BBC accused of Brexit bias by more than 70 MPs in open letter
123 replies, posted
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52001064]Unlike you I am not looking for an advantage, it was in context to the point I made that the EU is shit but the people from the more disadvantaged countries of the EU don't just moan about their plight they do something about it.
The constant moaning about a situation that might or might not happen is tiresome.[/QUOTE]
A situation "that might or might not happen" can still fuck over those who are not as fortunate as you are, and if it is preventable then of course they are going to oppose it?
And what makes you think those who complain don't already do all they can to live life the best they can?
What is even your point? "Shut up and take it"? Seems you're completely removed from reality. For someone who said that people's feelings should be taken into account, you really lack empathy.
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52001064]Unlike you I am not looking for an advantage, it was in context to the point I made that the EU is shit but the people from the more disadvantaged countries of the EU don't just moan about their plight they do something about it.
The constant moaning about a situation that might or might not happen is tiresome.[/QUOTE]
Not really much else I can say to this that the previous poster didn't already.
Obviously empathy is something you struggle with, but you may want to know that "other people have it worse than you!" does very little to alleviate the stress of the person you are currently attempting to belittle. Especially when you then go on to use the situation of those people to push your agenda.
I mean, I don't want pity, I shared my personal experience to provide context to my opinions about how a particular piece of Tory legislation is out of touch with reality and will cause harm to young people.
That said, I feel it says a lot about you as a person that you could be given a glimpse into another person's troubles and just think "Oh my how tiresome! :rolleyes:".
The only tenuous link this shit even has to do with the EU (outside of you trying to be a knob because you disagree with me about it) was that without the programs and projects put in place and funded by the EU my situation would be far more dire than it is currently.
You keep pushing this dumb idea that I think the UK is ~doomed~ as if it's going to sink into the fucking ocean- but in reality I just understand the extent that communities like mine rely on EU funding in order to operate.
If this dumb fucking decision is going to hit our country as hard as [i] people who know what they are talking about[/i] have predicted, how can I trust our government, a Government that has thus far shown they don't give a single solitary shit about the rest of us, to come up with the funding necessary to keep all these programs, all of these communities running?
To you this "may or may not happen" is such a political, ephemeral, distant, issue. One that you don't have to particularly care about so long as your feels of nationalism and/or xenophobia are assuaged.
To people in my position, It threatens what little security and stability we have managed to build, It has the potential to fuck up everything we have had to work so hard for- turn lives and businesses upside-down. If you can't understand why that's a big deal from my perspective, then there's really no reasoning with you.
guys just a word of advice, when you're looking at economic forecasts and variables etc for the UK make sure you also compare them with all other developed nations - basically the OECD - because normally there's a pattern to this type of data. If there's no pattern or there is a pattern, that's very interesting and you can start adding weight to your arguments, whatever you're arguing for. For example the UK currency falling is quite obviously outside of the OECD norms, you won't find other countries in this same situation, while on the other hand you'll see that OECD forecasts for growth are quite normal in the short-run [URL]http://www.oecd.org/eco/outlook/Will-risks-derail-the-modest-recovery-OECD-Interim-Economic-Outlook-March-2017.pdf[/URL]. Of course bear in mind that this is just a forecast - it might be right or wrong, or extremely wrong. Inflation is also interesting too, UK's inflation is on an upward trend along with the rest of the OECD [url]https://data.oecd.org/price/inflation-cpi.htm#indicator-chart[/url].
The purpose of my post is not to do the research for you, but to point anyone interested in the right direction.
[QUOTE=Anteep;52002810]guys just a word of advice, when you're looking at economic forecasts and variables etc for the UK make sure you also compare them with all other developed nations - basically the OECD - because normally there's a pattern to this type of data. If there's no pattern or there is a pattern, that's very interesting and you can start adding weight to your arguments, whatever you're arguing for. For example the UK currency falling is quite obviously outside of the OECD norms, you won't find other countries in this same situation, while on the other hand you'll see that OECD forecasts for growth are quite normal in the short-run [URL]http://www.oecd.org/eco/outlook/Will-risks-derail-the-modest-recovery-OECD-Interim-Economic-Outlook-March-2017.pdf[/URL]. Of course bear in mind that this is just a forecast - it might be right or wrong, or extremely wrong. Inflation is also interesting too, UK's inflation is on an upward trend along with the rest of the OECD [url]https://data.oecd.org/price/inflation-cpi.htm#indicator-chart[/url].
The purpose of my post is not to do the research for you, but to point anyone interested in the right direction.[/QUOTE]
Yeah but this could be contrary to the tabloid articles so it can't be true.
Anyway SH's resident self proclaimed economical experts must have taken all of the facts into consideration.
Fulgrim I love your summing up about reasoning when you claim I have feels of nationalism and xenophobia because my opinion differs from yours especially when most of your responses/opinions seem to be based on emotion and your own personal experience.
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52005184]Fulgrim I love your summing up about reasoning when you claim I have feels of nationalism and xenophobia because my opinion differs from yours especially when most of your responses/opinions seem to be based on emotion and your own personal experience.[/QUOTE]
Because yours are based on anything else than that? You dismiss any source that goes contrary to your own opinion, going so far as to say the BBC is biased but use it's articles when it support your own bias.
Snip
[editline]24th March 2017[/editline]
[QUOTE=_Axel;52005196]Because yours are based on anything else than that? You dismiss any source that goes contrary to your own opinion, going so far as to say the BBC is biased but use it's articles when it support your own bias.[/QUOTE]
I posted an article that claimed the BBC were biased with regards to Brexit, but as usual you have misquoted me out of all proportions as an argument.
Aren't you arguing based on nothing more than your feelings and personal experience when you claim those who oppose Brexit are whining and not doing anything to "pull on their bootstraps"?
[QUOTE=_Axel;52005334]Aren't you arguing based on nothing more than your feelings and personal experience when you claim those who oppose Brexit are whining and not doing anything to "pull on their bootstraps"?[/QUOTE]
No I wasn't arguing that [B][I]everybody[/I][/B] whining about Brexit the same as I wasn't saying that the BBC are biased about [B][I]everything[/I][/B].
Aren't"t you just misquoting everything I say?
I notice how you keep desperately moving from one accusation to another. What is your point?
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52005406]No I wasn't arguing that [B][I]everybody[/I][/B] whining about Brexit the same as I wasn't saying that the BBC are biased about [B][I]everything[/I][/B].
Aren't"t you just misquoting everything I say?
I notice how you keep desperately moving from one accusation to another. What is your point?[/QUOTE]
Then what the fuck do you mean by that:
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52001064]Unlike you I am not looking for an advantage, it was in context to the point I made that the EU is shit but the people from the more disadvantaged countries of the EU don't just moan about their plight they do something about it.
The constant moaning about a situation that might or might not happen is tiresome.[/QUOTE]
Funny that you say I'm "desperately" moving from one point to another when I'm only going back to a point that you blatantly ignored. "What is your point" is a question I asked 15 hours ago and you still haven't answered it.
[QUOTE=_Axel;52005424]Then what the fuck do you mean by that:
Funny that you say I'm "desperately" moving from one point to another when I'm only going back to a point that you blatantly ignored. "What is your point" is a question I asked 15 hours ago and you still haven't answered it.[/QUOTE]
And where in that statement did I say that everyone opposing Brexit should "pull on their bootstraps?
If you are so confused by my point what the fuck have you been arguing about for the last few days?
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52005491]And where in that statement did I say that everyone opposing Brexit should "pull on their bootstraps?
If you are so confused by my point what the fuck have you been arguing about for the last few days?[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;51996830]i have always found that the people doing the bleating are often the ones who can't get on in life, take a leaf out of the eastern european countries book and do something constructive about your plight other than fucking moaning if it is really that bad, which it really fucking isn't.[/QUOTE]
Where did I say you said "everyone"?
Why don't you answer this post instead of nitpicking my words?
[QUOTE=_Axel;52001103]A situation "that might or might not happen" can still fuck over those who are not as fortunate as you are, and if it is preventable then of course they are going to oppose it?
And what makes you think those who complain don't already do all they can to live life the best they can?
What is even your point? "Shut up and take it"? Seems you're completely removed from reality. For someone who said that people's feelings should be taken into account, you really lack empathy.[/QUOTE]
Yeah cos I'm all out of empathy after constantly reading here what a dumb cunt, xenophobe, racist, nationalist I am for choosing to vote a certain way in a referendum.
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52005564]Yeah cos I'm all out of empathy after constantly reading here what a dumb cunt, xenophobe, racist, nationalist I am for choosing to vote a certain way in a referendum.[/QUOTE]
So because people have called you mean things on an internet forum you categorize those who complain about Brexit potentially affecting their life negatively as lazy bastards who whine instead of helping themselves?
At what point do you realize the irony of labelling people who have genuine concerns as lazy bums because others have used buzzwords on you?
I don't recall calling you any of that myself.
:snip:
off topic. if you've quoted me for a reply, oh well.
[QUOTE=_Axel;52005592]So because people have called you mean things on an internet forum you categorize those who complain about Brexit potentially affecting their life negatively as lazy bastards who whine instead of helping themselves?
At what point do you realize the irony of labelling people who have genuine concerns as lazy bums because others have used buzzwords on you?
I don't recall calling you any of that myself.[/QUOTE]
Lol you can't help misquoting everything I say.
[editline]24th March 2017[/editline]
[QUOTE=Crumpet;52005596]maybe it's because you're a massive generalizing hypocrite and constantly blather on about shit you aren't qualified to, only to drop back to 'well it's my opinion' when it goes awry. you make some good backed up posts but other times you just claim the most absurd shit.
just a cursory glance of your 5 pages.[/QUOTE]
Yeah and everything you and everyone that agrees with you are qualified to talk shit, is that it?
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52005605]Lol you can't help misquoting everything I say.
[editline]24th March 2017[/editline]
Yeah and everything you and everyone that agrees with you are qualified to talk shit, is that it?[/QUOTE]
Oh, you did quote. The second half of the sentence you're replying to is vital to it's meaning.
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52005605]Lol you can't help misquoting everything I say.[/QUOTE]
Then if that's not what you mean maybe you can clarify that? Don't see how else I could interpret your post.
What exactly does you presenting yourself as a victim of FP bullies have to do with claiming that people who complain about Brexit can't be arsed to make any effort to help themselves?
[QUOTE=_Axel;52005759]Then if that's not what you mean maybe you can clarify that? Don't see how else I could interpret your post.
What exactly does you presenting yourself as a victim of FP bullies have to do with claiming that people who complain about Brexit can't be arsed to make any effort to help themselves?[/QUOTE]
I am not a victim but why would I have empathy with people that think 17 million people are dumb cunts, racist, blah blah because they chose differently.
Ironically the same people that drone on about integration and accepting other people's cultures etc but can't even accept another point of view.
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52005920]I am not a victim but why would I have empathy with people that think 17 million people are dumb cunts, racist, blah blah because they chose differently.[/QUOTE]
And what makes you think those who criticize Brexit think that? Why do you say they should stop whining and help themselves instead when they haven't even said that's what they think?
Not to mention empathy is beside the point, you're admitting to being intellectually dishonest and arbitrarily assuming things about the way their life works just because you don't like them or their attitude. That's just the pinnacle of letting your feelings control your opinion rather than rationality.
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52005184]Fulgrim I love your summing up about reasoning when you claim I have feels of nationalism and xenophobia because my opinion differs from yours[/QUOTE]
Because of the content of previous posts from you, not ~because you have a different opinion~. You seriously aren't a victim, nobody feels sympathetic to those poor leave voters because they maybe got called dumb at some point.
This is my own personal opinion, But how can you blame people when leave voters famously fell for Tory promises of all things (what was written on the infamous NHS bus again?), and continue to revere political figures that scarpered the moment they got their "victory".
Besides, since when has nationalism been considered objectively bad by everyone? would you personally argue that nationalism is a negative thing?
A massive part of the leave campaign was rooted in very open nationalism- "Take our country back!" "Make our own laws!" "British Sovereignty!"- how is suggesting that nationalism is a possible motivator for you some kind of snark?
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52005184] most of your responses/opinions seem to be based on emotion and your own personal experience.[/QUOTE]
Again, no they don't.
Most of my responses are centred on the understanding of just how much places like my community rely on EU funding to prop up services etc that the Tories wont allocate resources to. That's objectively true.
Without the EU, it's only logical to assume this funding will evaporate.
Where was the illogical emotional reasoning again because this all looks pretty grounded from where i'm sitting.
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;51996830]a lot of EU countries are fucked financially (FACT) so I am still waiting for an explanation as to why the EU hasn't worked for these countries? untold other EU countries populous is scattered across the EU trying to make a living which suggests to me that they are not in great shape either.[/QUOTE]
cause Eurozone sucks. But funnily enough, the UK is not a part of that :/
[QUOTE=fulgrim;52006335]Because of the content of previous posts from you, not ~because you have a different opinion~. You seriously aren't a victim, nobody feels sympathetic to those poor leave voters because they maybe got called dumb at some point.
This is my own personal opinion, But how can you blame people when leave voters famously fell for Tory promises of all things (what was written on the infamous NHS bus again?), and continue to revere political figures that scarpered the moment they got their "victory".
Besides, since when has nationalism been considered objectively bad by everyone? would you personally argue that nationalism is a negative thing?
A massive part of the leave campaign was rooted in very open nationalism- "Take our country back!" "Make our own laws!" "British Sovereignty!"- how is suggesting that nationalism is a possible motivator for you some kind of snark?
Again, no they don't.
Most of my responses are centred on the understanding of just how much places like my community rely on EU funding to prop up services etc that the Tories wont allocate resources to. That's objectively true.
Without the EU, it's only logical to assume this funding will evaporate.
Where was the illogical emotional reasoning again because this all looks pretty grounded from where i'm sitting.[/QUOTE]
I don't think it's a snark per se but if you honestly don't believe that the level of hive mind rhetoric that has been used in these forums regarding people who voted for Brexit is ridiculous then you must of been reading with rose coloured remain glasses on.
Mostly people will argue that for instance you cannot tar everyone with the same brush, Muslims being a current example, but with regular monotony these forums claim that Brexit voters are all dumb right wing bigots, then can't understand said voters lacking empathy with remain voters here.
As I have said before this view is exclusive to this forum and some dubious biased media outlets so I just "feel" it's only right for me to post for the sake of balance.
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;51996830]a lot of EU countries are fucked financially (FACT) so I am still waiting for an explanation as to why the EU hasn't worked for these countries? [/QUOTE]
I remember you asking the exact same thing before, specifically naming Portugal in another one of your posts and I answered why and you completely ignored it, so I doubt you're being truthful when you say you're waiting for an explanation since you're doing the same thing again
[QUOTE=Gwoodman;52010254]I remember you asking the exact same thing before, specifically naming Portugal in another one of your posts and I answered why and you completely ignored it, so I doubt you're being truthful when you say you're waiting for an explanation since you're doing the same thing again[/QUOTE]
i named quite a few countries so your post didn't actually cover my question.
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52010279]i named quite a few countries so your post didn't actually cover my question.[/QUOTE]
so because I answered to one of the three you named as it is clear as a sunny day that you don't know anything about the country, it "doesn't cover the question"? That's ridiculous.
[editline]25th March 2017[/editline]
Sounds like since you are constantly barging on the EU and the Eurozone and I claimed the fault is within the country's banks, it doesn't help your argument so you chose to ignore it
[QUOTE=Gwoodman;52010288]so because I answered to one of the three you named as it is clear as a sunny day that you don't know anything about the country, it "doesn't cover the question"? That's ridiculous.
[editline]25th March 2017[/editline]
Sounds like since you are constantly barging on the EU and the Eurozone and I claimed the fault is within the country's banks, it doesn't help your argument so you chose to ignore it[/QUOTE]
I'm not denying it or ignoring it, I am just pointing out that EU membership with it's free trade etc cannot guarantee economical stability. the concept is shit, there is no parity between member states economically. the rich states get richer and the poor states get poorer as their workforce move on to richer states. the richer states bailout the poorer states as they fail, how is this good?
No, the EU makes the countries more stable. That's the fucking point of it. Have you been railing against the EU without knowing what it is? You naughty boy.
The idea is that we "help" the countries struggling, they'll begin to grow, and in turn, they'll help us if we're struggling.
By "helping" the countries struggling, I could just mean that a rich man such as yourself props up a factory in lithuania, because it's much cheaper there, and the EU gives you less bullshit for trying such a thing. You benefit, Lithuania benefits, Lithuania will benefit you more as it reaches the same GDP per capita. It's a simple fucking thing.
[QUOTE=The Jack;52010554]No, the EU makes the countries more stable. That's the fucking point of it. Have you been railing against the EU without knowing what it is? You naughty boy.
The idea is that we "help" the countries struggling, they'll begin to grow, and in turn, they'll help us if we're struggling.
By "helping" the countries struggling, I could just mean that a rich man such as yourself props up a factory in lithuania, because it's much cheaper there, and the EU gives you less bullshit for trying such a thing. You benefit, Lithuania benefits, Lithuania will benefit you more as it reaches the same GDP per capita. It's a simple fucking thing.[/QUOTE]
The simple fact is that the principal isn't working though.
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52014255]The simple fact is that the principal isn't working though.[/QUOTE]
[Citation Needed]
[QUOTE=Craigewan;52014321][Citation Needed][/QUOTE]
Would make a lot of sense as his title tbh
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