Designer of 3-D Printable Gun Has His 3-D Printer Seized
63 replies, posted
[IMG]http://englishrussia.com/images/chechen_weapons/9.jpg[/IMG]
ban hardware stores, basic tools.
The problem here is that the guy intended to publish the design of a gun and print it without any sort of license to do so, and the company seized the printer fearing they'd get caught in the whole legal ordeal when it happened.
If someone wants to make a gun and has enough need for it, they'll make one out of common stuff, or even print some parts off the internet (the files for an AR-15 are up there, and that plus a trip to a hardware store = a fuckin' assault rifle). 3D-printing guns just makes the whole ordeal much easier.
it's not illegal to build your own gun. people do it every day. the only way it could be illegal is if he made it an NFA weapon and didn't it register it before building it
where teh fuck is the auto playing sound coming from
3D printers... i can imagine a future "catch-a-ride" working.
[QUOTE=JerryK;37888602]where teh fuck is the auto playing sound coming from[/QUOTE]
the vimeo link
[QUOTE=JerryK;37888602]where teh fuck is the auto playing sound coming from[/QUOTE]
Vimeo videos still autoplay. I tried bugging Garry about it but no luck yet.
Vimeo videos autoplay?
I've never had that happen.
Oh, apparently I have Vimeo blocked by default in NotScript. Guess that's why.
Woo Javascript blockers. :v:
holy shit that guy sounds a lot like george clooney.. It's like I'm listening to bruce wayne pitch wayne industries to me! but seriously though this is a pretty cool invention, too bad it's been taken
Sensationalist much. Just a rental company's lawyers getting antsy about liability, nothing to see here.
He's not doing a single thing that's against the law. Anyone over the age of 18 (21 for pistols) can build a working firearm as long as it falls within regulations (semi-automatic only, not open bolt, etc etc).
Fuck these guys, I'll print guns all day.
Who the fuck was the asshole that put the autoplaying video?
[editline]3rd October 2012[/editline]
Scared the shit out of me, had my volume super loud.
am I the only one that didn't hear anything from the Vimeo video on page 1
seriously, I forgot those even autoplayed until someone brought it up
There are two points in this:
First: Printing your own gun means you're capable of creating a weapon without the need to buy one, yet you still need ammunition. But having a gun means that one of the critical parts is done and therefore there might be some problems, especially if there are any regulations on gun posession. This would be kinda dangerous, but having a gun doesn't mean that people automatically use them - yet they have the opportunity to do so.
Second: On the other hand he didn't do anything wrong. He was just about to proof the capabilities and possibilities of 3D-printers, especially when it comes down to everyday life. He didn't violate any laws but surely he can't just create copyrighted weapons on his own.
Aren't all the guns in Mass Effect made with some form of 3D printer? I remember seeing a thing about the Turian military publicly releasing the blueprints for a gun so that anyone could fabricate one to go out and shoot some husks. I found it pretty interesting.
Considering all the solid things you make with your omnitool are manufactured on the spot I think so yeah.
And printing your own gun parts is functionally identical to machining your own gun parts from a legal standpoint, it just requires less skill from the printer.
Like I said, this is a set of suits saying "He made a gun? Doesn't he need a license to make those? Even if he doesn't it'll look really, really bad for us if he goes and does something stupid with it because we provided the printer, let's just get out for safety."
You can literally make a gun out of a [url=http://info.stylee32.net/Weapons%20and%20Military/Homemade/Four%20winds%20Shotgun.gif]few pieces of pipe and a nail[/url]... and people are worried about 3d printing being used by criminals?
It's not like guns are these MAGICALLY SOPHISTICATED DEVICES that take professional equipment to make, gun mechanics at their very most basic form revolve around a fucking metal pin hitting a primer.
[QUOTE=DarkMonkey;37889027]Sensationalist much. Just a rental company's lawyers getting antsy about liability, nothing to see here.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, the title makes it seem like the government seized it, when the producer simply didn't want their printers associated with making firearm parts out of plastic, no matter if they worked or not.
[QUOTE=MightyMax;37886916]he was doing this to prove a point of what will happen with 3d printers.
[editline]2nd October 2012[/editline]
and when everyone gets their hands on one.[/QUOTE]
I could just make a medieval cannon out of a steel piping and some flash powder right now.
100x more fun and I dont need a $20,000 printer to do it.
The concern is not that 3d printer makes guns, it's that it can or at least will soon be able to make high quality guns, none of that backyard trash.
[quote]“It is the policy of Stratasys not to knowingly allow its printers to be used for illegal purposes,” the company wrote, noting that Wilson lacked a federal license for manufacturing firearms.
[/quote]
I like this quote because it really brings into question what sort of power we're dealing with here, we KNOW 3d printing will be abused and Defense Distributed is doing a great job at whistle blowing. However, i really wish they'd allow them to continue, this could be incredibly fascinating.
I can understand revoking the lease on the 3d printer if someone intends on building something that could possibly kill them.
Is having 3D printer tech going to make the world explode with all these new guns that governments wont be able to track and regulate?
No.
Anyone with access to materials can build whatever they want, given they know what they are doing.
Idea: a website with approved models to be printed, and access to print your own homemade models with a license? That way people might be able to monitize their creations (if they'd like) while maintaining some control over who can print what. It'd be funny to see someone pirate a shape though :v:
snip
I would expect them to seize someone's 3-D printer for printing a new 3-D printer.
[QUOTE=Scar;37887067]If people abuse this technology to murder someone, punish them, don't collectively restrict everyone from using it simply because of the possibility of it being abused[/QUOTE]
That's what we've been trying to tell people about guns themselves for pretty much forever now, but as it turns out thought policing is perfectly acceptable in cases where you aren't personally the one being punished.
You know, I never actually thought of printing guns with a 3D printer.
[QUOTE=FunnyBunny;37896410]This is really stupid.
On top of all of the people have already stated, it's stupid because it's not going to prevent anything.
There's 2 types of gun crime:
1. Wealthy middle aged man kills wife - crime of passion
2. Gang crime/poor neighborhoods - Compton, Detroit, etc. - man gets killed for $80 in his wallet
The thing is, you're never going to prevent #1. There's nothing you can do to watch for it; the only way you could possibly stop it is removing all guns altogether. And that's even more absurd, because at this point it's virtually impossible to remove all the guns that are in circulation in this country, and because if he doesn't have a gun the guy would just use a knife instead.
The thing that you can prevent is #2. As a rule of thumb, the only way to prevent this crime is by improving the way of life. You have to make the area richer, both in education and economically. People like to act like banning guns will help, but the underground market will still exist for firearms.
Banning 3-D printed guns will only 'stop' type #1 crimes. (I use that term loosely because let's face it, if a guy wants to kill his wife, he'll find a way). 3D printers are incredibly expensive. Not only are they themselves expensive ($10,000+), but so is the material they print.
This is a picture of something that I printed a couple weeks ago.
The opaque tan structure is the one that was actually printed. It was printed in 3 separate pieces to make it as cheap as possible and to minimize on filler material. This thing is tiny, and it cost me $65 to print.(I didn't go through some 3rd party printing company that made a massive profit from this, $65 was the absolute cost of the raw material required to print this) This one is made of plastic, it would shatter if you tried to make a gun from it and fire a bullet. Printing an entire handgun out of this stuff would probably cost you ~$750-$1000.
And that's only plastic. Metal printers are significantly further back in their development. I have no idea how much a metal printer costs, but I can imagine it's significantly more expensive than a plastic one. On top of that, the material itself would be significantly more expensive as well. Once again I have no Idea how much it would actually cost, but I can imagine it being in the $2000+ range, for a [B]handgun[/B]. This is also not mentioning that 3d printed metal that is laid down layer by layer is significantly weaker than metal that was cast and machined for the explicit purpose of being a gun.
On the streets you can get stolen handguns for $100-200. (An actual legal handgun from the store will go for $400-$500)
Since we've established that the only kind of crime we can consider stopping is poverty/gang crime, it comes down to:
1. Know a guy on the streets who owns a metal 3D printer, who will print you a handgun, for ~$2500 (he's gotta make a profit off you), which will be weaker and generally less reliable than a real handgun... or...
2. Get an actual handgun from some guy on the streets for <$200, 10-15 times cheaper.
The politicians that are talking about this are full of shit. This is nowhere near to being an actual problem. I for one am very excited for this. Right now the consumers are restricted to the selection of guns that companies manufacture. With CAD software at people's disposal and crowdsourcing, we might see even better/more efficient guns that simply cannot be machined (There are objects that are impossible to machine from one piece but are extremely easy to print), or just cool looking, 1 of a kind guns. For those who can afford it, of course.
[B]TLDR:[/B] Crimes of passion cannot be stopped. The only crime banning gun printing could possibly stop is crime due to poverty. However, printing guns is extremely expensive, so this law would be totally useless as you can buy an actual stolen gun off the streets for 10x cheaper.
[B]EDIT: [/B]I didn't include premeditated plots in the types of gun crime because if someone actually takes the time to properly plan a murder, no amount of regulations is going to help you find them.
[editline]3rd October 2012[/editline]
In reality you wouldn't even need anyone to release the files. You can sit down with a gun and one of [URL="http://www.amazon.com/Titan-23175-Electronic-Digital-Caliper/dp/B000B8XYV8"]these[/URL] and pump out a near-exact replica in a day. In fact, it would probably take longer to print the gun than it would to make a CAD model of one.[/QUOTE]
AR15 lowers don't handle a whole lot of pressure and are pretty commonly made of regular old ABS plastic
Oh no those intercity thugs are gonna be printing guns. and all they would need is a prohibitively expensive machine, this will be a much bigger problem than homemade/stolen/smuggled guns!
[QUOTE=latin_geek;37888518][IMG]http://englishrussia.com/images/chechen_weapons/9.jpg[/IMG]
ban hardware stores, basic tools.
The problem here is that the guy intended to publish the design of a gun and print it without any sort of license to do so, and the company seized the printer fearing they'd get caught in the whole legal ordeal when it happened.
If someone wants to make a gun and has enough need for it, they'll make one out of common stuff, or even print some parts off the internet (the files for an AR-15 are up there, and that plus a trip to a hardware store = a fuckin' assault rifle). 3D-printing guns just makes the whole ordeal much easier.[/QUOTE]
You can find blueprints or plans for all sorts of guns out there, information isn't illegal.
[url]http://www.cncguns.com/downloads.html[/url]
You just need to be wealthy enough to afford the machinery and skilled enough to build them.
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