Black Lives Matter organiser is white yet took a scholarship only for Black Students - Polidicks

Because them being white means they still have it better... somehow? yeah I don't know what logic this operates on, other than racism

[QUOTE=wauterboi;48500290][t]https://img.washingtonpost.com/wp-apps/imrs.php?src=https://img.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/files/2013/08/concentrated-poverty.png&w=1484[/t] [/QUOTE] 12% of 63% is more than 45% of 13% There are more white kids living in poverty than there are black kids living in poverty... But apparently they don't matter because the average white person is doing better than the average black person and too many liberals only see the color of peoples skin.

God it's so fucking hard to find scholarships as a white, male, CS student. All the scholarships at my college are for black kids, hispanic kids, women, or nursing students (or some combination thereof). I guess they just assume that since I'm white I'm made of fucking money, racist motherfuckers

[QUOTE=AlexConnor;48502469]12% of 63% is more than 45% of 13% There are more white kids living in poverty than there are black kids living in poverty... But apparently they don't matter because the average white person is doing better than the average black person and too many liberals only see the color of peoples skin.[/QUOTE] Nope, that's not what I'm saying at all. The solution shouldn't be get rid of black scholarships. The solution should be addressing the rest of the people in that graph through different means much like the black scholarships with a focus on the cause for them being included on the graph. Also, there may be more whites affected, but the point of proportion is to show the percentage affected versus unaffected, leading me to believe there is a problem plaguing black people that needs to be addressed.

Jeez I'm actually surprised the US has things like woman only scholarships, it's blatantly sexist.

[QUOTE=NotMeh;48502147]Because them being white means they still have it better... somehow? yeah I don't know what logic this operates on, other than racism[/QUOTE] We live in a white supremacist society (that is, a society where in just about every concievable social situation one is in, they are in an objectively better situation if they are white). [QUOTE=proboardslol;48502487]God it's so fucking hard to find scholarships as a white, male, CS student. All the scholarships at my college are for black kids, hispanic kids, women, or nursing students (or some combination thereof). I guess they just assume that since I'm white I'm made of fucking money, racist motherfuckers[/QUOTE] Only .25% of all scholarship money is earmarked toward blackfolk. And @AlexConnor: you are right, there are more white people total in poverty than black folks. But if you are black you are also disproportionately more likely to go to jail, be in poverty, die 5 years earlier, and so on and so fourth. That, amoung other things, is the impact of systemic racism. It isn't a forced choice, you can have scholarships for poor people (there are tons of those already, they are called financial aid) and also have scholarships for black people.

[QUOTE=Flameon;48503157]We live in a white supremacist society (that is, a society where in just about every concievable social situation one is in, they are in an objectively better situation if they are white).[/QUOTE] What the actual fuck?

[QUOTE=proboardslol;48502487]God it's so fucking hard to find scholarships as a white, male, CS student. All the scholarships at my college are for black kids, hispanic kids, women, or nursing students (or some combination thereof). I guess they just assume that since I'm white I'm made of fucking money, racist motherfuckers[/QUOTE] Prepare to be pleasantly surprised in grad school. Our class is about 80% Asian so basically any white/black person who applied got in and got a full ride. Only 0.5% of the class is black, and maybe 5% is white (the rest being Indian).

[QUOTE=NotMeh;48503205]What the actual fuck?[/QUOTE] I can't speak to Estonia, but yes, that is the United States.

[QUOTE=Flameon;48503268]I can't speak to Estonia, but yes, that is the United States.[/QUOTE] What a joke. Is there anyone who legitimately believes this?

[QUOTE=leontodd;48503028]Jeez I'm actually surprised the US has things like woman only scholarships, it's blatantly sexist.[/QUOTE] With universities we've basically broken even as far as % of uni/college population goes. However people are opposed to women choosing not to take certain courses and take on certain careers. However you won't hear about the problem of men not choosing certain courses.

[QUOTE=Doctor Zedacon;48503290]What a joke. Is there anyone who legitimately believes this?[/QUOTE] Someone who obviously dislikes white people and will do anything to make them look bad in other words, a racist

[QUOTE=Doctor Zedacon;48503290]What a joke. Is there anyone who legitimately believes this?[/QUOTE] If you could press a button and redo your life being black would you? I can't even comprehend a situation outside of the fringest of cases [meeting a serial killer who only wants to kill white people] where my life hasn't been improved because I am white.

[QUOTE=wauterboi;48503014]Nope, that's not what I'm saying at all. The solution shouldn't be get rid of black scholarships. The solution should be addressing the rest of the people in that graph through different means much like the black scholarships with a focus on the cause for them being included on the graph. Also, there may be more whites affected, but the point of proportion is to show the percentage affected versus unaffected, leading me to believe there is a problem plaguing black people that needs to be addressed.[/QUOTE] Scholarships are a drop in the ocean, with nil-to-extremely-minimal effect on anyone beyond the individual students who receive them. They certainly don't in any way address the problems affecting so many black people in the US. And yet, handing out scholarships based on race is still racial discrimination. Ineffective and racist, that's a winning combination... You could solve every other significant problem that disproportionately affect blacks in the US (gang violence, incarceration rates, police treatment, etc) but unless you fix the issue that it's near impossible to break out of poverty (regardless of race)then you'll never see the wealth gap change.

I was under the impression black only scholarships existed because either organizations focused on black youths fund them or previously the scholarship was mostly given to white male recipients. Same for how jobs are given more often to people with white sounding names with the same qualifications as someone with a black sounding name.

I think resolving economic injustice is incredibly important! But its not mutually exclusive with anything we are talking about. Yes the scholarships are a drop in the ocean, but every policy I can even think of is a drop in the ocean because we live in a huge fuckin' ocean of economic and racial injustice. Doesn't mean the scholarships aren't valueable. So many of the benefits to being white are also super hard to measure, but we have some tests that get at it. Likelyhood of getting hired with a white sounding name, likelyhood of getting hired as a black with a criminal record vs as a white, if you got on a bus and asked the bus driver to give you a free ride - the odds they would accept you if you were white vs black. Tons of minor things that point to a huge cultural preference for white people.

[QUOTE=Flameon;48503387]I think resolving economic injustice is incredibly important! But its not mutually exclusive with anything we are talking about. Yes the scholarships are a drop in the ocean, but every policy I can even think of is a drop in the ocean because we live in a huge fuckin' ocean of economic and racial injustice. Doesn't mean the scholarships aren't valueable.[/QUOTE] Race-based scholarships of any kind will only breed more fucking racism How is that difficult to understand?

[QUOTE=Aldawolf;48499827]BEING poor and white is not the same as being poor and black. Both suck, one sucks harder. Many reports in places like Baltimore and Furgeson have shown this. We have minority scholarships that reward people for getting through the suckyness of their life. You can't claim to be "Colorblind" and think that helps when it has been shown racism is still very prevalent today, saying you're colorblind is just dismissing the problem. It's almost but not quite as bad as saying the problem lies within something like "Black Culture".[/QUOTE] So a poor white&black person living in the same shitty area, same financial problems, ect aren't the same and being black and poor sucks harder than being white and poor? That's a fucked up way of thinking.

[QUOTE=NotMeh;48503398]Race-based scholarships of any kind will only breed more fucking racism How is that difficult to understand?[/QUOTE] I don't know what you are saying here, if you are saying: 1.) They breed backlash, I think thats a bad arguement because the backlash ineviably happens when you try and fight racism in a racist society. 2.) That they themselves are racist: they are devoted toward fighting systemic racism. They do not create systemic racism, so I don't think this is a strong arguement. Poor people being poor is the result of a classist society, but it isn't very persuasive to say we shouldn't give scholarships to the poor because that would also be classist. [editline]20th August 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=SpaceGhost;48503402]So a poor white&black person living in the same shitty area, same financial problems, ect aren't the same and being black and poor sucks harder than being white and poor? That's a fucked up way of thinking.[/QUOTE] They measurably aren't the same experiences. I think a poor black person probably has more in common with a poor white person than a rich black person, but the reason their experiences aren't 100% homogenous is because one is black and one isn't.

[QUOTE=SpaceGhost;48503402]So a poor white&black person living in the same shitty area, same financial problems, ect aren't the same and being black and poor sucks harder than being white and poor? That's a fucked up way of thinking.[/QUOTE] Because ON AVERAGE blacks are worse than whites. That's their justification. Even when it's shown that there's more poor white people than black people. Because of course, there's more white people in general. [QUOTE=Flameon;48503157]We live in a white supremacist society[/QUOTE] I reject this notion, if you lived in a white supremacist society you wouldn't have non-white people publicly elected positions of power. If you're trying to come up with your own definition of white supremacy you might as well quit using this argument. [QUOTE=Flameon;48503157](that is, a society where in just about every concievable social situation one is in, they are in an objectively better situation if they are white)[/QUOTE] This is wrong.

[QUOTE=Flameon;48503409]2.) That they themselves are racist: they are devoted toward fighting systemic racism. They do not create systemic racism, so I don't think this is a strong arguement.[/QUOTE] Systemic racism =/= racism. Systemic equality would only mean equality of outcome, and you could have equality of outcome under apartheid. So it would be possible to have a racist system (aparthied) that is not systemically racist... The label is irrelevant.

[QUOTE=Flameon;48503157]We live in a white supremacist society (that is, a society where in just about every concievable social situation one is in, they are in an objectively better situation if they are white). Only .25% of all scholarship money is earmarked toward blackfolk. And @AlexConnor: you are right, there are more white people total in poverty than black folks. But if you are black you are also disproportionately more likely to go to jail, be in poverty, die 5 years earlier, and so on and so fourth. That, amoung other things, is the impact of systemic racism. It isn't a forced choice, you can have scholarships for poor people (there are tons of those already, they are called financial aid) and also have scholarships for black people.[/QUOTE] Financial Aid is different. My parents make 100k/year but guess what? they bought a house in the 90s and are paying a mortgage and have other debts. My dad is deep in debt to the IRS so basically no help from him. My mom also bought a house recently and then sold it so she's got no money so basically I have to rely on financial aid to go to college. So what's the government got for me? a $5,500 unsubsidized stafford loan that increases $1,000 per year. Then to cover the difference, a PLUS loan at a slightly worse interest rate. Also unsubsidized. This is the kind of "financial aid" that suburban white kids get. None.

In the case of scholarships racial discrimination is even more retarded than in the case of racial quotas. Scholarships exist so that people who couldn't pay for school otherwise can attend. The only factor here is income, races have fuck all to do with it. Flameon, your asinine argument about blacks always having it worse than whites is irrelevant. You can't claim that black people are poorer than white people with the same income as them, that's completely stupid. There is literally no reason to have race factor in scholarship distribution. Not like I expect you to actually address my argument, you didn't even bother to in the other thread.

[QUOTE=axelord157;48498889]"Black/women only scholarships are racist/sexist!!!" [url]http://www.collegescholarships.org/scholarships/[/url] [url]http://www.schoolsoup.com/scholarship-directory/race-minority/[/url] [url]http://www.collegescholarships.org/scholarships/interracial.htm[/url] [url]http://www.collegescholarships.org/scholarships/dwarfism.htm[/url] Thoughts?[/QUOTE] The selection pool is lower and it sucks. I'm against mandatory quotas anyways, select the best applicants. Always. I'm sick of this white privilege bullshit. We're in the same position that middle class minorities are in, too rich on paper to get financial aid from the government, too poor to afford college without it. The only difference is, they have options beyond the "general scholarships".

You are not in the same position as minorities because you dont experience systemic racism. [editline]20th August 2015[/editline] Also Axel there is more to systemic racism than economic inequality, and the point of scholarships is to ENTIRELY to deal with inability to afford college - if it was then no rich people would get scholarships. They award different things, but the general idea is to make it easer for folks to go to a university. The point of a targeted scholarship to to address a very specific at-need population that may not be addressed otherwise. For example, since there are more whites than blacks in the USA if we just handed out scholarships to the poor we do not necessarily know that the impact will be felt for black America. Thats why we need a more nuanced approach than just 'herp derp poor pppl'

Why does it matter how it impacts a certain race? A poor person is a poor person, their fucking race does not matter at all. They're in the same conditions as every other poor person and need that money just as everybody else.

[QUOTE=Flameon;48504222]Also Axel there is more to systemic racism than economic inequality, and the point of scholarships is to ENTIRELY to deal with inability to afford college - if it was then no rich people would get scholarships. They award different things, but the general idea is to make it easer for folks to go to a university.[/quote] And what exactly hinders black students more when it comes to going to a university that additional money can counter? [Quote]The point of a targeted scholarship to to address a very specific at-need population that may not be addressed otherwise.[/QUOTE] Yeah and that need is money. Don't act like race factors in this, it doesn't. [Quote]For example, since there are more whites than blacks in the USA if we just handed out scholarships to the poor we do not necessarily know that the impact will be felt for black America. Thats why we need a more nuanced approach than just 'herp derp poor pppl'[/QUOTE] What? I can't even grasp the logic of your argument. It's like you've got a very specific idea in your mind but can't formulate it the way you want to. "There are mode whites than blacks in the US so if we handed scholarships to the poors we don't know if it will affect black people." Uh actually we do know it will affect black people who need financial help to attend school, that's all that matters. What exactly is the problem here?

[QUOTE=NotMeh;48504279]Why does it matter how it impacts a certain race? A poor person is a poor person, their fucking race does not matter at all. They're in the same conditions as every other poor person and need that money just as everybody else.[/QUOTE] Because one population has been historicaly underserved and has continued to be underserved for the past 300 years. At the end of the day it starts to sound less like, "We should care about all poor people" and more like, "We should care about poor white people." If you actually had fidelity to the poor you'd want to make sure that poor people of all shapes, colors, and sizes were served and not just the white ones. So, to do that we need a nuanced approach that takes into account the potential unconcious biases of people when they decide to say - hire someone for a job, or dole give out aid.

[QUOTE=Flameon;48504338]Because one population has been historicaly underserved and has continued to be underserved for the past 300 years. At the end of the day it starts to sound less like, "We should care about all poor people" and more like, "We should care about poor white people." If you actually had fidelity to the poor you'd want to make sure that poor people of all shapes, colors, and sizes were served and not just the white ones. So, to do that we need a nuanced approach that takes into account the potential unconcious biases of people when they decide to say - hire someone for a job, or dole give out aid.[/QUOTE] What the fuck? We're defending giving equal treatment to all races and you act like we want to only help out poor white people? You're fucking out of your mind. Scholarships have fuck all to do with whether people are likely to hire you, I don't see why you want to push compensations for systemic racism and reparations for goddamn slavery (which doesn't even affect anybody anymore) everywhere you can and especially in places where it is irrelevant such as the education system.

[QUOTE=Flameon;48504222] For example, since there are more whites than blacks in the USA if we just handed out scholarships to the poor we do not necessarily know that the impact will be felt for black America. Thats why we need a more nuanced approach than just 'herp derp poor pppl'[/QUOTE] Giving scholarships to middleclass/wealthy black people just because of their skin color hardly helps with poverty. Instead of looking at the colors we should be looking at their economic situation. We have these scholarships that can give people a great opportunity but why cut off access to them based on something you can't control, your race? [QUOTE=Flameon;48504222]You are not in the same position as minorities because you dont experience systemic racism. [/QUOTE] Should probably poll the thread before assuming somebody is a privileged wealthy white male or something similar to that.