[QUOTE=BFG9000;38121206]So by that logic, Richard Dawkins should go kill himself.[/QUOTE]
what.
and i called you an idiot because, well, you can figure out the rest.
So little clapping at the end, not surprised though, it is the Midwest, it's going to be a while before it gets legalized here unfortunately.
[QUOTE=Bobie;38118965]personally i feel it's time that organized religion ended altogether.[/QUOTE]
Personally I just think that religious institutions should have zero direct political power, trying to force it any further than that is oppression
Too bad most people in the audience didn't even understand what he did.
[QUOTE=PaChIrA;38121238]Wait, is this guy for gay rights or against them, I assume that since everyone here is on his side that he is for them. But I am not sure, since the title says anti gay rights. Can't really view the video right now, so could someone let me know?[/QUOTE]
Er, sorry, he's [b]for[/b] gay rights, I don't know why I put against...
[QUOTE=CanadianBill;38127267]He's against.[/QUOTE]
wow
no he's not
he's for gay rights
[QUOTE=obdob;38126974]Personally I just think that religious institutions should have zero direct political power, trying to force it any further than that is oppression[/QUOTE]
but how do you measure political power? a devout christian will vote for somebody that upholds values similar to their own beliefs. to remove the leadership from all spirituality will give people a better sense of direction in their own religious affiliation.
[QUOTE=CanadianBill;38127267]He's against.[/QUOTE]
did you even watch the video
unfortunately the majority of anti-gay-rights supporters are idiotic and don't have the required intelligence to understand what the speaker was doing.
[QUOTE=Bobie;38124717]what.
and i called you an idiot because, well, you can figure out the rest.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Bobie;38121071]
i'll be as 'bigoted' as i want about the ideals of those who pose a threat to equality.[/QUOTE]That's what
Also, suggesting I am an idiot and then claiming I can "figure out the rest" is a fallacy of logic
just because I have different views than you does not make me an idiot. I would call you an idiot now, but seeing that would lower me to your level, I will just say you're being pretty naive when you claim that organized religion should just die. You're showing the same kind of intolerance that you claim people that follow organized religion have. Maybe some people WANT to have an "organized" religion. And you coming in and saying that they shouldn't be able to have it is just wrong.
[QUOTE=BFG9000;38127805]That's what
Also, suggesting I am an idiot and then claiming I can "figure out the rest" is a fallacy of logic
just because I have different views than you does not make me an idiot. I would call you an idiot now, but seeing that would lower me to your level, I will just say you're being pretty naive when you claim that organized religion should just die. You're showing the same kind of intolerance that you claim people that follow organized religion have. Maybe some people WANT to have an "organized" religion. And you coming in and saying that they shouldn't be able to have it is just wrong.[/QUOTE]
you're an idiot because you keep misrepresenting my argument, talk about me using logical fallacies then your entire argument is one big strawman.
and so fucking what if people want an organized religion. people want lots of things, it doesn't make it right does it? a tax exempt entity of propaganda is something i should be allowed to criticize. the only reason you think i'm bigoted is because you don't actually understand my argument.
[QUOTE=BFG9000;38127805]That's what
Also, suggesting I am an idiot and then claiming I can "figure out the rest" is a fallacy of logic
just because I have different views than you does not make me an idiot. I would call you an idiot now, but seeing that would lower me to your level, I will just say you're being pretty naive when you claim that organized religion should just die. You're showing the same kind of intolerance that you claim people that follow organized religion have. Maybe some people WANT to have an "organized" religion. And you coming in and saying that they shouldn't be able to have it is just wrong.[/QUOTE]
It's not that people have an issue with the basis of religion, it's that most religions in general have some sort of basis in prejudiced teachings, (I'm looking at christianity, islam, and judaism) It is fine for singular worshippers to practice on their own time, and even to perhaps come to a mutual conjugation and discussion (and even discuss such topics in public) but when 'the church' get's involved, and when people submit not only to just the teachings of their holy book, but of the words of whoever is able to use their rank in the organization to influence others, then we have a problem.
The argument that religion 'does more harm than good' is also a null argument. Any harm done to others that is justified by a belief is simply absurd. Here is also a list of charitable organizations that are non-religious [url]http://techskeptic.blogspot.com/2007/12/atheist-charities.html[/url]
People are calling you an idiot because you're defending an organization with a basis in hatred, prejudice, and violence without acknowledging that fact. Your personal beliefs are understandable, and I ask that you try to reason with those who are against you without using argumentative language. But you first need to understand why others may have differing opinions before you argue with them.
[QUOTE=Bobie;38127857]you're an idiot because you keep misrepresenting my argument, talk about me using logical fallacies then your entire argument is one big strawman.
and so fucking what if people want an organized religion. people want lots of things, it doesn't make it right does it? a tax exempt entity of propaganda is something i should be allowed to criticize. the only reason you think i'm bigoted is because you don't actually understand my argument.[/QUOTE]
Ok, since you're saying that I don't understand your argument then why don't you help me out? Instead of actively slandering my level of intelligence why don't you proactively try to convey your point? Your saying that is only emotionally charging this discussion, and as Scott Adams once said you can't have a rational discussion that's emotionally charged.
So please, continue nix the insults.
[editline]21st October 2012[/editline]
See; Dan teh man put it in a way I can read without flipping shit.
[QUOTE=BFG9000;38127995]Ok, since you're saying that I don't understand your argument then why don't you help me out? Instead of actively slandering my level of intelligence why don't you proactively try to convey your point? Your saying that is only emotionally charging this discussion, and as Scott Adams once said you can't have a rational discussion that's emotionally charged.
So please, continue nix the insults.
[editline]21st October 2012[/editline]
See; Dan teh man put it in a way I can read without flipping shit.[/QUOTE]
organized religion is not necessary for individual spirituality. all organized religion does is give some form of false credibility to the ideals of those at the top of ladder. for example, if the pope speaks out against X controversial subject, it can have a seriously adverse effect depending on the subject that has been spoken out on.
A good example of this is contraception in africa. because large amounts of africa are devoutly religious for whatever reason, they take the word of those at a higher power in the religion itself as the word of god, and therefore act upon the will of said person in power.
However, if there were no person at the head of religion then they would have to act upon their own intuition, which for better or worse, would have far less ground for people to agree on.
your argument is that people want organized religion and want to practice it themselves. i am not proposing concentration camps for catholics, i'm asking to get rid of power structures within spirituality as it is an [i]extremely[/i] sensitive issue in the world right now. People should be allowed to pray by themselves or as a local community, but the fact that a presidential candidate has to be endorsed by a religion just goes to show the power that some people have and can/will abuse.
government and religion should be seperated
[QUOTE=AlphaX10;38128552]government and religion should be seperated[/QUOTE]
Yeah, they should probably put that into some kind of document that's the basis for governing a country.
In the news today: the inherent shortcomings of the human condition fail to correct themselves--many people still quite disappointing.
Update: Twist ending surprises all; dozens gain small flicker of hope!
[QUOTE=Bobie;38118965]personally i feel it's time that organized religion ended altogether.[/QUOTE]
It never will. It's human nature pretty much
Ah I see what you mean Bobie; I agree to some extent.
[QUOTE=Orkel;38128813]It never will. It's human nature pretty much[/QUOTE]
'human nature' is a vast concept subject to interpretation, and is up there with rape and murder being 'human nature' when realistically it's just the condition of your environment. I think religion will exist for a long time, but maybe not in it's present form.
[QUOTE=Orkel;38128813]It never will. It's human nature pretty much[/QUOTE]
Everyone and their mother claims to know something about human nature but very few people can actually back this up with any actual facts.
[QUOTE=Orkel;38128813]It never will. It's human nature pretty much[/QUOTE]
That's only half the problem. Some of it IS the hunger for power that many leaders have. The other half, which is less primitive, is something along the lines of people consciously abusing something like religion to promote their own agenda. Think Westboro.
[QUOTE=BFG9000;38128891]Ah I see what you mean Bobie; I agree to some extent.[/QUOTE]
im glad we could come to an agreement. there's nothing wrong with believing all the shit you want to believe on an [i]individual[/i] level, but when it begins to effect others that would be otherwise unknowing or unwilling of your effect then it becomes a problem. this doesnt just apply to religion, it applies to anything with a power structure.
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