Russia invades Ukraine. Roads and airports being blocked and occupied
1,366 replies, posted
Russia's Black Sea Fleet has given Ukrainian forces in Crimea until 5:00 local time (03:00 GMT) on Tuesday to surrender or face an all-out assault, according to Ukrainian defence ministry sources quoted by Interfax-Ukraine news agency. "If by 5am tomorrow morning they do not surrender a real assault will begin on units and sections of the Ukrainian armed forces all over Crimea," defence ministry officials are quoted as saying. So far there is no further confirmation of the ultimatum from other sources.
This is from the BBC live feed.
[url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-26413953[/url]
[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;44112502]Euro maiden isn't a valid source.
They will say anything to gain support for their cause.[/QUOTE]
Interfax is reporting the same thing.
[QUOTE=laserpanda;44112589]Interfax is reporting the same thing.[/QUOTE]
I saw the bbc post above your one. I still stand by my statement that EuroMaiden should not be used as a valid source and that people should wait for news to come from less bias media before posting or accepting as fact.
The reports shouldn't be denied just because they're posted on Madian, though, as would an unseen report by a Russian source get noticed as well. We've got Interfax doing the reporting, too, so there's that.
So shits hitting the fan in 12 hours.
If the thousands of Crimean forces surrender, do you think the mainland Ukraine is just going to let it happen without retaliation?
[QUOTE=Orkel;44112656]So shits hitting the fan in 12 hours.
If the thousands of Crimean forces surrender, do you think the mainland Ukraine is just going to let it happen without retaliation?[/QUOTE]
I don't believe that particular news, but I personally think even if it's true, and Crimean forces surrender, yes, I think they'll let it go without any kind of retaliation. They swallowed the invasion, they swallowed literal occupation of Crimea, they'll swallow this as well. Because there's nothing they can do anyway.
Honestly if this is true I can really see Russia going for the north east next, around Donetsk, and Kharkov.
[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;44112069]Relitively small pro-EU protests.
Gov makes draconic anti protest laws.
More people protest against laws.
Protest turns foul with molotovs.
Laws removed.
Ceasefires called but fail for one reason or another.
Riots continue.
Ukerain government ousted by force.
Interim government made up entirely by opposition to old gov.
Interim government has ultra nationalists in there.
Laws passed to stop russian from being an offical language (in some regions the majority of people are russian speaking)
Some of interim government want to sever ties with russia (svoboda).
Russia has a base in crimea and want to keep it.
Crimea wants independence and refuses to recognise interim goverment.
Mysterious well armed men appear in ukerain taking over airports.
Apcs block roads.
Pro russian crimean activists raise russian flag everywhere and take over stuff.
Mysterious well armed men are actually russian.
Ukerain's interim gov fires head of armed forces
Russians have controlled a few military bases.
World is telling Russia to stop
Russia says they are there to keep peace.
I think the russian army is only in and around Crimea though. There are pro russian protests outside crimea aswell as well as anti russian protests in crimea.[/QUOTE]
For someone who followed the entire thing you still can't spell Ukraine correctly.
[QUOTE=RazorsharpLT;44112683]For someone who followed the entire thing you still can't spell Ukraine correctly.[/QUOTE]
I make pretty much the same typos when trying to type really fast. Abominations come out of that: Ukrain, Ukerain, Urkaine etc. It's a funny word.
[QUOTE=gudman;44112545]And yet this same garbage
is absolutely okay with you as long as it's about another country, yes?[/QUOTE]
I don't mean to insult the people, just Putin. I'm sorry if I offended you.
[QUOTE=Orkel;44112656]So shits hitting the fan in 12 hours.
If the thousands of Crimean forces surrender, do you think the mainland Ukraine is just going to let it happen without retaliation?[/QUOTE]
What could Ukraine possibly do to Russia besides just escalating the conflict. I hate to say it but unless someone is prepared to take on the bear, I don't think much will come of this except angry words and appeasement.
[QUOTE=gudman;44112698]I make pretty much the same typos when trying to type really fast. Abominations come out of that: Ukrain, Ukerain, Urkaine etc. It's a funny word.[/QUOTE]
Pretty sure it was intentional, considering it was the exact same 'typo' every single time. Ukerain.
[QUOTE=Orkel;44112656]So shits hitting the fan in 12 hours.
If the thousands of Crimean forces surrender, do you think the mainland Ukraine is just going to let it happen without retaliation?[/QUOTE]
I hope so. It's not going to be pretty if they don't.
The Ukrainians really need to make the Russians shoot at them before surrendering the bases.Provoke them into using military force then surrender It really is the best move at this point. The outcry will be enormous, and the international community can start freezing assets.
[QUOTE=Orkel;44112656]do you think the mainland Ukraine is just going to let it happen without retaliation?[/QUOTE]
yes
the crimea has been lost since the beginning.
Lets not give Russia the easiest pretext to take half the country next
Judging by the BBC feed it seems as if almost nobody followed the Ukrainian Admiral into switching allegiance; a Naval Officers group he tried to persuade started singing the national anthem after his speech, and they're still not giving up on the holdings.
[QUOTE=Zenreon117;44112709]What could Ukraine possibly do to Russia besides just escalating the conflict. I hate to say it but unless someone is prepared to take on the bear, I don't think much will come of this except angry words and appeasement.[/QUOTE]
Unfortunately. And appeasement has worked so well in the past. I see this as the beginning of something much larger. I strongly oppose the idea of appeasement. And what I see of these economic sanctions looks like nothing more that strongly worded letters and finger waving at Russia. Russia in my opinion will only respond to force. Otherwise they'll begin to believe that the rest of the world will roll over and allow their aggression to happen.
[QUOTE=imarawrus;44112789]Unfortunately. And appeasement has worked so well in the past. I see this as the beginning of something much larger. I strongly oppose the idea of appeasement. And what I see of these economic sanctions look like nothing more that strongly worded letters and finger waving at Russia. Russia in my opinion will only respond to force. Otherwise they'll begin to believe that the rest of the world will roll over and allow their aggression to happen.[/QUOTE]In the current age we don't necessarily need to use force. Economic sanctions, alienation and isolation from the western world is enough to cripple the big bear, as they rely on most of your patents and businesses (e.g microsoft, Apple, Sony, etc.)
[QUOTE=RazorsharpLT;44112826]In the current age we don't necessarily need to use force. Economic sanctions, alienation and isolation from the western world is enough to cripple the big bear, as they rely on most of your patents and businesses (e.g microsoft, Apple, Sony, etc.)[/QUOTE]
I understand what you're saying but I feel that the Russians just do not care. It doesn't make a lick of difference to them in my opinion.
[QUOTE=imarawrus;44112789]Unfortunately. And appeasement has worked so well in the past. I see this as the beginning of something much larger. I strongly oppose the idea of appeasement. And what I see of these economic sanctions looks like nothing more that strongly worded letters and finger waving at Russia. Russia in my opinion will only respond to force. Otherwise they'll begin to believe that the rest of the world will roll over and allow their aggression to happen.[/QUOTE]
As much as I hate to say it.
The Crimea, or even Eastern Ukraine is not worth sparking a world war over.
It's on BBC now, does that make it official?
[url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-26424738[/url]
[QUOTE=imarawrus;44112839]I understand what you're saying but I feel that the Russians just do not care. It doesn't make a lick of difference to them in my opinion.[/QUOTE]Yes, but as Nodachi mentioned - Crimea is not really worth another world war. And Ukraine isn't part of NATO, so U.S has no other apparent reason to intervene except for... well... having a dick waving competition with Russia. U.S shouldn't be viewed as the 'world police' and i respect it's decision not to stick it's nose where it doesn't belong (a nice change of view, if you ask me)
one must wonder why Russia not yet started invade the mainland Ukraine for the Russian speakers regions and tactical imprortance ...
namely Odessa, Mykolaiv, Kherson districts in South
and Donetsk and Kharkiv in East
Man I wonder what those Ukraine soldiers are thinking right now.... Their country has been through so much already and now this. Who do they stand by?
[QUOTE=NoDachi;44112840]As much as I hate to say it.
The Crimea, or even Eastern Ukraine is not worth sparking a world war over.[/QUOTE]
I'm not saying I want to see another world war, but where do we draw the line? 6 years ago it was South Ossetia and Abkhazia, now it's Crimea. What's next?
[QUOTE=Dwarden;44112895]one must wonder why Russia not yet started invade the mainland Ukraine for the Russian speakers regions and tactical imprortance ...
namely Odessa, Mykolaiv, Kherson districts in South
and Donetsk and Kharkiv in East[/QUOTE]
If Russia invade the rest of Ukraine then war would most certainly break out. I think Russia is just going to bite and hold onto Crimea. But that's just my guess.
[QUOTE=imarawrus;44112909]I'm not saying I want to see another world war, but where do we draw the line? 6 years ago it was South Ossetia and Abkhazia, now it's Crimea. What's next?[/QUOTE]
You draw the line at provoking a war that could kill hundreds of thousands and decend Ukraine into a bloody civil war.
If Russia actually invades mainland Ukraine, I can't see that not happening.
The Ukrainian military already has questionable loyalties and its not even likely they would even attempt to resist as a whole.
but as the BBC said
[quote]So far Russia's military operation has been largely blood-less. Its forces have met with only some passive resistance from Ukrainian units who can do very little.
Perhaps the initial military phase of this crisis is largely at an end. However if Russian troops were to move into eastern Ukraine it could take this drama to a whole new level.
It is not so much that there would be full-scale mechanised warfare - though clearly some Ukrainian units might fight.
The greater danger is that such a move could prompt a bitter civil struggle with pro- and anti-Russian groups mobilising against each other.[/quote]
[QUOTE=imarawrus;44112909]I'm not saying I want to see another world war, but where do we draw the line? 6 years ago it was South Ossetia and Abkhazia, now it's Crimea. What's next?[/QUOTE]I hate to imply this, but South Ossetia wasn't of ANY strategical importance, and now it's having an economical downfall. So, really, Russia gained nothing from that (except maybe an imaginary penis extension). Crimea is a whole other thing, though. With a huge naval base and loads a' black gold
BBC just got confirmation from press office of the Defense Ministry for the ultimatum.
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