make a horrible mistake, but I think people are pushing this gorilla thing WAY too far. The fact that people even think that the life of a child is worth less than a GORILLA just makes me lose faith in society even more.

Maybe instead of complaining they shot the Gorilla, they should be complaining the Zoo's safety systems were so shit a child could fall into the enclosure in the first place. But no, that might require logical thought and it's easier to bitch about the past instead of working towards a better future.

This sort of social justice phenomenon where people resort to harassment at mass is one of the things I hate the most about people and I'm not sure if there's an effective way of fighting it.

What type of degenerate trash do you have to be to value a child's life less than a goddamn animal.

[QUOTE=Starpluck;50429640]-lots of online harassment stuff-[/QUOTE] You know. A while back, maybe 5+ years or so I thought the internet was a pretty shitty place. I liked it, but I admitted that it was pretty hostile. There were hackers, phishing scams, random harassment for kicks etc etc. But this has just gone to hell. Internet seems safer than ever the more mainstream it's become, but this kind of shit just seems to get more and more intense. If you end up in public light you will be fucking drowned through every channel with the worst harassment some idiots can figure out to put you through. And it's so fucking disgusting.

[QUOTE=MrJazzy;50430335]This sort of social justice phenomenon where people resort to harassment at mass is one of the things I hate the most about people and I'm not sure if there's an effective way of fighting it.[/QUOTE] Well nothing quite helps someone get over watching their child almost die like getting harassed by nameless hordes.

Betting all the people harrassing the family would kill an animal themselves if it had just casualy bit them.

[QUOTE=Starpluck;50429870]We have our very own on Facepunch (and many more in the other thread saying there is no justification to choose killing the endangered gorilla over the kid)[/QUOTE] Good job quoting my post out of context. I never said that there was no justification to kill the gorilla to ensure the safety of the child. You're creating a false dichotomy here: it's not "kill the gorilla and save the child" or "save the gorilla and let the child die". There's a third option called "tranquillise the gorilla at the risk of it becoming violent and injuring/killing the child before it succumbs to the sedative". I think that's an option worth considering if the animal was particularly rare.

[QUOTE=Headhumpy;50430446]Good job quoting my post out of context. I never said that there was no justification to kill the gorilla to ensure the safety of the child. You're creating a false dichotomy here: it's not "kill the gorilla and save the child" or "save the gorilla and let the child die". There's a third option called "tranquillise the gorilla at the risk of it becoming violent and injuring/killing the child before it succumbs to the sedative". I think that's an option worth considering if the animal was particularly rare.[/QUOTE] That third option would most likely lead to both the animal and child's death. The child, because you shot a fucking hypodermic needle into what's holding onto him, is now at the mercy of an animal with 3-6 times the strength of a human being with just as big of a temperament. By the time the sedative would kick in, the child could have been killed or severely injured, then it would come down to killing the gorilla anyway.

[QUOTE=jiggu;50430374]You know. A while back, maybe 5+ years or so I thought the internet was a pretty shitty place. I liked it, but I admitted that it was pretty hostile. There were hackers, phishing scams, random harassment for kicks etc etc. But this has just gone to hell. Internet seems safer than ever the more mainstream it's become, but this kind of shit just seems to get more and more intense. If you end up in public light you will be fucking drowned through every channel with the worst harassment some idiots can figure out to put you through. And it's so fucking disgusting.[/QUOTE] social media is what enables this kind of behavior

[QUOTE=purvisdavid1;50430515]That third option would most likely lead to both the animal and child's death. The child, because you shot a fucking hypodermic needle into what's holding onto him, is now at the mercy of an animal with 3-6 times the strength of a human being with just as big of a temperament. By the time the sedative would kick in, the child could have been killed or severely injured, then it would come down to killing the gorilla anyway.[/QUOTE] Jeff Corwin echoed similar sentiments in the OP. [quote]Tranquilising a large animal is not instant, he said. It could take many minutes and require multiple darts.[/quote] Gorilla's do not react kindly to having several mini-knives jabbed into them. [editline]31st May 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=No_0ne;50430546]social media is what enables this kind of behavior[/QUOTE] That is like saying "the internet enables this kind of behavior" but that might get in the way of you and everyone elses irrational disdain for social media.

[QUOTE=Starpluck;50430579] That is like saying "the internet enables this kind of behavior" but that might get in the way of you and everyone elses irrational disdain for social media.[/QUOTE] i have no serious beef with social media, just saying that it provides an easy vector for harassment and death threats, so these witch hunts end up happening more often and with greater intensity

[QUOTE=Headhumpy;50430446]Good job quoting my post out of context. I never said that there was no justification to kill the gorilla to ensure the safety of the child. You're creating a false dichotomy here: it's not "kill the gorilla and save the child" or "save the gorilla and let the child die". There's a third option called "tranquillise the gorilla at the risk of it becoming violent and injuring/killing the child before it succumbs to the sedative". I think that's an option worth considering if the animal was particularly rare.[/QUOTE] It can and usually does take up to 45 minutes for an animal that size to lose consciousness from a tranquilizer dart, in which time anything could happen, especially since to administer that sedative you have to shoot a big fucking dart at the animal. Would you rather take that route if it was your kid sitting there? [editline]31st May 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Starpluck;50430579]Jeff Corwin echoed similar sentiments in the OP. Gorilla's do not react kindly to having several mini-knives jabbed into them. [editline]31st May 2016[/editline] That is like saying "the internet enables this kind of behavior" but that might get in the way of you and everyone elses irrational disdain for social media.[/QUOTE] Just because the internet in general enables that kind of behavior doesn't mean that the main social media site in the world that attracts 1.65 billion active monthly users and has its tendrils in thousands of other sites couldn't possibly play the biggest part in enabling that behavior on and off the internet.

I saw this video going around Facebook and they totally cut out the part where the gorilla is basically swinging the kid around by his arm No wonder so many fucking idiots are jumping on the bandwagon [editline]1st June 2016[/editline] Social media is such a shithole, what kind of trash do you have to be to message someone and harass them about what happened

I bet almost all of these people who are complaining about the gorilla getting killed eat meat. At least when Harambe got killed it was to save someone's life.

Apparently it was the right thing to do. [url]http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/zookeeper-explains-harambe-gorilla-die-8092794[/url]

There are many people who confuse their own opinions as facts. They should listen to the experts.

[QUOTE=Kylel999;50435646]I saw this video going around Facebook and they totally cut out the part where the gorilla is basically swinging the kid around by his arm No wonder so many fucking idiots are jumping on the bandwagon [editline]1st June 2016[/editline] Social media is such a shithole, what kind of trash do you have to be to message someone and harass them about what happened[/QUOTE] That's the most fucked up part of stuff like Facebook/youtube, people can edit a video and with some understanding of what makes a viral video, you can set up this false impression of an event and fuck up the public perception of a story. It's kinda scary in a 1984 sorta way, just produce an edited video/article of something and suddenly the victim is now the evil mcbadguy and the big fuckin' gorilla is a cute cuddly teddy ape. It's highly usable by the governments of the world to fuck up someone's reputation and authority if they're a dissenter. I really wish there was a way to educate people to seek out further info on things like this but 95% of people read some synopsis and spend the rest of the energy they would've used to find out more on judging one side from flawed info, and then attacking that individual/group.

Did they ever find out how the kid got into the habitat? Like clearly he fell in but like was the Mom completely absent or was it "I turned my back for a second" sort of thing.

[QUOTE=Headhumpy;50430446]Good job quoting my post out of context. I never said that there was no justification to kill the gorilla to ensure the safety of the child. You're creating a false dichotomy here: it's not "kill the gorilla and save the child" or "save the gorilla and let the child die". There's a third option called "tranquillise the gorilla at the risk of it becoming violent and injuring/killing the child before it succumbs to the sedative". I think that's an option worth considering if the animal was particularly rare.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Headhumpy;50424084] [QUOTE=Chernobyl426;50423176]Even if it's the last lowland gorilla on Earth it would be literally impossible to turn the parents away and say "Yep, your son is fucked." It's easy to play the "value of life" god game on paper but when it actually comes to making that decision it's going to be a human every time.[/QUOTE] Not really. I'd just say to the parents "we'll do the best we can to save your son but you have to understand that this is the last lowland gorilla on Earth and we want to preserve it so we can't shoot it". They'd be upset but hey, parents of missing children get upset too when police actions get called off after a while. There are definitely situations where we draw a line and say "we can't do any more than this to save [person]'s life." I'm saying that we should include impact on the environment and ecosystem in the assessment as well, rather than simply time and cost factors.[/QUOTE] :suicide:

[QUOTE=Morgen;50437197]:suicide:[/QUOTE] That post was based off the hypothetical situation raised by the person I was replying to where it was the absolute last gorilla on Earth, which isn't currently the case. Please learn to read.

[QUOTE=Headhumpy;50437640]That post was based off the hypothetical situation raised by the person I was replying to where it was the absolute last gorilla on Earth, which isn't currently the case. Please learn to read.[/QUOTE] If it's literally the last lowland gorilla on Earth than the species is already fucked.

[QUOTE=Headhumpy;50437640]That post was based off the hypothetical situation raised by the person I was replying to where it was the absolute last gorilla on Earth, which isn't currently the case. Please learn to read.[/QUOTE] No no , we can read. Your statement was shit; no confusion here.

[QUOTE=Headhumpy;50437640]That post was based off the hypothetical situation raised by the person I was replying to where it was the absolute last gorilla on Earth, which isn't currently the case. Please learn to read.[/QUOTE] What's the point of keeping one gorilla? Are you going to clone it?

[QUOTE=Dr. Ethan Asia;50437747]What's the point of keeping one gorilla? Are you going to clone it?[/QUOTE] If it's the last gorilla on Earth, you are right that it probably is a lost cause. It's a god damn shame that such a situation should even come about, however: how does a species that has thrived for millions of years suddenly find itself on the brink of extinction? I see value in having biodiversity, and preserving what is unique and irreplaceable. I enjoy the beauty of the natural world and find it shameful to see it destroyed by human actions. Endangered animals encapsulate everything that I find wrong about how humans relate to our environment, which is why hubristic rhetoric like "humans are above all animals, our lives should be prioritised over theirs" annoys me to no end. We shouldn't even be putting ourselves in situations where we have to make these decisions: we shouldn't be keeping animals on public display, we shouldn't be interfering with their lives, and we shouldn't be encroaching on their natural habitats.

[QUOTE=Headhumpy;50437873]If it's the last gorilla on Earth, you are right that it probably is a lost cause. It's a god damn shame that such a situation should even come about, however: how does a species that has thrived for millions of years suddenly find itself on the brink of extinction? I see value in having biodiversity, and preserving what is unique and irreplaceable. I enjoy the beauty of the natural world and find it shameful to see it destroyed by human actions. Endangered animals encapsulate everything that I find wrong about how humans relate to our environment, which is why hubristic rhetoric like "humans are above all animals, our lives should be prioritised over theirs" annoys me to no end. We shouldn't even be putting ourselves in situations where we have to make these decisions: we shouldn't be keeping animals on public display, we shouldn't be interfering with their lives, and we shouldn't be encroaching on their natural habitats.[/QUOTE] Maybe try to imagine if your child fell into the Gorilla exhibit? Would you so casually say "Awh shucks, it's the last Gorilla on Earth nothing can be done about it."

[QUOTE=Headhumpy;50437873]If it's the last gorilla on Earth, you are right that it probably is a lost cause. It's a god damn shame that such a situation should even come about, however: how does a species that has thrived for millions of years suddenly find itself on the brink of extinction? I see value in having biodiversity, and preserving what is unique and irreplaceable. I enjoy the beauty of the natural world and find it shameful to see it destroyed by human actions. Endangered animals encapsulate everything that I find wrong about how humans relate to our environment, which is why hubristic rhetoric like "humans are above all animals, our lives should be prioritised over theirs" annoys me to no end. We shouldn't even be putting ourselves in situations where we have to make these decisions: we shouldn't be keeping animals on public display, we shouldn't be interfering with their lives, and we shouldn't be encroaching on their natural habitats.[/QUOTE] Biodiversity is a good thing yeah but a lot of these animals wouldn't survive if they was just left in the wild now. Zoos cost money to run and keep the animals in a good state, visitors help pay for that. Of course proper safety systems should be in place to prevent situations like this. However if we do get into this situation then you 100% should choose the human everytime. It shouldn't even be a debate, you shouldn't compromise the safety of the human even a little bit for the animal. You seriously need to re-evaluate your priorities if you think otherwise. We shouldn't mess with their natural habitats either if they are in the wild. But that wasn't the concern here.

I'd like to bring to question something else entirely Why aren't tranquilizers more powerful ?

[QUOTE=Jetpack Bear;50438371]I'd like to bring to question something else entirely Why aren't tranquilizers more powerful ?[/QUOTE] The more tranquilizer you give them, the more you risk permanent injury.