[QUOTE=kaine123;42327529]Why do people not like the new controller? It seems like something genuinely unprecedented.[/QUOTE]
"because it isn't like every other controller"
[QUOTE=Grimhound;42327436]The reason many thought it could be HL3 is because we've been left for more than half of a decade on a cliffhanger, and our balls are rather miserably blue at this point. As such, the petty masses will snub everything Valve's announced based on some warped sense of vendetta, and will actively push for Microsoft to give Valve the finger.
People are desperate and dumb.[/QUOTE]
no
you thought it would be HL3 because EVERY TIME valve says they'll announce something, or even says they'll be around something that is announced (fuck, it doesn't even need to be this, a game updating causes people to fly off the side of the earth), people automatically fabricate "evidence" that it'll be HL3, and get caught up in hype based on nothing.
Then they say they won't fall for it again, and valve lied to them, but 2 months later the same thing happens.
[QUOTE=Untouch;42327555]no
you thought it would be HL3 because EVERY TIME valve says they'll announce something, or even says they'll be around something that is announced (fuck, it doesn't even need to be this, a game updating causes people to fly off the side of the earth), people automatically fabricate "evidence" that it'll be HL3, and get caught up in hype based on nothing.
Then they say they won't fall for it again, and valve lied to them, but 2 months later the same thing happens.[/QUOTE]
Please, Valve knows the card and they play it when they want attention. Was a COUNTDOWN really necessary for these announcements?
And I thought slide pads were bad.
[QUOTE=DigitalySane;42326016]I hate trackpads, they're fucking horrible.[/QUOTE]
I don't think these can be considered standard trackpads though, I kind of like the idea behind the controler, should be cool to use
I don't know what all the fuss is. It honestly looks like one of these shitty controllers you get for 'gaming' on your iPod.
hmm this looks pretty neat. Cant wait to see how it performs when someone reviews it. We wont know until then.
I like it. I just think people are hating it for no other reason than the fact that it's a controller, regardless of the fact that it's probably going to be built with quality in mind. Plus it's not like this is your only option for Steambox! You can always hook up a wireless mouse/keyboard or any other usb compatible controller of your choice! This all just seems like whining for the sake of whining.
I think they should not have made an announcement, just ship it with the 300 steam machines, and people would have gone, what the hell is this? when they opened up the box, then posted about how good it works (assuming it does), or how bad it is. Right now we just have a cheap looking picture and a few details..
I'd give it a go, even though I despise the tiny little track-pad on my laptop, I would surly give it a try.
[QUOTE=TheHydra;42326355]lmfao "language of guns" wtf[/QUOTE]
"design language" is a real thing
that guy's still a dink though
[QUOTE=RikohZX;42326376]Apparently pulling triggers on the shoulders of controllers translates to gun triggers.[/QUOTE]
shooters are the very reason there's triggers on controllers, don't tell me someone just randomly thought "shoot I don't like EVERY button to be normal let's just throw some swingy bits on the back for good measure". The N64 joystick/Z trigger felt like they were a last minute addition specifically to add that functionality, and it was kept with the Wii Nunchuck (which became the trigger for the gun peripheral)
[t]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/91/Wii_Zapper-2009-03-12.jpg[/t]
design language carries
This thing looks great. I hope it isn't terribly expensive though.
Looking at the Facebook comments for this is fucking embarrassing. Filled with people crying about how Valve aren't announcing HL3.
[QUOTE=Durrsly;42327542]"because it isn't like every other controller"[/QUOTE]
More like "because the concepts behind things like the track pad and touch screen are, at the moment, novelties and have yet to actually be proven to be any good. track pads are the last thing someone thinks about when it comes to precision movement and having the most PRECISE part of a controller be controlled using a track pad is unsettling"
[QUOTE=daijitsu;42327879] "let's just throw some hinged swingy bits on the back for good measure"[/QUOTE]
This is making me have flashbacks to Bop-it extreme.
[editline]27th September 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=Pandamox;42327900]More like "because the concepts behind things like the track pad and touch screen are, at the moment, novelties and have yet to actually be proven to be any good. track pads are the last thing someone thinks about when it comes to precision movement and having the most PRECISE part of a controller be controlled using a track pad is unsettling"[/QUOTE]
Have you ever used a macbook trackpad? They are fantastic, partly because they have a myriad of gestures supported by osx, but also because they are smooth and easy to use.
[QUOTE=Grasp;42327909]This is making me have flashbacks to Bop-it extreme.[/QUOTE]
crap, knowing the 90's I guess that isn't a far off assumption that it happened by accident :v:
I think they're trying to blur the line between mouse and gamepad.
[QUOTE=Grasp;42327909]This is making me have flashbacks to Bop-it extreme.
[editline]27th September 2013[/editline]
Have you ever used a macbook trackpad? They are fantastic, partly because they have a myriad of gestures supported by osx, but also because they are smooth and easy to use.[/QUOTE]
I have used it and as i've said before i have some [b]big ass thumbs[/b] so doing any precise movements on a small ass track pad, even the macbook ones never turns out well.
I absolutely have confidence that Valve will have researched and tested it thoroughly and the track pads won't be as big as an issue as my previous experiences would lead me to believe, but it doesn't make it any less unsettling
I think if valve is looking at track pads so hard, they must know setting we don't
I really love this idea instead of using joysticks
Joysticks are good for very specific types of games and are kind of shoehorned in for other games but we've just delt with it for ages because the joystick is where the industry started
I really would love to try it first though, I hope they have displays up in gamestops and such. I love that the touchpads are theoretically actually good for mouse-focused games and would give the percision of a mouse without needing a mouse. I do wonder how ergonomic the controller is to actually use for more than a couple of minutes though. And the center-focused buttons make me curious too - normally center buttons on a 360 controller for example are far enough away from your thumbs that you might as well just not use them in normal play, you have to reach specifically for them which isn't good at all. This has such a center focused design I wonder if that'll be an issue. If they make the controller small enough (i.e. I can easily hit the center buttons on some PS3 rock candy third party controller I got which is smaller) then it won't be an issue.
Also their haptic thing doesn't make much sense to me so I really want to feel it for myself and see if it works good or not.
But mostly I'm just glad we are getting away from joysticks. They work good for games like racing, and they are nice ergonomically, but they aren't very precise unless you get seriously good at using them and even then you'll never want to control an RTS with one if you can help it. This looks much better and might be the thing I've always wanted to get PC-like control but for my console or sitting back from my PC.
I wonder how well it would work too with the oculus rift too. Whats cool is that because its hackable theoretically Oculus could make a 3rd party attachment or implementation inside of the controller that you can install yourself to really make it work great with VR.
Precision isn't the only problem, one of the worst things with touch based controls is the lack of physical feedback that you get from analog sticks and buttons.
Well thats why its a beta test. If people dont like then Valve will shelve it and may or may not start again.
[QUOTE=Propane Addict;42325954]HL3 is obviously going to be the SteamBox's release title to drive sales. They know there is no way the console will survive without a bomb to back it up.[/QUOTE]
You are kidding right? I know tons of people who would love to get into PC gaming with the whole PC/indie boom that Steam is enjoying right now but just can't get away from the fact that they've been console gamers all their lives, only want to play on a TV, and don't like the barrier to entry that PC's have with needing to build your own (unless you enjoy being ripped off), cords everywhere, etc.
People are more accepting now than ever for PC gaming and getting past these barriers to entry but this will be the final slice in the pie that'll make PC gaming as equal of an option as picking xbox or PS would be.
Not to mention I would like to get a cheapo steambox just for playing indie games and PC streaming for those games that I would much rather play on a TV like GRID, sleeping dogs or platformers. I would still prefer to play games like Civ V on my PC with a mouse though of course (especially since I like to multitask between turns while playing Civ), but hopefully a controller like this, IF it works out good, will actually allow people who only own a steambox to actually play games like Civ on it.
[editline]27th September 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=Mingebox;42328001]Precision isn't the only problem, one of the worst things with touch based controls is the lack of physical feedback that you get from analog sticks and buttons.[/QUOTE]
Well apparently their haptics system will address that but we'll see how it works
Still though how are these touchpads any more physical than a mouse is? And the joysticks aren't really all that physical either when you get down to it.
People seem to think a touchpad = laptop trackpad
Touchpad tech, materials and design can vary wildly from each other. You simply don't know if this happens to be a design and material that works really damn well for games unlike most touchpad designs. It wouldn't surprise me if they even did something like the Novint Falcon for these pads, where depending on the weight or surface of an item you were moving, shooting, etc the falcon would provide varying degrees of resistence/vibration/etc that made it actually feel like you were moving said item. Though thats a bit of a stretch to do.
[QUOTE=KorJax;42328053]You are kidding right? I know tons of people who would love to get into PC gaming with the whole PC/indie boom that Steam is enjoying right now but just can't get away from the fact that they've been console gamers all their lives, only want to play on a TV, and don't like the barrier to entry that PC's have with needing to build your own (unless you enjoy being ripped off), cords everywhere, etc.
People are more accepting now than ever for PC gaming and getting past these barriers to entry but this will be the final slice in the pie that'll make PC gaming as equal of an option as picking xbox or PS would be.
Not to mention I would like to get a cheapo steambox just for playing indie games and PC streaming for those games that I would much rather play on a TV like GRID, sleeping dogs or platformers. I would still prefer to play games like Civ V on my PC with a mouse though of course (especially since I like to multitask between turns while playing Civ), but hopefully a controller like this, IF it works out good, will actually allow people who only own a steambox to actually play games like Civ on it.[/QUOTE]
They can't just freeload off of older games in order to push a new console though. Look at the Wii-U, their sales were abysmal compared to the Wii and the main reason everyone cites for that is the games. There haven't been any major games on the Wii-U that warrant someone wanting to buy it, you need a game that people WANT to spend hundreds of dollars on a console in order to play - GTA V and The Last Of Us are both fantastic examples. I haven't seen that many people shell out the cash to buy a PS3 [b]only[/b] for one of those games when they were released, the same is going to go for the Steam Machine. If a big game like Portal 3 or HL3 was a launch title for the Steam Machine, there is no doubt sales would be exponentially higher
[QUOTE=Arthamus;42325832]
[t]http://cdn2.store.steampowered.com/public/images/promo/livingroom/rljKewyz3M/controller.jpg[/t][/QUOTE]
Wait, that's the [I]front[/I] of the controller? The way the handles look it looks like it should be the fucking back. Who thought this was a good idea? This looks fucking awful. Have fun playing anything that isn't a shooter with this thing.
But of course because it's Valve that means it's good
[QUOTE=Swilly;42326454]So my finger is going to be vibrating while I'm aiming.
Thanks.[/QUOTE]
Its not vibrations
They are making it sound like you can do vibrations if you wanted to but the complexity of this "haptic feedback" is supposidly advanced enough that you could pretty much emulate all sorts of touch feedback. Like perhaps it detecting when you move your finger while navigating a menu and it apply a soft, subtle "static" or "fuzz" feeling when you move it through how the haptic magnets move and react to that sense.
I really have no idea how it'll work in practice though it doesn't sound anything like haptics in phones or rumble for controllers
[QUOTE=Diet Kane;42328119]Wait, that's the [I]front[/I] of the controller? The way the handles look it looks like it should be the fucking back. Who thought this was a good idea? This looks fucking awful. Have fun playing anything that isn't a shooter with this thing.
But of course because it's Valve that means it's good[/QUOTE]
I can actually see it working pretty well with fighting games, if your key bindings were set right.
[QUOTE=AaronM202;42328215]I can actually see it working pretty well with fighting games, if your key bindings were set right.[/QUOTE]
if you're playing a fighting game with anything other than an arcade stick, you're [I]doing it wrong.[/I]
[QUOTE=Pandamox;42328090]They can't just freeload off of older games in order to push a new console though. Look at the Wii-U, their sales were abysmal compared to the Wii and the main reason everyone cites for that is the games. There haven't been any major games on the Wii-U that warrant someone wanting to buy it, you need a game that people WANT to spend hundreds of dollars on a console in order to play - GTA V and The Last Of Us are both fantastic examples. I haven't seen that many people shell out the cash to buy a PS3 [b]only[/b] for one of those games when they were released, the same is going to go for the Steam Machine. If a big game like Portal 3 or HL3 was a launch title for the Steam Machine, there is no doubt sales would be exponentially higher[/QUOTE]
Console exclusivity for games doesn't really apply to the PC though because there aren't PC generations, and generally you can play any game made for PC on your PC no matter how old it is so there is no issue with backwards compatability (you just might need something like DOSbox).
PC gets tons of exclusive games too, like pretty much every strategy/4X game ever made, simulation games, a bulk of the indie games now-a-days, etc.
There is already a strong interest that people have in PC, they just don't want to bother dropping $600-$700 on parts for a decent PC on top of having to build it (otherwise its closer to $1000 for the PC), dealing with cords, having a giant box, etc. Plus lack of "couch gaming".
You are treating this as if the Steambox and SteamOS are fresh new consoles that run on their own fresh new builds that require games to be specifically made for it, when in fact it already has a big library behind it. The only issue is, if a developer is willing to port to linux to get it. And a lot of older PC games won't work on linux which poses a problem too. It's still completely different to the Wii-U which was a failure largely because of its branding and the fact that for a good year it had a grand total of maybe 50 games you could get for it, not all of them any good.
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