4chan's "project harpoon" brings out the beauty in overweight women
329 replies, posted
[QUOTE=sourcegamer101;48481884]That's what 4chan does, and good on them
these fat acceptance people are fucking delusional as is[/QUOTE]
I'm well aware that's what they do, that's why I'm saying there's not much point looking into the benefits or downsides of fat shaming when this is as simple as trolling.
Do we really need to find moral justification when something as simple as pissing off the easily pissed off is already good enough?
[QUOTE=Aldawolf;48481912]I'm pretty sure an overwhelming majority of fat people know that it's unhealthy, there is a vocal minority that are trying to claim it isn't but they're few and far between and are largely ignored and laughed at. Fat acceptance is more about not being a dick to a fat person (Which you shouldn't be a dick to anyone but this isn't a perfect world), just a small group of people on tumblr latch onto things like that and run wild with ideas. They're silly and shouldn't really be accounted for when talking about a problem except when you want to laugh at them, as their impact on the larger picture is so small compared to a general lack of education on food and nutrition, the overworked american, the billion dollar fast food industry...all these have way bigger impacts than some idiots and trolls preaching on a tumblr blog.[/QUOTE]
Here's where we run into the recurring problem with internet-based movements. How do we know the exact percentage of the overall group that are reasonable, forward-thinking individuals and how many are 'idiots and trolls preaching on a tumblr blog'. There's no way of actually knowing for certain unless someone does a study (naturally you'll lean one way or the other based on your personal experiences) and as a result I'm not comfortable saying which is the dominant party either way.
All we can honestly do is create a label to distinguish the more radical or extremist members of the overall collective,like what people have done with 'social justice warrior' to distinguish radical feminists, civil rights activists and anti-racists. As you can tell, that doesn't seem to work well either, as people keep trying to shift the definitions to mean whatever they want them to mean (a fox news reporter yelling about those damn 'commie, socialist liberals' comes to mind).
[QUOTE=Viva;48481918]The original idea was exactly that, but then you had people using them for their own purposes. AKA tumblr and feminst folks using the images to propagate fat acceptance which is arguably doing just as much harm as fat shaming.[/QUOTE]
I already explained in another post, but incase you didn't see it I really think these people aren't doing nearly as much harm as overworking Americans, bad education on nutrition (Be honest: How often do you read the labels on your food? I used to never until I got very serious about my weight) and a fast food industry built on destroying self control and being cheap and accessible food while also being incredibly high calorie and bad for you (I looked up the calories to one of those DQ meals you can get for 5 dollars, for 5 dollars you can get some food that is void of nutrition and 1500 calories, and people can eat a lot more than that in one day without knowing what or how much they're putting in their bodies)
Hey this is something I could actually partake in
Photoshopping images like this I used to do for fun with my friends to see if it would even be possible to photoshop some people to actually look healthy.
[QUOTE=RichyZ;48481948]what do you mean anorexia in young adults is easily caused by fat shaming
no richy, you see, you're an SJW[/QUOTE]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/tv4hXe9.png[/img]
Unsure if actual skeleton or "SJW to skeleton" userscript.
[QUOTE=RichyZ;48481948]what do you mean anorexia in young adults is easily caused by fat shaming
no richy, you see, you're an SJW[/QUOTE]
Where has anyone mentioned anything about anorexia? Are you incapable of not jumping to either extreme of any particular issue?
this is actually a middle school argument unfolding on a massive scale thanks to the internet
This sounds like good, clean fun, where's the issue?
[QUOTE=Zyler;48481938]Here's where we run into the recurring problem with internet-based movements. How do we know the exact percentage of the overall group that are reasonable, forward-thinking individuals and how many are 'idiots and trolls preaching on a tumblr blog'. There's no way of actually knowing for certain unless someone does a study (naturally you'll lean one way or the other based on your personal experiences) and as a result I'm not comfortable saying which is the dominant party either way.[/QUOTE]
I am certain an overwhelming majority of people who are feminists, fat acceptance, black lives matter are sane and people who say "Kill all men" "Fat is healthy" "White people need to die" are a very loud minority, mostly because places like reddit put the most focus on them and it's what a lot of people are exposed to. That's all fine and dandy until it starts to devolve into a circlejerk over these groups and generalize feminists as manhating fat ugly pigs when that is far from the truth. You're just exposed to those kind of people more because places like Reddit eat that shit up and share it the most. You've probably read more about "insane SJWs feminazis xd" then the tenants of genuine feminism.
That's really the problem with a place like Reddit, their only exposure to these movements are the bad and crazy people so they start to generalize it and ignore the core principles and ideas or even go as far to resent them JUST because of this outspoken minority they're always exposed to, leading to this stupid internet war of Atheists vs Feminists.
[QUOTE=RichyZ;48481975]responding to the "fact" that since [B]fat suicide is outweighed by fat people losing weight[/B], fat shaming is perfectly acceptable
when in reality, fat shaming leads to a culture that we have today, where young women and men sometimes get a warped view of themselves a young age causing them to starve themselves to look good for shitty people[/QUOTE]
Well of course fat suicide is going to outweigh fat people who lost their weight.
[QUOTE=Aldawolf;48481969]I am certain an overwhelming majority of people who are feminists, fat acceptance, black lives matter are sane and people who say "Kill all men" "Fat is healthy" "White people need to die" are a very loud minority, mostly because places like reddit put the most focus on them and it's what a lot of people are exposed to. That's all fine and dandy until it starts to devolve into a circlejerk over these groups and generalize feminists as manhating fat ugly pigs when that is far from the truth. You're just exposed to those kind of people more because places like Reddit eat that shit up and share it the most. You've probably read more about "insane SJWs feminazis xd" then the tenants of genuine feminism.[/QUOTE]
I agree with you, the trouble is when we start dealing with specific people and attempt to ascertain their intentions based on what group they claim to be affiliated to. We have to find a balance between attacking an entire group of people based on guilt by association and permissing any action by an individual of said group based on their identification of being a member or ad hoc-ly removing them from the group they identify with using a 'no true scotsman' fallacy. I don't feel like this should be a particularly difficult thing to do, but a lot of people on the internet struggle attempting to exist between these two extremes.
[QUOTE=Levithan;48481834]I would argue that shaming overweight folk leads to more death than positive affirmations ever will[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=d00msdaydan;48481853]More people have killed themselves after being called fat than had their lives cut short by being obese?[/QUOTE]
Eh, here's quick numbers I just searched
[QUOTE=http://www.cdc.gov/heartdisease/facts.htm]About 610,000 people die of heart disease in the United States every year–that’s 1 in every 4 deaths.[/QUOTE]
There are a few sources that say that 1 in 5 Americans are killed due to obesity related heart disease, and some that say that half of all heart disease deaths are related to obesity (roughly 1 in 8 americans).
So let's lowball it and say there are roughly 300,000 deaths per year for obesity related heart disease deaths in America.
[QUOTE=https://www.afsp.org/understanding-suicide/facts-and-figures]The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) collects data about mortality in the U.S., including deaths by suicide. [B]In 2013 (the most recent year for which full data are available), 41,149 suicides were reported[/B], making suicide the 10th leading cause of death for Americans[/QUOTE]
If you're looking at these numbers, obesity related heart disease kills at least more than 7 times those who commit suicide (and that's all suicide, not just body shaming).
[QUOTE=RichyZ;48481975]responding to the "fact" that since fat suicide is outweighed by fat people losing weight, fat shaming is perfectly acceptable
when in reality, fat shaming leads to a culture that we have today, where young women and men sometimes get a warped view of themselves a young age causing them to starve themselves to look good for shitty people[/QUOTE]
But there's a difference between fat shaming and giving people the help they need. Namely, giving people resources, offering to coach them or help them get them to a gym. There's nuance to this issue, and the exact actions you should take on the matter vary between specific individuals based on their health and mental well-being.
I find that you're taking a very extreme viewpoint on this whole thing, one that is not conductive to progressively and constructively solving the issue of people's physical and mental health.
[editline]18th August 2015[/editline]
[QUOTE=RichyZ;48482001]and do you have numbers on the amount of people who've lost weight because people were dickheads to them about their weight?[/QUOTE]
We don't know one way or the other. Are you assuming that it is higher than the 1 in 5 who die from heart disease, if so, where are your sources?
Once again, you seem to exist in this ridiculous extreme where anyone who is worried about the health of morbidly obese people in one of the most obese nations in the world is an inhuman monster who just wants to torture people for their personal satisfaction.
the irony of acting like you give a shit about fat people's health when you're running a massive online effort to humiliate them
[QUOTE=RichyZ;48482001]and do you have numbers on the amount of people who've lost weight because people were dickheads to them about their weight?[/QUOTE]
Not really, because I'm not condoning being a dick to someone about their weight.
How the fuck would that help?
[QUOTE=RichyZ;48482001]and do you have numbers on the amount of people who've lost weight because people were dickheads to them about their weight?[/QUOTE]
I remember 1 article about a man losing weight because one of his friends called him Fat Ass at least once every day.
[editline]fatfuck[/editline]
Wasn't called Fat Ass, it was Fat Fuck.
[url]http://www.doyoueven.com/2015/01/chef-loses-133kg-friend-texts-fat-fk-every-day-six-weeks/[/url]
[QUOTE=Zyler;48482013]We don't know one way or the other. Are you assuming that it is higher than the 1 in 5 who die from heart disease, if so, where are your sources?[/QUOTE]
He's claiming the opposite and it makes much more sense imo.
[QUOTE=RichyZ;48482001]and do you have numbers on the amount of people who've lost weight because people were dickheads to them about their weight?[/QUOTE]
No, but I do have the numbers to show more men and women in America suffer from binge-eating disorders than anorexia and bulimia combined.
[QUOTE=Ruski v2.0;48481675]They have a point.
Fat acceptance is going to kill more people than cancer in the coming century.[/QUOTE]
That's a bold fuckin' statement, eh?
[editline]/[/editline]
Like, I'm not underselling the importance of healthy weight management or anything. I think the "fat acceptance" movement (or rather, the niche subgroup of the movement that is actually just "anti-thin") is ridiculous, yeah. It's extremely disingenuous. Yet, somehow, "[I]thin shaming tumblerinas will kill more people than cancer[/I]" feels like a pretty loaded statement to me.
Oh no, I'm not trying to justify it. I just noticed interest in the numbers between suicide due to it and the obesity related death itself.
[QUOTE=RichyZ;48482037]not trying to spite you, trying to ask legit questions about fat shaming
dunno why anyone would try to justify it, which tons have done on the first page
you can give people advice, but fat shaming is like telling a religious person "youre a fucking retard god doesnt exist jesus is a lie you dumb fuck", it would make you look edgy and wouldn't change a religious person's mind[/QUOTE]
Fair enough, and I agree with you. I do however think you should examine how you read other people's posts and find the intent of the poster you find in them. As far as I can see, there's nothing on the first page that condones mentally abusing someone based on their weight. If you asked each the individual posters if they condoned that sort of thing, I bet they would give you the same response me and Snickerdoodle gave you.
[editline]18th August 2015[/editline]
[QUOTE=RichyZ;48482047]and im guessing calling them lardasses and making fun of them constantly will change that[/QUOTE]
This is what I mean right here. You are assuming intent in what Canuhearme posted that wasn't clearly distinguishable from his actual post. Why, from what he posted, did you assume he condones mental abuse? If he was condoning emotionally abusing people based on their weight then I'd agree with your response, but as far as I can tell he wasn't doing that.
here's a good video on the subject:
[video=youtube;Bb2mVGE63YU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bb2mVGE63YU[/video]
[QUOTE=RichyZ;48481975]responding to the "fact" that since fat suicide is outweighed by fat people losing weight, fat shaming is perfectly acceptable
when in reality, fat shaming leads to a culture that we have today, where young women and men sometimes get a warped view of themselves a young age causing them to starve themselves to look good for shitty people[/QUOTE]
and yet the deaths from anorexia can't hold a candle to the deaths from obesity
[QUOTE=RichyZ;48482080]i assume intent in canyouhearme's post because the dudes an edgelord by default, its impossible to go into any of these arguments without taking prior knowledge into account[/QUOTE]
Baring whether or not he is in fact an 'edgelord', what has he posted specifically in this thread that means he supports emotionally abusing people?
[QUOTE=RichyZ;48482080]i assume intent in canyouhearme's post because the dudes an edgelord by default, its impossible to go into any of these arguments without taking prior knowledge into account[/QUOTE]
What?
It's a joke about fat people being heavy. Fat suicide out[B]weighs[/B] people who aren't fat any more.
Get it?
[QUOTE=Aldawolf;48481969]I am certain an overwhelming majority of people who are feminists, fat acceptance, black lives matter are sane and people who say "Kill all men" "Fat is healthy" "White people need to die" are a very loud minority, mostly because places like reddit put the most focus on them and it's what a lot of people are exposed to. That's all fine and dandy until it starts to devolve into a circlejerk over these groups and generalize feminists as manhating fat ugly pigs when that is far from the truth. You're just exposed to those kind of people more because places like Reddit eat that shit up and share it the most. You've probably read more about "insane SJWs feminazis xd" then the tenants of genuine feminism.
That's really the problem with a place like Reddit, their only exposure to these movements are the bad and crazy people so they start to generalize it and ignore the core principles and ideas or even go as far to resent them JUST because of this outspoken minority they're always exposed to, leading to this stupid internet war of Atheists vs Feminists.[/QUOTE]
A lot of women that I know that are about body acceptance just want realistic mannequins and realistic depiction in modeling, which is totally okay. I think a mix of both is cool.
[t]http://static3.businessinsider.com/image/50bd29f76bb3f72307000026-618-718/victorias-secret-and-dove-models.jpg[/t]
[QUOTE=RichyZ;48482109]heart disease comes from many factors, the biggest being yeah, obesity, but large factors including smoking cigarettes (which most people have declared the shaming of to be dumb) and hereditary reasons (which are unavoidable unless you can fat-shame your parents before you're born)[/QUOTE]
At least 1 in 12 are based on obesity from snickerdoodles posts, and we still don't know how many deaths are caused by fat shaming. We have no idea either way which is the biggest issue, and it would be incredibly difficult to find out. Which is all meaningless since I don't understand why we can't just exist the middle ground of neither shaming people based on their appearance or condoning unhealthy conditions as being healthy. People are being harmed by either extreme, so why can't we just be in the middle?
I still think you are assuming intent in people's postings here and the vast majority of people in this thread would agree with you if you would just stop being so confrontational in your posts.
[QUOTE=Ruski v2.0;48481675]They have a point.
Fat acceptance is going to kill more people than cancer in the coming century.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Big Dumb American;48482042]That's a bold fuckin' statement, eh?[/QUOTE]
let's do more numbers then
[quote=http://www.cancer.org/acs/groups/content/@research/documents/webcontent/acspc-042151.pdf]
[B]In 2014, about 585,720 Americans are expected to die of cancer, almost 1,600 people per day[/B]. Cancer is the second most common cause of death in the US, exceeded only by heart disease, accounting for nearly 1 of every 4 deaths. [/quote]
[quote=https://www.wvdhhr.org/bph/oehp/obesity/mortality.htm]Using data on all eligible subjects from all six studies, Allison et al. estimated that 280,184 obesity-attributable deaths occurred in the U.S. annually. When risk ratios calculated for nonsmokers and never-smokers were applied to the entire population (assuming these ratios to produce the best estimate for all subjects, regardless of smoking status, i.e., that obesity would exert the same deleterious effects across all smoking categories), the [B]mean estimate for deaths due to obesity was 324,940[/B].[/quote]
So almost 2 times more people die from cancer than obesity related deaths (I found a source on obesity related deaths now).
So fat acceptance would have to do quite a lot to kill that many people.
[QUOTE=Snickerdoodle;48482145]let's do more numbers then
So almost 2 times more people die from cancer than obesity related deaths (I found a source on obesity related deaths now).[/QUOTE]
If you listen to any health scientists, the consensus right now is that we're in an obesity epidemic.
[QUOTE=Snickerdoodle;48482145]let's do more numbers then
So almost 2 times more people die from cancer than obesity related deaths (I found a source on obesity related deaths now).[/QUOTE]
Given these figures, the only scenario I could realistically imagine for obesity-related deaths outpacing cancer deaths is a cure for cancer.
[QUOTE=Zyler;48481900]Well, there's a mid-point between getting somebody help and just shaming them for being bad at losing weight without providing any alternatives.[/QUOTE]
"being bad at losing weight" implies they have tried. Only a total douche would make fun of someone for trying, and that isn't what this is about.
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