Native Italians to live homeless next to refugeeshelter filled with brandnew furniture. - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Aldawolf;49291945]Why can't we help both? [editline]10th December 2015[/editline] 5000 refugees is chump change to take care of in terms of government budgets, you shouldn't really be complaining about them getting care. Petition your government to take care of the homeless people, donate to local charities (I donated to the UN for the refugee crisis), or volunteer. Do I think we should do something about the homeless? Duh. Do I still think we should help refugees? Absolutely.[/QUOTE] No, you cannot help them. It would be nice. The first priority should be taking care of our own nations first. The sick treating the sick cures no one.

[QUOTE=Lonestriper;49292310]Do you have a lick of evidence to suggest that governments are actually siphoning money that was destined for the elderly, homeless or disabled citizens to give to refugees? Forgive me for being skeptical. It just seems to reek of bullshit.[/QUOTE] I'm guessing that he doesn't but that it's instead taken as assumed in his head that any spare money to give to people who are down on their luck should be spent on domestic homeless before bringing in international homeless (i.e. the refugees). If the money came out of a different budget corner, why wasn't it already being spent on local homeless? I look forward to being proven wrong about my assumptions about Rangergxi's argument. Hopefully with a reliable cited source backing up the original statement. If I [I]am[/I] correct in framing the argument, it's a position I can understand, even if I don't agree with it.

It is times like these I wish we would all collectively just get our heads out of our asses and look at the empty buildings, look at the homeless, look at the rotting stockpiles of food, look at the hungry, and make the fucking connection. Like damn, what does it really take to make a city? Some concrete, some metal, some plastic and some copper. Oh don't forget glass. Jee where oh where are we going to get such exotic materials? Please could a person with an advanced degree in economics just make sense of who should give money to who? Or... you know... we could just give them jobs building, designing, and manning the new civil space that they have created the demand for? We can help in supplies, expertise, and manpower. We have all these things and the main thing tripping us up is the question of "Herp derp who is going to pay for all this rock and corn?" Hopefully we will get our shit together soon enough, because right now the fact that we are still using a system that helped us trade chickens for milk is ridiculous. Numbers are useful up to a point and then they just make everything vastly more complicated than it reasonably ought to be.

[QUOTE=Lonestriper;49292310]Do you have a lick of evidence to suggest that governments are actually siphoning money that was destined for the elderly, homeless or disabled citizens to give to refugees? Forgive me for being skeptical. It just seems to reek of bullshit.[/QUOTE] [url]http://www.reuters.com/article/us-europe-migrants-sweden-forecast-idUSKCN0SG0I220151022[/url] Sweden is probably the worst when it comes to this.

[QUOTE=Rangergxi;49292261][B]In all countries[/B] they're siphoning resources away from programs for elderly, homeless and disabled to benefit refugees.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Lonestriper;49292310]"Evidence, please."[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Rangergxi;49292368]-only Sweden-[/QUOTE] Would you like to try again? Sweden may be making poor choices in responding to the crisis and that is certainly something open to criticism, but one does not a global mismanagement crisis make. Also, your source immediately mentions that the spending cuts are "across the board". They're not specifically raiding programs to benefit the disabled, homeless, and elderly, they're shaving a bit off of their spending on their own people in general and using it on the refugees. That is an entirely different argument and you shouldn't need to be told that it's dishonest to pretend otherwise. If you wish to argue that those programs should be exempted from cuts to pay for the refugee crisis, please begin actually arguing that point instead of cloaking it in layers of weasel wording.

The article was very vague one exactly what areas spending was being reigned in from to help cover the cost. Didn't even mention anything related to elderly, homeless or disabled Swedish citizens at least. [editline]11th December 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=elixwhitetail;49292374]Would you like to try again? Sweden may be making poor choices in responding to the crisis and that is certainly something open to criticism, but one does not a global mismanagement crisis make. Also, your source immediately mentions that the spending cuts are "across the board". They're not specifically raiding programs to benefit the disabled, homeless, and elderly, they're shaving a bit off of their spending on their own people in general and using it on the refugees. That is an entirely different argument and you shouldn't need to be told that it's dishonest to pretend otherwise. If you wish to argue that those programs should be exempted from cuts to pay for the refugee crisis, please begin actually arguing that point instead of cloaking it in layers of weasel wording.[/QUOTE] Oh basically this. Thank you elixwhitetail.

[QUOTE=Rangergxi;49292368][url]http://www.reuters.com/article/us-europe-migrants-sweden-forecast-idUSKCN0SG0I220151022[/url] Sweden is probably the worst when it comes to this.[/QUOTE] This is a great article! Not only does it actually prove you wrong, but it proves a lot of stupid bullshit I've seen on FP regarding refugees wrong. [QUOTE] Finance Minister Magdalena Andersson said asylum costs were unsustainable in the longer term and called on other European countries to do more to share the burden.[/QUOTE] Costs and associated strains on services and infrastructure in individual nations wouldn't be as high if Europe wasn't filled with xenophobic assholes. But nah fuck that lets sit back and point at other countries for being stupid enough to accept human beings escaping a warzone that is escalating daily because western bombing campaigns. [QUOTE] Andersson said planned savings would include reducing the cost of sick leave and making the asylum system more cost-effective as well as other measures.[/QUOTE] There it is ladies and gentlemen. The welfare state in Sweden being utterly demolished. Thanks for bringing this to our attention Rangergxi. [QUOTE]Sweden will also speed up the expulsion of around 6,000 people whose asylum applications were rejected.[/QUOTE] But people on FP told me that every asylum seeker was a terrorist in disguise. [QUOTE]The country's public finances are among the most solid in Europe and government debt, at around 36 percent of GDP, is among the lowest.[/QUOTE] Immigration destroys economies Great post, thanks.

I think we should just let them all die in their home country so that I won't have to be mildly inconvenienced any more.

[QUOTE=Tobylol;49299832]I think we should just let them all die in their home country so that I won't have to be mildly inconvenienced any more.[/QUOTE] Again, this sort of faul flawed rhetoric isn't in any way contributing to the discussion. Well done, you argue with ad ridiculum like a child.