Chelsea Manning to Undergo Gender Reassignment Surgery
73 replies, posted
[QUOTE=false prophet;51048872]So this is where my taxes go...[/QUOTE]
[quote]The cost for female-to-male reassignment can be more than $50,000. The cost for male-to-female reassignment can be $7,000 to $24,000. Between 100 to 500 gender-reassignment procedures are conducted in the United States each year.[/quote]
[quote]In fiscal year 2015, military spending is projected to account for 54 percent of all federal discretionary spending, a total of $598.5 billion[/quote]
[QUOTE=false prophet;51048872]So this is where my taxes go...[/QUOTE]
Give me a break, we're talking fractions of a penny here. Could it be you're simply more content with your taxes going towards things that are actually morally questionable instead of aiding the sick?
[QUOTE=The golden;51048898]To helping people get the medical attention they need, yes.
Or were you implying that because of her actions she should be denied basic medical care?[/QUOTE]
While I understand how trans people are their gender, I don't think we should support the reassignment surgery of a soldier who swore an oath to defend their country, and then made a conscious choice to betray it.
It's not like she is wasting away with cancer and needs a life-saving surgery. She wants to physically be a woman instead of a man, but she should of thought of that before she committed treason.
[QUOTE=italics560;51065869]While I understand how trans people are their gender, I don't think we should support the reassignment surgery of a soldier who swore an oath to defend their country, and then made a conscious choice to betray it.
It's not like she is wasting away with cancer and needs a life-saving surgery. She wants to physically be a woman instead of a man, but she should of thought of that before she committed treason.[/QUOTE]
It's treating a mental health problem. It's not like trans people are just one day like "you know, being a woman/man would be pretty swell." I'd read up on what dysphoria is.
Denying someone's human rights because they're a traitor says a lot about the country she betrayed, no?
Don't get me wrong, what I think Manning did was wrong (well, in so much that she went with WikiLeaks - who are notorious for not removing information and therefore endangering lives), but she shouldn't be treated as an inhuman dog because of it. Fucks sake, if this was Russia we were talking about, a hell of a lot more people would be complaining about it.
Fact of the matter is, how you treat your enemies says a lot about you and your country.
[QUOTE=italics560;51065869]While I understand how trans people are their gender, I don't think we should support the reassignment surgery of a soldier who swore an oath to defend their country, and then made a conscious choice to betray it.
It's not like she is wasting away with cancer and needs a life-saving surgery. She wants to physically be a woman instead of a man, but she should of thought of that before she committed treason.[/QUOTE]
If you were imprisoned for life and were also made to have a body of the opposite sex permanently, would it not bother you? Perhaps not at first, but after ten to twenty years?
I know this is different; the government is not causing the problem. They are refusing to treat a serious mental health concern, though.
Also consider [I]why[/I] she committed treason: a misguided effort to [I]help[/I] America. No need for pure malice against this.
[QUOTE=italics560;51065869]While I understand how trans people are their gender, I don't think we should support the reassignment surgery of a soldier who swore an oath to defend their country, and then made a conscious choice to betray it.
It's not like she is wasting away with cancer and needs a life-saving surgery. She wants to physically be a woman instead of a man, but she should of thought of that before she committed treason.[/QUOTE]
Unfortunately, there is this little screwball set of rules that some old farts made up called the Constitution.
While yes, we should get rid of it posthaste so we can deny medical treatment to anyone who we don't like under the vague guise of "b-but taxpayer money shouldn't pay for criminals", it is kind of a roadblock to us becoming a totalitarian police state for the time being.
Yeah, she should have thought of becoming a woman before she committed this crime, totally. I mean, whenever I walk out my front door to commit a crime, I always make sure that I'm totally comfortable and healthy, and will be until the end of my potential incarceration, because I know in advance that the United States has a long-standing policy of denying basic mental health treatment to prisoners.
ouch my sense of sarcasm
[QUOTE=The golden;51048898]To helping people get the medical attention they need, yes.
Or were you implying that because of her actions she should be denied basic medical care?[/QUOTE]
No, I'm implying that my tax dollars shouldn't go to helping someone snip off their dicks
[edit] and heres why
When I am sick I don't get free medical care.
[QUOTE=false prophet;51066077]When I am sick I don't get free medical care.[/QUOTE]
So you're saying that no prisoners should receive medical care.
Is she facing life threatening disease? No?
[QUOTE=false prophet;51066077]No, I'm implying that my tax dollars shouldn't go to helping someone snip off their dicks
[edit] and heres why
When I am sick I don't get free medical care.[/QUOTE]
Perhaps your country should finally have the balls to get universal health care, 'insurance companies' and others be damned.
My country is not about fair treatment like this. It's about how more money can be made.
It's very sad that in order to receive treatment you either need to be in a federal prison or pay out of pocket. Oh and not all insurance cover every cost.
[QUOTE=false prophet;51066200]My country is not about fair treatment like this. It's about how more money can be made.
It's very sad that in order to receive treatment you either need to be in a federal prison or pay out of pocket. Oh and not all insurance cover every cost.[/QUOTE]
[I]Should[/I] our country not be about fair treatment? Would you prefer the status quo, or for taxation to actually be for the public good?
If the latter, you shouldn't oppose her tax-funded medical treatment. It sets precedent for medical prison care nationwide, further pushing for the sort of universal healthcare seen elsewhere in the world that enables families to not go bankrupt to medical emergencies.
But her tax-funded medical treatment is exactly what I want. Why should prisoners be allowed elective procedures like this when there are people dying of curable diseases simply because they can't afford to pay for treatment?
I am all for higher taxes if it means that our society improves. I will NOT be okay with my taxes being used in this way unless it is there for everyone. Equality is a two way street after all.
[QUOTE=false prophet;51066289]But her tax-funded medical treatment is exactly what I want. Why should prisoners be allowed elective procedures like this when there are people dying of curable diseases simply because they can't afford to pay for treatment?
I am all for higher taxes if it means that our society improves. I will NOT be okay with my taxes being used in this way unless it is there for everyone. Equality is a two way street after all.[/QUOTE]
this country is never going to see true universal healthcare all at once
if you want that kind of improvement, it needs to come a piece at a time
that means standing up for justice to others when possible, and not advocating against that justice just because you do not have it for yourself yet
it's like if you and your best friend were both jailed for a murder neither of you commited, and spiting that friend for being released from prison after evidence clears only him of the accusation
[editline]17th September 2016[/editline]
or if gay rights organizations were to never attempt state-wide gay marriage legalization, because they would settle for nothing less than all-at-once nationwide legislation
no progress would have been made
[QUOTE=skatehawk11;51066483][I]Great spending of my tax money[/I]. Why does some dude that wants to mutilate his genitals get free medical treatment that [B][I]is a criminal[/I][/B] and I don't? It's not like they have a life threatening disease that without it they would die.[/QUOTE]
I can't tell if this is sincere or a parody of the most obvious thoughtless response to the topic.
[QUOTE=CatFodder;51066527]I can't tell if this is sincere or a parody of the most obvious thoughtless response to the topic.[/QUOTE]
People like him actually exist.
Thankfully they don't last long here.
[QUOTE=false prophet;51066289]But her tax-funded medical treatment is exactly what I want. Why should prisoners be allowed elective procedures like this when there are people dying of curable diseases simply because they can't afford to pay for treatment?
I am all for higher taxes if it means that our society improves. I will NOT be okay with my taxes being used in this way unless it is there for everyone. Equality is a two way street after all.[/QUOTE]
We have a fucked up system where instead of your tax money going to reform prisoners and provide healthcare for everyone, that money instead goes to baby-sitting them in a hell hole while sustaining them for whatever arbitrary time period they're kept there because our prison system is designed to funnel your tax money into the hands of the people running private prisons. I agree, we should have public healthcare for everyone regardless of criminal status, and it's fucking travesty that our country is run this way. Hopefully with time we can reform this.
[QUOTE=skatehawk11;51066483][I]Great spending of my tax money[/I]. Why does some dude that wants to mutilate his genitals get free medical treatment that [B][I]is a criminal[/I][/B] and I don't? It's not like they have a life threatening disease that without it they would die.
[highlight](User was permabanned for this post ("Terrible poster. Cannot function here." - Big Dumb American))[/highlight][/QUOTE]
[t]http://i.imgur.com/UNcPxTF.png[/t]
[QUOTE=MR-X;51047456]Well don't do anything stupid to get put into military prison. While the treatment she has been getting sucks and it harsh even by U.S prison standards but you can't feel all that sorry for her seeing as she recklessly released documents and did more harm then good.[/QUOTE]
She literally did 0 harm to government operations. Have you heard of any government officials getting shot as a result? No? That's what i thought
Edward Snowden and Chelsea Manning deserve pardons
[QUOTE=space1;51066717]She literally did 0 harm to government operations. Have you heard of any government officials getting shot as a result? No? That's what i thought
Edward Snowden and Chelsea Manning deserve pardons[/QUOTE]
Snowden sure, I agree completely. Manning's a more complicated case, since the information didn't go through journalists only (and WikiLeaks later proved to be uncooperative with the Guardian, etc.) and so the information wasn't redacted and properly evaluated - so that information that might put people's lives at danger weren't taken out.
[QUOTE=false prophet;51066200]My country is not about fair treatment like this. It's about how more money can be made.
It's very sad that in order to receive treatment you either need to be in a federal prison or pay out of pocket. Oh and not all insurance cover every cost.[/QUOTE]
"If I can't get free healthcare, nobody can get it."
Okay, pal.
[QUOTE=false prophet;51048872]So this is where my taxes go...[/QUOTE]
i highly doubt you pay taxes
[QUOTE=Cructo;51067666]Law abiding citizens should definitely come before criminals though.[/QUOTE]
If you're going to make the argument that all Americans [I]except criminals[/I] should have healthcare, that's a different discussion.
If you're arguing that all Americans (without exception) should have healthcare, for ethical reasons, then stipulating [I]X group shouldn't have it FIRST[/I] is deliberately withholding an ethical obligation out of jealousy or spite.
Conveniently take what I say out of context and ignore everything else I wrote
[I]Wow, this is where my taxes go?[/I] Good, good stuff.
[QUOTE=Bridger;51068058][I]Wow, this is where my taxes go?[/I] Good, good stuff.[/QUOTE]
Your taxes could also go to healthcare for the general public if it weren't for your country having a private system. Prisoners only get free coverage if they're eligible and the prison decides to pay - which, given the profit-driven nature of the American penal system, is not the top priority of the jailers.
Don't complain about her being able to manage within an unfair system. Instead, look toward solutions for changing the system itself.
[QUOTE=Arctic-Zone;51068122]Your taxes could also go to healthcare for the general public if it weren't for your country having a private system. Prisoners only get free coverage if they're eligible and the prison decides to pay - which, given the profit-driven nature of the American penal system, is not the top priority of the jailers.
Don't complain about her being able to manage within an unfair system. Instead, look toward solutions for changing the system itself.[/QUOTE]
Didn't mean to come off as complaining, I genuinely think it's a good thing she's getting the treatment because with how jacked the healthcare system is and how she's been treated in jail there was a very real chance she wouldn't get it, but I'm glad she did.
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