Oh for fuck's sake :doh:
This whole situation is basically lighting up bad areas of both sides.
Want to know what happened after the PSP-1000 and 2000, people pirated software, placed in hacks and basically made online unplayable. I was infact, made fun of at one point for getting a 3000 series because it breaks in a specific way when you try to hack it. I was made fun of because I couldn't get games for free or hack in games.
However, I did purchase my PS3 in the hopes of having backwards compatibility. If I were to hack my PS3, it would just to be able to play old PS2 games like Ace Combat 4 and Dark Cloud 2(a game which I haven't beat). Its not fair that they removed the otherOS function suddenly on people.
Both sides are at fault, anyone who argues other wise is not willing to take into effect what individuals will do with this. I'm looking at this from a societal benefit. How many would use to homebrew games or create a PS2 compatibility emulator, and how many would pirate. I'll say its most likely pirate or hack, especially because there will be a resulting backlash at Sony. Sure, whenever we see news about piracy being a small percentage, its always about PC. Not consoles. And pirating with a console is actually easier than it is with a PC(For the most part).
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;28896326]
Why? Because it causes "damage"? What damage? How is that damage inflicted? Why is that damage bad?[/QUOTE]
Well it enables piracy and cheating, doesn't it?
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;28896326]Do I need to explain why simple use of a system "forcing" agreement seems, and is very wrong?
[/QUOTE]
[quote]By using or accessing the System Software, you agree to be bound by all current terms of this Agreement.[/quote]
This can be accessed prior to buying the console. So, after reading this, how are Sony 'forcing' you into an agreement? They're not forcing you to buy a PS3 and use it, are they?
[QUOTE=rampageturke 2;28896368]I don't remember signing my rights away when I bought it from play.com[/QUOTE]
You signed them away by turning them on. It's in the ToS.
YOu don't remember it because you probably didn't read the ToS.
[QUOTE=Killuah;28896359]Yea please call him.
And the initial ToS is with th papers you get along the PS3. I still have mine from the SNES and even THEY state that you shall not tinker with the soft/hardware.
They can't prosecute him for the stuff that has to do with the PSN, that's probably right.[/QUOTE]
TOS papers must be read to apply, if you're unawares of them, they don't apply.
I was unaware of any TOS papers with my PS3, if I'm unaware of them, how may I comply to them and then how may I thusly be sued under not complying with info I don't have? Of course, that's a bad argument, but still. How many people ARE aware of them?
The PSN shit doesn't apply at all, but even the basis of their argument is pure corporate crap.
[editline]30th March 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Killuah;28896385]Well it enables piracy and cheating, doesn't it?[/QUOTE]
Sure it does, but it enables other shit.
And that's the fucking worst argument ever. "Piracy". You can't honestly believe piracy is killing the industry.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;28896435]TOS papers must be read to apply, if you're unawares of them, they don't apply.
I was unaware of any TOS papers with my PS3, if I'm unaware of them, how may I comply to them and then how may I thusly be sued under not complying with info I don't have?[/quote]
That's called being careless. Just because you failed to see them when unpacking your PS3 doesn't grant you immunity from it.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;28896435]TOS papers must be read to apply, if you're unawares of them, they don't apply.
I was unaware of any TOS papers with my PS3, if I'm unaware of them, how may I comply to them and then how may I thusly be sued under not complying with info I don't have? Of course, that's a bad argument, but still. How many people ARE aware of them?
The PSN shit doesn't apply at all, but even the basis of their argument is pure corporate crap.
[editline]30th March 2011[/editline]
Sure it does, but it enables other shit.
And that's the fucking worst argument ever. "Piracy". You can't honestly believe piracy is killing the industry.[/QUOTE]
Hahaha what? Next you are telling me rules you don't know of must not be followed.
"But officer, I didn't know I wasn't alowed to cross the road when the light is red"
No.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;28896435]
And that's the fucking worst argument ever. "Piracy". You can't honestly believe piracy is killing the industry.[/QUOTE]
You can't honestly believe piracy doesn't hurt the industry.
Did the PS2 come with said TOS papers? Why the fuck isn't half the world being sued for "hacking" that thing?
It's merely the hypocrisy and pointlessness of prosecuting these people that pisses me off.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;28896435]TOS papers must be read to apply, if you're unawares of them, they don't apply.
I was unaware of any TOS papers with my PS3, if I'm unaware of them, how may I comply to them and then how may I thusly be sued under not complying with info I don't have? Of course, that's a bad argument, but still. How many people ARE aware of them?
The PSN shit doesn't apply at all, but even the basis of their argument is pure corporate crap.
[editline]30th March 2011[/editline]
Sure it does, but it enables other shit.
And that's the fucking worst argument ever. "Piracy". You can't honestly believe piracy is killing the industry.[/QUOTE]
The question is, will it be used FOR those other features by a majority of people or will be mainly used for no-balled hackers and neckbearded pirates?
[QUOTE=Sir Whoopsalot;28896490]You can't honestly believe piracy doesn't hurt the industry.[/QUOTE]
Did I say "I don't believe it hurts the industry at all"? No. It does, but the damage it does? If it was as bad as the many companies that tell us it's as bad as, there'd be no entertainment business at all.
Not to mention, the gaming industry, and movie industry are making more money each year than ever before, so clearly, the damage is untold and unimaginable as no one buys games or movies now.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;28896492]Did the PS2 come with said TOS papers? Why the fuck isn't half the world being sued for "hacking" that thing?
It's merely the hypocrisy and pointlessness of prosecuting these people that pisses me off.[/QUOTE]
It actually did in the booklet if you read the back pages. But you didn't find out and damage was local. Now that consoles can get online and do so much more.
[QUOTE=Swilly;28896523]The question is, will it be used FOR those other features by a majority of people or will be mainly used for no-balled hackers and neckbearded pirates?[/QUOTE]
Does it really matter?
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;28896536]Does it really matter?[/QUOTE]
Does it matter if guns are primarily used to kill people or to defend yourself when needed?
[QUOTE=Swilly;28896533]It actually did in the booklet if you read the back pages.[/QUOTE]
Then why aren't half the world being sued? I've no clue how many people I know who've modded their PS2's to run however they wanted them too, piracy as well was a huge issue, but now it's necessary to sue someone with life ruining charges?
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;28896536]Does it really matter?[/QUOTE]
Yeah it does! It fucks up the entire development process for Game Developers(Not piracy) but the hacking will ruin the balance they try to create in the games. Imagine if you could hack in TF2.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;28896435]
Sure it does, but it enables other shit.
And that's the fucking worst argument ever. "Piracy". You can't honestly believe piracy is killing the industry.[/QUOTE]
I don't. You are putting words in my mouth.
You were saying that you are 100% against not having "qualms of any sort of damage that this leaves in it's path(100% against this)"
Well, cheating for example is damage to healthy competitive online play, isn't it?
Piracy is arguable, true. I'll leave it with the cheating as the sufficient example.
[QUOTE=Sir Whoopsalot;28896552]Does it matter if guns are primarily used to kill people or to defend yourself when needed?[/QUOTE]
No, it doesn't.
[editline]30th March 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Killuah;28896577]I don't. You are putting words in my mouth.
You were saying that you are 100% against not having "qualms of any sort of damage that this leaves in it's path(100% against this)"
Well, cheating for example is damage to healthy competitive online play, isn't it?
Piracy is arguable, true. I'll leave it with the cheating as the sufficient example.[/QUOTE]
Cheating never really factored into my argument so, you got that on me.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;28896560]Then why aren't half the world being sued? I've no clue how many people I know who've modded their PS2's to run however they wanted them too, piracy as well was a huge issue, but now it's necessary to sue someone with life ruining charges?[/QUOTE]
Again, damage was local and couldn't spread as easily. I didn't hack my PS2 because I didn't know how nor have the cash to get the components.
It wasn't hit like the PSP 1000s and 2000s.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;28896560]Then why aren't half the world being sued? I've no clue how many people I know who've modded their PS2's to run however they wanted them too, piracy as well was a huge issue, but now it's necessary to sue someone with life ruining charges?[/QUOTE]
Life ruining charges he brought on himself by the way.
[QUOTE=Swilly;28896570]Yeah it does! It fucks up the entire development process for Game Developers(Not piracy) but the hacking will ruin the balance they try to create in the games. Imagine if you could hack in TF2.[/QUOTE]
You can hack in TF2.
you get banned, not fucking sued.
[editline]30th March 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Swilly;28896594]Again, damage was local and couldn't spread as easily. I didn't hack my PS2 because I didn't know how nor have the cash to get the components.[/QUOTE]
You can hack a ps2 with a piece of tape and a wire cutter.
[editline]30th March 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Sir Whoopsalot;28896598]Life ruining charges he brought on himself by the way.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, by editing software he clearly deserves the fate that's befalling him.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;28896043]If you purchase something you have legal right to it. He didn't sign to make him in agreement to the contract you have quoted there. So, uhm... no?[/QUOTE]
Once again for those who missed it. You didn't buy the software, you purchased the hardware and Sony are "courteous" enough to provide said software for free. That does not mean you own a licence to the software, meaning you have no right to be modifying the software with intent to distribute.
Sony are well within their rights to sue or at least punish people creating CFW, but going after the users with anything more than a PSN ban is stupid and likely illegal.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;28896603]You can hack in TF2.
you get banned, not fucking sued.
[editline]30th March 2011[/editline]
You can hack a ps2 with a piece of tape and a wire cutter.
[editline]30th March 2011[/editline]
Yeah, by editing software he clearly deserves the fate that's befalling him.[/QUOTE]
If you fucking KNEW how to use that wire cutter.
And if you hacked steam?
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;28896579]No, it doesn't.
[/QUOTE]
Why not just freely distribute guns to every American citizen, including the mentally disturbed and unstable? It doesn't matter right?
There's too many people who use them negatively, just like there's too many people who use CFW negatively.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;28896560]Then why aren't half the world being sued? I've no clue how many people I know who've modded their PS2's to run however they wanted them too, piracy as well was a huge issue, but now it's necessary to sue someone with life ruining charges?[/QUOTE]
Because obviously sueing most of their users is not possible for a company. So they sue the people who enable the community to hack their console.
[QUOTE=hexpunK;28896624]Once again for those who missed it. You didn't buy the software, you purchased the hardware and Sony are "courteous" enough to provide said software for free. That does not mean you own a licence to the software, meaning you have no right to be modifying the software with intent to distribute.
Sony are well within their rights to sue or at least punish people creating CFW, but going after the users with anything more than a PSN ban is stupid and likely illegal.[/QUOTE]
Thank you for disagreeing with me and saying what I have been trying to say.
I don't pay a large amount of attention to GeoHot's antics but is this about right?
GeoHot hacks PS3, runs shit that should've been on it in the first place, modifies hardware which he rightly purchased and put otherOS on it
Song got pissed
Sued, cancelled all forms of his communication to his "people" (Youtube, twitter, website etc.)
GeoHot was like, "you mad bro?"
GeoHot's lawyers come into the fray and are all like "hey Sony, check this out"
and we're here now?
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;28896603]
Yeah, by editing software he clearly deserves the fate that's befalling him.[/QUOTE]
Could you stop with the trivialisation please? You start to sound a little hot headed.
And I'd like people who read this post to rate agree or disagree.
[QUOTE=xeonmuffin;28896660]I don't pay a large amount of attention to GeoHot's antics but is this about right?
GeoHot hacks PS3, runs shit that should've been on it in the first place, modifies hardware which he rightly purchased and put otherOS on it
Song got pissed
Sued, cancelled all forms of his communication to his "people" (Youtube, twitter, website etc.)
GeoHot was like, "you mad bro?"
GeoHot's lawyers come into the fray and are all like "hey Sony, check this out"
and we're here now?[/QUOTE]
Much more to it.
[QUOTE=Sir Whoopsalot;28896630]Why not just freely distribute guns to every American citizen, including the mentally disturbed and unstable? It doesn't matter right?
There's too many people who use them negatively, just like there's too many people who use CFW negatively.[/QUOTE]
So you get rid of all guns, and suddenly only criminals have them and can do whatever the fuck they want with them because they're already breaking the law and now have weapons to do it with?
See, it doesn't work as an analogy.
Except only hackers would have it and you stop them how really? arresting them? suing them? More of this very bullshit?
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