• Republican Summer Wish List: Make Bush tax cuts permanent, Dismantle 'Obamacare', Cut down energy re
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This has got to be the dumbest shit I've ever heard. Republicans will be the end of America.
Alright, Jeep-Eep, come on out of the lurker's den and speak.
[QUOTE=Noble;36153471] What I am saying though, is that repealing the bush tax cuts means tax hikes for everybody, not just the rich.[/QUOTE] Unless you say, "let's repeal the tax cuts only for the rich" like obama did. [editline]1st June 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=Contag;36153794]The only Republicans left are social conservatives, and republicans who haven't left their nuclear bunker since Reagan. For about five minutes there was some legitimate complaining (well some of it anyway) and campaigning from the Tea Party, but that was gobbled up by the current batch of pro-wealthy big military industrial complex social conservative republicans.[/QUOTE] Yeah any republican not too social conservative enough is called out as a RINO and tends to not get reelected
[QUOTE=S31-Syntax;36154624]Social Conservatism is but 1 flavor in the ice cream shop that is the GOP. Granted its that one flavor that a ton of people seem to like for some reason, won't shut the fuck up about it, and keep trying to force samples on everyone... but its still 1 (ONE) flavor out of easily another 10 flavors.[/QUOTE] 10 variations, are you misinformed or just daft? Speaking in terms of Republican ideological divisions (that is, at least of elected Republicans), there are really only three groups in the House alone, in order of size from largest to smallest: Conservatives, both fiscally and socially - [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republican_Study_Committee[/url] Tea Partiers, that is so-called fiscal conservatives - [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea_Party_Caucus[/url] and Libertarians, the smallest faction - [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberty_Caucus[/url] So do tell, where are the 10 flavours? These are the ideological caucuses of the House, the largest federal elected body, so surely if there are 10 across the country we should find more than 5 among elected Republicans, let alone 3? That and regardless of which caucus they're in, only 1 is not inherently social conservative, with the RSC being so in writing, and the Tea Party being so in action, and those two groups eclipse Libertarians by a wide margin.
[QUOTE=Megafan;36155528]10 variations, are you misinformed or just daft? Speaking in terms of Republican ideological divisions (that is, at least of elected Republicans), there are really only three groups in the House alone, in order of size from largest to smallest: Conservatives, both fiscally and socially - [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republican_Study_Committee[/url] Tea Partiers, that is so-called fiscal conservatives - [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea_Party_Caucus[/url] and Libertarians, the smallest faction - [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberty_Caucus[/url] So do tell, where are the 10 flavours? These are the ideological caucuses of the House, the largest federal elected body, so surely if there are 10 across the country we should find more than 5 among elected Republicans, let alone 3? That and regardless of which caucus they're in, only 1 is not inherently social conservative, with the RSC being so in writing, and the Tea Party being so in action, and those two groups eclipse Libertarians by a wide margin.[/QUOTE] While yes, those 3 there are the most well known, there are still more than that. 10 may have been more of an estimate (unless you count historical factions as well) But even then, your post proves my point. Social Conservatism is part of the GOP, but the GOP is NOT Social Conservatism. But since you've jabbed at me there anywho, lets see here. [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Factions_in_the_Republican_Party_%28United_States%29[/url] You have, in the Republican Party today: -Traditionalists -Conservatives *Social Conservatives *Fiscal Conservatives *Paleo Conservatives *Neo Conservatives -Moderates -Libertarians -Liberals (I.E. RINO or Rockefeller Republicans) And fun fact, just cause there are only ~3 of those there in the House, that doesn't automatically mean that the others don't exist. So again, Point still stands, There is more than JUST Social Conservatism, and there are also more than what you posted there.
[QUOTE=S31-Syntax;36155767]While yes, those 3 there are the most well known, there are still more than that. 10 may have been more of an estimate (unless you count historical factions as well) But even then, your post proves my point. Social Conservatism is part of the GOP, but the GOP is NOT Social Conservatism. But since you've jabbed at me there anywho, lets see here. [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Factions_in_the_Republican_Party_%28United_States%29[/url] You have, in the Republican Party today: -Traditionalists -Conservatives *Social Conservatives *Fiscal Conservatives *Paleo Conservatives *Neo Conservatives -Moderates -Libertarians -Liberals (I.E. RINO or Rockefeller Republicans) And fun fact, just cause there are only ~3 of those there in the House, that doesn't automatically mean that the others don't exist. So again, Point still stands, There is more than JUST Social Conservatism, and there are also more than what you posted there.[/QUOTE] Well yes, but in terms of the Republican Party as an organization, the moderates, liberals, and traditionalists are preposterously marginalized, if they can be said to exist at all.
[QUOTE=Megafan;36155888]Well yes, but in terms of the Republican Party as an organization, the moderates, liberals, and traditionalists are preposterously marginalized, if they can be said to exist at all.[/QUOTE] Okay, assuming that the populations of those you mentioned are so small they may as well not exist, we can pretty easily agree then that there are more than 3 flavors, yes?
[QUOTE=S31-Syntax;36156039]Okay, assuming that the populations of those you mentioned are so small they may as well not exist, we can pretty easily agree then that there are more than 3 flavors, yes?[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=S31-Syntax;36155767]While yes, those 3 there are the most well known, there are still more than that. 10 may have been more of an estimate (unless you count historical factions as well) But even then, your post proves my point. Social Conservatism is part of the GOP, but the GOP is NOT Social Conservatism. But since you've jabbed at me there anywho, lets see here. [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Factions_in_the_Republican_Party_%28United_States%29[/url] You have, in the Republican Party today: -Traditionalists -Conservatives *Social Conservatives *Fiscal Conservatives *Paleo Conservatives *Neo Conservatives -Moderates -Libertarians -Liberals (I.E. RINO or Rockefeller Republicans) And fun fact, just cause there are only ~3 of those there in the House, that doesn't automatically mean that the others don't exist. So again, Point still stands, There is more than JUST Social Conservatism, and there are also more than what you posted there.[/QUOTE] All but the last 3 of those are socially conservative, though. It's just that the Social Conservatives are [I]really[/I] social conservative. The liberal and moderate groups are very small ,and I imagine that the moderate voters, as well as liberal voters, switch between the Republicans and Democrats. The libertarians, while not insignificant, are the smallest of the main groups. Let's take this ice cream analogy all the way. At the hypothetical ice cream shop Republicream, you've got 10 flavors: -Vanilla Social Conservative Chip -An entire Social Conservative subsection, with --Double Social Conservative Chunk --Social Conservative --Social Conservative Swirl --Social Conservative Social Conservative Chip -Flavor of the Day, which may or may not have social conservative chips in it -Mint, which sometimes gets social conservative chips accidentally flicked into it from surrounding Social Conservative flavors and finally -Demon Sheep Flavor, which is actually just an extra, unused tray that some troublemaker stuck a "Demon Sheep Flavor" sticker on, that Republicream fans accuse other Republicream fans of eating Now let's go with Presidential Candidates, Republicream's list of special mixes of flavors and toppings: -about half a dozen social conservative flavors with minor differences between them -a flavor with not much social conservatism in it, but it barely gets ordered at all, so little that they took it off the menu because it was wasting space -a surprisingly popular flavor that started out as a joke on the internet but caught on wildly, it doesn't have much social conservatism, but it isn't actually ice cream, it's just peanut butter, nothing but peanut butter I don't know what all of those Frozen Yogurt stores would be in this analogy. God, those things are popping up [I]everywhere[/I]. They mostly all have different store names, but they're all basically the same shop, with the same architecture and everything. Am I the only one who's noticed this? Or have they been here for a while and I've just been oblivious? But this is off topic.
[QUOTE=Megafan;36155888]Well yes, but in terms of the Republican Party as an organization, the moderates, liberals, and traditionalists are preposterously marginalized, if they can be said to exist at all.[/QUOTE] Depends if you measure the Republicans by the politicians they have in office or the population of people who identify themselves as Republican. You get a different answer from those two different angles.
Welp, get ready boys, the revolution is-a-comin' And it [B] definitely[/B] will not be peaceful.
[QUOTE=BananaFoam;36158658]Welp, get ready boys, the revolution is-a-comin' And it [B] definitely[/B] will not be peaceful.[/QUOTE] Why is a revolution coming?
[QUOTE=Noble;36158821]Why is a revolution coming?[/QUOTE] Because they're taking our ice cream. Haven't you been reading the thread?
In other words: Lets make things even worse. Its beyond understanding what goes in their mind. Are they retarded? Ignorant? Or just plain evil?
[QUOTE=S31-Syntax;36153679]Facepunch Left Leaning TODO list: 1. Make fun of ALL Republicans 2. Stereotype Republicans 3. Talk about leaving the country because of Republicans 4. Call anyone who disagrees with you Republicans 5. Fail to understand the Republican party as a whole, use Social Conservatives as basis for entire opinion of Republicans 6. Return to step 1[/QUOTE] For the Record, the Democratic Party is further right than their non-American counterparts, and may be on par with their right wing parties. The Republican Party on the other hand, is off the charts, and if brought to another nation, would never be taken seriously.
[QUOTE=Hidole555;36158962]Because they're taking our ice cream. Haven't you been reading the thread?[/QUOTE] No ice cream, no peace! No ice cream, no peace!
[QUOTE=dass;36159014]In other words: Lets make things even worse. Its beyond understanding what goes in their mind. Are they retarded? Ignorant? Or just plain evil?[/QUOTE] Can you explain in further detail how it will make things worse?
[QUOTE=S31-Syntax;36154624]Social Conservatism is but 1 flavor in the ice cream shop that is the GOP. Granted its that one flavor that a ton of people seem to like for some reason, won't shut the fuck up about it, and keep trying to force samples on everyone... but its still 1 (ONE) flavor out of easily another 10 flavors.[/QUOTE] the fuck are you talking about ice cream for? the Republican platform is social conservatism. you know, it's why all the candidates were social conservatives?
[QUOTE=S31-Syntax;36154624]Social Conservatism is but 1 flavor in the ice cream shop that is the GOP. Granted its that one flavor that a ton of people seem to like for some reason, won't shut the fuck up about it, and keep trying to force samples on everyone... but its still 1 (ONE) flavor out of easily another 10 flavors.[/QUOTE] As somebody born substantially longer ago than yesterday, I have a hard time swallowing this, considering I distinctly recall when, of the entirety of Congress, one Republican voted no on DOMA. Because that would indicate you have two flavors of Republican: Social Conservatives, and Steve Gunderson. It also means a great many Democrats are also Social Conservatives, but that's another subject. Now, I happen to know Steve wasn't cloned recently. I think a clone from 96 is too young to run for office anyway. So if you'd care to give me a list of all these GOP members who are currently in office and are openly opposed to DOMA (and not just on constitutional grounds- because it's wrong [I]morally[/I]), I'll consider a claim that there's more to the current US right than hating gays. Of course, then you have the contraception mandate backlash to worry about, among other things. [QUOTE=Noble;36160138]Can you explain in further detail how it will make things worse?[/QUOTE] Why don't you [I]read the thread?[/I] Considering it's already been discussed.
I find people who call themselves conservatives and want lower tax rates fucking hilarious. In the past, we had tax rates that would make them claim the end of the world was happening.
[QUOTE=Xenocidebot;36160381]Why don't you [I]read the thread?[/I] Considering it's already been discussed.[/QUOTE] Almost everything I've seen here is pure rhetoric, appeals to emotion, and very little discussion of facts, logic, and evidence.
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[QUOTE=thisispain;36160267]the fuck are you talking about ice cream for? the Republican platform is social conservatism. you know, it's why all the candidates were social conservatives?[/QUOTE] Because I'm talking about "Social Conservatives" Which, as mentioned earlier, is Social Conservatism^99. And sorry, I forgot that you can only make jokes and metaphors if they repeatedly bash the GOP as whole. And I find it interesting that you are one of the only people here that has an issue with the Ice Cream metaphor.
there's no ice cream metaphor, the republican party is socially conservative: [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republican_Party_(United_States)[/url]
[QUOTE=Noble;36160670]Almost everything I've seen here is pure rhetoric, appeals to emotion, and very little discussion of facts, logic, and evidence.[/QUOTE] ...yet you cited a source known predominantly for being funded by and supporting very conservative viewpoints, including [URL="http://www.heritage.org/events/2009/06/signature-in-the-cell-dna-evidence-for-intelligent-design"]intelligent design "theory".[/URL] I'd be very wiling to take you seriously if you didn't post "pure rhetoric, appeals to emotion, and very little discussion of facts, logic, and evidence" if you had the good common courtesy to do the same. As is, it just appears you're a nimrod.
[QUOTE=thisispain;36161275]there's no ice cream metaphor, the republican party is socially conservative: [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republican_Party_%28United_States%29"]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republican_Party_(United_States)[/URL][/QUOTE] "Remember kids! When discussing on the internet, no fun allowed! Internet debating is serious business!" -thisispain and I [I]know that already.[/I] I was talking about the faction, the specific faction, the one everyone hates, the one named [I]"SOCIAL CONSERVATIVES"[/I] As in, the furthest right of the right leaning people. Stop going back on a point I've already addressed. I addressed it for a reason, I didn't type into a box so you could recap the same thing so I could then address it again.
i don't even know what you are talking about anymore, is this supposed to be fun?
[QUOTE=thisispain;36162397]i don't even know what you are talking about anymore, is this supposed to be fun?[/QUOTE] That was the point of the goddamn metaphor, to add some humor to the discussion. Apparently you didn't catch on to that, so sorry for spoiling your serious endeavor. I was saying that the faction known [I]directly[/I] as the "Social Conservatives" of the republican party, are not the entirety of the Republican party. YES. There is an element of Social Conservatism present in the entirety of the Republican Party. HOWEVER. There is a reason that they are specifically named and the rest of them [I]don't call themselves Social Conservatives.[/I] They don't call themselves that because they don't agree with them. These are called "Factions" and are typically present in a large group with many different opinions. Those with similar opinions will usually group, thus creating these "Factions". I do not understand how you cant grasp this concept.
[QUOTE=S31-Syntax;36162513]I was saying that the faction known [I]directly[/I] as the "Social Conservatives" of the republican party, are not the entirety of the Republican party.[/QUOTE] Okay. So why is it that, of all cosponsors of the Respect for Marriage Act, there is a grand total of [I]one[/I] Republican? Is Ileana Ros-Lehtinen a faction all her own?
[QUOTE=Xenocidebot;36162970]Okay. So why is it that, of all cosponsors of the Respect for Marriage Act, there is a grand total of [I]one[/I] Republican? Is Ileana Ros-Lehtinen a faction all her own?[/QUOTE] She may share similar views to the other members of her faction in Congress, but obviously her opinion differs on that subject. What kind of question is that?
If you're claiming [QUOTE]the faction known [I]directly[/I] as the "Social Conservatives" of the republican party, are not the entirety of the Republican party[/QUOTE] and yet the entirety of the republican party is demonstrably socially conservative except one individual, then social conservatives [I]do[/I] make up the entirety of the republican party. You don't get to say different "factions" exist if only one individual behaves outside the norm. I'm trying to go easy here because I think you've got a point and just don't know what it is yet. I asked you before to cite an example of some republicans demonstrably not socially conservative, just, in general, and you're not doing that, just acting weird. Meanwhile it's very easy to cite instances of the republican party acting as a cohesive, socially conservative block, as I've now done twice.
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