UK education sixth in global ranking, Angry Birds nation takes first place - Polidicks

[QUOTE=yawmwen;38614286]well i dont believe that your version of economic distribution is moral. because efficiency is but a means to achieve an end goal(happiness). if efficiency comes at the cost of worker happiness you are defeating the point of efficiency in the first place.[/QUOTE] worker happiness contributes to efficiency, gj

[QUOTE=yawmwen;38614286] i would rather have society determine its own prosperity and organize itself rather than having someone else organize it for them anyways.[/QUOTE] But that is the purpose of a government, is to ensure that the organization with which society addresses itself is upheld by those who would seek to break it.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;38614286]well i dont believe that your version of economic distribution is moral.[/QUOTE] you want to sacrifice order for chaos there's a reason why worker's cooperatives are so rare; they're fucking incompetently run

[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;38614320]worker happiness contributes to efficiency, gj[/QUOTE] but slavery doesn't(generally) contribute to happiness.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;38614336]but slavery doesn't(generally) contribute to happiness.[/QUOTE] nor does it contribute to efficiency? there's a reason the south had such a pisspoor economy

[QUOTE=Swilly;38614329]But that is the purpose of a government, is to ensure that the organization with which society addresses itself is upheld by those who would seek to break it.[/QUOTE] yea and this works better on smaller scales. having federal governments that are far removed from the population are generally unable to properly facilitate proper societal self-determination that well. they become accountable to other factors that aren't as present at local levels. there needs to be something set up, but that something should be minimalist and only there to enforce human rights, not actually distribute or legislate. [editline]27th November 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;38614352]nor does it contribute to efficiency? there's a reason the south had such a pisspoor economy[/QUOTE] what are you even talking about anymore? im referring to your ideal of crushing worker autonomy in exchange for efficiency that benefits only a small group of people that retain autonomy.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;38614357]yea and this works better on smaller scales. having federal governments that are far removed from the population are generally unable to properly facilitate proper societal self-determination that well. they become accountable to other factors that aren't as present at local levels. there needs to be something set up, but that something should be minimalist and only there to enforce human rights, not actually distribute or legislate. [/QUOTE] Federal governments are supposed to be heavily centralized and every state has a federal system. The entire idea is to centralize power into a single spot which then moves to another central point which then goes to the final central point. This way, orders and changes coming from the top can be determined down to the bottom.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;38614357]what are you even talking about anymore? im referring to your ideal of crushing worker autonomy in exchange for efficiency that benefits only a small group of people that retain autonomy.[/QUOTE] I'm not talking about crushing worker autonomy, I'm talking about good management practices. Newsflash - workers generally don't tend to be good at running the company. If they were actually good at that, then shareholders would take note. A CEO or even a midlevel manager requires a vastly different skillset, personality and level of innate intelligence than the average worker.

[QUOTE=Swilly;38614379]Federal governments are supposed to be heavily centralized and every state has a federal system.[/QUOTE] i know and i dont agree that state governments are necessarily local enough. im talking county and city level. [editline]27th November 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;38614395]I'm not talking about crushing worker autonomy, I'm talking about good management practices. Newsflash - workers generally don't tend to be good at running the company. If they were actually good at that, then shareholders would take note. A CEO or even a midlevel manager requires a vastly different skillset, personality and level of innate intelligence.[/QUOTE] and yet they still produce nothing for society "wealth creation" is only beneficial in capitalism and it mostly benefits the capitalists. i dont think that is very moral.

I'll keep discussing this later, I gotta a paper I have to finish very soon are I'm in deep shit.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;38614396]and yet they still produce nothing for society "wealth creation" is only beneficial in capitalism and it mostly benefits the capitalists. i dont think that is very moral.[/QUOTE] what are even you talking about this makes no sense at all

[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;38614433]what are even you talking about this makes no sense at all[/QUOTE] management doesnt actually produce a good, they manipulate capital for the benefit of capitalists.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;38614443]management doesnt actually produce a good, they manipulate capital for the benefit of capitalists.[/QUOTE] we've been over this

Yeah, I read somewhere... TvTropes that Finland has pretty good education system. No idea why, despite being finnish and having gone basic schools. Anyone smarter than me got anything on that?

[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;38614456]we've been over this[/QUOTE] yea and it still doesnt satisfy me that someone gets rich without actually benefiting society.

have you ever even read a proper econ textbook? your notions seem to be like a hundred and fifty years out of date my automerge ;c [editline]27th November 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=yawmwen;38614465]yea and it still doesnt satisfy me that someone gets rich without actually benefiting society.[/QUOTE] they provide a service to society that society deems good enough to pay them lots of money

[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;38614466]have you ever even read a proper econ textbook? your notions seem to be like a hundred and fifty years out of date my automerge ;c[/QUOTE] i have [quote]they provide a service to society that society deems good enough to pay them lots of money[/quote] yea and society is run by the same people who provide the service deemed good enough. [editline]27th November 2012[/editline] basically capitalists have said that the job of a capitalist is valuable and therefore they should pay themselves lots of money that they "earned"(stole) from workers who actually produce for society.

Fuck you Hungary! Go America!

I do like the uk system. I can have a nice diplomatic discussion with staff and they do listen to your side of a debate and take it into account. Some staff are just terrible though.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;38614516]i have yea and society is run by the same people who provide the service deemed good enough. [editline]27th November 2012[/editline] basically capitalists have said that the job of a capitalist is valuable and therefore they should pay themselves lots of money that they "earned"(stole) from workers who actually produce for society.[/QUOTE] I'm sorry, but do you even understand how businesses work? Or basic economics? I don't mean to be disrespectful but you seem to talk about something you know nothing about.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;38614516]basically capitalists have said that the job of a capitalist is valuable and therefore they should pay themselves lots of money that they "earned"(stole) from workers who actually produce for society.[/QUOTE] erm this simply doesn't make sense? capitalists aren't an organized cabal of people, laughing maniacally as they feed themselves inflated salaries. if a CEO isn't worth the money he's being paid, the shareholders fire him. stop with this ludicrous class warfare idea, it just doesn't stand up to any kind of scrutiny

[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;38614621]erm this simply doesn't make sense? capitalists aren't an organized cabal of people, laughing maniacally as they feed themselves inflated salaries. if a CEO isn't worth the money he's being paid, the shareholders fire him. stop with this ludicrous class warfare idea, it just doesn't stand up to any kind of scrutiny[/QUOTE] well there is a class war and i hope you reconsider your position on it

[QUOTE=yawmwen;38614642]well there is a class war and i hope you reconsider your position on it[/QUOTE] are you high (serious question)

[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;38614685]are you high (serious question)[/QUOTE] are you

[QUOTE=yawmwen;38614691]are you[/QUOTE] n

[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;38614697]n[/QUOTE] yawmwen u jus got wrekt m8

[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;38614697]n[/QUOTE] good

That's pretty funny I'm of Finnish blood, but my family moved to the UK so I could get a good education and become what I want - I want to be an engineer or physician, which are both done better in Finnland then the UK. GG WP Finnland.

[QUOTE=Swilly;38613080] And while it pains me to say it, the Teacher's Union needs to be slapped in the face.[/QUOTE] Not all unions are created equal. I'm no fan of them in general but I'm realistic enough to admit that most of them aren't even half as bad as that cesspool of sycophants.

France isn't on there. Glad to see I'm not the only one who thinks our education fucking sucks. Been studying IT in a reasonably high ranked university, it's our last year, and we've been studying the same things over and over. Most of our courses are introductions and we never get to the advanced stuff. Brilliant.