• Dark Souls II to be more Punishing
    237 replies, posted
[QUOTE=PieClock;42240807]Not everyone is great at PvP. [B]Great thing about this is it will pull a few more guys like you who aren't good at pvp into the experience. [/B] If they do this though they really do need to make online more secure than it is at the minute.[/QUOTE] And it determines player skill level how? If it's anything like the last games, soul level means nothing in relation to skill. DSP can grind up to SL 90+ while hardcore players who PvP on occasion can be running around at SL 1. Plot progression doesn't matter because bad players can still finish the game and experts can be doing another playthrough. If it's based on successful invasions, what stops the system from mistaking me for a good player if I get a bunch of bad invaders, and then ends up throwing in xXPRAISE_THE_SUNXx_420 who's running his SL 15 Enchanted Armor of Khazfuckistan build who immediately fucks up my shit when I least expect it?
[QUOTE=CommanderPT;42240826]My heart seriously can't handle being invaded. I love Demon's Souls and Dark Souls. Two of my favorite games. But god damn my heart rate goes up like fuck knowing that some asshole just got into my game with the sole intention of shitting on my day.[/QUOTE] I get the same thing. After I see that fog wall go up, I panic. I usually end up dying because these assholes are built to invade and kill people.
ENB covered this in one of his videos. There is covenant that is built around getting help when someone invades your world. So you join that covenant, and whenever someone invades you, people from a separate coop covenant are summoned into your world to help you deal with the invader. Really cool concept, I think.
[QUOTE=evilweazel;42240900]ENB covered this in one of his videos. There is covenant that is built around getting help when someone invades your world. So you join that covenant, and whenever someone invades you, people from a separate coop covenant are summoned into your world to help you deal with the invader. Really cool concept, I think.[/QUOTE] And they can suck and get killed, or they can be trolls and [I]purposely[/I] suck and get killed.
good change, there wasn't much of a reason to go human in dark souls unless you were doing PVP or needed help with a boss, doesn't seem like it'll be much harder [QUOTE=KmScMT;42240648]there IS NO humanity[/QUOTE] oh no there's another thing that's pretty much the same thing
[QUOTE=Rellow;42240908]And they can suck and get killed, or they can be trolls and [I]purposely[/I] suck and get killed.[/QUOTE] Bad luck happens. People could always try getting better at the game, as well.
That's good, actually adds some actual challenge now. I love playing the game online anyways, it's more fun when there's more challenge.
[QUOTE=Rellow;42240858]And it determines player skill level how? If it's anything like the last games, soul level means nothing in relation to skill. DSP can grind up to SL 90+ while hardcore players who PvP on occasion can be running around at SL 1. Plot progression doesn't matter because bad players can still finish the game and experts can be doing another playthrough. If it's based on successful invasions, what stops the system from mistaking me for a good player if I get a bunch of bad invaders, and then ends up throwing in xXPRAISE_THE_SUNXx_420 who's running his SL 15 Enchanted Armor of Khazfuckistan build who immediately fucks up my shit when I least expect it?[/QUOTE] First off you're giving too much credit to Dark Souls PvP'ers. It's really not that difficult. Secondly, it doesn't determine player skill - my point was that hopefully there will be more new players so it's not always "hardcore" players invading others. Also, there's changes to accommodate this too. If you're not comfortable fighting in PvP alone there's a convenient that you can join that will summon another player to help you when you're invaded. If you're still an absolute pussy about joining in on the fun online then maybe you're not playing the right game / don't sign into your online service.
people act as though being invaded is some terrible calamity of the end of time or something. even if you suck so much shit that you can't defend yourself you don't lose anymore than you would if you died any other way. [editline]19th September 2013[/editline] if you seriously can't handle online play then just disconnect yourself. it's not forcing you to be interactive.
I like being able to see ghosts and read messages. It makes the game less empty. I don't care for PvP at all, though.
Why would you punish the player even more, in a game designed to kill you a lot you shouldn't be severely punished for dying. I was probably gonna get DS2, but this made me reconsider.
Ok, in a game that's heavily reliant on trial and error to learn and eventually succeed, they're going to punish you for the way they designed their game. Christ, that's going to be rough on the first-timers.
[QUOTE=Fatfatfatty;42241052]Why would you punish the player even more, in a game designed to kill you a lot you shouldn't be severely punished for dying. I was probably gonna get DS2, but this made me reconsider.[/QUOTE] wow. weak. on another note this is fantastic, seeing as I don't think the first dark souls wasn't difficult enough, this'll mean a great deal to those who're actively pursuing a better challenge in a video game.
to be honest i dont see the problem with this if you play enough, you're bound to get static humanity(ones that you pick up, not consume) while you're in undead form. let's say you die as an undead, and reach a point where your HP is kinda pathetic. as long as you remember to have retrieval after each death then you'll always be fairly fine since you can just reactivate humanity. also it's really just part of the game anyways
sounds hardcore as shit, kinda like demon's souls soul form but worse. my body is ready
[QUOTE=Laferio;42241071]wow. weak. on another note this is fantastic, seeing as I don't think the first dark souls wasn't difficult enough, this'll mean a great deal to those who're actively pursuing a better challenge in a video game.[/QUOTE] this. I was fairly new to dark souls and only started playing it since a few months ago, and it's the single most rewarding game I've played through its difficulty. I feel that DSII is being made for those that actually truly enjoy DS for what it is, and are seeking more of an actual challenge.
I also feel that it doesn't spoon feed you any type of lore/objectives, I mean it wasn't until halfway through the first dark souls I realized what I was doing. It simply felt like a great roller coaster ride.
[QUOTE=Fatfatfatty;42241052]Why would you punish the player even more, in a game designed to kill you a lot you shouldn't be severely punished for dying. I was probably gonna get DS2, but this made me reconsider.[/QUOTE] If this scares you off, never play Demon's Souls. At least in this your health gets lowered as you die, but in Demon's Souls if you weren't human then your max HP would be halved. And you know what? It really wasn't that bad at all.
I'm not saying the game is at fault, it's just that PvP in dark souls is about as fun as a beesting to the dick, more often than not you will meet a hacker or a twink. I never invested many weeks into the game, so I got fucked up rather quickly by people who played it since launch/hacks.
get better at PvP.
Personally, I never ran into any hackers or had problems with twinks. But if that really is a huge problem, I think it'd be neat if the benefits for invading were more useful for the average player. That way the amount of hackers and twinks invading shouldn't be too common.
The problem lies in that the enemies have so much more experience about the game in general, if someone has invested 400 hours into dark souls they will completly wreck someone who has invested just 50, and listening to you guys, the only reasonable solution is to ignore sleep and need for food and play until you yourself have 400 hours of experience. I played dark souls for the story, not for the PvP, I enjoyed the cooperative mode, but sometimes there would always be a dickbee invading and ruining your everything. Might as well play the game without the ethernet cable in then.
The worst part about invasions in dark souls is that pretty much all players that aren't high level, are on NG+ and did a SL1 run with super awesome gear by the time they get to the NG+ This was really unbalanced for lower level invasions since pretty much 100% of the time if you were invaded before you got Sen's Fortress (not counting the catacombs and forest), it was by a twink with uber gear and a skillset to match it. What they need to do in DS2 is not only make invasions based on your level but the "overall level" of your items as well. So someone who is level 1 but with end game or otherwise impossible to get gear for that level would instead register as level 30 or so, and as such only be able to invade players in the level 20-40 ranges. But a level 50 player who is using gear at around level 50 would still register as level 50 Thats why being invaded was a pain in the ass for half the game in dark souls - because most of the time it was just gonna be a twink. Of course being invaded at mid level is fun because generally the twinks stop bothering at that point so you get invaded by standard players most of the time, and being invaded at high level is fun because its straight up dual of the fates shit.
invading phantoms are literally part of the plot so you're just going to have to accept it or wuss out
Honestly this does sound like a really dumb idea. I like the online features of Dark Souls because it was a very risk versus reward scenario. You used humanity to get more rare items, but you also risk getting murdered by other players. It was good because you had a choice when it came to participating in it. But now it's not risk/reward, it just sounds really obnoxious. Why the hell would I play a game where anybody could show up just to fuck me over any time they feel like it, especially a game that's meant to be this difficult? Just because you like PvP doesn't mean every player does, and it certainly doesn't mean every player should be forced into it at all times.
[QUOTE=Fatfatfatty;42241165]The problem lies in that the enemies have so much more experience about the game in general, if someone has invested 400 hours into dark souls they will completly wreck someone who has invested just 50, and listening to you guys, the only reasonable solution is to ignore sleep and need for food and play until you yourself have 400 hours of experience. I played dark souls for the story, not for the PvP, I enjoyed the cooperative mode, but sometimes there would always be a dickbee invading and ruining your everything. Might as well play the game without the ethernet cable in then.[/QUOTE] Well the thing is with dark souls is that even at high level mistakes are lethal. While an experienced player will know the ropes much more than one who does not, a sword stabbing you in the back or taking a hit on you still hurts like a bitch no matter what level unless you are using high level gear (in which case, you are twinking). Thats what makes dark souls' combat so good. At no point are you a complete god that steamrolls everything, because even low level enemies can wreck your shit if you are careless. Including, low level players. The problem is when those players use their skill to twink high end gear while remaining at low level, making their effective level much higher than it really is, and then do that to prey on level 1-20 players
[QUOTE=KorJax;42241206]Well the thing is with dark souls is that even at high level mistakes are lethal. While an experienced player will know the ropes much more than one who does not, a sword stabbing you in the back or taking a hit on you still hurts like a bitch no matter what level unless you are using high level gear (in which case, you are twinking). Thats what makes dark souls' combat so good. At no point are you a complete god that steamrolls everything, because even low level enemies can wreck your shit if you are careless. Including, low level players. The problem is when those players use their skill to twink high end gear while remaining at low level, making their effective level much higher than it really is, and then do that to prey on level 1-20 players[/QUOTE] I know dark souls, I have it and I played it through.
[QUOTE=Moustacheman;42240273]Dark Souls was like a spanking compared to this, I'm guessing. Will they go whole fist? Let's hope so.[/QUOTE] let's just hope there's lube DLC
I liked dark souls art style and combat, but honestly the whole dying constantly, having to reload at last checkpoint thing just didn't appeal to me. Will probably sit this one out Also, consolitis of the ages, dark souls didn't give a [I]fuck[/I]
[QUOTE=Whatsinaname;42241199]Honestly this does sound like a really dumb idea. I like the online features of Dark Souls because it was a very risk versus reward scenario. You used humanity to get more rare items, but you also risk getting murdered by other players. It was good because you had a choice when it came to participating in it. But now it's not risk/reward, it just sounds really obnoxious. Why the hell would I play a game where anybody could show up just to fuck me over any time they feel like it, especially a game that's meant to be this difficult? Just because you like PvP doesn't mean every player does, and it certainly doesn't mean every player should be forced into it at all times.[/QUOTE] Being human had no effect on item rarity (your humanity counter did though, up to 10 humanity). The only bonus being human had in Dark Souls was that it let you be invaded (including by NPCs, nessciary to get certain special gearsets), and it let you summon other players to co-op in missions with, and it let you kindle bonfires to give you extra healing flasks whenever you respawn or rest there. Which is a great advantage, but if you had the capability to beat bosses on your own you could pretty much avoid the risk of invasion by simply choosing to no co-op, and you only need to be human for a brief moment to kindle the bonfire permanently. I do wish though that they make it so if you are undead, your invasion range is smaller (i.e. you can only be invaded by people within 3 levels of you instead of 10) and your invasion timer is much bigger (only a max of 1 invasion every 30 minutes instead of 10-15). So there is still a higher risk for being human over being undead. [editline]19th September 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=hypno-toad;42241233]I liked dark souls art style and combat, but honestly the whole dying constantly, having to reload at last checkpoint thing just didn't appeal to me. Will probably sit this one out Also, consolitis of the ages, dark souls didn't give a [I]fuck[/I][/QUOTE] Eh, how dark souls handles death is part of the game. Thats part of its brilliance - dieing is apart of the design and it isn't some kind of end all "you lose!" failure state. The only time you truly lose is when you make the same mistake (death) twice in a row without going to get your souls, and even then its a small loss you take when that happens rather than a "reload a previous save" like it is in most games.
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