One-third of Valve is currently working on Virtual Reality - Polidicks

[QUOTE=AaronM202;50556298] You know, the dozens of leaks over the past couple of years pointing to the same two games? No? You dont remember all the L4D3 and HL3 stuff?[/QUOTE] define "leak" please

[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;50556159]"Innovating" in regards to video games Why would we discuss medical VR in a thread about Valve's VR team?[/QUOTE] Because Valve is creating and supporting the platform that enables that content. Not to mention they [I]are[/I] innovating in video games, you guys just don't [I]care[/I]. The Lab experiments are the literal definition of innovative and are some of the most clever and well polished VR experiences that existed on launch. They are also video games. Just because you guys aren't interested doesn't mean they're not innovating still, and that's the point of my analogy.

[QUOTE=AaronM202;50556298]Yes as i said, you're basing this off a weird unifinished version used for Dota 2.[/QUOTE] What part of modular makes you think 'unfinished'? Those are non-inclusive things. [QUOTE=AaronM202;50556298]That and what? When people got their hands on the tools people were freaking out about how the limits increased on things like map size and whatnot.[/QUOTE] Yes, that's because they're used to Source. Source 2 is still trash compared to every other modern engine out there. [QUOTE=AaronM202;50556298]You know, the dozens of leaks over the past couple of years pointing to the same two games?[/QUOTE] So your source is basically fuck-all then?

[QUOTE=Hell-met;50556317]define "leak" please[/QUOTE] Theres a lot less pointing to L4D3 i'll admit, but there were those, whatever they were, weird employee team tracker lists that popped up every so often, among the groups listed were for those two. On Half-Life, well, we've had numerous over the past year, including a brand new model of d0g.

I feel like a lot of people still don't quite get how different VR is. I understand a lot of you guys haven't tried it, and not to be condescending but like.. Until you try it, you really can't make big generalizations about VR. Every time there's a VR discussion on Facepunch outside of the dedicated VR thread, at least half of the posts are objectively wrong or just VR101 do's and dont's that people don't understand because they have no first hand experience.

[QUOTE=AaronM202;50556329] On Half-Life, well, we've had numerous over the past year, including a brand new model of d0g.[/QUOTE] You mean the Dog model that was confirmed to have been made for a toy Dog; which was then used for an internal VR test? What does that confirm? You're starved for Half-Life news and you'll literally eat up anything that even looks like Half-Life. You need to relax your belief of 'leaks'. -Edit- [QUOTE=AaronM202;50556344]Yes im sorry that reality bends to your needless cynicism because this company isnt doing what you like as fast as you'd want.[/QUOTE] Yeah, that one.

[QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556328]So your source is basically fuck-all then?[/QUOTE] Yes im sorry that reality bends to your needless cynicism because this company isnt doing what you like as fast as you'd want. [t]http://images.designntrend.com/data/images/full/70072/hlf-life-3-dog-jpg.jpg?w=780[/t] [editline]20th June 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556342]You mean the Dog model that was confirmed to have been made for the toy dog model available on Valve's store; which was then used for an internal VR test?[/QUOTE] That was never confirmed, that was speculation. [QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556342]What does that confirm?[/QUOTE] More than "but they're NOT" [QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556342]You're starved for Half-Life news and you'll literally eat up anything that even looks like Half-Life. You need to relax your belief of 'leaks'.[/QUOTE] Uh, no, im perfectly relaxed, im just not deciding to ignore things that exist because it doesnt further my anger towards a company.

Wasnt the dota 2 editor on source 2 capable of handling extremely high polygon models though that other engines couldn't? I find it odd how pessimistic people are about something which isnt even out the door. Save your judgment for the actual release

ah well I envy AaronM202's pink-tinted glasses, but I hope he'll finally change his mind once we hit the 15 years cap. that said valve is still permanently my favorite company and any news they give is fine. Though it's clear they're falling way behind outside of VR business.

[QUOTE=da space core;50556366]Wasnt the dota 2 editor on source 2 capable of handling extremely high polygon models though that other engines couldn't? I find it odd how pessimistic people are about something which isnt even out the door. [/QUOTE] CryEngine 3 has no actual polygon limit and people have pushed upwards of 100 million polygons on screen realtime (Albeit with exceptionally low framerates). Unreal Engine 4 has a limit of 4 million tris per skeletal mesh.

[QUOTE=Hell-met;50556372]ah well I envy AaronM202's pink-tinted glasses, but I hope he'll finally change his mind once we hit the 15 years cap.[/QUOTE] "Pink-tinted glasses" "starved for information" Can you guys come up with something other than a buzzword statement? You're not really shooting me down here, you're just going "oh well good for that optimistic little child, well back to the real world--" Here, i made a post on why i believe [url=https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1507632&p=50514735&viewfull=1#post50514735]Half-Life has taken so long[/url]. Have fun with that. Just for you.

[QUOTE=AaronM202;50556344] That was never confirmed, that was speculation. [/QUOTE] [url=http://www.preternia.com/2015/03/3a-teases-16-scale-half-life-2-dog/]It's time to calm down.[/url]

[QUOTE=Map in a box;50556171]Except for maintaining their current games, working on VR, and keeping steam working and adding features to it? ~oh no, valve isn't focusing solely on games and is instead diversifying, shame on them on not relying on just games!!!!~[/QUOTE] How dare someone who fell in love with a video game company not like it when they stop releasing games. I am not speaking objectively, I am merely speaking from my point of view, so there's no need to whiteknight for Valve. I'm sick of their current games, it's unreasonable to expect me not to be when they all range from 5-10 years old. I don't care about VR because it's not affordable, and I'm pretty sure my living conditions would limit my experience heavily. And Steam has nothing to do with video game development.

[QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556395][url=http://www.preternia.com/2015/03/3a-teases-16-scale-half-life-2-dog/]It's time to calm down.[/url][/QUOTE] Stop. Cool, it was for an action figure, whatever (Doesnt invalidate the textures found in the VR files for humans, and atleast one or two having HL or L4D3 directories anyway). But stop trying to insinuate that im somehow "freaking out", or whatever. Im just fucking tired of every Valve thread boiling down to: [QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556024]I would argue they have. You forget that a lot of the people that made both Half-Life and Half-Life 2 great have left the company. Valve's last original in-house produced game is Portal 2, which is over 5 years old with nothing new even announced since then.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Swilly;50555416]With 4 competing standards and exvlusives no less! It's life buying a console![/QUOTE] [QUOTE=redBadger;50555270]I haven't liked valve in a long time. They've stopped doing anything remotely interesting in years.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=1/4 Life;50555076]There will never be another Half-Life game.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Mr. N;50555328]I don't care about VR and I never will. It's an expensive gimmick.[/QUOTE] You see this shit? This shit right here? This is every Valve thread now. Because people, despite oh so confidently proclaiming every time they "Dont care about Half-Life" or "they dont care about Valve anymore", it always descends into this shit pile argument involving how they HAVE to point out that Valve isnt catering to their whim at this very moment. Even ignoring actual things that exist to go "no, my pessimism that i must inform everyone about at a moments notice every Valve thread must take precedence" [editline]20th June 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Keychain;50556402]How dare someone who fell in love with a video game company not like it when they stop releasing games. I am not speaking objectively, I am merely speaking from my point of view, so there's no need to whiteknight for Valve. I'm sick of their current games, it's unreasonable to expect me not to be when they all range from 5-10 years old. I don't care about VR because it's not affordable, and I'm pretty sure my living conditions would limit my experience heavily. And Steam has nothing to do with video game development.[/QUOTE] New game engine is made. This means no new games in development. [i]???[/i]

[QUOTE=AaronM202;50556329]Theres a lot less pointing to L4D3 i'll admit, but there were those, whatever they were, weird employee team tracker lists that popped up every so often, among the groups listed were for those two. On Half-Life, well, we've had numerous over the past year, including a brand new model of d0g.[/QUOTE] [thumb]http://www.innersphere.de/wp-content/uploads/source2_logo_cc1.jpg[/thumb]

[QUOTE=AaronM202;50556426] New game engine is made. This means no new games in development. [I]???[/I][/QUOTE] Much like the rest of your arguments: These two things are non-inclusive. Until Valve announces they're working on a game, or something substantial is leaked, the only thing we know is that Dota 2 now runs on Source 2 and Valve is busy with Steam & VR. Not one leak has turned up any substantial information in over 10 years and much of the people that helped create the games you enjoyed are gone. Gabe stated that 'classic games' would require their employees to have a very good reason to create, giving credence to the theory that Valve is now only interested in multiplayer experiences where they can sell in-game content. Portal 2 was deemed a 'failure' in this category because they could not monetize it in the same way TF2 was. As for the citizen textures; those are all you have. You don't even know where they're from. Are they for VR? Were they in Stars of Blood or their test RPG game? New IP? Test content? [QUOTE=zoox;50556443][thumb]http://www.innersphere.de/wp-content/uploads/source2_logo_cc1.jpg[/thumb][/QUOTE] For context, this picture is 3 years old now.

[QUOTE=zoox;50556443]-[/QUOTE] Oh i forgot about that, thanks. The dev tracker thing was something completely different but yeah i forgot about that. [editline]20th June 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556450]Much like the rest of your arguments: These two things are non-inclusive. Until Valve announces they're working on a game, or something substantial is leaked, the only thing we know is that Dota 2 now runs on Source 2 and Valve is busy with Steam & VR. Not one leak has turned up any substantial information in over 10 years. As for the citizen textures; those are all you have. You don't even know where they're from. Are they for VR? Were they in Stars of Blood? New IP? Test content?[/QUOTE] When everything points to them working on something game related, why do you still feel the need to go "they're not doing video games" Must you? Seriously, honest question. If it was any other company, literally ANY other company, people would accept some new game would be coming based on the information we have, but because its big papa Valve, oh no they cant be doing anything it doesnt fit my bitterness at them not catering to me in a couple of years, its all a hoax, its all fake, no you need more proof, no more more more. Why.

[QUOTE=AaronM202;50556453] When everything points to them working on something game related[/QUOTE] You're simply not allowed to argue this until you define what 'everything' is. You presented a Dog model that turned out to be completely the opposite of what you thought it was, and referenced some face textures that could be from anything Valve is doing at this time. Barring a 3 year old picture of a L4D3 issue tracker where it shows them setting up nothing more than a test-bed, where is all this evidence of a new title outside of VR games?

[QUOTE=AaronM202;50556453] If it was any other company, literally ANY other company, people would accept some new game would be coming based on the information we have, but because its big papa Valve, oh no they cant be doing anything it doesnt fit my bitterness at them not catering to me in a couple of years, its all a hoax, its all fake, no you need more proof, no more more more. Why.[/QUOTE] I can't think of a single other company that ever pulled this "be patient" stunt for so long. It's hard to compare when there's only one instance in existence. You get mad at relentless pessimism but you're doing the exact same relentless thing from the other side. Maybe accept that your evidence is shit and cannot turn people to "the good side". You speak like you got some divine wisdom crap.

How many employees does Valve have nowadays? Last time I heard a number, it was just over 100 something, but that was years back.

[QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556503]You're simply not allowed to argue this until you define what 'everything' is. You presented a Dog model that turned out to be completely the opposite of what you thought it was, and referenced some face textures that could be from anything Valve is doing at this time. Barring a 3 year old picture of a L4D3 issue tracker where it shows them setting up nothing more than a test-bed, where is all this evidence of a new title?[/QUOTE] Hm... New engine, designed by a video game developer to develop video games? No, no thats wrong, it cant possibly be for video games. Leaked emails from a company with notoriously long dev cycles proving theres a game in the works? Nah, inconclusive. Leaked code in DOTA 2 updates related to Half-Life with weird new information in it that seem to happen every couple of months? Might as well be confirmation it doesnt exist. Leaked textures in a VR games set on said new video game engine by video game developers designed for video games, pointing to above mentioned new games? Bah, peasent shit. You're right, you've convinced me the video game company making a new video game engine designed for video games, who's had leaks pointing to the same two video games pretty consistently for years now, is absolutely and totally not working on these two video games at this moment for this new engine. It would be silly of me to think realistically, i'll go back to the bitter pessimism now. [editline]20th June 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Hell-met;50556506]I can't think of a single other company that ever pulled this "be patient" stunt for so long. It's hard to compare when there's only one instance in existence. You get mad at relentless pessimism but you're doing the exact same relentless thing from the other side. Maybe accept that your evidence is shit and cannot turn people to "the good side". You speak like you got some divine wisdom crap.[/QUOTE] You might have a point if you didnt blatantly ignore any of the other games this company has developed and how long they've taken. Yeah sure my logic in the Half-Life thread is speculative, but within the context of the company it could make sense. And if people get annoyed by my unwillingness to accept that this company is somehow not doing a thing, well, welcome to my world. In any event, i can name a few. Like Doom 4. Doom 4 turned out good. [editline]20th June 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Clavus;50556515]How many employees does Valve have nowadays? Last time I heard a number, it was just over 100 something, but that was years back.[/QUOTE] 300 iirc.

[QUOTE=AaronM202;50556531]New engine, designed by a video game developer to develop video games? No, no thats wrong, it cant possibly be for video games.[/QUOTE] A new engine does not mean new games in the typical sense without more information. Source 2 so far has only been used for Dota 2 and VR, and as I stated earlier it's the first Valve-made engine to launch without a AAA game to go with it. I will add that I read your post about why Half-Life 3 may be so delayed, and as a Source developer I disagree with most of it. Every single Half-Life release has been absolutely groundbreaking. Valve raises the bar with each game they make. Source 2 is absolute trash. They cannot hope to match the look or feel of AAA games from 5 years ago, let alone current ones. My current running theory is that Valve wrote themselves in to a hole. The Source 1 engine is one of the worst open-space engines around, and that's made worse by snow. My guess is that Half-Life 2: Episode 3 could not be completed with the tools they had at hand to their satisfaction and they instead chose to wait until they could get their Engine tech on-par with the rest of the industry. In that time, they discovered the power of hats and in-game economies, and they began to take in huge amounts of cash thanks to them now being the defacto PC game publisher. Valve no longer has an incentive to keep making the 'classic' games, a statement later confirmed by Gabe. If a Half-Life 3 is coming, it's still a long, long way off; and it most likely won't resemble current Half-Life games. [QUOTE=AaronM202;50556531]Leaked emails from a company with notoriously long dev cycles proving theres a game in the works? Nah, inconclusive.[/QUOTE] Can you provide a link to these? [QUOTE=AaronM202;50556531]Leaked code in DOTA 2 updates related to Half-Life with weird new information in it that seem to happen every couple of months? Might as well be confirmation it doesnt exist.[/QUOTE] Every Valve engine uses HL(X) as the executable name and has hold-over data from Half-Life. The 'code' you saw leaked are simple FGD entries and other misc information that revealed no substantial new entities and [B]definitely[/B] no dates. We know Half-Life 2: Episode 3 was worked on for many years before Valve went full-silence, so unless you can provide a date for these files we can't say when or where they're truly from, and we especially can't say they're from current work. [QUOTE=AaronM202;50556531]Leaked textures in a VR games set on said new video game engine by video game developers designed for video games, pointing to above mentioned new games? Bah, peasent shit.[/QUOTE] Can you provide information showing these textures aren't from a VR related project, canned title, or test suite? [QUOTE=AaronM202;50556531]You're right, you've convinced me the video game company making a new video game engine designed for video games, who's had leaks pointing to the same two video games pretty consistently for years now, is absolutely and totally not working on these two video games at this moment for this new engine. It would be silly of me to think realistically, i'll go back to the bitter pessimism now.[/QUOTE] [B]Desperate.[/B]

[QUOTE=Clavus;50556515]How many employees does Valve have nowadays? Last time I heard a number, it was just over 100 something, but that was years back.[/QUOTE] The [URL="https://steamcommunity.com/groups/Valve"]valve stream group[/URL] has 229 members - not sure if they are all still employees though

[QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556559]A new engine does not mean new games in the typical sense without more information. Source 2 so far has only been used for Dota 2 and VR, and as I stated earlier it's the first Valve-made engine to launch without a AAA game to go with it.[/QUOTE] Okay i dont have anything faux-witty or the like, this is just outright stupid. [QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556559]Can you provide a link to these?[/QUOTE] [b]LITERALLY ON THE BOTTOM OF THE LAST PAGE.[/b] [QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556559]Every Valve engine uses HL(X) as the executable name and has hold-over data from Half-Life. The 'code' you saw leaked are simple FGD entries and other misc information that revealed no substantial new entities and [B]definitely[/B] no dates. We know Half-Life 2: Episode 3 was worked on for many years before Valve went full-silence, so unless you can provide a date for these files we can't say when or where they're truly from, and we especially can't say they're from current work.[/QUOTE] Considering they mention VR and "questlines" both of which arent a thing in HL2, uh, that'd be pretty easy. Even easier if you bothered to look into it for a minute before going for desperate pessimism. [QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556559]Can you provide information showing these textures aren't from a VR related project, canned title, or test suite?[/QUOTE] Uh, okay? [url]http://www.valvetime.net/threads/examining-the-files-of-steamvr-performance-test-aperture-robot-repair.253841/[/url] Its listed as "Engineer", a character iirc previously rumored to be in L4D3. Well that and his [b][i]directory directly references L4D3.[/i][/b] And also, y'know, "Left 4 Dead Characters - “vr_l4d_characters_skody” " [QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556559][B]Desperate.[/B][/QUOTE] Hey buddy. Stop doing that.

[QUOTE=AaronM202;50556614]Considering they mention VR and "questlines" both of which arent a thing in HL2, uh, that'd be pretty easy.[/QUOTE] You ignored my point about us not knowing where or when these lines came from. For all we know this work was done 2007-2011. There were leaked Half-Life related VR test games inside Valve's VR demo, and Doug Lombardi already confirmed that a game like Half-Life 3 would not be a VR title. [QUOTE=AaronM202;50556614]Its listed as "Engineer", a character iirc previously rumored to be in L4D3.[/QUOTE] Can you show me where this rumor came from? [editline]edit[/editline] [QUOTE=AaronM202;50556614][B]LITERALLY ON THE BOTTOM OF THE LAST PAGE.[/B][/QUOTE] You mean the picture of the issue tracker? Those aren't emails, they're 3 years old, and all they show is a test-bed being set up. There isn't a single issue indicative of actual gameplay being worked on. It's also been shown that Valve has been testing porting Source 1 games to Source 2.

[QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556559]I will add that I read your post about why Half-Life 3 may be so delayed, and as a Source developer I disagree with most of it. Every single Half-Life release has been absolutely groundbreaking. Valve raises the bar with each game they make.[/QUOTE] Uh, okay... How does this go against what i posted? If anything you're just giving me a third point for my reasoning as to why its taken so long, so thanks i guess. [QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556559]Source 2 is absolute trash. They cannot hope to match the look or feel of AAA games from 5 years ago, let alone current ones.[/QUOTE] You yourself described it as modular, so this is a moot point. [QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556559]My current running theory is that Valve wrote themselves in to a hole. The Source 1 engine is one of the worst open-space engines around, and that's made worse by snow. My guess is that Half-Life 2: Episode 3 could not be completed with the tools they had at hand to their satisfaction and they instead chose to wait until they could get their Engine tech on-par with the rest of the industry. In that time, they discovered the power of hats and in-game economies, and they began to take in huge amounts of cash thanks to them now being the defacto PC game publisher.[/QUOTE] You say this like the games those hat economies are in arent already good games on their own with no time or effort put into the development of them. It also has nothing to do with Valves history of perfectionism with their titles or anything. Or Portals influence on the next game. Nope. [QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556559]Valve no longer has an incentive to keep making the 'classic' games, a statement later confirmed by Gabe. If a Half-Life 3 is coming, it's still a long, long way off; and it most likely won't resemble current Half-Life games.[/QUOTE] This proves nothing of substance. Why you would even reference this is beyond me. [editline]20th June 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556625]You ignored my point about us not knowing where or when these lines came from. For all we know this work was done 2007-2011.[/QUOTE] Considering it references terms only listed since around 2015, you're wrong. Again... Uh, research? I mean ive been bothering to look into this stuff, you clearly havent. [QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556625]Can you show me where this rumor came from?[/QUOTE] Re-read and look at the part where its mentioned his directory references L4D3. [QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556625]You mean the picture of the issue tracker? Those aren't emails, they're 3 years old, and all they show is a test-bed being set up. There isn't a single issue indicative of actual gameplay being worked on. It's also been shown that Valve has been testing porting Source 1 games to Source 2.[/QUOTE] Well, for one, the source 1 thing doesnt matter considering its still listing "Left 4 Dead 3", and second, okay? 3 years ago... Alright and? Thats 4 years after L4D2 was released, and they have some pretty long dev cycles. Whats your point? You seem to gradually be losing a point in all of this.

[QUOTE=AaronM202;50556637] Whats your point? You seem to gradually be losing a point in all of this.[/QUOTE] My point is you have no actual information as to what Valve is working on, but you definitely think you do. So far with all my repeated questioning, you've given me a model of Dog made for a toy and a bunch of unsupported arguments. Another member in this thread was kind enough to post a 3 year old picture that shows no actual gameplay being worked on. Can you provide [B]any[/B] solid information that backs up your claims?

[QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556675]My point is you have no actual information as to what Valve is working on, but you definitely think you do. So far with all my questioning, you've given me a model of Dog and a bunch of arguments. Another member in this thread was kind enough to post a 3 year old picture that shows no actual gameplay. Can you provide [B]any[/B] solid information that backs up your theory?[/QUOTE] Pointing out that the hl3.txt leak contained terminology they only started using around 2014/2015, and the Engineer textures having L4D3 directory references isnt evidence? Cause thats exponentially more than anything you have, which is nothing.

[QUOTE=AaronM202;50556690]Pointing out that the hl3.txt leak contained terminology they only started using around 2014/2015, and the Engineer textures having L4D3 directory references isnt evidence?[/QUOTE] What terminology? You also have not shown me the so-called 'leak' where someone said there would be a character called Engineer in a game called L4D3.

[QUOTE=1/4 Life;50556697]What terminology?[/QUOTE] Jesus Christ. Give me a minute, in the mean time have some more stuff you'll find a way to blatantly ignore so you can remain cynical: [t]http://www.valvetime.net/attachments/hl3-2-png.24259/[/t] [t]http://www.valvetime.net/attachments/hl3-1-png.24258/[/t]