• Legal Child Porn Linked to Lower Child Sex Abuses
    221 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Meller Yeller;34669009]It's not impossible but age becomes a factor and again, even if they are informed, it's not difficult for an adult to take advantage of them through deception. A lot easier than an adult.[/QUOTE] it's not difficult for an adult to take advantage of children because children are not properly educated and are shielded from things that people arbitrarily decide that might harm their ~innocence~
As long as it's fake shit, like lolicon, I don't see the problem.
[QUOTE=Sherow_Xx;34668906] I think this quote is interesting, because it touches on one of those things that gets thrown around like it's the holy grail all the time: Freedom. The way I see it, there is indeed a lot of issues with child pornography, but on the other hand, I do appreciate freedom, and I do think it is silly to illegalize data; text, images, videos... Not to mention the laws against almost all drugs, which I find extremely confusing given that America calls itself the [I]"land of the free"[/I]. So which is it? Censor the harmful things, which takes away freedom? Or freedom, even if it means letting people view recordings of children being harmed? [/QUOTE] You seriously don't understand the concept of relative freedom and the social contract, don't you. [editline]12th February 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=Sanius;34669018]it's not difficult for an adult to take advantage of children because children are not properly educated and are shielded from things that people arbitrarily decide that might harm their ~innocence~[/QUOTE] The idea of children being "children" and having things such as innocence is actually a fairly recent thing, you know. As recent as the late 18th century people saw children as little more then small adults, and treated them as such. Furthermore, sexual encounters with minors are generally abusive in nature because the adult is often using a position of power to coerce the child into an action, whether it be as a member of the family, threat of violence in the case of a stranger, or a person in a position of responsibility (teacher.)
[QUOTE=Sanius;34668822]lack of proper sex education, demonization of sexuality, and the idea that innocence is a thing[/QUOTE] You're conveniently forgetting one really important thing - children are easy to manipulate and exploit because they've been taught that adults are always authority figures This is why child porn needs to stay illegal
[QUOTE=Zeke129;34669114]You're conveniently forgetting one really important thing - children are easy to manipulate and exploit because they've been taught that adults are always authority figures [/QUOTE] included in "lack of proper education"
[QUOTE=Sanius;34669142]included in "lack of proper education"[/QUOTE] So what you're arguing is doing away with the concept of a "childhood" entirely and treat them as tiny adults with feeble-minded brains from the beginning.
[QUOTE=Canuhearme?;34669164]So what you're arguing is doing away with the concept of a "childhood" entirely and treat them as tiny adults with feeble-minded brains from the beginning.[/QUOTE] try again without the logical fallacies
[QUOTE=Sanius;34669142]included in "lack of proper education"[/QUOTE] And since children will never be properly educated it's impossible to determine if their consent is genuine or coerced
[QUOTE=Zeke129;34669114]You're conveniently forgetting one really important thing - children are easy to manipulate and exploit because they've been taught that adults are always authority figures[/QUOTE] How about the fact that their decision-making skills are indisputably worse by virtue of brain anatomy? I think that's a more important thing not being touched on. The PFC requiring a 20-year bake time doesn't stop being a thing just because you educate a child.
[QUOTE=Xenocidebot;34669247]How about the fact that their decision-making skills are indisputably worse by virtue of brain anatomy? I think that's a more important thing not being touched on. The PFC requiring a 20-year bake time doesn't stop being a thing just because you educate a child.[/QUOTE] I don't look at things from the ~biotruth~ angle if there are perfectly good psychological ways to explain something
[QUOTE=Zeke129;34669180]And since children will never be properly educated it's impossible to determine if their consent is genuine or coerced[/QUOTE] I would hardly say that they will never be properly educated, but as of now it is impossible to determine whether they have actually consented or not. In order for such proper education to come into play, there needs to be an understanding that someone older than you is not automatically deserving of authority. Obviously as a person you should treat those you don't know with a certain level of respect, but I mean it's the principle of the thing.
I dont want this ever legalized.
[QUOTE=Woomp;34669384]I dont want this ever legalized.[/QUOTE] do you care to explain your reasoning
[QUOTE=Terminutter;34666894]Should I even be suprised? :v:[/QUOTE] Child Pornography != Drawn Lolicon, as much as the mainstream media would like it to be.
(This post may be a little messy as I had to rewrite it) [QUOTE=Patriarch;34668885]Well, I think it would be fair to say that they have a lesser mental capacity compared to adults or teenagers, and so they would find it hard to process some things, especially things like sex. Then again, that could also be a sexual education problem and our attitude to sex in general.[/QUOTE] I don't think I've ever gotten a good answer to this, and I'm curious. The way I see it, it definitely is a sexual education problem and our attitude towards sex. But if it isn't that, what is it you think it could otherwise be? I mean, the way I see it, sex is really fucking simple: People touch each other because it feels good, and it's also how you make babies, [i](insert short mention of evolution to explain why it feels good)[/i] and when people don't want babies they use condoms. Those are also good for preventing diseases. What more is there to it, if it isn't all the stuff society has placed on it? I just don't get all this talk about "informed consent" and being "mature" or "mentally capable", I mean, why is this enlightened mind needed before you can decide whether you want sex or not, when you don't need it for so many other things, like playing games, soccer or going to an amusement park? In any case, even if sexual education doesn't solve the problem, it would in any case help making it harder to manipulate and coerce children. But I think if we reach a point where sex is as acceptable as any other thing, even that won't be an issue. Nobody will be trying to manipulate or coerce. [QUOTE=Canuhearme?;34669064]You seriously don't understand the concept of relative freedom and the social contract, don't you.[/QUOTE] Apperantly I don't, I've never heard those terms before. "Relative freedom" sounds like a very slippery slope. Please do explain. [QUOTE=Meller Yeller;34668918]Because they aren't informed. If a child ever agrees to do this it's because an adult takes advantage of how easy children are to deceive and that's not fair to them.[/QUOTE] Indeed, I think the only way to improve the situation is to remove the 'taboo' and to start educating children. It won't instantly make all children geniuses that are capable of deciding everything, but it will sure help. [QUOTE=Meller Yeller]And if you look at sex abuse cases, even children who are never taught about anything sexual are often scarred by this stuff. This feeling that something done to them is "wrong" somehow comes naturally to young children.[/QUOTE] I don't think that's entirely true. There's countries in the world, and times in history, where sexual ecounters involving children are/were not seen as harmful, and I don't see any real reason why it would be? [B]EDIT:[/B] I can see how that would happen if there was some obviously abusive stuff going on, like if the guy was threatening the child or using violence and force. Any person, young and old, can tell that something feels wrong if they're being threatened or harmed. But from what I've heard, in those cases where such things were not involved, the child only feels harmed when they actually discover the whole story. Up until then they feel totally fine or even good about it. I think I read somewhere that children who are obviously raped actually feel [I]less[/I] harmed, because it is clear that what happened was wrong and who is the bad person. In cases where literal force was not involved, the child feels even worse because they feel guilt and feel like they were betrayed. My interpetation of that is this: Obvious force / violence and threats is always bad for anyone. "Consensual" sex with children is bad because they don't know the whole truth, and thus they are indirectly being lied to and are betrayed. But if they knew the whole truth, and if there wasn't this whole perception that it is wrong, bad, and if there wasn't a giant taboo, then I don't see where the harm would appear? [B]EDIT:[/B] Ayep, here it is: [url]http://www.alternet.org/reproductivejustice/146941/the_trauma_myth%3A_understanding_the_true_dynamics_of_sexual_abuse?page=1[/url] [quote]In nearly all the cases, the adults I questioned had not experienced the abuse as traumatic when it occurred and only came to regard it as so years later.[/quote] [quote]This state of affairs is far from surprising. How can trauma be the cause of harm if most victims say that the abuse was not traumatic when it happened? A growing number of scholars in the sexual abuse field are coming to agree that understanding how and why sexual abuse damages victims probably has little to do with the actual abuse and a lot to do with what happens in its aftermath.[/quote]
[QUOTE=sami-pso;34667413]If legalizing real child porn reduces the number of times children are abused, how is that not a good thing? Hell, if we can work toward only having soft porn of children, and still satisfy all the pedos out there, that would be great if you ask me. Banning something only creates a desire, so i am for regulating. You obviously can argue that children will be forced to pose naked, but how does that even compare against children getting raped? It doesn't.[/QUOTE] you basically just said "either we make child porn legal or else children will get raped."
I see no good reason why you shouldn't be able to fap to a [i]drawing[/i] in the privacy of your own home.
the real moral is if someone has porn and gets bored after jacking off they go rob shit
[QUOTE=Megafanx13;34669323]I would hardly say that they will never be properly educated, but as of now it is impossible to determine whether they have actually consented or not. In order for such proper education to come into play, there needs to be an understanding that someone older than you is not automatically deserving of authority. Obviously as a person you should treat those you don't know with a certain level of respect, but I mean it's the principle of the thing.[/QUOTE] Most victimization of children is done by family though, abusive families aren't going to teach their kids that it's okay to disregard what they tell them to do
[QUOTE=Sanius;34669396]do you care to explain your reasoning[/QUOTE] Child abuse.
[QUOTE=Woomp;34669848]Child abuse.[/QUOTE] Child rape =/= pedophilia
[QUOTE=Crimor;34669955]Child rape =/= pedophilia[/QUOTE] 12 year olds usually don't intend to be in CP. Almost all the time its forced.
[QUOTE=Woomp;34670021]12 year olds usually don't intend to be in CP. Almost all the time its forced.[/QUOTE] Pedophilia is the attraction to children, not the porn itself. And this thing is talking about lolicon etc, as in, no real children involved.
Pedophilia is wrong because being attracted to children is wrong. There is no justification for being sexually attracted to a child.
[QUOTE=Woomp;34670058]Pedophilia is wrong because being attracted to children is wrong. There is no justification for being sexually attracted to a child.[/QUOTE] Did you ever choose what you're attracted to?
[QUOTE=Woomp;34670058]Pedophilia is wrong because being attracted to children is wrong. There is no justification for being sexually attracted to a child.[/QUOTE] where's the justification for being attracted to the same sex, if justification is what makes it right?
[QUOTE=Crimor;34670067]Did you ever choose what you're attracted to?[/QUOTE] Pussy. [editline]12th February 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=strayebyrd;34670076]where's the justification for being attracted to the same sex, if justification is what makes it right?[/QUOTE] That isn't that I said, I said there was no justification for being attracted to children because its morally wrong and I for one find it disgusting.
[QUOTE=Woomp;34670112]Pussy. [editline]12th February 2012[/editline] That isn't that I said, I said there was no justification for being attracted to children because its morally wrong and I for one find it disgusting.[/QUOTE] So you woke up one day and said "I think I'll like pussy from now on"? You can't decide what you're attracted to.
[QUOTE=Crimor;34670137]So you woke up one day and said "I think I'll like pussy from now on"? You can't decide what you're attracted to.[/QUOTE] I guess so, I woke up one morning drunk at a party and some girl was sucking my dick
How could they 'legalize' child abuse?
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