Democratic National Convention & Protests Super(delegate)thread - Goodbye, Bernie
1,979 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Disgruntled;50769246]Anyone who WANTS Trump in office wants some group of innocent individuals to suffer. End of. Trump supporters want to HURT someone.
Any Trump supporter who denies this is lying, either to themselves or to everyone else.
I REFUSE to let some "strongman" demagogue authoritarian like Trump take over a country that established itself on equality for ALL human beings.
[B][U]Destroy Trump and all that he stands for.[/U][/B] By any means necessary.[/QUOTE]
Why would I want to hurt someone? Just because someone supports one candidate (no matter which side disagrees or feels how he will run the country) for maybe the wrong or right reasons, makes them violent?
[QUOTE=duckmaster;50769094]You're honestly kidding yourself if you think the USA is fucked if Clinton gets in.[/QUOTE]
Am I? It seems at this point that the House is going to be paralyzed regardless. The Supreme Court will probably be saved. Clinton just has too much baggage and I'm afraid she's going to be like Nixon; slimy and ultimately very damaging.
I mean let's be realistic here - both candidates are god awful. Trump is 100 times worse but it's essentially the difference between hanging yourself in Trump and cutting yourself daily with Clinton.
I guess that's easy to say when I don't live in the States, however.
[QUOTE=Disgruntled;50769246]Anyone who WANTS Trump in office wants some group of innocent individuals to suffer. End of. Trump supporters want to HURT someone.
Any Trump supporter who denies this is lying, either to themselves or to everyone else.[/QUOTE]
I'm probably biased on this, but the only Trump supporter whose views I can understand is actually my own grandfather. I've really only heard what he thinks about the immigration issue, but his reasoning is that when he was in Vietnam, he (and just about every other troop that was stationed there during the war) couldn't tell if the South Vietnamese were friendly or hostile.
Of course we're not in a war, but I can definitely understand his views, and to a very small extent, I agree.
[QUOTE=Maegord;50769280]Wait, but didn't you say that if you had to take Clinton or Sanders as president, that you preferred Sanders? Sanders, who specifically calls for getting rid of nuclear energy and closing all of the plants in the country? [URL]https://berniesanders.com/issues/climate-change/[/URL] If climate change, and specifically nuclear energy is your single issue, I don't understand your rankings if Sanders specifically wants to get rid of the entire field you're studying.[/QUOTE] I actually didn't know that about Sanders, that sucks. That stance solidifies my vote for Trump. Most of our nuclear plants are going to be closed in the next 30 years anyway, we need to focus on building new ones.
[editline]24th July 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=MissZoey;50769282]I feel like many people forget that Sanders promised from the start to back whoever the candidate is.[/QUOTE] Ted Cruz signed a pledge to support the Republican candidate and look how that turned out
[QUOTE=TheKritter71;50769340]Why would I want to hurt someone? Just because someone supports one candidate (no matter which side disagrees or feels how he will run the country) for maybe the wrong or right reasons, makes them violent?[/QUOTE]
I didn't specifically mean physically hurt. A Trump presidency will hurt innocent people in all sorts of ways, directly or indirectly.
[QUOTE=RIPBILLYMAYS;50769392]Ted Cruz signed a pledge to support the Republican candidate and look how that turned out[/QUOTE]
He started walking that back way back in May after Trump attacked his family. Sanders is talking about endorsing Clinton days before the convention.
Plus there is a lot less reasons for Sanders to not endorse Clinton than there was for Cruz not to endorse Trump.
[QUOTE=Raidyr;50769434]He started walking that back way back in May after Trump attacked his family. Sanders is talking about endorsing Clinton days before the convention.
Plus there is a lot less reasons for Sanders to not endorse Clinton than there was for Cruz not to endorse Trump.[/QUOTE]
One can hope I guess. I don't think Sanders will blow it for the DNC but due to the Clinton hate, DNC emails, and Bernout backlash, he has the power to shift the tide against the DNC if he wanted to.
[QUOTE=RIPBILLYMAYS;50769469]One can hope I guess. I don't think Sanders will blow it for the DNC but due to the Clinton hate, DNC emails, and Bernout backlash, he has the power to shift the tide against the DNC if he wanted to.[/QUOTE]
And what would that accomplish, exactly? Split the democratic vote with Stein and let a fascist take office?
[QUOTE=IrishBandit;50769489]And what would that accomplish, exactly? Split the democratic vote with Stein and let a fascist take office?[/QUOTE]
Welcome to the club, Johnson is already taking away Conservative votes from Trump.
A 4 way election between Trump, Johnson, Stein, and whatever the DNC can scrap up would be amazing for the political system. A lot of people are only voting Trump because they hate Clinton, it would be more fair than you think
Is the DNC actually falling apart before it has even begun?
[QUOTE=RIPBILLYMAYS;50769538]Welcome to the club, Johnson is already taking away Conservative votes from Trump.
A 4 way election between Trump, Johnson, Stein, and whatever the DNC can scrap up would be amazing for the political system. A lot of people are only voting Trump because they hate Clinton, it would be more fair than you think[/QUOTE]
And vice versa. This is the year of voting for the lesser evil, whatever that means to you.
[editline]24th July 2016[/editline]
Which I suppose is every two party election, really.
[QUOTE=duckmaster;50769094]You're honestly kidding yourself if you think the USA is fucked if Clinton gets in.[/QUOTE]
Who's kidding who here? What makes you think Hillery won't F things up for the USA? She's already F'ing up her own campaign with DWS.
[QUOTE=OvB;50769606]And vice versa. This is the year of voting for the lesser evil, whatever that means to you.
[editline]24th July 2016[/editline]
Which I suppose is every two party election, really.[/QUOTE]
Stein isn't as big as Johnson because the Green Party isn't on all the ballots. Last I heard she was polling at 5% while Johnson was at 13%
[QUOTE=duckmaster;50769094]You're honestly kidding yourself if you think the USA is fucked if Clinton gets in.[/QUOTE]
She'd sell out American interests to support her corporate overlords.
[editline]24th July 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=Disgruntled;50769402]I didn't specifically mean physically hurt. A Trump presidency will hurt innocent people in all sorts of ways, directly or indirectly.[/QUOTE]
And so you advocated hurting innocent people in order to prevent what you imagine might happen?
[editline]24th July 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=IrishBandit;50769489]And what would that accomplish, exactly? Split the democratic vote with Stein and let a fascist take office?[/QUOTE]
But we're talking about taking votes away from Clinton.
[QUOTE=da space core;50768739]Did RIPBILLYMAYS actually state he supported trump though? The only legit trump supporters I saw here were ogornot and johnfisher, both banned.[/QUOTE]
Damn, I guess I haven't achieved enough notoriety.
Also with the most recent events about the rabbit hole that is the DNC, I don't know how anyone who is aware of it can with a good conscience still support Hillary, even with how much they may hate Trump, at least it isn't [B]literally[/B] proven she is this corrupt.
I'm just happy I got out of the city before it started. Currently down the shore loving the peace and quiet.
Yall can enjoy your DNC, Imma be on the beach.
[QUOTE=wystan;50769923]Damn, I guess I haven't achieved enough notoriety.
Also with the most recent events about the rabbit hole that is the DNC, I don't know how anyone who is aware of it can with a good conscience still support Hillary, even with how much they may hate Trump, at least it isn't [b]literally[/b] proven he is this corrupt.[/QUOTE]
The only reason educated people are voting Hillary is because she isn't Trump. Young educated voters overwhelmingly want Sanders. Old people want Hillary because "she's got experience" even though she's done a shit job and used her position as SoS to build up the Clinton Foundation.
And people don't care that Trump isn't corrupt because they believe he'll destroy the country. They would rather deal with a crooked broken system than go through the process of tearing it down and building a better system entirely.
[QUOTE=RIPBILLYMAYS;50769942]The only reason educated people are voting Hillary is because she isn't Trump. Young educated voters overwhelmingly want Sanders. Old people want Hillary because "she's got experience" even though she's done a shit job and used her position as SoS to build up the Clinton Foundation.
And people don't care that Trump isn't corrupt because they believe he'll destroy the country. They would rather deal with a crooked broken system than go through the process of tearing it down and building a better system entirely.[/QUOTE]
Yea, but what irks me so much is the people that still do this to spite Trump, or any alternative for the matter, are basically just enabling this behavior and will let it continue in the future. It's shortsighted in my opinion.
(Cue people posting telling me that voting Trump is also shortsighted.)
[QUOTE=Ridge;50769885]She'd sell out American interests to support her corporate overlords.
[editline]24th July 2016[/editline]
And so you advocated hurting innocent people in order to prevent what you imagine might happen?
[editline]24th July 2016[/editline]
But we're talking about taking votes away from Clinton.[/QUOTE]
Please explain to me how shes going to sellout the American public for her corporate overlords then.
[QUOTE=RIPBILLYMAYS;50769942]
And people don't care that Trump isn't corrupt because they believe he'll destroy the country. They would rather deal with a crooked broken system than go through the process of tearing it down and building a better system entirely.[/QUOTE]
I'm personally not convinced that Trump being elected will be the first step to building a better system.
[QUOTE=duckmaster;50770006]Please explain to me how shes going to sellout the American public for her corporate overlords then.[/QUOTE]
Same way Bush did?
[QUOTE=Disgruntled;50769246]Anyone who WANTS Trump in office wants some group of innocent individuals to suffer. End of. Trump supporters want to HURT someone.
Any Trump supporter who denies this is lying, either to themselves or to everyone else.
I REFUSE to let some "strongman" demagogue authoritarian like Trump take over a country that established itself on equality for ALL human beings.
[B][U]Destroy Trump and all that he stands for.[/U][/B] By any means necessary.[/QUOTE]
Yeah fight the "authoritarian" by acting legitimately like an authoritarian nutter.
[QUOTE=BelatedGamer;50770020]I'm personally not convinced that Trump being elected will be the first step to building a better system.[/QUOTE]
At this point I don't care what system he builds because I am sick of the one we have currently.
[QUOTE=RIPBILLYMAYS;50769942]The only reason educated people are voting Hillary is because she isn't Trump. Young educated voters overwhelmingly want Sanders. Old people want Hillary because "she's got experience" even though she's done a shit job and used her position as SoS to build up the Clinton Foundation.
And people don't care that Trump isn't corrupt because they believe he'll destroy the country. They would rather deal with a crooked broken system than go through the process of tearing it down and building a better system entirely.[/QUOTE]
Eh, I think there are probably plenty of fine, intelligent reasons to support any candidate in a given election. Be it Sanders or Clinton, or Trump and the cadre of other Republicans that didn't make it. They may be for particularly niche reasons, or reasons that we disagree with, or disagreement with the facts underlying the issues, but in a nation of over three-hundred-million, there's inevitably going to be intelligent people supporting any candidate.
[QUOTE=Disgruntled;50769246][B]Anyone who WANTS Trump in office wants some group of innocent individuals to suffer. End of. Trump supporters want to HURT someone.
Any Trump supporter who denies this is lying, either to themselves or to everyone else.[/B]
I REFUSE to let some "strongman" demagogue authoritarian like Trump take over a country that established itself on equality for ALL human beings.
[B][U]Destroy Trump and all that he stands for.[/U][/B] By any means necessary.[/QUOTE]
Any policy a politician is willing to take will undoubtedly make someone suffer. It's just the way things tick and click. The way you are wording this though is pretty hilarious because you are acting as if by actually enforcing our laws we are doing something horrid.
Yeah, fuck those people living in California working the agricultural sector in near slave labor.
Yeah, fuck all those families coming from South/Central America which have to live in a coyote's den, for a few months, and be forced to smuggle narcotics and possibly have their children sold into sexual rings!
Yeah, fuck all those people who actually went through the systems legally, spend the money and time, and now are being told that all they had to do was wait for a Democrat of the 1920's to come back, who seems to have a hardon for creating slavery for roughly 11 million people.
As far as I'm concerned, if we have to be blunt and come down on not only the illegals, but those hiring and enslaving them, so be it. We should come down on them like an eagle to salmon in the water.
Build a uniformly designed border fence, finance the creation of 7km ranges enforced by camps of 100 army troops, do whatever it takes to stem it once and for all.
Being a politician is just deciding who gets killed.
If you take money away from Social Security or healthcare, you will have sick old people die as a result. But when you spend that money on improved roads and stable bridges, less motorists will die due to road conditions.
Take money away from the military and the soldiers and sailors have to fight with limited capabilities. But when you put that money into education and proper schools, less kids will grow up to be criminals or die in gang violence.
This is literally what every politician does, its not exclusive to Trump's campaign. You're picking sides on who you want to live and who you don't care dies or not.
I hate to say it but the only real hope we've got for Sanders to have a shot at running with the democratic nomination is if something were to happen to Hillary. As much as we'd be better off for it that's probably a pipe dream.
[QUOTE=RIPBILLYMAYS;50770209]Being a politician is just deciding who gets killed.
If you take money away from Social Security or healthcare, you will have sick old people die as a result. But when you spend that money on improved roads and stable bridges, less motorists will die due to road conditions.
Take money away from the military and the soldiers and sailors have to fight with limited capabilities. But when you put that money into education and proper schools, less kids will grow up to be criminals or die in gang violence.
This is literally what every politician does, its not exclusive to Trump's campaign. You're picking sides on who you want to live and who you don't care dies or not.[/QUOTE]
Whatever you do you're going to upset someone and nobody will ever be completely satisfied, that's why compromise is important - you might not like the 5% budget cut for the military but if it means you can use that to expand the healthcare/education budget then maybe it's worth the small sacrifice. You might not like paying extra taxes but if it means better access to healthcare without having to put yourself in debt then it's worth it.
tell me more about how people who come to america for a better life and better economic conditions are more enslaved working here and actually making money than working a worse job and barely making any money in their home country, and starving
[QUOTE=cis.joshb;50770527]tell me more about how people who come to america for a better life and better economic conditions are more enslaved working here and actually making money than working a worse job and barely making any money in their home country, and starving[/QUOTE]
Where would you want me to start? Even if they are making money, most of the money feeds into the cartels or coyote groups that brought them over. Not to mention that a severe effect on the US economy, mostly at the state level, has been occurring as more and more low-level jobs are being taken by illegal migrants, and we no longer have the bootstrap jobs which give people some history in the job market.
So yeah, it's fairly shitty all around. Just allowing them to come here feeds the illegal activities of other groups, and giving suddenly amnesty to 11.5 to 12.5 million people is fucking stupid and will most likely cause even further problems for all parties down the road.
Forgive my ignorance, but the convention determine which candidate can run up for the presidency right?
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.