AP: UK to expel Israeli diplomat over Dubai case - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Gmod_Fan77;20926473]The Palestinians already had a sizeable chunk of land, even after Israel became a nation.[/QUOTE] So did czechoslovakia :downs: Palestinians were forced out of their homes because of a stupid foreign mandate that let them have no word in. Jews had already been living in the area along with nearly every other major religion. There is no logic to creation of a jewish state, other then imperialism. I don't care what size the chunk of land was (though they ended up just herding them into ghettos anyway), it wasn't compensation for violating the right to self-determination. The creation of an all encompassing state that didn't declare allegiance to any book was entirely possible (the fucking foundations for it were already set). Imperialism and zionism destroyed that possibility with arrogance and hostility. There is no justification for the creation of Israel. Just as there would not be any justification to the creation of a Christian state of Jerusalem, or a Muslim state.

[QUOTE=Hypocrite;20926692]They didn't back then, I'm talking about during the first few immigration waves.[/QUOTE] Yeah, but [i]I'm not[/i].

[QUOTE=Hypocrite;20926352]Russia invaded Georgia because they believe they somehow are entitled to the land. You know that Georgia was originally part of the USSR? When they split Georgia chose to leave Russia and become an semi-independent state. Please don't spout any crap about the war being to 'protect' Ossetia. Because that's sure not how it looked to me.[/QUOTE] Except the truth is that most citizens in South Ossetia hold Russian passports and as such are [b]Russian citizens[/b]. Russia intervened when Georgia began to shell the Capital of South Ossetia with god knows how much artillery, killing many [b]Russian Citizens[/b], the reason it didn't look like that to you is because you're an idiot.

[QUOTE=Gmod_Fan77;20926687]You're saying this is all Israel's fault. Israel got attacked by Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Palestine, and a few others (I think) almost instantly as they got independence, and they were backed by the fucking Soviet Union. Israel didn't start the aggressions, the other nations did. Israel is probably taking things too far, I admit, but they aren't entirely at fault here.[/QUOTE] Read my post. Hypocrite already said all the things you're saying, and my post was in answer to them.

[QUOTE=Conscript;20926709]So did czechoslovakia :downs: Palestinians were forced out of their homes because of a stupid foreign mandate that let them have no word in. Jews had already been living in the area along with nearly every other major religion. There is no logic to creation of a jewish state, other then imperialism. I don't care what size the chunk of land was (though they ended up just herding them into ghettos anyway), it wasn't compensation for violating the right to self-determination. The creation of an all encompassing state that didn't declare allegiance to any book was entirely possible (the fucking foundations for it were already set). Imperialism and zionism destroyed that possibility with arrogance and hostility. There is no justification for the creation of Israel. Just as there would not be any justification to the creation of a Christian state of Jerusalem, or a Muslim state.[/QUOTE] Palestinians are not all arabs and muslims and alot of arabs also immigrated into palestine at the same time. [editline]12:18AM[/editline] [QUOTE=Incognito;20926731]Except the truth is that most citizens in South Ossetia hold Russian passports and as such are [b]Russian citizens[/b]. Russia intervened when Georgia began to shell the Capital of South Ossetia with god knows how much artillery, killing many [b]Russian Citizens[/b], the reason it didn't look like that to you is because you're an idiot.[/QUOTE] oh come on, you have to know how the russians act in chechnya, this is the same shit different place. Anyone with half a brain can see the Russians only used it as an excuse to try and sieze control of Georgia. And now that I think about it, that doesn't make sense either. Isn't South Ossetia IN Georgia?

[QUOTE=Hypocrite;20926816]Palestinians are not all arabs and muslims and alot of arabs also immigrated into palestine at the same time.[/QUOTE] I never said they were. That wasn't the point. The point was islam, christianity, and judaism all lived in one society without quarrel until zionism created an opportunity for a western puppet. [QUOTE=Hypocrite;20926816]oh come on, you have to know how the russians act in chechnya, this is the same shit different place. Anyone with half a brain can see the Russians only used it as an excuse to try and sieze control of Georgia. And now that I think about it, that doesn't make sense either. Isn't South Ossetia IN Georgia?[/quote] chechnya's situation is entirely different then south ossetia's. after the collapse of the USSR, there were a lot of former soviet citizens who couldn't find citizenship within the new nations that supplemented the USSR. russia offered these people citizenship, and responded when they were attacked. south ossetia is in georgia, but before the collapse of the USSR it was an autonomous oblast. of course this was not recognized by the new government of georgia and they viewed it as simply a part of national georgia. that was the spark of tensions and secessionism in south ossetia of course whether russia's motives were entirely defensive is up to debate. russia maintains a sphere of influence and subduing NATO-oriented georgia is a nice step toward helping it maintain that and fight NATO expansionism. both georgia and russia are in the wrong IMO, and the south ossetians are being used as pawns in a power struggle.

[QUOTE=Conscript;20926888]I never said they were. That wasn't the point. The point was islam, christianity, and judaism all lived in one society without quarrel until zionism created an opportunity for a western puppet.[/QUOTE] Ah, I see what you were trying to say now. [editline]12:23AM[/editline] [QUOTE=TH89;20926727]Yeah, but [i]I'm not[/i].[/QUOTE] I don't know what you're talking about anymore. I need to sleep anyway.

[QUOTE=TH89;20924390]You know what a comparison is, right? It doesn't mean someone is claiming two things are similar in every way. Sometimes, it can be only one way! [img]http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3677532/4r2p0y.jpg[/img][/QUOTE] So a picture of an Isreali holding a sign agains arabs has to do with all the citizen of Israel, right? [img]http://msc.walla.co.il/archive/124049-5.jpg[/img] Look, it's an arabs and he's also a terrorist! thats must mean that all of the arabs are terrorists! Exactly the same thing.

[QUOTE=Ker‎o;20927113]So a picture of an Isreali holding a sign agains arabs has to do with all the citizen of Israel, right? Look, it's an arabs and he's also a terrorist! thats must mean that all of the arabs are terrorists! Exactly the same thing.[/QUOTE] [url]http://www.facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=908793[/url]

[QUOTE=TH89;20927175][url]http://www.facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=908793[/url][/QUOTE] Uh, you really can't count on survey that was taken only in a few schools, and don't even say the exact amount except for "almost half of".

[QUOTE=Ker‎o;20927324]Uh, you really can't count on survey that was taken only in a few schools, and don't even say the exact amount except for "almost half of".[/QUOTE] It does, if you [i]actually bother to read the article[/i]. [quote]In response to the question of whether Arab citizens should be granted rights equal to that of Jews, 49.5 percent answered in the negative.[/quote]

[QUOTE=TH89;20927376]It does, if you [i]actually bother to read the article[/i].[/QUOTE] You are right, I only read the first 2 paragraphs. Anyway, I'm still with my first claim.

[quote]The poll was commissioned last month by Maagar Mochot, an Israeli research institution, under the supervision of Prof. Yitzhak Katz. It took a sampling of 536 Jewish and Arab respondents between the ages of 15-18.[/quote] [url]http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1155627.html[/url] Paragraph six.

536 is a pretty decent sample size. Even if the nationwide number is somewhat above or below, it's still appallingly high.

[QUOTE=TH89;20927560]536 is a pretty decent sample size. Even if the nationwide number is somewhat above or below, it's still appallingly high.[/QUOTE] Well nomatter what I say you'll bring your articles and stuff, but I tell you as a citizen that there are load of people here who are pro-palastines, and most of the ones who aren't are people who live in places where the arabs lunch missiles to, other than arab nations where you hate Israel even if it do nothing.

[QUOTE=Ker‎o;20927631]Well nomatter what I say you'll bring your articles and stuff, but I tell you as a citizen that there are load of people here who are pro-palastines, and most of the ones who aren't are people who live in places where the arabs lunch missiles to.[/QUOTE] Being a citizen doesn't really give you more credibility. It's like saying I AM CITIZEN OF CHINA AND THERE LOTS GOOD FREEDOM OF SPEECH HERE.

[QUOTE=Ker‎o;20927631]Well nomatter what I say you'll bring your articles and stuff, but I tell you as a citizen that there are load of people here who are pro-palastines, and most of the ones who aren't are people who live in places where the arabs lunch missiles to, other than arab nations where you hate Israel even if it do nothing.[/QUOTE] haha wow So what you're saying is, that no matter how many of those pesky "facts" he brings into the discussion, you know better than him because you do. And Palestinians lunch missiles at you. Okay.

[QUOTE=TH89;20927674]Being a citizen doesn't give you more credibility, it just means you're more likely to be biased.[/QUOTE] Not really. The net is flood with logos and stickers calling you to come to Belin an protest, you see it in all of the media, most of the newspapers editors are pro-arabs, you can really feel it's strong. You are just affected by the media, I am affected by the everyday life.

[QUOTE=Ker‎o;20927758]Not really. The net is flood with logos and stickers calling you to come to Belin an protest, you see it in all of the media, most of the newspapers editors are pro-arabs, you can really feel it's strong. You are just affected by the media, I am affected by the everyday life.[/QUOTE] Not really. Personal experience doesn't really help when you're talking on a national level. Unless you're trying to imply that you have met and know the stances of tens of thousands of people from every individual area in the country. [editline]12:58AM[/editline] See, feeling something and knowing the facts about something are two different things. It doesn't really matter what you've come to "feel".

[QUOTE=Mr. Mcguffin;20927705]haha wow So what you're saying is, that no matter how many of those pesky "facts" he brings into the discussion, you know better than him because you do. And Palestinians lunch missiles at you.[/QUOTE] Goddamn Palestinians. [img]http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3677532/lunch.jpg[/img] [editline]02:00AM[/editline] [QUOTE=Ker‎o;20927758]You are just affected by the media, I am affected by the everyday life.[/QUOTE] The media can be so inconvenient when it tells people what is happening, can't it? A girl from my town went to Israel, to be "affected by the everyday life." Your military [i]crushed her with a bulldozer[/i].

[QUOTE=TH89;20927855]Goddamn Palestinians. [img]http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3677532/lunch.jpg[/img] [editline]02:00AM[/editline] The media can be so inconvenient when it tells people what is happening, can't it? A girl from my town went to Israel, to be "affected by the everyday life." Your military [i]crushed her with a bulldozer[/i].[/QUOTE] You've got to admit, when it comes to being evil in a Machiavellian way, they really do go for the gold.

[QUOTE=JDK721v2;20926599]Murdering thousands of Palestinians isn't genocide?[/QUOTE] No? Systematic slaughter is genocide. Provide to me proof that there is systematic slaughter based on ethnicity and I'll change my viewpoint.

[QUOTE=Gmod_Fan77;20924047]If you actually knew Israel's history and how it's been treated, you'd be defending them too. Israel was dispersed brutally by the Assyrian Empire, and more recently assimilated into the Turkish (Ottoman) Empire then later the British Empire. Jews were frequently the targets of brutality by the Russia in the pre-Lenin era also. Post-WW2, after the Jewish people were targeted for extermination by Hitler, Britain gave Israel independence to provide the Jews with a safe haven. Around the time Israel became a nation, they were almost immediately converged on by several Soviet-backed Middle East nations (which Israel proceeded to beat the shit out of in the war), and now, after suffering for thousands of years at the hands of about every nation in the area, all Israel is asking for is their land back..[/QUOTE] lol, I'm Jewish you tool. I've actually BEEN to Israel. I doubt you have. I know the history of my people very well, because I, uh, you know, kind of HAD to learn it? and I used to suport Israel. So again, bite your tongue It's not their fucking land. They retaliated after fucking Ben-gorien slaughtered innocent settlers and farmers. They aren't asking for their land back, they're fucking flinging chemicals and bombs at innocent people and then taking the land. [editline]02:24AM[/editline] [QUOTE=Gmod_Fan77;20924241]No one's gone to the Middle East countries demanding them to be peaceful. You know, Israel may be acting aggressive in the Middle East, but the starting aggression in 1947 wasn't their fault, but the other countries', and even know Israel's not the only one of the countries in the area to blame for the conflict.[/QUOTE] actually it was, you ignorant bastard. [editline]02:29AM[/editline] [QUOTE=Regulas021;20928290]No? Systematic slaughter is genocide. Provide to me proof that there is systematic slaughter based on ethnicity and I'll change my viewpoint.[/QUOTE] pretty much the insanely high civilian death toll?

[QUOTE=TH89;20927560]536 is a pretty decent sample size. Even if the nationwide number is somewhat above or below, it's still appallingly high.[/QUOTE] Tens of millions of people, and you think 536 represents the general opinion?

[QUOTE=Gmod_Fan77;20928640]Tens of millions of people, and you think 536 represents the general opinion?[/QUOTE] Do you know what sample means?

[QUOTE=Warhol;20928344]So again, bite your tongue [/QUOTE] nou [quote]actually it was, you ignorant bastard. [/QUOTE] So the brutal actions of a Middle Eastern alliance against one nation only shortly after it even came into existence ISN'T said alliance's fault, but Israel's? [editline]09:40PM[/editline] I also see people fail to mention the missile attacks Palestine conducted against Gaza in the last year or so. [editline]09:41PM[/editline] [QUOTE=Conscript;20928680]Do you know what sample means?[/QUOTE] So you honestly believe because 536 people (only 49.5% of the total number of people asked) said they didn't think Arabs should have rights, that means ALL of Israel thinks the same thing?

uhhhh, ben-gorien brought upon Israel. Palestine never attacked Gaza... you have no idea what you're talking about, it's hillarious

[QUOTE=Gmod_Fan77;20928683] So you honestly believe because 536 people (only 49.5% of the total number of people asked) said they didn't think Arabs should have rights, that means ALL of Israel thinks the same thing?[/QUOTE] Obviously not if it's only 49.5%. But I as for a projection that a significant amount of israelis are xenophobic towards arabs, yes. Though that's not much of a surprise. also I like how this is the only reply I ever got from you.

[QUOTE=Warhol;20928344]pretty much the insanely high civilian death toll?[/QUOTE] Which could be said of many occupations, wars and conflicts in the past. Once again, provide proof of a systematic slaughter of a group of people based on their ethnicity, and not simply their location. Considering many Palestinians live in Israel and aren't being interfered with in any way, it doesn't apply. In order for such an act to condemn a government, prove it takes place on a national level or is in some way sanctioned by their government. Until then, its a high civilian death toll.

[QUOTE=Regulas021;20928825]Which could be said of many occupations, wars and conflicts in the past. Once again, provide proof of a systematic slaughter of a group of people based on their ethnicity, and not simply their location. Considering many Palestinians live in Israel and aren't being interfered with in any way, it doesn't apply. In order for such an act to condemn a government, prove it takes place on a national level or is in some way sanctioned by their government. Until then, its a high civilian death toll.[/QUOTE] I wanted to stay outside this but. [QUOTE]Genocide is the deliberate and systematic destruction, in whole or in part, of an ethnic, racial, religious, or national group.[/QUOTE]