Notch on Steam "I worry about the PC as a gaming platform becoming owned by a single entity that tak
303 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Sgt-NiallR;36945152]Not right now, but they might in the future.[/QUOTE]
That's like saying that since no giant planet eating space worms have came and eaten the Earth yet we should take measures to protect our selves from them because it could POSSIBLY happen in the future.
[QUOTE=GoDong-DK;36945201]Do we know whether Notch has spoken with Valve about it? If you're considering putting your game on steam, such details can mean a lot when taking such a decision. I'm not saying that you're necessarily wrong, but the opposite could be equally true.[/QUOTE]
That isn't something Valve can tell anyone since it depends on how well the game sells on Steam which happens after the deal is done, unless Notch goes through the experience of actually having a game on Steam, he can't know for sure how Steam taxes would have affected him.
notch is a fucking piss ass homo retard and i won't buy minecraft anyways
[SUB][SUB]yes, i'm mad that he makes shitload of fucking ass money with this retarded game[/SUB][/SUB]
[QUOTE=Sir Whoopsalot;36945268]So it only becomes a problem when we have to pay for it, that's sound reasoning.[/QUOTE]
I didn't say it was reasonable, but it's why people care about the xbl fee and don't give a shit about what steam does.
[QUOTE=Sir Whoopsalot;36945268]So it only becomes a problem when we have to pay for it, that's sound reasoning.[/QUOTE]
Steam can manage to keep up the servers and bandwith and shit from just the money they make on selling games, Microsoft has to charge extra for it, which is why people are mad.
[QUOTE=Robbobin;36945262]Notch is entitled to make whatever decisions he wants with his games, even if they're made for silly reasons. His decision isn't entirely without precedent; if I had a product so many thousands of people wanted, I'd be very careful dolling out significant chunks of my profit.[/QUOTE]
It seems the only reason he's giving on his response about why he doesn't put Minecraft on Steam is because he's afraid he might want to do something more with Minecraft that Steam might not allow which is reasonable.
That "I fear for PC Gaming" part was completely pointless.
[QUOTE=_Chewgum;36945074]You'll probably earn more when you have your game on steam with the 30% cut anyway, so why cry about it.[/QUOTE]
This is stupid in so many ways. If you have a choice between either paying one corporation a pretty large percentage of your profits or simply not sell as much, there is a monopoly going on. I don't understand how everybody could be up in arms over the indie developer last week having to pay Microsoft some money to release a patch, but be like "Hey, why are you complaining? If you didn't pay Valve money you wouldn't make as much money." - it's completely the same. And in the end, the more services a game has to go through, paying fees and so on, the worse for the consumer; the price will ultimately be rising because the developers don't really have a choice.
It's like with music artists, either release your shit on bandcamp (or that alike) and have a very limited reception, or write a contract with Sony music forcing you to make 7 albums and give half your profit to them. Is that a good thing?
Yeah it seems like a pretty sanctimonious, silly excuse. I guess there are some worries about steam swallowing the whole games industry, but unless you think that someone is going to go to the effect of actually challenging steam's service (which I think is incredibly unlikely, since steam is excellent), it's a waste of time fighting it.
I think notch has a perfectly valid reason to not sell with valve: he doesn't want to. Trying to play the moral high ground was sanctimonious drivel, but I guess that's his own problem.
[QUOTE=Electrocuter;36945330]It seems the only reason he's giving on his response about why he doesn't put Minecraft on Steam is because he's afraid he might want to do something more with Minecraft that Steam might not allow which is reasonable.
That "I fear for PC Gaming" part was completely pointless.[/QUOTE]
What would he do that steam won't allow? Free content? Cross platform? going Free-to-play? I don't see what he would do that steam wouldn't allow.
The only reason he doesn't like steam since he is one of the lucky ones, he got his game to sell without even getting on a distribution platform, and he sees anything above 0% taken from his game as a rip off. Yes he might make more money in the long run from being on his own site, but most indie devs don't have it that good, they need steam or some like it.
All this sounds like to me is when the rich bitch about being taxed too much when they are usually paying less then everyone else.
[QUOTE=Electrocuter;36945277]That isn't something Valve can tell anyone since it depends on how well the game sells on Steam which happens after the deal is done, unless Notch goes through the experience of actually having a game on Steam, he can't know for sure how Steam taxes would have affected him.[/QUOTE]
If you read their FAQ: [url]http://steampowered.com/steamworks/FAQ.php[/url]
You'll see that the pricing is set before actual sales. Notch could've discussed this with Valve before making a decision.
[editline]26th July 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=Robbobin;36945419]Yeah it seems like a pretty sanctimonious, silly excuse. I guess there are some worries about steam swallowing the whole games industry, but unless you think that someone is going to go to the effect of actually challenging steam's service (which I think is incredibly unlikely, since steam is excellent), it's a waste of time fighting it.
I think notch has a perfectly valid reason to not sell with valve: he doesn't want to. Trying to play the moral high ground was sanctimonious drivel, but I guess that's his own problem.[/QUOTE]
He would probably also make less money. I don't think it's all moral highground.
If they released it on steam that doesn't mean the end of them selling the game on their website still. There are many companies that still sell their games independently while having some being sold on steam, putting the game on steam will make it more convenient for people to buy the game.
In my head I kinda compare him to a One-Hit-Wonder in the Music business.
Having luck one time doesn't make you an expert of the industry. I may listen to him if his next game is a success.
Also I have a question about the 30%
Does he mean they keep 30% from every sale?
Or did he mean they own 30% of the Digital Distribution Market?
[QUOTE=mobrockers2;36945322]Steam can manage to keep up the servers and bandwith and shit from just the money they make on selling games, Microsoft has to charge extra for it, which is why people are mad.[/QUOTE]
Also MS throws in ads too even though you're already paying 60 dollars a year (raised pricing for Call of Duty map pack "exclusivity" and probably all dlc they get earlier I believe?)
Speaking of Minecraft can you still not change your accounts email?
Prices between console, retail and Steam are hardly different. If different at all.
I said a week or so ago that Notch had no reason to not put Minecraft on Steam because all the issues he had previously raised were nullified. His problem now is just that he talked himself in to a corner and his ego and pride refuse to let him back down and admit defeat.
I also think that Notch doesn't realize that Steam controls the market because we the consumers allow them to. If people didn't like Steam for whatever reason it most likely wouldn't have so much influence on the video game marketplace.
Notch got an inflated ego and sense of self worth with the success of Minecraft, giving him the false impression that he had incredible knowledge of the industry.
So, why is Notch the authority on anything?
[QUOTE=Bredirish123;36945604]I also think that Notch doesn't realize that Steam controls the market because we the consumers allow them to. If people didn't like Steam for whatever reason it most likely wouldn't have so much influence on the video game marketplace.[/QUOTE]
I think Notch is completely aware of that. And of course people like it, it's convenient and it has most of the games you can get. Problem is that the alternatives are starting to disappear, inpendent physical distribution is becoming less relevant, and the physical distribution going on in the PC market often includes Steam. It's becoming ubiquitous, and that's both a good and a bad thing.
[QUOTE=Zeos;36945672]So, why is Notch the authority on anything?[/QUOTE]
"I made one super popular game so I obviously know the ins and outs of the industry"
It must be kind of sad to know that you have allready hit the peak of your career. Nothing he makes will be as popular and profitable as minecraft is.
I can kind of agree about the PC being dominated by a single entity, as that can create a monopoly but we have other online sellers. For the 30%, how else will they pay for the servers and bandwidth.
[QUOTE=MaGGiFiXXX;36945517]Or did he mean they own 30% of the Digital Distribution Market?[/QUOTE]
I'm almost certain he means 30% of all PC games sold DD and retail, are through Steam.
Christ do you guys seriously think Steam is going to charge thirty cents on the dollar for ever copy of a game sold in order to keep its servers running are you kidding me?
Ok hold up analyze this phrase:
"PC as a gaming platform becoming owned by a single entity that takes 30% of all PC games sold"
That doesn't seem to imply a 30% charge on revenues, he is worried about Steam monopolizing content distribution which sooner or later will become a legitimate concern, and just because we all love Steam and all hate Notch (who, regardless of our views is an extremely successful developer) doesn't change that.
Even then, it's not him that's made it to this state, since he abandoned the damn game and left it in a state of half finished ideas, while setting a price tag of a retail finished game when he claimed "Well, time to take a permanent vacation and oh yeah, here is my generic fantasy card game."
Though I have massive respect to Jeb who is piecing together the game with his new team, finishing things like villages (That were supposed to be done for the Adventure update, almost a year ago), as well as the countless number of bugs that needed fixing.
if it ever comes to a fight i know which grossly overweight game dev I'm backing
You're right Notch, it's not like Retail stores let your shelf their games for free. They totally don't buy the games for a lower price and then resell them for 50-60$. No to mention it's not like you have to spend money on producing the packaging and printing the CD's. Lets also not forget about shipping costs.On top of that if you're on a console, manufacturers charge you an extra 10$ per copy sold on their system.
God this guys a moron.
Why the hell do you think indie developers don't put their games up in retail? Because its more a more expensive process. 30% is a totally fair price.
-snip-
[QUOTE=Doctor Zedacon;36945643]Notch got an inflated ego and sense of self worth with the success of Minecraft, giving him the false impression that he had incredible knowledge of the industry.[/QUOTE]
Give him a break, he just doesn't want to publish his stuff on steam. He's encouraging self-distribution because of his own experiences, and I'd say he actually has something to say in that field as he has sold his own game that way, and it turned out to be successful. Now, what gives you the knowledge to say he's wrong to say that he thinks? Past experience with distributing games?
[QUOTE=Zeos;36945785]Even then, it's not him that's made it to this state, since he abandoned the damn game and left it in a state of half finished ideas,[B] while setting a price tag of a retail finished game[/B] when he claimed "Well, time to take a permanent vacation and oh yeah, here is my generic fantasy card game."
[/QUOTE]
Finished retail games for PC are usually 50-60 dollars.
[QUOTE=POLOPOZOZO;36945762]I'm almost certain he means 30% of all PC games sold DD and retail, are through Steam.
Christ do you guys seriously think Steam is going to charge thirty cents on the dollar for ever copy of a game sold in order to keep its servers running are you kidding me?[/QUOTE]
While I'm not saying that Valve's charging 30% (it's probably less), Apple's doing it and seemingly app developers go along with it. Apple appstore is a pretty fucking big business, so I'd say they're at least somewhat comparable.
[QUOTE=legolover122;36945846]Finished retail games for PC are usually 50-60 dollars.[/QUOTE]
Okay, you've got me there, but he fucking doubled the price of the game and claimed "RELEASED". Even though the game was still a mess of broken and half implemented ideas.
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