Democratic National Convention & Protests Super(delegate)thread - Goodbye, Bernie
1,979 replies, posted
[QUOTE=shadow_oap;50768850]They couldn't even wait a little? God, fucking disgusting. I don't understand why her campaign continues to make decisions that only push Bernie supporters away.[/QUOTE]
It was almost definitely done as a concession for her to step down in the first place.
[QUOTE=Raidyr;50768839]If the Sanders protesters get unruly then they will just prove everything that both the Democrat and Republican establishment have been saying about them this entire election. I voted Sanders, I don't want his movement to be tainted with riots and chaos.[/QUOTE]
Well, define unruly? Because to the best of my knowledge and correct me if I'm wrong there's been pretty much no "riots or chaos" that have been trending with Bernie Sanders supporters. Being loud and noisy at a convention isn't unruly, that's how political conventions work because they are passionate events that have real effects on regular people.
[QUOTE=Jim Morrison;50768866]Well, define unruly? Because to the best of my knowledge and correct me if I'm wrong there's been pretty much no "riots or chaos" that have been trending with Bernie Sanders supporters. Being loud and noisy at a convention isn't unruly, that's how political conventions work because they are passionate events.[/QUOTE]
Unruly isn't the right word, I should have said violent. I agree that there hasn't been any prior instances of Sanders supporters being violent (despite what some may want to portray) but some may view this as their last best chance at being heard.
[QUOTE=RIPBILLYMAYS;50768848]Also even though Trump is wrong in believing climate change is a hoax, [URL="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7LYRUOd_QoM"]Clinton does not give a fuck about Climate Change[/URL]. She flipped her stances on the Keystone XL pipeline and foreign oil because the Clinton Foundation got money from corporations who would benefit from it. The change pissed off her environmental supporters and surprised Obama too.[/QUOTE]
Oh yeah, but Trump changing his opinions on everything else every other day, that's just fine.
[QUOTE=LTJGPliskin;50768878]Oh yeah, but Trump changing his opinions on everything else every other day, that's just fine.[/QUOTE]
First of all, provide a specific example when you make claims so you have an actual argument to defend.
Second, Climate Change is my [I]main concern[/I] as a voter, and I am studying Nuclear Engineering to solve it. A candidate's belief in it or not is irrelevant to solving the problem. I see nuclear energy as the only actual solution to climate change, and the democrats do not support it. The Republicans do. Trump's stances on coal and climate change mean nothing to me.
[QUOTE=RIPBILLYMAYS;50768889]First of all, provide a specific example when you make claims so you have an actual argument to defend.
Second, Climate Change is my [I]main concern[/I] as a voter, and I am studying Nuclear Engineering to solve it. A candidate's belief in it or not is irrelevant to solving the problem. I see nuclear energy as the only actual solution to climate change, and the democrats do not support it. The Republicans do. Trump's stances on coal and climate change mean nothing to me.[/QUOTE]
As part of their platform the GOP one mentions nuclear power insofar as a resource that is free-market viable and doesn't require subsidies. This is essentially them trying to have their cake and eat it too as it's pretty much impossible to run a nuclear powered infrastructure without government subsidy and regulation. The DNC platform doesn't mention nuclear by name but it does talk about clean energy sources and Clintons platform specifically talks about nuclear. The only thing I can find on Trump is off hand comments supporting before the campaign.
All told it looks like both parties are sort of vague when it comes to nuclear policy. With that in mind, I'd pick the person who doesn't favor deregulation that would lead to global warming becoming worse, Clinton. It genuinely blows my mind that someone who's main concern is global warming will actually vote for Trump in November.
[QUOTE=RIPBILLYMAYS;50768889]First of all, provide a specific example when you make claims so you have an actual argument to defend.[/QUOTE]
[url]http://time.com/4362393/donald-trump-supported-addressing-climate-change-before-calling-it-a-hoax/[/url]
Trump changed his opinions about climate change as well.
Also, I'd tell you to look up the dozens or so other times he's changed his opinions, but the general population of the site already knows you're only about one step behind orgornot anyways, so I don't expect you to actually do the research and continue to form and change your invalid opinions that support electing an egomaniacal, narcissistic, thin-skinned manbaby billionaire into the highest position of power in the world, possibly endangering the very principles that hold us up as a society, just so you can spite a candidate that you don't like.
The problem isn't that Trump doesn't believe in climate change, it's that neither does the GOP, so having them in the legislative chambers writing bills that get signed by the person in the executive chamber is going to make global warming [I]worse[/I]. I simply don't believe you are this shortsighted.
I agree with what shadowop said.
It's vital that people protest the present plutocratic oligarchy.
Clinton [i]needs[/i] the votes of sanders' supporters. The platform has been changed, but like any deal, it is not permanent and can be changed to something else.
Keeping a little pressure both on Clinton and especially on the DNC is essential. We need them as much as they need us. A Trump presidency will benefit neither group.
I could live with trump as president if he doesn't crash the global economy worse than before by defaulting on our debt or letting China and Russia off the diplomatic leash.
I don't see trump being content with that. He is a megalomaniac and the one thing he covets is power. (Unlimited power!) I fear he won't stop until all dissent is silent.
[QUOTE=LTJGPliskin;50768939][url]http://time.com/4362393/donald-trump-supported-addressing-climate-change-before-calling-it-a-hoax/[/url]
Trump changed his opinions about climate change as well.
Also, I'd tell you to look up the dozens or so other times he's changed his opinions, but the general population of the site already knows you're only about one step behind orgornot anyways, so I don't expect you to actually do the research and continue to form and change your invalid opinions that support electing an egomaniacal, narcissistic, thin-skinned manbaby billionaire into the highest position of power in the world, possibly endangering the very principles that hold us up as a society, just so you can spite a candidate that you don't like.[/QUOTE]
The thing is there are a few positions you can take over Clinton and support Trump for. You can also circumvent policy discussion and just go with morality which is what a lot of Trump supporters do since his policy is typically indefensible. But to see a Trump supporter blithely talk about how climate change is his biggest concern and endorse Trump and the Republican platform is hitherto unseen levels of mental gymnastics.
Good job Democrats this might be even more a shitshow than last week.
Ah who I am kidding, at this point I really don't care anymore. America is likely fucked regardless of who gets in office. Probably even more fucked under Trump but it won't be easy under Clinton either.
You guys are in serious need of an actual peaceful revolution right now. Both parties deserve at this point to be annhiliated - the Republicans for voting in a crazy racist man-child that will ruin America's international reputation for decades, and the Democrats for being corrupt and trying to stop a fair race from happening (I assume there was probably something like that in the Republican camp at some point but didn't work out).
I don't support the third parties either so this is a nightmare sonario.
This year fucking sucks.
[QUOTE=Raidyr;50768952]The thing is there are a few positions you can take over Clinton and support Trump for.[/QUOTE]
I agree, but for someone like Donald Trump I seriously doubt he'd take steps to enforce his own policies and follow his own positions.
That bingo card is too easy. It'll be filled before the end of the first day. Maybe before lunch.
[QUOTE=BlackMageMari;50768981]You guys are in serious need of an actual peaceful revolution right now.[/QUOTE]
Unfortunately, the results for the California and New York primaries crushed that peaceful revolution. We're not going to get another chance for the next 4-8 years.
Neither parties have shown enough care for nuclear. After studying energy policy and energy politics I see the Democrat's views on Solar and Wind as the main way to go as blatantly wrong. Each energy source has a place (you don't want to heat your food on a pile of radioactive rocks) and the Democrats are trying to create a overly complicated system where renewables provide most of our electricity. I see this as a wasted investment.
Regardless I would like to steer the thread back to the DNC and Sanders supporters protesting the convention.
DNC 2016: "NO EMAILS ALLOWED!"
[QUOTE=Sableye;50769006]DNC 2016: "NO EMAILS ALLOWED!"[/QUOTE]
New platform policy: Make the US Postal Service Great Again
[QUOTE=RIPBILLYMAYS;50769002]Neither parties have shown enough care for nuclear. After studying energy policy and energy politics I see the Democrat's views on Solar and Wind as the main way to go as blatantly wrong. Each energy source has a place (you don't want to heat your food on a pile of radioactive rocks) and [B]the Democrats are trying to create a overly complicated system where renewables provide most of our electricity. I see this as a wasted investment.[/B]
Regardless I would like to steer the thread back to the DNC and Sanders supporters protesting the convention.[/QUOTE]
i'm not exactly sure what you're talking about. Renewables hardly account for most of our power production, its certainly better than the "all above (but mostly coal)" strategy of the republicans.
the storage problem of renewables is [I]a[/I] problem but its not like we're generating huge amounts of wasted electricity from them either, gas powerplants still have to maintain the load
so are these Bernie supporters actually going to vote like Bernie wanted them to do or are they just going to protest and continue to not vote for the next 20 years
[QUOTE=Ridge;50768985]That bingo card is too easy. It'll be filled before the end of the first day. Maybe before lunch.[/QUOTE]
Is this better?
[img_thumb]http://i.imgur.com/QsEbDX6.png[/img_thumb]
[editline]24th July 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=LTJGPliskin;50769035]so are these Bernie supporters actually going to vote like Bernie wanted them to do or are they just going to protest and continue to not vote for the next 20 years[/QUOTE]
If they hate Hillary, they will vote Trump
If they hate the system, they will vote 3rd Party
If they don't care anymore, they will stay at home
If they hate Trump, they will vote Hillary
[QUOTE=RIPBILLYMAYS;50769002]Neither parties have shown enough care for nuclear. After studying energy policy and energy politics I see the Democrat's views on Solar and Wind as the main way to go as blatantly wrong. Each energy source has a place (you don't want to heat your food on a pile of radioactive rocks) and the Democrats are trying to create a overly complicated system where renewables provide most of our electricity. I see this as a wasted investment.
Regardless I would like to steer the thread back to the DNC and Sanders supporters protesting the convention.[/QUOTE]
Is it as blatantly wrong as saying that climate change isn't a big deal?
[QUOTE=BlackMageMari;50768981]Good job Democrats this might be even more a shitshow than last week.
Ah who I am kidding, at this point I really don't care anymore. America is likely fucked regardless of who gets in office. Probably even more fucked under Trump but it won't be easy under Clinton either.
You guys are in serious need of an actual peaceful revolution right now. Both parties deserve at this point to be annhiliated - the Republicans for voting in a crazy racist man-child that will ruin America's international reputation for decades, and the Democrats for being corrupt and trying to stop a fair race from happening (I assume there was probably something like that in the Republican camp at some point but didn't work out).
I don't support the third parties either so this is a nightmare sonario.
This year fucking sucks.[/QUOTE]
You're honestly kidding yourself if you think the USA is fucked if Clinton gets in.
[QUOTE=Raidyr;50769078]Is it as blatantly wrong as saying that climate change isn't a big deal?[/QUOTE]
Again I don't care who's wrong or right about a topic, I care about solving problems. I see the Republicans (historically) as the only support nuclear has had.
Can we drop the energy issues for now and go back to the DNC/email leaks/Sanders stuff?
[QUOTE=RIPBILLYMAYS;50769148]Again I don't care who's wrong or right about a topic, I care about solving problems. I see the Republicans (historically) as the only support nuclear has had.
Can we drop the energy issues for now and go back to the DNC/email leaks/Sanders stuff?[/QUOTE]
the best way to solve the energy crisis is to plug our ears and scream about how we need more oil and clean energy is a waste because climate change is just a hoax
[QUOTE=RIPBILLYMAYS;50769148]Again I don't care who's wrong or right about a topic, I care about solving problems. I see the Republicans (historically) as the only support nuclear has had.
Can we drop the energy issues for now and go back to the DNC/email leaks/Sanders stuff?[/QUOTE]
not really, nuclear isn't this end all be all to energy. Nuclear plants themselves require very specific geography to be constructed. they need massive amounts of cool water, stable techtonics, lots of land
plus the republicans are only nominally for nuclear, in fact Obama (a democrat) has pushed more for nuclear than the last 2 republicans have. republicans only care what the energy lobby wants and they want the ability to do whatever without having the government telling them what kinds of power to build but with climate change we can't afford to do that
Anyone who WANTS Trump in office wants some group of innocent individuals to suffer. End of. Trump supporters want to HURT someone.
Any Trump supporter who denies this is lying, either to themselves or to everyone else.
I REFUSE to let some "strongman" demagogue authoritarian like Trump take over a country that established itself on equality for ALL human beings.
[B][U]Destroy Trump and all that he stands for.[/U][/B] By any means necessary.
[QUOTE=RIPBILLYMAYS;50768889]First of all, provide a specific example when you make claims so you have an actual argument to defend.
Second, Climate Change is my [I]main concern[/I] as a voter, and I am studying Nuclear Engineering to solve it. A candidate's belief in it or not is irrelevant to solving the problem. I see nuclear energy as the only actual solution to climate change, and the democrats do not support it. The Republicans do. Trump's stances on coal and climate change mean nothing to me.[/QUOTE]
Wait, but didn't you say that if you had to take Clinton or Sanders as president, that you preferred Sanders? Sanders, who specifically calls for getting rid of nuclear energy and closing all of the plants in the country?
[quote]Begin a moratorium on nuclear power plant license renewals in the United States. Bernie believes that solar, wind, geothermal power and energy efficiency are proven and more cost-effective than nuclear – even without tax incentives – and that the toxic waste byproducts of nuclear plants are not worth the risks of the technology’s benefit. Especially in light of lessons learned from Japan’s Fukushima meltdown, Bernie has also raised questions about why the federal government invests billions into federal subsidies for the nuclear industry. We can have an affordable carbon-free, nuclear-free energy system and we must work for a safe, healthy future for all Americans.[/quote]
[url]https://berniesanders.com/issues/climate-change/[/url]
If climate change, and specifically nuclear energy is your single issue, I don't understand your rankings if Sanders specifically wants to get rid of the entire field you're studying.
I feel like many people forget that Sanders promised from the start to back whoever the candidate is.
[QUOTE=Disgruntled;50769246]Anyone who WANTS Trump in office wants some group of innocent individuals to suffer. End of. Trump supporters want to HURT someone.
Any Trump supporter who denies this is lying, either to themselves or to everyone else.
I REFUSE to let some "strongman" demagogue authoritarian like Trump take over a country that established itself on equality for ALL human beings.
[B][U]Destroy Trump and all that he stands for.[/U][/B] By any means necessary.[/QUOTE]
do you truly mean by any means necessary? there's a lot of means that could accomplish that that are very messy but also very effective
[QUOTE=Disgruntled;50769246]Anyone who WANTS Trump in office wants some group of innocent individuals to suffer. End of. Trump supporters want to HURT someone.
Any Trump supporter who denies this is lying, either to themselves or to everyone else.
I REFUSE to let some "strongman" demagogue authoritarian like Trump take over a country that established itself on equality for ALL human beings.
[B][U]Destroy Trump and all that he stands for.[/U][/B] By any means necessary.[/QUOTE]
What're you advocating here?
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