British actor Idris Elba cannot star as James Bond because he is black, says Rush Limbaugh - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Hat-Wearing Man;46786022]what! this guy? [img]http://pmcdeadline2.files.wordpress.com/2012/10/samberg__121018212719-275x387.jpg[/img] idk if he'd make a good Bond[/QUOTE] That's Adam Sandler. This is Michael Cera. [IMG]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/04/Jesse_Eisenberg_-_La_red_social_-_Madrid_-_2.jpg[/IMG] Jokes aside, they made M a woman, and it was a perfect bit of casting. Just saying.

[QUOTE=barrab;46784557]I like how this implies he was being racist when he wasn't at all.[/QUOTE] That's what I think too, but then again... plenty of racists freaked out when Idris starred as Heimdall in the Thor movies, stating that a black man has no place in Norse mythology. I actually agree with that reasoning, just as I'd agree that it'd be weird as fuck to cast Colin Farrell as Zatoichi - just an example, but you get my point.

[QUOTE=Pretiacruento;46786159]That's what I think too, but then again... plenty of racists freaked out when Idris starred as Heimdall in the Thor movies, stating that a black man has no place in Norse mythology. I actually agree with that reasoning, just as I'd agree that it'd be weird as fuck to cast Colin Farrell as Zatoichi - just an example, but you get my point.[/QUOTE] The main argument against the statements about Idris as Heimdall is that the Asgardians aren't Norse gods. They're technologically advanced aliens that the Norse worshipped as gods, and built their legends and folklore around. They can be any race.

[QUOTE=NuclearJesus;46786177]The main argument against the statements about Idris as Heimdall is that the Asgardians aren't Norse gods. They're technologically advanced aliens that the Norse worshipped as gods, and built their legends and folklore around. They can be any race.[/QUOTE] For a second I thought you were talking about Stargate.

[QUOTE=NuclearJesus;46786177]The main argument against the statements about Idris as Heimdall is that the Asgardians aren't Norse gods. They're technologically advanced aliens that the Norse worshipped as gods, and built their legends and folklore around. They can be any race.[/QUOTE] I know, but I think that notion goes out the window, considering that Scandinavians pictured Odin as a one-eyed blonde dude, or Valkyries as women. But I get what you're saying.

What's all this shit about posh aristocratic Britbong Empire wankery James Bond? Have you even seen Daniel Craig's Bond?

Changing the race of the defined character IS strange, regaurdless of whatever racial tones people wish to apply to this situation. How often has a character from a 20+ year ago suddenly had his race changed from white to black? Or from any race to any other race type? Its IS strange. I would personally be offended by them changing the main character to be black now, but I wouldn't fight against it, just let people know how I feel.

[QUOTE=Sprockethead;46784200]Well Rush limbaugh certainly cant star as james bond, because he is fucking fat. Anyway, i thought this 007 thing was a thing that passed down to different agents as time went by?[/QUOTE] he wouldn't just be playing "agent 007" though he'd be playing the character of James Bond. I really don't care if he's the new james bond or not, but I think it would be really cool if they made him a different character who was the new 007. that would give them a lot of freedom to make the films a bit more fresh, almost like a spinoff in a way.

[QUOTE=Coffee;46786186]For a second I thought you were talking about Stargate.[/QUOTE] No, those were the Asgard, technologically advanced aliens that the Norse worshipped as gods, and built their legends and folklore around.

[QUOTE=Bruhmis;46786464]he wouldn't just be playing "agent 007" though he'd be playing the character of James Bond. I really don't care if he's the new james bond or not, but I think it would be really cool if they made him a different character who was the new 007. that would give them a lot of freedom to make the films a bit more fresh, almost like a spinoff in a way.[/QUOTE] A Bond film without James Bond... Didn't exactly work out for Bourne Legacy.

[QUOTE=The Kins;46786102]Felix Leiter (Bond's CIA counterpart throughout the series) was also played solely by white actors up until 2006's Casino Royale, when Jeffery Wright stepped in and made the role his own. In a series that flirts with dramatically different depictions of the same core character, I'm not seeing a huge issue with Idris stepping into the tuxedo.[/QUOTE] Like I said in the other thread: [QUOTE=catbarf;46766026]Despite his perfect acting personality, I don't think Idris Elba is the best fit for Bond, but not because he's black per se. Bond was written to represent the idealistic social concept of the landed English gentry of the turn of the century, projected into the Cold War. His characterization as a suave, knowledged, respectable, and above all honorable gentleman is the continuation of the social construct of the British upper class. You can find a lot of characters similar to Bond in earlier (especially Victorian) works, where they usually take the role of a military officer (which has in turn been parodied, for example the Flashman series of the '70s), but with the end of WW2 and the start of the Cold War the fashionable trend was to write that sort of character as a spy rather than a soldier. A character meant to evoke that archetype basically has to be white, male, and British because it's exclusively a white, male, and British historical trope. I think, barring the hardcore racists and the Fleming purists, the vast majority of people who object to casting a black character as Bond do so because a black Bond doesn't really reflect the social context for the character archetype, and that's hard to articulate without seeming racist. Personally I don't care about who they choose for Bond because the last thirty years of cinema have already broken from Fleming's work, but I can see where the complaints come from.[/QUOTE] Felix Leiter's character is representative of the 1950's fledgling CIA, a gung-ho, can-do, technically sophisticated new organization that lacks the history or finesse of the British intelligence services. Leiter is there to supply Bond with the gadgets, equipment, and support he needs to do his job. He's symbolic of the American intelligence establishment, so racial diversity in casting that character is entirely consistent with his thematic background. When you're writing fiction you don't arbitrarily pick names for your characters out of a hat, even if they're supposed to just be random people- a name is symbolic and important to a character's identity. James Bond was chosen as a name because it was unassuming and 'ordinary', a boringly generic name, perfect for a spy who conceals his identity. It has a thematic purpose. Similarly, while a hypothetical MI6 intelligence officer could be of any race or social background, there's significance thematically to a character's racial and social identity and backstory. The character Bond [i]is[/i] could be any race or social class, but the character Bond [i]represents[/i] is pretty much exclusively white and upper-class. There was similar talk before the release of the show Elementary, where the white British war veteran doctor Watson is reimagined as an Asian-American civilian doctor Watson. Because Watson's social identity and military service are core to his character, and the odd relationship between Watson and Holmes a strong element of the franchise, there was [url=http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/culture/guystagg/100061063/casting-lucy-liu-as-dr-joan-watson-will-ruin-one-of-the-great-bromances-of-all-time/]some backlash[/url]. If you're changing a trait as fundamental as race or gender in an established character from a franchise older than everyone involved in production, you can expect backlash. Again, I don't see a problem casting Elba as Bond, because at this point the movies are James Bond in name only. They've diverged so far from the books, from the Cold War politics and anti-Soviet themes, that significant changes to the core character were really inevitable. My favorite Bond is Daniel Craig, and I readily admit that his humorless, straightforward demeanor is VERY different from Fleming's Bond and has pretty much dropped the aristocratic undertones of the character. I'm only saying this to explain why it's not pure racism to say 'hold on, this doesn't seem right', because there were people that said the same about Craig, and I think they were equally right.

The way I see it, if it's an established character, just leave the gender/race alone. Idris can definitely fit a Bond-like character but it seems forced. I don't get why "let's just make established characters black/a woman" became popular instead of writing new stories with an African-American/female role in mind. I feel like I'm alone on this but it's not like I want black characters/female characters made white/men either. I'm sure if that happened you'd start hearing some angry people, though.

Having an African American play James Bond doesn't work because of one particular reason. James Bond is a product of post war U.K. and pre-civil rights movement, regardless of what time period the film is made. If filmmakers want to create a spy series embedded in the society of the modern world, they could have cast Idris Elba in a film like "The Kingsmen". When a work of fiction is rooted in a time and place, it is unnecessary to graft it to fit a different one.

I think String would make a good Bond, but that's just me.

Fuck off with the "he's an old time aristocrat" bullshit, seriously. You know damn well nobody gives a single shit about that anymore, except for the die-hard Bond fans, of which there are very few in here. You're just trying to justify the fact that you simply don't want a black actor near your precious, old school white character. Seriously. There have never been any heated topics about Bond's character on FP, because nobody cares. I've never seen anyone use a 007 avatar for too long. There isn't even an active fucking thread on 007 in the Film & TV subforum. I'm sick and tired of people who are obviously just masking their racism with excuses like "that's not what the character is about" when they don't give a fuck about James Bond. Face it, 007 is just a generic action hero, him being white has never been a defining characteristic, and Idris Elba is [B]perfect[/B] for the role.

[QUOTE=adamsz;46787011]African American[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Zukriuchen;46787061]Fuck off with the "he's an old time aristocrat" bullshit, seriously. You know damn well nobody gives a single shit about that anymore, except for the die-hard Bond fans, of which there are very few in here. You're just trying to justify the fact that you simply don't want a black actor near your precious, old school white character. Seriously. There have never been any heated topics about Bond's character on FP, because nobody cares. I've never seen anyone use a 007 avatar for too long. There isn't even an active fucking thread on 007 in the Film & TV subforum. I'm sick and tired of people who are obviously just masking their racism with excuses like "that's not what the character is about" when they don't give a fuck about James Bond. Face it, 007 is just a generic action hero, him being white has never been a defining characteristic, and Idris Elba is [B]perfect[/B] for the role.[/QUOTE] Craig's Bond is so fucking different from novel Bond that I'm starting to actually believe that these fanboys erased the two highest grossing Bond films from memory because they don't want a black man playing him lmao ok, when Craig becomes a 80 year old dark haired upper class posh Brit facing Cold War problems yall can get back to me

why not make a movie that the only difference between it and the 007 series is the name or make it so he is another agent that works with bond and the movie he is in isn't about bond

[QUOTE=RichyZ;46786726]happens all the time in comics[/QUOTE] And in my opinion that degrades the quality of the super heroes / Characters. The characters were made a specific way to match a very unique role. Its all in fair claim for Rush to claim Idris should not be James Bond because he is black. He is not saying he hates the guys skin color and denounces him for it- He quite simply put it "Bond was originally white and Scottish. Idris is Black and British." I love how the media puts the spin on it too "And then he called himself racist." No... he stated that by saying so it would probably be seen as racist. Because people can't see 5 feet in front of their own faces. All that being said, I think Idris would have made a bad ass bond regardless, just give him a scottish accent. But this goes hand-in-hand for me with making Super Heroes a specific sexual orientation (Green Lantern) and or changing them to suit specific groups or racial audiences. Don't change whats already there, create something new. To soil an already established character because you feel it "Might not relate to every gender and race" is absurd. Not every super hero or character can be tuned to every viewers taste. That's why we have multiple characters and imaginations that didn't stop 10 years ago. (Though sometimes I wonder...)

[QUOTE=Zukriuchen;46787061][B]Fuck off with the "he's an old time aristocrat" bullshit, seriously. You know damn well nobody gives a single shit about that anymore[/B], except for the die-hard Bond fans, of which there are very few in here. You're just trying to justify the fact that you simply don't want a black actor near your precious, old school white character. Seriously. There have never been any heated topics about Bond's character on FP, because nobody cares. I've never seen anyone use a 007 avatar for too long. There isn't even an active fucking thread on 007 in the Film & TV subforum. I'm sick and tired of people who are obviously just masking their racism with excuses like "that's not what the character is about" when they don't give a fuck about James Bond. Face it, 007 is just a generic action hero, him being white has never been a defining characteristic, and Idris Elba is [B]perfect[/B] for the role.[/QUOTE] Uh, thanks? That's exactly what I give a shit about, and that's what I like about Bond, and it's why I watch Bond.

[quote]African-American[/quote] It's as if "black" is becoming offensive again and I have no idea what to say anymore, African-British?

[QUOTE=jiggu;46787416]Uh, thanks? That's exactly what I give a shit about, and that's what I like about Bond, and it's why I watch Bond.[/QUOTE] Really? The reason you watch Bond is because of the social context Fleming had in mind when he wrote the character? Not because of the well made action scenes, the easy to follow but intriguing plot, the simple yet interesting characters, or the impressive feats of 007? None of that? You watch it because he's "an old time aristocrat trying to adapt to the new world"? [editline]24th December 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=Keys;46787330]But this goes hand-in-hand for me with making Super Heroes a specific sexual orientation (Green Lantern) and or changing them to suit specific groups or racial audiences. Don't change whats already there, create something new.[/QUOTE] Why not? Character development is a thing, you know

Wait til these guys find out that Jesus was Arabic and Santa was Mediterranean :v:

[QUOTE=DaCommie1;46784448]Yes it would mean he's unrealistically old, they do often hint at him nearing the upper edges of middle-age nowadays. In Skyfall, as well, they pulled out the Aston Martin from Goldfinger too, and both Bond and M remembered it, though I take slight issue with M recalling it, as M didn't become M until Goldeneye, there was a different M back for Goldfinger. Of course, she still could have worked for MI6, but they had her talking as if she was M back then too, which she wasn't.[/QUOTE] A little late but in Goldeneye, Bond pretty explicitly say that she, as M, is a replacement.

[QUOTE=Zukriuchen;46787528]Really? The reason you watch Bond is because of the social context Fleming had in mind when he wrote the character? Not because of the well made action scenes, the easy to follow but intriguing plot, the simple yet interesting characters, or the impressive feats of 007? None of that? You watch it because he's "an old time aristocrat trying to adapt to the new world"? [editline]24th December 2014[/editline] Why not? Character development is a thing, you know[/QUOTE] Yes, that's what I find amusing. The character. If anything I think the action is pretty boring in the last few movies

[QUOTE=jiggu;46787673]Yes, that's what I find amusing. The character. If anything I think the action is pretty boring in the last few movies[/QUOTE] That's cool, but like it has been said, why can't Idris fit the same archetype? The old context he was written in barely applies because it's not (and hasn't been for a long time) what defines the character. Everything that does make him who he is are characteristics you can find in Idris Elba, moreso than a load of other actors out there

The reason why I don't like when established characters change gender/color everyone seems to only talk about them by their new gender/color and not by how well they were as the character. Constantly hearing "black Annie" and not just "Annie" is starting to piss me off.

[QUOTE=AkujiTheSniper;46787739]The reason why I don't like when established characters change gender/color everyone seems to only talk about them by their new gender/color and not by how well they were as the character. Constantly hearing "black Annie" and not just "Annie" is starting to piss me off.[/QUOTE] Perhaps if people didn't go all up in arms whenever a change like that was made, they'd stop talking about it like that too

[QUOTE=Zukriuchen;46787769]Perhaps if people didn't go all up in arms whenever a change like that was made, they'd stop talking about it like that too[/QUOTE] I'm hearing this from the people who like the race change. Always "have you seen the new black Annie? That's great!" but it's said like that's the only good thing from the movie and I never hear them talk about the movie after that. Both sides are putting a lot of emphasis on the race instead of the MOVIE.

"I can overlook facial structure changes, movement changes, voice changes, age changes, attitude changes and advancements in technology that border on the absurd, but the instant you change Bond's skin color, then we've got a problem. It changes EVERYTHING in ways that it has clearly never been changed before! I'll never enjoy the other movies or books or anything related to this fictional character again unless the next movie staring this fictional character that has changed bodies seven times over 50 years has a skin tone that I feel fits him better." This is a stupid discussion. If you don't want to see a black person playing Bond, don't go see the movie. It's not like the movie is going to make you watch it.