Neo-Nazis tried to crash a welcome party for migrants and refugees in Germany - Polidicks

what?

[QUOTE=Silly Sil;48628495]You sure no one ever? You people are really fucking nuts. Do you really think that people saw tanks outside their window, then started up their computers, started up google and checked unemployment rates of the EU countries, refusal rate, etc and decided where to go? That's the first thing you do when you flee for your life from a warzone? Give me a fucking break.[/QUOTE] No. Why are you calling us nuts and then make up a super crazy exagerated rhethoric question?

[QUOTE=Killuah;48628533]This argumentation is futile. The "what if people stopped" argument isn't one at all because it can be used against anything and thus against nothing. "what if polititians stopped caring" It's not important for whatever reason people are helping. It's help after all. If people need a sense of self importance and feeling good about the help, so be it. They are helping, they are feeling good about it. Win-win. Your super idealistic "but people need to help for the RIGHT reason" view isn't helping anyone and it's also far from reality. So get out there and help and donate in case you care. You don't have to feel good about it if you don't want to.[/QUOTE] All I can say is that I'm sorry that you've never believed in a cause enough to have a reason to do something apart from feeling better for yourself. For the record, I do a month of volunteer work every year, can you say the same?

[QUOTE=Kommodore;48628527]yeah they paid smugglers to get them to europe for no reason at all, they do things without any cause or justification whatsoever, that makes loads of sense and it's us who are crazy[/QUOTE] What the fuck does that even have to do with what I said? I said they didn't check all those fancy numbers you people keep copypasting. How in the hell did you get from that to there being no reason to leave? Where did that even come from? [QUOTE=Kommodore;48628527]surely there's no way word of mouth could have told them that germany was the best place to go. that would be insane.[/QUOTE] So you mean that they didn't check all these numbers, someone told them that a rich country is taking in immigrants and giving out equivalent of several monthly wages and they decided to go? Sure I'd do that too, even if I were nowhere near danger. I'm not saying there are no real war refugees between them, I don't know the numbers. I'm saying you don't pick and choose where you want to go if the only thing you want is not to die.

[QUOTE=Doom64hunter;48628422]No it's not hard to understand but it makes the whole Dublin regulation pointless if nothing is done about it. Everyone wants to go to Germany, and nowhere else, they know the system exists and as such go out of their way to avoid registration in other countries. And unemployment will likely become a bigger issue in Germany as well if they keep receiving the overwhelming majority of refugees/immigrants.[/QUOTE] Also, it will take a heavy toll on the welfare systems in Germany. Another issue is that the German government says that they are willing to take in 800k to 1 million immigrants this year alone, while I haven't heard yet how they are going to house and take care of them all. There is also the issue of international security risks, given the recent terrorist threats and attacks committed in Europa. Just letting them all into Europa without checking for potential security risks to Europa is a fantastically stupid idea of the EU. I don't like it either that the EU is pushing our country too to let more refugees in, while we are really full with the 2000 we have already taken in this year. All our refugee centers are already filled to the brim, and we even put a few refugees in guest families who volunteered. At this point, it is still sustainable to take care sufficiently of them. Nevertheless does Juncker want us to take in 8000, which is four times the amount we have now. It is really ridiculous, given how we really want to take care of the refugees as best as we can, and quadrupling the planned amount might put that all in jeopardy. Also, the welfare here is getting stained more and more by the year, and thus, the payouts for those keep getting lower and lower, especially for pensioners who paid for it when they worked. Unemployment here is also on the rise, and finding jobs is getting harder and harder even if you are well-educated. I am really wondering how Germany is going to handle that gargantuan amount of refugees/immigrants they want in their country.

[QUOTE=Killuah;48628548]No. Why are you calling us nuts and then make up a super crazy exagerated rhethoric question?[/QUOTE] ??? When people asked why they want to go to Germany and nowhere else, you guys started bringing up the numbers. As if the immigrants checked those numbers and decided to go to Germany.

[QUOTE=Jordax;48628629]Also, it will take a heavy toll on the welfare systems in Germany. Another issue is that the German government says that they are willing to take in 800k to 1 million immigrants this year alone, while I haven't heard yet how they are going to house and take care of them all. There is also the issue of international security risks, given the recent terrorist threats and attacks committed in Europa. Just letting them all into Europa without checking for potential security risks to Europa is a fantastically stupid idea of the EU. I don't like it either that the EU is pushing our country too to let more refugees in, while we are really full with the 2000 we have already taken in this year. All our refugee centers are already filled to the brim, and we even put a few refugees in guest families who volunteered. At this point, it is still sustainable to take care sufficiently of them. Nevertheless does Juncker want us to take in 8000, which is four times the amount we have now. It is really ridiculous, given how we really want to take care of the refugees as best as we can, and quadrupling the planned amount might put that all in jeopardy. Also, the welfare here is getting stained more and more by the year, and thus, the payouts for those keep getting lower and lower, especially for pensioners who paid for it when they worked. Unemployment here is also on the rise, and finding jobs is getting harder and harder even if you are well-educated. I am really wondering how Germany is going to handle that gargantuan amount of refugees/immigrants they want in their country.[/QUOTE] How do you know if those refugees/economic immigrants/whatever you people call them aren't going to pay taxes by the way? A lot of the ones who are actually able to make it to Europe have at least some education.

[QUOTE=Silly Sil;48628635]??? When people asked why they want to go to Germany and nowhere else, you guys started bringing up the numbers. As if the immigrants checked those numbers and decided to go to Germany.[/QUOTE] they probably didn't, i never mentioned any numbers, i'm not sure why you quoted me, and i cant understand why it's relevant when they can just receive that same information informally from a million different places

lol at the people who think that just because they're refugees they shouldn't have the right to choose where they go

[QUOTE=TornadoAP;48628661]How do you know if those refugees/economic immigrants/whatever you people call them aren't going to pay taxes by the way? A lot of the ones who are actually able to make it to Europe have at least some education.[/QUOTE] 3 months until they can get a job in Germany, 6 months in the Netherlands (from what I've read). They definitely have to live on welfare for that period, no way around it. Otherwise, there's the problem of oversaturation. I don't know how Germany wants to handle this, but if they take 800k-1 Million refugees this year, with only 500k (I think? that's the number I last heard) open job positions, with an additional unemployment rate of over 6% of the general population, the fact that not all the refugees will fit into the jobs (there'll certainly be common and rare educations) and the additional hurdles of actually employing a refugee (plus language problems), I can't see this being an easy task at all. Edit: The most insane thing about it is that neighbouring countries are struggling to take up a few thousand. I always have to double check the number to make sure if I'm reading things right, because compared to what Germany is aiming for, it's a drop in the ocean.

[QUOTE=Kommodore;48628685]they probably didn't, i never mentioned any numbers, i'm not sure why you quoted me, and i cant understand why it's relevant when they can just receive that same information informally from a million different places[/QUOTE] Or maybe the decision where to go wasn't based on shit like unemployment rate but on welfare? They wanna go where they get the most free cash. Hey I'd too. But at this point you have stopped running from certain death in a warzone.

[QUOTE=Doom64hunter;48628774]3 months until they can get a job in Germany, 6 months in the Netherlands (from what I've read). They definitely have to live on welfare for that period, no way around it. Otherwise, there's the problem of oversaturation. I don't know how Germany wants to handle this, but if they take 800k-1 Million refugees this year, with only 500k (I think? that's the number I last heard) open job positions, with an additional unemployment rate of over 6% of the general population, the fact that not all the refugees will fit into the jobs (there'll certainly be common and rare educations) and the additional hurdles of actually employing a refugee (plus language problems), I can't see this being an easy task at all. Edit: The most insane thing about it is that neighbouring countries are struggling to take up a few thousand. I always have to double check the number to make sure if I'm reading things right, because compared to what Germany is aiming for, it's a drop in the ocean.[/QUOTE] if i'm not mistaken 800,000k is the speculated number of migrants to arrive in Europe by the end of the year counting from the beginning of the year. there have been about 500,000 asylum applicants to germany since 2011.

[QUOTE=Silly Sil;48628822]Or maybe the decision where to go wasn't based on shit like unemployment rate but on welfare? They wanna go where they get the most free cash. Hey I'd too. But at this point you have stopped running from certain death in a warzone.[/QUOTE] Look, all that it takes for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing, and in this case evil is being put into shitty refugee camps down in the middle east where there's shitty water, not much food, and otherwise is just shit. I'm sorry if people want to go somewhere where they have a chance at a better life may cost you some more money every year, but this is the price we pay to keep people safe.

[QUOTE=Kommodore;48628831]if i'm not mistaken 800,000k is the speculated number of migrants to arrive in Europe by the end of the year counting from the beginning of the year. there have been about 500,000 asylum applicants to germany since 2011.[/QUOTE] There have already been over 300000 applications from January to August, in Germany only. The 800k are for Germany, not Europe. 800000 is a ridiculous number, that's 1% of the country's population in just 1 year.

[QUOTE=James xX;48628557]All I can say is that I'm sorry that you've never believed in a cause enough to have a reason to do something apart from feeling better for yourself. For the record, I do a month of volunteer work every year, can you say the same?[/QUOTE] If you say you don't feel better after helping someone you'd be crazy. As cynical as it sounds even acts of selflessness are selfish acts as they confront an issue we feel bad about. And honestly it doesn't matter why you help. As long as it's helping there's no point in arguing besides some ethical snobism. Germany has a good reputation. Some refugees still have phones so communication exist. Once the word goes 'round there's nothing you can do about it.

[QUOTE=TornadoAP;48628863]Look, all that it takes for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing, and in this case evil is being put into shitty refugee camps down in the middle east where there's shitty water, not much food, and otherwise is just shit. I'm sorry if people want to go somewhere where they have a chance at a better life may cost you some more money every year, but this is the price we pay to keep people safe.[/QUOTE] Benefits are shit in Poland so they don't even stay here even if they get here. So you have missed completely what I'm saying and why. I'm not concerned they will cost me money.

[QUOTE=TornadoAP;48628863]Look, all that it takes for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing, and in this case evil is being put into shitty refugee camps down in the middle east where there's shitty water, not much food, and otherwise is just shit. I'm sorry if people want to go somewhere where they have a chance at a better life may cost you some more money every year, but this is the price we pay to keep people safe.[/QUOTE] Evil will always prevail. As far as I'm concerned, these people will not be getting much better treatment if they go north either. Theirs already been a boom in homeless refugees across the EU, and if it's homelessness or a refugee camp with subpar standards, I'd take the refugee camp.

[QUOTE=KILLTHIS;48628898]If you say you don't feel better after helping someone you'd be crazy.[/QUOTE] Good thing I didn't say that then. I said that that shouldn't be the reason you help someone.

[QUOTE=Silly Sil;48628950]Benefits are shit in Poland so they don't even stay here even if they get here. So you have missed completely what I'm saying and why. I'm not concerned they will cost me money.[/QUOTE] I read a story where migrants went to poland and left because because of this exact reason, no free handouts. That's why they love Germany so much right now. Also reminds me of refugees complaining of being moved to areas without other muslims\big city economy. [url]http://www.thelocal.se/20150101/refugees-protest-rural-sweden-re-location[/url]

[QUOTE=James xX;48628557]All I can say is that I'm sorry that you've never believed in a cause enough to have a reason to do something apart from feeling better for yourself. For the record, I do a month of volunteer work every year, can you say the same?[/QUOTE] Are you really trying to take the moral high ground after attacking him for doing volunteer work, whatever the reason?

[quote]because the region is still unstable and they won't have nearly as much opportunities for a better life as they would in a developed country? [/quote] A guy from where I work recently immigrated here from Pakistan with a degree in business economics. That degree means dick-all here so he's filling shelves at a big box store which honestly is really sad. This most likely applies in other careers that any number of this current influx of refugees might have. While they might be safer in a western country their experience and academic standing might not be valid so that "better life" for someone that's 40 years old is a typical joe-job you normally expect to see a teen or a university student working. This also means that said demographic of 16-20something's who badly need a job to start building their future and fighting student debts are unable to find jobs because they have all been filled.

[QUOTE=Arrows;48629703]I read a story where migrants went to poland and left because because of this exact reason, no free handouts. That's why they love Germany so much right now. Also reminds me of refugees complaining of being moved to areas without other muslims\big city economy. [url]http://www.thelocal.se/20150101/refugees-protest-rural-sweden-re-location[/url][/QUOTE] I mean, does Poland even provide any support to refugees at all?

lol @ Europeans complaining about immigrants. It feels like the USA circa 2006 in here. Let's do some math, kids! During the first half of 2015, from January to the end of June, the EU as a whole has received 417,430 asylum applications. For ease of math, and to please marijuana users on FP, we shall now call this 420,000. This is just the number of applications - it's not even the number of people who will actually get to stay in the EU. But for the sake of math, let's assume that it is. The EU has a population of 508,191,116. This is also a nasty looking number, so for ease of math again, we'll just call it an even half-billion. When we do the division, this comes out to .084%. That's barely 8 and a half percent of a percent. To be frank, that ain't shit. It's barely a noteworthy portion of the EU population. To compare with the United States, we have about 11.5 million illegal immigrants, worth about 3% of the population. Most of these migrants/refugees, I understand want to be in Germany - a country with a birth rate well below the replacement rate. Germany should probably be thanking its migrants that it hasn't become a Japan with a demographic disaster underway. Let's face it, the big reason there's such a big stink about these rather small numbers of migrants is because Europe has been ethnically homogeneous for centuries. People in the UK, Germany, France, and especially Sweden and Denmark have never had to see a people with other skin colors or who speak languages not closely related to theirs. Until fairly recently, Europeans lived in their own little bubble where other races didn't exist, and now that suddenly they're confronted with people who are slightly different in superficial respects, they don't know what to do. That's why suddenly Neo-Nazis and other far-right ideologies have gained a lot of traction in western Europe. People like to talk about how the US has serious race issues, but I'm thankful not to be in Europe where, when a few brown people arrive, the whole country has to go completely apeshit.

What. You do realize that Europe was the power-house of colonial powers and they usually were importing people from different countries for the sake of cultural investigation for centuries correct? You really wanna know why theirs such a big stink in Europe right now? You really want to know? It's because immigration and "refugees" are eating away at the low and middle income jobs and are effecting a great deal of Europeans who are wanting to work those jobs, but cannot because most of these jobs are done by those refugees for little to no income. Its because Europe as a whole is right now in a massive housing shortage and [url=http://swedishsurveyor.com/2015/05/28/swedish-pensioners-evicted-so-as-to-make-room-for-asylum-seekers/]those which are born in-country are losing their homes to make way for the refugees and asylum seekers[/url]. It is because people do not see justice in forcing people to live on the streets in homelessness when they could of lived in the hundreds of refugee camps which their neighboring countries have offered. It is because people are sick of the so called "starving refugees" refusing food, aid, and services from the Red Cross for simply having a cross. Whether you like it or not, many reasons exist for why the EU should entirely lock out refugees and asylum seekers and take care of it's own people first. The entirety of the United Nations should be coordinating a relief effort instead of going about forcing countries to intake refugees. You cannot honestly expect the current system to work when all it has done so far has lead people to become spiteful and join anti-immigration groups to prevent further destruction of their countries lower-income groups.

[QUOTE=JoeSkylynx;48630595][...] It's because immigration and "refugees" are eating away at the low and middle income jobs and are effecting a great deal of Europeans who are wanting to work those jobs, but cannot because most of these jobs are done by those refugees for little to no income. [...][/QUOTE] This part here, at least, is complete garbage when applied to Germany. EU citizens get priority and the minimum wages here mean there's no financial benefit for employers to choose refugees as far as I know. (IIrc they are still in the process of being raised from the previous negotiation results.) For Austria it seems similar, since they give out limited work permits presumably for areas with high demand. That said, from what I've heard Sweden's refugee housing politics are really quite unrealistic, unlike most of the other countries'.

isn't neo-nazism like illegal as fuck there?

[url]http://www.mindenegybenblog.hu/fiuk-lanyok-velemeny/brutalis-allapotok-a-zsambeki-lehajtonal[/url] What a nice scenery :)

[QUOTE=Niklas;48629967]Are you really trying to take the moral high ground after attacking him for doing volunteer work, whatever the reason?[/QUOTE] Where did he say he did volunteer work, and where did I say it was wrong that he did volunteer work? Quotes please.

[QUOTE=James xX;48631789]Where did he say he did volunteer work, and where did I say it was wrong that he did volunteer work? Quotes please.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Killuah;48628411] I'm helping in a camp of about 600 people in my town and there are SEVERAL people who are academics, teachers, doctors, technicians and so on and so on. [/QUOTE] [QUOTE=James xX;48628557]All I can say is that I'm sorry that you've never believed in a cause enough to have a reason to do something apart from feeling better for yourself. For the record, I do a month of volunteer work every year, can you say the same?[/QUOTE]

People already weren't happy about all the migrants, and now thousands are pouring in. Just be glad it isn't worse than it was.