Fewer drivers pick the stick: The increasingly rare manual - Polidicks

Dunno about other cars cause not much else interests me but a manual transmission shaves about $1000 off the price tag of a Ford Focus or Mazda 3. I'd have more fun in a manual and also have an extra thousand to put towards options.

i rarely meet anyone that drives an auto. its weird when i have to drive someones car and it isn't a manual

[QUOTE=Viva;51185366]Philadelphia is where i live. I also work a county over which is mostly heavily hilled farm land but still densely populated.[/QUOTE] Lancaster? [editline]10th October 2016[/editline] Also, to everyone is talking about commuting in any city. [B]Why are you driving in a fucking city!?[/B]

[QUOTE=Swilly;51186013]Also, to everyone is talking about commuting in any city. [B]Why are you driving in a fucking city!?[/B][/QUOTE] Because I live in a city and work outside it? What kind of a question is that, lots of people have to go into, out of, or through a city. If you live in a city and work in the same city then biking or public transit might be viable if that's what you're getting at, but that's not an option in many cases. [editline]11th October 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=J!NX;51185932]who here knows how to use manual but still prefers auto, anyways?[/QUOTE] Me, when it's a decent automatic. I'll take my DSG'd GTI over a manual one any day (and can even run it in manumatic mode with paddle shifters if I really want), but I'd grudgingly take a manual over a four-speed 80s slushbox. It's all about the implementation.

[QUOTE=J!NX;51185932]who here knows how to use manual but still prefers auto, anyways?[/QUOTE] learned how to drive in a manual but drive an auto. i get what everyone means when they say that driving a manual is more interesting, engaging and fun, but i just drive to get from one place to another so an auto is better in literally every single way for me.

[QUOTE=TestECull;51184256]Shame, too, they're better in literally every way you can think of to the automatics in use today. CVT? Drone drone drone drone drone, TC slip wastes shittons of gas, wear out quick. Planetary automatic? TC slip wastes ton of gas, wears out quick, battle between lifespan and smoothness. The smoother it shifts the less lifespan you get out of the bands and clutches(It slips the hell out of them for smooth shifts), more often you have to change the fluid. Rougher it shifts the longer it lasts, but less comfortable. Computer-controlled sequential box: Herky-jerky in parking lots, clutches don't last long, fragile, stupidly expensive. You want good gas mileage? Fun to drive? Harder to steal? More engaging to drive? Less likely to get borrowed? Simpler? Cheaper to buy? Cheaper to maintain? Longer lived? More reliable? More in your control, something that's increasingly slipping away with every new computer added? You ever wonder what it's like to have a backup method to start your own car when the battery or starter doesn't do the trick? Get the stick. Unless you've lost the use of a leg or an arm there is no compelling argument in favor of the auto. And this is coming from someone who's using one every day. Fucking christ do I hate the automatic in my police car. I'm converting the fucking thing to stick at first opportunity. Biggest thing I miss about my old truck, the third pedal.[/QUOTE] Here's a crazy idea: some people just enjoy the convenience. They want to get from A to B without the added effort of a manual. In north america you have to go out of your way to drive a manual and most people just don't care. I can drive one, I can drive all kind of equipment but it makes no difference to me. I don't bitch and whine about how this car is an auto or another is a manual. It is what it is, just adapt to it.

I can understand the appeal of autos but personally, I learned on a manual and unless you have a medical reason that makes it not physically possible to drive a manual, you should learn on one. Learning a manual means you can then drive anything after as you know how both gear types work and it also doesn't restrict what you can buy to drive later on. As for production of cars, a lot are shifting to auto only in the US however its another story in Europe, we get production runs of auto and manuals while the US only gets the automatics, lot of European cars still come with the manual option and pretty sure they still sell well here but the influx of automatics is becoming a lot more common, specially with these quasi automatics that give you the control of a manual but the car does it all for you. Personally when I eventually get a car (gotta love having no money) I'll likely end up with a manual due to what I can afford, automatics are nice and all but there's a point where manuals are your only option when it comes to cost as manual cars are typically cheaper than their automatic variants. Plus I know its likely placebo but I feel like you can get more out of a manual transmission than you can automatic, being able to keep the engine in certain gears for longer or forcing it into higher gears earlier certainly has its advantage, where an auto might shove you into 4th you can use 5th or 6th on a manual and the engine will be fine and the same again in reverse, the auto might decide it wants to stay in 4th but you want to get around something, the auto won't drop a gear but with a manual you can. Its really all down to preference and what you can get, but the appeal of an automatic in traffic is something I can understand and I can also understand the overall appeal on the US market, you guys travel basically by just driving, making that task overall easier certainly has its appeal, plus don't take this wrong but the way you're taught to drive in the US is hilariously bad so again, not surprised that autos are vastly more popular.

[QUOTE=catbarf;51186060]Because I live in a city and work outside it? What kind of a question is that, lots of people have to go into, out of, or through a city. If you live in a city and work in the same city then biking or public transit might be viable if that's what you're getting at, but that's not an option in many cases. [/QUOTE] Unless you work a trade job, public transit should get you in and out of the city with relative ease.

[QUOTE=Viva;51185326]This is my main issue with these threads because people will flock to old ideas that really aren't that true anymore and attack automatic. Theres a growing trend now with a few famous racing drivers buying sports cars with automatics in them. Even they get shit on by these groups and they explain it by saying their job everyday is shifting and changing gears and its nice to have an automatic car to chill out with and not worry. the performance is still there and they still enjoy it but with no worries and with relaxation. I'm debating on buying a genesis coupe but i have minor experience with stick, im still debating on getting stick or automatic for it. Yeah itd be more fun but i also drive 50 minutes to work every day and most my job is driving over an entire county, i'm not sure id want to deal with that and it significantly pisses two of my friends off who lob insults at me for chosing a boring car, for limiting it and making a 3.8l v6 engine act like a 4 speed inline4 and im ruining the car. Yet even across the board the manual versions are shown to be literally a difference of .7 seconds in acceleration. I don't understand why i'm suddenly hitler for considering automatic.[/QUOTE] off topic but if youre set on the genesis coupe get the automatic, ive driven my friends and based on what i experienced and the general online consensus it seems like the manuals that hyundai used in it is just generally awful (floaty, vague feel) anyway, i drove an automatic for the first 4 years after getting my license. it was an 05 and had its share of problems but it wasn't awful. as someone who drives a manual now (because its engaging), my problem with the automatic isnt even a problem with the automatic, its with the fact that the ease of use in driving an automatic car allows people who shouldnt be allowed to drive to do so, and that it means people dedicate less of their attention to actually driving the car. you can't text and drive in a manual (at least not easily)

I'll probably always drive a manual, an automatic motorbike would be weird and seriously give you absolutely no control, and I'd only be owning cars for fun and having the most control over. I only commute to work with my bike anyway due to the fact it's quicker than driving a car, and with lanesplitting I rarely need to shift on my bike anyway. There are some times that I wish I had an auto, mainly when I'm just being super lazy and have to use my car for something that I'd rather take my bike on, but overall couldn't imagine owning an auto.

Column shift is where it's at

Pretty sure it would be a good idea here to get a car with a manual transmission if you want its resell value to be something decent. Right now I only know my boss who drives an automatic on both his private vehicle and the van of our work.

[QUOTE=Swilly;51186013] Also, to everyone is talking about commuting in any city. [B]Why are you driving in a fucking city!?[/B][/QUOTE] 40 minute car drive vs 2 hour bus drive. I'd have to get up at like 3AM to get to work in time for my day shift

[QUOTE=Swilly;51186013]Lancaster? [editline]10th October 2016[/editline] Also, to everyone is talking about commuting in any city. [B]Why are you driving in a fucking city!?[/B][/QUOTE] Because public transport is [b]absolute shithole[/b] in both reliability and the fact that you get tons of other people there, often smelling of yesterday's garbage. Not only does that ruin mood, it also is a health hazard. Not to mention lack of space. I can take whatever I want in my car, can't get more than a backpack on public transport. And I can listen to my own music through stereo rather than earphones which will sound like shit anyway with all the creeps breathing down my neck.

[QUOTE=rndgenerator;51186641]Because public transport is [b]absolute shithole[/b] in both reliability and the fact that you get tons of other people there, often smelling of yesterday's garbage. Not only does that ruin mood, it also is a health hazard. Not to mention lack of space. I can take whatever I want in my car, can't get more than a backpack on public transport. And I can listen to my own music through stereo rather than earphones which will sound like shit anyway with all the creeps breathing down my neck.[/QUOTE] Not quite my experience but hey Really though the road network sucks balls in most European cities, there's nowhere to park, you idle 70% of time. Meanwhile trams arrive in 30 minute intervals at worst, drive on their own rails separate from traffic and have right of way pretty much everywhere they cross. Unless you have to drive between towns to work there's no reason to have a car.

Public transport sucks in the US

[QUOTE=Zombii;51186135]off topic but if youre set on the genesis coupe get the automatic, ive driven my friends and based on what i experienced and the general online consensus it seems like the manuals that hyundai used in it is just generally awful (floaty, vague feel) anyway, i drove an automatic for the first 4 years after getting my license. it was an 05 and had its share of problems but it wasn't awful. as someone who drives a manual now (because its engaging), my problem with the automatic isnt even a problem with the automatic, its with the fact that the ease of use in driving an automatic car allows people who shouldnt be allowed to drive to do so, and that it means people dedicate less of their attention to actually driving the car. you can't text and drive in a manual (at least not easily)[/QUOTE] Skimming the first page of google search had all cases pointing to the fact that Automatic users get into less crashes vs Manual users. This was just a quick search though so if you can find any reputable sources I'd be fine with being proven wrong.

[QUOTE=SuperDuprKyle;51184006]I have a stick and I fucking hate it. Going up hills is actually living hell, I actually fear for my life when I have to stop on a hill and the horror of rolling back and hitting the car behind me. It sucks balls. Also traffic is AWFUL[/QUOTE] Stop on a hill Hit your break Start releasing clutch. Wait for your car to start shaking a bit and stop there Release your break and start accelerating while releasing the clutch fully now Bam, nice work, no problems

[QUOTE=Swilly;51186131]Unless you work a trade job, public transit should get you in and out of the city with relative ease.[/QUOTE] I really wish that were the case, but it's not. In theory I could walk to the metro, take the metro (changing lines at one point), get off at a stop a couple miles from my workplace, and bike the rest of the way, but as much as I hate driving in this area I'd rather do forty minutes in my car than close to two hours by public transit. My case is far from unusual, because public transit is typically focused on bringing people to and from the center of a metropolitan area and not moving around its outskirts. City driving is an unfortunate necessity for many people. And, really, in my case it doesn't get any better when I get out of the city. I live in the DC area, which recently beat out LA for worst traffic in the country. After my last car got totaled on the highway because some jackass in a lifted truck wasn't paying attention to the cars braking in front of him, I find it very hard to enjoy driving when I have to be constantly wary of everyone else on the road. I'm seriously considering changing jobs just to get a shorter commute.

[QUOTE=Swilly;51186131]Unless you work a trade job, public transit should get you in and out of the city with relative ease.[/QUOTE] What kind of ideal utopia do you live in

I don't like how easily tunnel-vision sets in when driving long roads with an automatic. But then again. I'm a fan of more ascetic rides. Like why I'm gonna change next year from my 650cc bike back to a 125cc.

[QUOTE=Citrus705;51183962]I drive a manual[/QUOTE] At last, I have found my people [editline]11th October 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=SuperDuprKyle;51184006]I have a stick and I fucking hate it. Going up hills is actually living hell, I actually fear for my life when I have to stop on a hill and the horror of rolling back and hitting the car behind me. It sucks balls. Also traffic is AWFUL[/QUOTE] To me, it depends on how steep the hill is and what kind of car I'm driving. If I'm on my dad's petrol Punto, any hill will be a burden, because that shit stalls by surprise. If I'm on my diesel A3, only the steepest of hills is a mighty challenge for me, and thats because I pussy out and don't give it enough throttle in fear of breaking something.

[QUOTE=Grenadiac;51183905]The 70s and prior. Automatic transmissions were sluggish on average and very expensive to build so that they could keep up with fast acceleration; a manual and a good driver allowed the '69 Fury with its 383 to get a 5.1 0-60, blindingly fast for a commercially available car at the time. Modern computerized transmissions outpace any human.[/QUOTE] ya like f1 cars rev so fast theyd blow the transmission if they didnt have a computer to flip it

When driving in America I noticed that everyone was starting and stopping in traffic, jolting to a stop after moving 30cm, driving right up the person in front to close the gaps. You just don't get that in England and I think it's because it requires more effort to do with a clutch and it's essentially pointless.

I don't even think about shifting gears when driving. Just happens by itself, the same way you don't need to think about breathing.

[QUOTE=catbarf;51187098]I really wish that were the case, but it's not. In theory I could walk to the metro, take the metro (changing lines at one point), get off at a stop a couple miles from my workplace, and bike the rest of the way, but as much as I hate driving in this area I'd rather do forty minutes in my car than close to two hours by public transit. My case is far from unusual, because public transit is typically focused on bringing people to and from the center of a metropolitan area and not moving around its outskirts. City driving is an unfortunate necessity for many people. And, really, in my case it doesn't get any better when I get out of the city. I live in the DC area, which recently beat out LA for worst traffic in the country. After my last car got totaled on the highway because some jackass in a lifted truck wasn't paying attention to the cars braking in front of him, I find it very hard to enjoy driving when I have to be constantly wary of everyone else on the road. I'm seriously considering changing jobs just to get a shorter commute.[/QUOTE] Not to mention the Metro has been an absolute clusterfuck the past few months.

I had to learn on manual transmissions since that's all my family has ever owned. As of now I've been driving MT for around 11 years and I don't have any plans to own an automatic for the time being. My old Nissans were MT, and my current 05 Subaru Legacy GT is a 5 speed and I love how that car feels. The transmission is a perfect match for that engine, it's a blast to drive for a car with only 250 HP/TQ. Granted I do live in more of a rural area, but even when I have to do some moderate to heavy city driving it doesn't bother me. The clutch can feel a little heavy if it's really bad stop and go traffic, but otherwise I can't complain. I think it's disappointing that MT vehicles are so hard to come by in the US, but that's just how things are. Either way I'm still going to continue enjoying my MT vehicles until I can't find any more of them, since they suit my driving preferences for now. [QUOTE=Rahu X;51185417] Manuals require you to think about your driving, and as such, aren't as easy to drive for most. [/QUOTE] I know this has been responded to, but no. That's not the case at all. Even in heavy traffic you're not going to be thinking about clutch control and upshifting or downshifting, it's all second nature once you get over the initial learning curve.

Autos are a hell of a lot more comfortable when it comes to driving in a city, but manuals are so much more fuel efficient and the exact same car usually accelerates better with a manual box than an auto also if your manual gearbox decides to shit itself you're not nearly as fucked as you would be with an auto box then again, nothing can ever beat the combination of an automatic gearbox, a Torsen quattro pulling on all 4 wheels and a wide open frozen lake covered in fresh snow

[QUOTE=DudesonFan;51187491]but manuals are so much more fuel efficient and the exact same car usually accelerates better with a manual box than an auto[/QUOTE] Again, this used to be the case, but go look up fuel efficiency on CVT-equipped cars versus their manual counterparts. The latest generation is typically around ~5MPG better for the CVT over manual. Then for performance, look at electronic dual-clutch transmissions. They accelerate better because they change gears instantly and don't have to stop applying torque while shifting, and if you want you can use electronic paddle shifters to keep manual control over when it shifts. Then look at an old Civic or something, and you're absolutely right, the manual is just better in every measurable way. Then look at something like a modern Golf, where the seven-speed DSG automatic gets better gas efficiency than the six-speed manual. The point is, things aren't so black-and-white anymore- you have to consider the measured strengths and weaknesses of a particular automatic versus its manual equivalent, because a lot of blanket assumptions no longer apply.

As someone who drives a manual and probably always will, I can safely say it's just one of those things that becomes a part of you. I don't care if I'm stuck in LA traffic for 2 hours working my clutch over and over, I don't even notice I'm doing it. I'd be just as annoyed, if not more, in an auto having to go back and forth from the brake and the accelerator since the car constantly wants to roll forward. However, I have driven more recent DCT's and I have to say they're an absolute blast. There's clearly a lot of people here confusing "paddle shifters" and DCT's - DCT's actually feel like you're driving a manual, there's just no clutch to operate. At least, that's how I felt driving my boss's 2013 M3. I like how at the end of the article it said something to the effect that "your car's next owner will be hard to find because no one drives a manual hur dur", that's a crock of shit. Due to being a smaller statistic, it's a guarantee your car will sell faster and for more than an auto because an enthusiast out there is going to already be looking for one. And for commuting? I'll stick to my motorcycle. Commuting sucks ass in a car in general, doesn't matter if it's auto or manual. I'll get home 30 minutes faster than everyone else, thanks.