What change? Obama personally signs PATRIOT ACT extension. - Polidicks

[QUOTE=LunchboxOfDoom;30075734]The United States is not a Fascist nation. It has never been, and it won't be one anytime soon. Neither is it a Corporatist nation. The PATRIOT Act does nothing towards us, nor your average American. We still have our rights and freedoms as citizens; we are not (hard as this may be to believe) being watched over like the people of the dystopia of Oceania from 1984, we are not being indoctrinated like the Italians under Mussolini were, we are not having en masse arrests and beatings of foreigners, we are not creating death camps or work camps to enslave and exterminate them in, and we are not going on a march through the streets later today in brown shirts with swastikas galore.[/QUOTE] This. The PATRIOT Act is absolutely horrible, but some of you make it out to be like it's 1984 come true. The US is not a Fascist nation, and certainly not a dystopian one. If we're Fascists, the UK might as well be too, considering they've got that whole closed circuit camera thing going on if I recall correctly. [editline]27th May 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=Raiskauskone V2;30075994]Oh yes, I will. We shall ride the wave of diarrhea and piss amidst the sharks of hatred to the safety[/QUOTE] Pissing in a sea of sharks and diarrhea.

[QUOTE=Meller Yeller;30075519]I'm not ignorant because I'm well aware of it and what it does. I'm just not overreacting because I'm a normal person who actually has their own life and problems to deal with so they don't go into a panic over something like this.[/QUOTE] This way of thinking is what enables extremists and corrupt people to gain power, not only in the USA but everywhere and in history, to gain power in the first place. You think " it will not affect me anyway " until it affects you. And that is the most stupid way of dealing with things.

[QUOTE=Killuah;30076013]This way of thinking is what enables extremists and corrupt people to gain power, not only in the USA but everywhere and in history, to gain power in the first place. You think " it will not affect me anyway " until it affects you. And that is the most stupid way of dealing with things.[/QUOTE] It's true, acting like it doesn't matter simply because it doesn't affect you directly isn't good. However, this PATRIOT Act is not the end of the world or even of American citizens' freedom.

[QUOTE=LunchboxOfDoom;30075643]It's only been used in a handful of cases as it is, the reason being this is a serious matter that is not to be taken lightly. You'd think from how our fellow FP'ers are describing it the government is knocking down the doors of every foreigner in the country, arresting them, torturing them, and putting them in work camps for the rest of their natural lives- all whilst parading around in the streets in brown shirts to the tune of the Horst Wessel Lied... :colbert:[/QUOTE] The problem is not that they are doing it. The problem is that they are allowed to do.so. [editline]27th May 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=Megafanx13;30076024]It's true, acting like it doesn't matter simply because it doesn't affect you directly isn't good. However, this PATRIOT Act is not the end of the world or even of American citizens' freedom.[/QUOTE] True but it is a tendency and I'd rather have people overreacting than not caring at all.

[QUOTE=Killuah;30076038]The problem is not that they are doing it. The problem is that they are allowed to do.so.[/QUOTE] Except that they aren't allowed to do those things. This act is bad because it invades your privacy, but it really only comes into play if you are actually doing something illegal. They don't have the ability to just knock down innocent people's doors and put them in prison camps.

[QUOTE=The golden;30078686][url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism[/url] Seems to fit the future of America pretty well. (Minus the Anti-Conservative part)[/QUOTE] [quote]Following the defeat of the Axis powers in World War II, the term fascist has been used as a pejorative word,[48] often referring to widely varying movements across the political spectrum.[49] In political discourse, the term "fascist" is commonly used to denote authoritarian tendencies, but is often used as a pejorative epithet by adherents to both left-wing and right-wing politics to denigrate those with opposing viewpoints. George Orwell wrote in 1944 that "the word 'Fascism' is almost entirely meaningless ... almost any English person would accept 'bully' as a synonym for 'Fascist'".[50] Richard Griffiths argued in 2005 that "fascism" is the "most misused, and over-used word, of our times".[28] "Fascist" is sometimes applied to post-war organisations and ways of thinking that academics more commonly term "neo-fascist".[51][/quote] Yes. That. Either way, I'm not saying America is Fascist but you'd have to actually understand the term fully to understand what that even means, America does, actually have some Fascistic tenancies. However, Fascism isn't synonymous with killing Jews or instituting an Orwellian propaganda state, it can be economic policies as well. The 'Anti-Conservative' part back in the days of Fascism was a reaction to [i]actual[/i] conservatism. The fiscal kind, they saw keeping the money you earned as putting yourself before the state, which was not acceptable. That is a lot of why the Jews were persecuted, as they were seen as mostly among the wealthy class in post-war Germany. [quote]Fascists opposed the laissez-faire economic policies that were dominant in the era prior to the Great Depression.[201] After the Great Depression began, many people from across the political spectrum blamed laissez-faire capitalism, and fascists promoted their ideology as a "third way" between capitalism and communism.[181] Fascists declared their opposition to finance capitalism, interest charging, and profiteering.[202] Nazis and other anti-Semitic fascists considered finance capitalism a "parasitic" "Jewish conspiracy".[203] Fascist governments introduced price controls, wage controls and other types of economic interventionist measures.[204] Fascists thought that private property should be regulated to ensure that "benefit to the community precedes benefit to the individual."[205] Private property rights were supported but were contingent upon service to the state.[206] For example, "an owner of agricultural land may be compelled to raise wheat instead of sheep and employ more labour than he would find profitable."[207] However, they promoted the interests of successful small businesses.[208] Mussolini wrote approvingly of the notion that profits should not be taken away from those who produced them by their own labour, saying "I do not respect — I even hate — those men that leech a tenth of the riches produced by others".[209] According to historian Tibor Ivan Berend, dirigisme was an inherent aspect of fascist economies.[210] The Labour Charter of 1927, promulgated by the Grand Council of Fascism, stated in article 7: "The corporative State considers private initiative, in the field of production, as the most efficient and useful instrument of the Nation", then continued in article 9: "State intervention in economic production may take place only where private initiative is lacking or is insufficient, or when are at stakes the political interest of the State. This intervention may take the form of control, encouragement or direct management."[211][/quote]

Left does something bad: [quote]Oh well it's not really their fault they just didn't have a choice I'm sure[/quote] Right does the exact same thing: [quote]FUCKING HICK REDNECK IGNORANT NAZI FASCISTS FUCK THEM EVERYONE WHO VOTED FOR THEM IS AN IDIOT AHSFJSDGKSLDJGKSD[/quote] Moral of the story: Hypocrisy and bias.

What do we want?! Gradual Change! When do we want it?! In due course! Through established channels! [editline]27th May 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=acds;30079255]Left does something bad: Right does the exact same thing: Moral of the story: Hypocrisy and bias.[/QUOTE] Democrats are better nine times out of ten. Democrats don't try to take abortions away from women who need them. Democrats don't try to needlessly crush unions. Democrats have a viable candidate for 2012.

[QUOTE=acds;30079255]Left does something bad: Right does the exact same thing: Moral of the story: Hypocrisy and bias.[/QUOTE] Well I guess if you can really consider the Democrats the Left, then this still isn't true. In that thread about Harry Reid, the Senate Majority Leader (D) endorsing the PATRIOT Act, lots of FP supporters of Obama and other Democrats called him an idiot.

[QUOTE=Sega Saturn;30074830]If he didn't, it would have been another Republican berserk button pressed. Fox News would have brought on "annalists" to bash him on his terror policy and it would be thrown in his face for months to come by the retarded Republican House. At the same time, we still haven't worked out a compromise to raise the debt ceiling, and we can't have this in the way. Despite the sense behind it, it's a horrid bill and I hope it gets killed as soon as the budget is safe again.[/QUOTE] So basically unless you do what the Republicans want, they'll cause a stink to force you to do what they want? If you act that way, then the Republicans will always win. It's like giving in to the demands of terrorists.

So Obama is a patriot now... [img]http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20050917000215/metalgear/images/4/42/Big_Boss.jpg[/img] [img]http://img1.uploadscreenshot.com/images/orig/5/14614154298-orig.jpg[/img]

[QUOTE=analrapist;30081912] It's like giving in to the demands of terrorists.[/QUOTE] You could actually say that some of the bullshit the GOP does [i]is[/i] terrorism, just not physical. They are still trying to induce hysteria and terror (see FOX news and other propaganda tools) in order to have the public give in to their demands.

[QUOTE=Meller Yeller;30075413]No, people on here are just acting ridiculous talking about how America is turning in to a shithole because of something that will affect practically no one and really doesn't change our quality of life in any way. Typical Facepunch acting like women overreacting and exaggerating about everything.[/QUOTE] If it's affecting practically no one and not doing anything, why is it being passed, secondly, it is affecting people. You're a selfish ass hat if you want to pass something thats going to cause harm and tarnish the face of your nation, purely to promote fear, just because it wont affect YOU, but it will just about everyone else. Fuck you, no seriously FUCK you.

I'm even more ashamed that I'm from the same state as Obama. [editline]27th May 2011[/editline] He's from Chicago though, so it was pretty obvious he was a liar and corrupt. [editline]27th May 2011[/editline] Harry Reid is a dickweed. Dick Durbin (The good senator from Illinois) should be the majority leader.

[QUOTE=SwissArmyKnife;30074790]Honestly if you go to vote every four years thinking voting for one man who's mainly a figure head is going to make a difference, it's not. Yes there's sway, yes they have power, but it's power that's rarely used in favor of appeasing the people who've been in power and make the most money by being in power. So I'm not at all surprised shit like this happened.[/QUOTE] I agree. The only thing nobody really has control over is when the president will issue an Executive Order which comes rarely due to the rashness of the situation it is probably applied to. Those don't have to get congress's approval. Lybia, Internment, Fair hiring for government jobs. Just to name a few.

[QUOTE=JaegerMonster;30075481]Because it's fucking terribly wrong you retard. Something doesn't have to affect you directly at that very moment for you to speak out against it. Goddamn you are an idiot. [highlight](User was banned for this post ("Flaming" - Starpluck))[/highlight][/QUOTE] Jaeger gets banned for this but Meller Yeller gets away with this gem of sexism? [quote=Meller Yeller] Typical Facepunch acting like women overreacting and exaggerating about everything. [/quote]

[QUOTE=Phycosymo;30082355]You could actually say that some of the bullshit the GOP does [i]is[/i] terrorism, just not physical. They are still trying to induce hysteria and terror (see FOX news and other propaganda tools) in order to have the public give in to their demands.[/QUOTE] I agree. But that was the whole reason I voted for Obama --- I wanted someone who would do things differently and not just give in to irrational GOP demands.

[QUOTE=analrapist;30082680]I agree. But that was the whole reason I voted for Obama --- I wanted someone who would do things differently and[b] not just give in to irrational GOP demands.[/b][/QUOTE] Pretty much a pipe dream nowadays unless if there is some big political and social reform.

Oh god again? Well Obama, you just lost my vote for a reelection, have fun.

Unfortunately the alternative is even worse. This is how it always is. We end up voting for a shitty candidate just to try to keep someone even shittier from getting power, and nothing ever changes. The large majority of Americans want us to get the fuck out of our wars and stop wasting so much money, but no matter who we vote for the wars will go on and on and on.

ITT people have not done their research.

[QUOTE=redBadger;30082980]ITT people have not done their research.[/QUOTE] Would you like to elaborate on that or will you continue to not contribute in any meaningful way?

[QUOTE=Phycosymo;30082740]Pretty much a pipe dream nowadays unless if there is some big political and social reform.[/QUOTE] It's just (from what I have garnered) the GOP is highly, highly vocal and has some of the most loud people working for them and command the attention of millions in America. To try and make change, that is, changing the status quo, would be like announcing total war on the GOP. In fact why doesn't America get an independent president who -Redacted-. Just like George Washington.

George Washington told plenty of lies. [editline]27th May 2011[/editline] unless you're thinking of a different george washington

So Obama signed the PATRIOT ACT, eh? My personal opinion on the PATRIOT ACT is that the PATRIOT ACT is called the PATRIOT ACT [b]PATRIOT ACT[/b]

[QUOTE=PunchedInFac;30083247] In fact why doesn't America get an independent president who never tells a lie. Just like George Washington.[/QUOTE] Washington was one of the rich elite who owned slaves. Lets not have another one of those pricks. And he wanted Britain gone so he could take power.

[QUOTE=Solo Wing;30082791]Oh god again? Well Obama, you just lost my vote for a reelection, have fun.[/QUOTE] lol only other choices you'll have are people like ron paul and newt gingrich

*automerge-snip*

[QUOTE=analrapist;30082868]This is how it always is. We end up voting for a shitty candidate just to try to keep someone even shittier from getting power, and nothing ever changes.[/QUOTE] obama isn't a shitty president

[QUOTE=FreakySoup;30083332]So Obama signed the PATRIOT ACT, eh? My personal opinion on the PATRIOT ACT is that the PATRIOT ACT is called the PATRIOT ACT [b]PATRIOT ACT[/b][/QUOTE] Actually it's called the U.S.A.P.A.T.R.I.O.T. Act.