• Scientist makes first synthetic life, consensus complete.
    175 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Perfumly;22064863]Holy shit [editline]05:13PM[/editline] Are we seriously basically making living things from nothing now?[/QUOTE] Not really. They took pieces of a bacteria and reconstructed it.
[QUOTE=Robber;22066113]I can't imagine how that could become too dangerous. It's just altered DNA. If it was possible to create some kind of super deadly cell it would have happened through natural evolution already[/QUOTE] MRSA, E.bola, Meningitis, Anthrax. Seriously man come on.
[QUOTE=Eudoxia;22066141]But I want to live several thousands of years at least.[/QUOTE] But you wouldn't. It would just be a computer pretending to be you.
[QUOTE=Splurgy;22066175]But you wouldn't. It would just be a computer pretending to be you.[/QUOTE] Last time I checked it would be like soem mind. It would be me, but running on a brain sim on a lump of Compuetronium instead of a biological brain.
[QUOTE=Eudoxia;22066226]Last time I checked it would be like soem mind. It would be me, but running on a brain sim on a lump of Compuetronium instead of a biological brain.[/QUOTE] No it would be a copy of your mind. You stop existing when the chemical reactions stop in your brain. It may be like you but it wouldn't be you, ever.
[QUOTE=bravehat;22066250]No it would be a copy of your mind. You stop existing when the chemical reactions stop in your brain. It may be like you but it wouldn't be you, ever.[/QUOTE] Depends on what you define as you. If it's the character, memories, personality etc. then it would be you inside that computer. If you define it as the specific molecules you are made from then it's not you.
[QUOTE=Johnnsen;22065090]I doubt mankind can be responsible with creating life.[/QUOTE] My thoughts exactly. Anyone ever read the book, [I]Watchers[/I], by Dean Koontz? Great book. Short plot sypnosis: genetic research leads to a dog with the intelligence of a human and a abomination bred for war which wants nothing more than to rip the dog and anyone with it to shreds that is also as intelligent as a human. Man finds dog. Abomination chases dog and, by the same logic, man. At the same time, the NSA wants the dog and the monster back, and they are also chasing the guy. I'm not afraid of a zombie virus. There's something most zombtards never think about; if the only desire of a zombie is to bite other creatures, they would attack and kill off eachother quickly without survivors having to do anything. The only medically possible zombie would be a human infected with a strain of rabies which would drive them to bite other humans and infect them. However, because of this, not only would they kill eachother, the only thing you'd need to do to get rid of them was fire a squirtgun or spray them with a hose a few times as opposed to a blowing their heads off with a Mossberg. Rabies instills a massive hydrophobia(fear of water) complex, and this isn't a don't-like-to-go-swimming one, it's where you will run like you're being chased by a pack of hell-demons at the mere sight of water. If you don't believe me, you need to watch a video of a human afflicted by rabies. For example, A video was released on the internet of a African child infected with rabies. His mother attempted to give him some water. Mind you, this was a little plastic cup, like the ones that come on top of bottles of cough syrup. The kid strained against his bonds(he was in a hospital, tied to a bed) like she was holding a venemous snake instead of a cup of water, screaming and thrashing and frothing at the mouth. Now that I've gotten the fear of zombies out of the way, let me return to the topic at hand. The biggest danger with this kind of research is that they would create, unintentionally or intentionally, a virus or creature. Either could be deadly to humans. If the monster was bloodthirsty enough to want to kill humans, it would be a danger to it's creators and would be a huge waste of money. Like a dangerous dog at the kennels, it would have no use if it could not be trained to work with humans instead of trying to bite their faces off. If it was a virus, a virus is easy to misplace or accidentally release. A virus doesn't have to turn humans into zombies to be deadly, you know.
[QUOTE=petieng;22065906]Depends on your definition of 'you'.[/QUOTE] It's hard to have a definition of "you" when you're dead.
This just in: 10 foot tall blue cats spotted running around and looking for big ass trees to live in
[QUOTE=STREWTH_99;22064977]And then they fuck something up and create a super-deadly virus by accident.[/QUOTE] How would they create a virus by working on cells ?
[QUOTE=UnnamedPlayer;22066389]This just in: 10 foot tall blue cats spotted running around and looking for big ass trees to live in[/QUOTE] What about the 30 foot tall rainbow teddy bears that shoot laser beams from their eyes?
Humans are now Gods
This is technically the first engineered-from-scratch virus, too
[QUOTE=Robber;22066294]Depends on what you define as you. If it's the character, memories, personality etc. then it would be you inside that computer. If you define it as the specific molecules you are made from then it's not you.[/QUOTE] But this is just the problem. At the moment, we've no idea how memories are stored in the brain - there's some vague theories about quantum entanglement but that's pretty much it. The best a computer could do is [i]simulate[/i] the brain, and a simulation is by definition an imitation; not the real thing. Supposing there was a way to upload your brain without killing you. Would you then be prepared to kill yourself so the you in the computer could live on unimpeded?
Is this actually a fully synthetic cell, or just one altered by a created virus. Because if its the second I think this has been done before.
[QUOTE=Robber;22066294]Depends on what you define as you. If it's the character, memories, personality etc. then it would be you inside that computer. If you define it as the specific molecules you are made from then it's not you.[/QUOTE] Well its "you" in the loosest term, it's not you because your [b]awareness [/b] of yourself dies at that point in time. It is a copy of you, but you the current you, will never exist again just a perfect copy that's is aware of itself and the transition to you, but it will know the difference.
[QUOTE=lolwutdude;22065145]who the fuck ever plays engineer[/QUOTE] Oops I meant infiltrator
[QUOTE=Splurgy;22066548]But this is just the problem. [b]At the moment, we've no idea how memories are stored in the brain - there's some vague theories about quantum entanglement but that's pretty much it.[/b] The best a computer could do is [i]simulate[/i] the brain, and a simulation is by definition an imitation; not the real thing. Supposing there was a way to upload your brain without killing you. Would you then be prepared to kill yourself so the you in the computer could live on unimpeded?[/QUOTE] LOL WRONG where in god's name did you get that idea
[QUOTE=Splurgy;22066548]But this is just the problem. At the moment, we've no idea how memories are stored in the brain - there's some vague theories about quantum entanglement but that's pretty much it. The best a computer could do is [i]simulate[/i] the brain, and a simulation is by definition an imitation; not the real thing. Supposing there was a way to upload your brain without killing you. Would you then be prepared to kill yourself so the you in the computer could live on unimpeded?[/QUOTE] To be able to simulate the brain entirely I'm pretty sure we would need to know how it works. So in this case, the computer running your mind would run it exactly how a human brain would. I don't see any problem with this. Yes your body may have died in the biological sense, and your brain isn't using the same particles it was when it was biological, but the processes are the same. To me, I am the processes of my mind, not the physical make up of it.
[QUOTE=Quo Vadi;22066610]LOL WRONG where in god's name did you get that idea[/QUOTE] New Scientist. Why, do you know how memories are stored? [QUOTE=petieng;22066620]To be able to simulate the brain entirely I'm pretty sure we would need to know how it works. So in this case, the computer running your mind would run it exactly how a human brain would. I don't see any problem with this. Yes your body may have died in the biological sense, and your brain isn't using the same particles it was when it was biological, but the processes are the same. To me, I am the processes of my mind, not the physical make up of it.[/QUOTE] [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_room]Ok, but this[/url]
[QUOTE=petieng;22066620] [b]To me, I am the processes of my mind, not the physical make up of it.[/b][/QUOTE] According to psychology it's literally impossible to truly think this way
[QUOTE=petieng;22066620]To be able to simulate the brain entirely I'm pretty sure we would need to know how it works. So in this case, the computer running your mind would run it exactly how a human brain would. I don't see any problem with this. Yes your body may have died in the biological sense, and your brain isn't using the same particles it was when it was biological, but the processes are the same. To me, I am the processes of my mind, not the physical make up of it.[/QUOTE] But you're dead, so you don't really care anyway. [editline]07:02PM[/editline] [QUOTE=Quo Vadi;22066658]According to psychology it's literally impossible to truly think this way[/QUOTE] According to psychology, it's literally impossible to not want to have sex with your mother.
[QUOTE=Splurgy;22066655]New Scientist. Why, do you know how memories are stored?[/QUOTE] Information is relayed in the medial temporal lobe of the brain (specifically the hippocampus but there's more activity than just it) to storage centers for important and nonimportant memories (which is why you forget certain shit easier than other shit) [editline]07:04PM[/editline] [QUOTE=Mingebox;22066662] According to psychology, it's literally impossible to not want to have sex with your mother.[/QUOTE] I always disliked the Freudian model
[QUOTE=Quo Vadi;22066710]Information is relayed in the medial temporal lobe of the brain (specifically the hippocampus but there's more activity than just it) to storage centers for important and nonimportant memories (which is why you forget certain shit easier than other shit) [/QUOTE] That's how it's relayed. How is it stored? How do those storage centres store it?
Also, on the subject of memory, this is P. cool [img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/13/Triangle-place-cells.png[/img] It's, as quoted, Spatial firing patterns of seven place cells recorded from a single electrode in the dorsal CA1 layer of a rat. The rat ran several hundred laps clockwise around an elevated triangular track, stopping in the middle of each arm to eat a small portion of food reward. Black dots indicate positions of the rat's head; colored dots indicate places where action potentials occurred, using a different color for each cell [editline]07:07PM[/editline] [QUOTE=Splurgy;22066740]That's how it's relayed. How is it stored? How do those storage centres store it?[/QUOTE] Electrically- it travels along neurons. As for the second and third questions, you can find them with a quick look at Wikipedia. I have absolutely no idea as to why you thought the scientific world had hypotheses on quantum entanglement having a place in memory. Do you even know what quantum entanglement is?
[QUOTE=Splurgy;22066655] [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_room]Ok, but this[/url][/QUOTE] Obviously it's hard to speculate on something that doesn't exist yet, but my view of mind uploading that does not involve 'death' would be a computer that handles the process of my brain in the exact way my brain did, but through silicon or whatever, not organic molecules. It would not be a software simulation. All I see from the Chinese room argument is that the Turing test and therefore current concept of 'strong AI' is misplaced, because the machine does not necessarily need a mind. The whole idea of mind uploading is [I]giving[/I] the machine a mind. [QUOTE=Mingebox;22066662]But you're dead, so you don't really care anyway.[/QUOTE]I think a body, absent of any mind would not care either way, which is the only thing that is dead.
The future starts here, in 2010.
[QUOTE=Dlaor;22066999]The future starts here, in 2010.[/QUOTE] Where's my goddamn jetpack?
[QUOTE=Quo Vadi;22066757]Also, on the subject of memory, this is P. cool [img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/13/Triangle-place-cells.png[/img] It's, as quoted, Spatial firing patterns of seven place cells recorded from a single electrode in the dorsal CA1 layer of a rat. The rat ran several hundred laps clockwise around an elevated triangular track, stopping in the middle of each arm to eat a small portion of food reward. Black dots indicate positions of the rat's head; colored dots indicate places where action potentials occurred, using a different color for each cell [editline]07:07PM[/editline] Electrically- it travels along neurons. As for the second and third questions, you can find them with a quick look at Wikipedia. I have absolutely no idea as to why you thought the scientific world had hypotheses on quantum entanglement having a place in memory. Do you even know what quantum entanglement is?[/QUOTE] Not really. It has something to do with particles and observations but physics in general is buried under a thick haze for me. [url=http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/blog/2009/aug/26/entropy-time-arrow-quantum-mechanics]I found the article in question, but I think I got the wrong end of the stick.[/url] I looked on Wikipedia, and it had information about long term potentiation and neuronal connectivity, but I'm still failing to grasp exactly how discrete things like the smell of an apple pie or that time when your brother used your voice recording pen without your permission and recorded over that clip of West Side Story off of GMTV that you were going to play to your Mum when she got in can be stored. It says stuff about connections between neurones but what makes neurones capable of storing information? They're just cells that you can electrically excite, and they're nerves and whatnot. How do they store things?
[QUOTE=petieng;22066904] I think a body, absent of any mind would not care either way, which is the only thing that is dead.[/QUOTE] Your consciousness is copied, not transferred. From your own perspective, you would cease to exist, but the clone would swear that it was successful.
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