• Dean Evans (Creator of FC3: Blood Dragon) had other game ideas, including a game about a jewish thei
    169 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Lebowski;45980689]He could easily make a good thievery game without having to use the stereotypes that have been a detriment to my people for hundreds of years. The character being kleptomaniac has no effect on the fact that this guy, wanting to make a game that exploits these stereotypes, is also not even Jewish from what I can find. He has no right to be speaking out for my people in this way, because it is still harmful. This is a load of anti-semitic garbage, as are a lot of the posts in here. You goyem need to stay in your lane.[/QUOTE] As an Orthodox Jew, I find this game idea really interesting. It could explore the life of Hasidim and how this character struggles to control his kleptomania, knowing that he is supporting a stereotype and feeling ashamed that he is breaking the commandment not to steal. I would play it.
[QUOTE=Lebowski;45981325]Intentions don't matter when what you put out there still comes off as prejudiced. He has no right to be speaking to my people; no amount of pedantic white posts from [I]another[/I] gay white dude trying to equate what he's experienced to what I've experienced will convince me otherwise. You are [B]not[/B] entitled to use my stereotypes in an attempt to be an edgy game designer. I dis-include you.[/QUOTE] Intentions completely matter, if you assume something that is not discriminatory is discriminatory and someone clarifies and explains why, then there is nothing else to be said. If this is the way you must be, then I respect that. Truly I do feel for you and I wish the best. It is a shame that you do not look at me as a human-being, someone who has lived, loved, lost, and struggled as you have; but as a "pedantic white poster and another gay white dude". I wish you well in life and I will never look at you as Jewish, but as just another Human, something I think; far more important than the labels that make us different. I do not wish to continue this argument with you, I've shown you great respect, understand your points and argued them, but I do not feel that was given back and I do not feel you deserve my time anymore. You do not know the life I have lived, nor the people I love and have experienced life with.
[QUOTE=Svinnik;45981347]As an Orthodox Jew, I find this game idea really interesting. It could explore the life of Hasidim and how this character struggles to control his kleptomania, knowing that he is supporting a stereotype and feeling ashamed that he is breaking the commandment not to steal. I would play it.[/QUOTE] Good for you? You're still giving money to a non-Jew to talk about Jewish issues, when it is almost assuredly the developer attempting to make an edgy and intentionally offensive game because he likes to push "taboos". [editline]14th September 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=doommarine23;45981349] I do not wish to continue this argument with you, I've shown you great respect, understand your points and argued them, but I do not feel that was given back and I do not feel you deserve my time anymore. You do not know the life I have lived, nor the people I love and have experienced life with.[/QUOTE] I've shown you no respect because [I]you[/I] assume that what you've experienced can be equated to what I've experienced. To quote you "You do not know the life I have lived, nor the people I love and have experienced life with." so it's probably good if we stop now.
[QUOTE=Lebowski;45981354]Good for you? [B]You're still giving money to a non-Jew to talk about Jewish issues,[/B] when it is almost assuredly the developer attempting to make an edgy and intentionally offensive game because he likes to push "taboos". [/QUOTE] What a strange thing to say. Do you also complain about white anti-racist lecturers or male women's studies lecturers?
[QUOTE=Lebowski;45981354]Good for you? You're still giving money to a non-Jew to talk about Jewish issues, when it is almost assuredly the developer attempting to make an edgy and intentionally offensive game because he likes to push "taboos".[/QUOTE] The Shiva was made by non Jews and was a masterpiece. You are doing more damage than the dev by calling non Jews Goyim. Stop referring to their lack of Jewish blood and treat them like humans. Is your mother Jewish?
The question to ask is, would you make similar jokes playing off black people? Alternatively, would you tell a black person to stop whining about racist jokes?
[QUOTE=sloppy_joes;45981371]What a strange thing to say. Do you complain about anti-racist lecturers being white?[/QUOTE] Do anti-racist lecturers frequently shout the words that have been a detriment to what they are teaching about? No, they typically understand that it is not for them to decide, or say out of historical context. I don't think they ever attempt to use them as much as possible to come off as "edgy" and "making a point", they make that point just fine by talking about how bad these words are by using them rarely, and in an appropriate context. Their rhetoric comes from the people who have actually experienced racism, not their own personal experience. [editline]14th September 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=Sgt-NiallR;45981375]The question to ask is, would you make similar jokes playing off black people? Alternatively, would you tell a black person to stop whining about racist jokes?[/QUOTE] That's what I'm getting at, [I]almost anyone else[/I] would be rightfully offended; but anti-semitism is the OK fallback to racism? [editline]14th September 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=Svinnik;45981372]The Shiva was made by non Jews and was a masterpiece. You are doing more damage than the dev by calling non Jews Goyim. Stop referring to their lack of Jewish blood and treat them like humans. Is your mother Jewish?[/QUOTE] Yep, and she calls non-jews what they are; non-jews and goyem. I'll treat them human once my outrage at this wanton anti-semitism is seen as justified; for I have NOT been treated as human throughout the majority of my life. A goyem is a goyim is a goy. They're non-jews, and it's one word for it. They have no right to be offended at having a word for "not being jewish" when there are a million slurs for BEING jewish. You should pick up Dawn by Elie Wiesel and Wanderings by Chaim Potok to see how we have ended up in the situation that we have.
[QUOTE=Lebowski;45981396]Do anti-racist lecturers frequently shout the words that have been a detriment to what they are teaching about? No, they typically understand that it is not for them to decide, or say out of historical context. I don't think they ever attempt to use them as much as possible to come off as "edgy" and "making a point", they make that point just fine by talking about how bad these words are by using them rarely, and in an appropriate context. Their rhetoric comes from the people who have actually experienced racism, not their own personal experience. [editline]14th September 2014[/editline] That's what I'm getting at, [I]almost anyone else[/I] would be rightfully offended; but anti-semitism is the OK fallback to racism? [editline]14th September 2014[/editline] Yep, and she calls non-jews what they are; non-jews and goyem. I'll treat them human once my outrage at this wanton anti-semitism is seen as justified; for I have NOT been treated as human throughout the majority of my life. A goyem is a goyim is a goy. They're non-jews, and it's one word for it. They have no right to be offended at having a word for "not being jewish" when there are a million slurs for BEING jewish. You should pick up Dawn by Elie Wiesel and Wanderings by Chaim Potok to see how we have ended up in the situation that we have.[/QUOTE] I mean, I know the situation us Jews are in. You're from the US though. The United States has been kind to the Jews compared to Poland or the USSR. My family is from the Soviet Union and suffered horribly under the Soviets. My great Grandfather had perfect grades in school and still was assigned to a shitty job out in Siberia. His father was a Soviet soldier who was killed by the Nazis. My family had a German branch that was wiped out by the Nazis. I have a very little family that is just starting to recover from the holocaust and the forced secularism of the USSR. As an Israeli, I know the feeling of walking through the Arab quarter of Jerusalem and seeing hate in the eyes of Palestinians who consider me an enemy. My great grandfather is now living in Israel and is still suffering of the murder of his father by the Nazis and the rockets being fired at his beloved country, a fulfillment of his dream. However, he doesn't share your views. He treats all people as human and when he found a lost Palestinian boy, he didn't ignore him because he was an enemy. He helped him find his family and my great grandfather and the family became good friends because he was able to look past their not being Jewish and their being the enemy into their hearts.
[QUOTE=Lebowski;45981244]Because being a Self-Hating Jew to appease the people who would rather see us as lesser is pandering to the oppressor. Maybe it's because other "pretty serious Jews" are actually really tired of hearing how greedy the world sees them?[/QUOTE] just because you can crack a joke at your expense doesn't mean you hate yourself it's called having a sense of humour
[QUOTE=Svinnik;45981474]I mean, I know the situation us Jews are in. You're from the US though. The United States has been kind to the Jews compared to Poland or the USSR. My family is from the Soviet Union and suffered horribly under the Soviets. My great Grandfather had perfect grades in school and still was assigned to a shitty job out in Siberia. His father was a Soviet soldier who was killed by the Nazis. My family had a German branch that was wiped out by the Nazis. I have a very little family that is just starting to recover from the holocaust and the forced secularism of the USSR. As an Israeli, I know the feeling of walking through the Arab quarter of Jerusalem and seeing hate in the eyes of Palestinians who consider me an enemy. My great grandfather is now living in Israel and is still suffering of the murder of his father by the Nazis and the rockets being fired at his beloved country, a fulfillment of his dream. However, he doesn't share your views. He treats all people as human and when he found a lost Palestinian boy, he didn't ignore him because he was an enemy. He helped him find his family and my great grandfather and the family became good friends because he was able to look past their not being Jewish and their being the enemy into their hearts.[/QUOTE] Ook dude, I understand that you're fearful for the wellbeing of your family; but pretty much Israel is the one that's in the position to stop the violence. I'm not gonna argue about Palestine-Israel relations with you because it's [I]obviously[/I] going to go absolutely nowhere because we're just going to kvetch at each other eternally. The Palestinians who look at you with hate in their eyes obviously know nothing of who you really are, but you know nothing of them either; for there is a WALL between the two of us; and the US is aiding that by sending billions of dollars a day, that Israel is maintaining a wall so that we may never learn that we could be brothers or friends; not in this life. They are nearly being wiped out by the Israeli government so that hate you perceive is born in fear and for the stereotypes that radicalists have perpetuated about you; and the hate you look at them is with the stereotypes that Israeli radicalists have perpetuated you into thinking. There are Palestinian Jews who have the same fears you do for their own families. "The US has been relatively nice to the Jews" is [B]entirely[/B] in policy and has been entirely misguided by the Christian/Catholic Right-Wing because they feel pity for us Jews, when we do NOT want their misguided pity. If you knew the shit I had to put up with on a near daily basis for being Jewish, you'd understand that while the US may be pandering in it's policies, it's people are still entirely hostile to anything they perceive as "too different" in a whole variety of ways. [editline]14th September 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=Zuimzado;45981531]just because you can crack a joke at your expense doesn't mean you hate yourself it's called having a sense of humour[/QUOTE] Sometimes it does mean you have hate bred into you. You seriously think self-hate born out of prejudicial stereotypes about you is not a thing? What about all the Uncle Ruckuses and Uncle Toms? I have a fine sense of humor; when it's not at the exploitation of stereotypes perpetuated against me being done by someone who has never been on the butt-end of these stereotypes.
[QUOTE=Lebowski;45981541]Ook dude, I understand that you're fearful for the wellbeing of your family; but pretty much Israel is the one that's in the position to stop the violence. I'm not gonna argue about Palestine-Israel relations with you because it's [I]obviously[/I] going to go absolutely nowhere because we're just going to kvetch at each other eternally. The Palestinians who look at you with hate in their eyes obviously know nothing of who you really are, but you know nothing of them either; for there is a WALL between the two of us; and the US is aiding that by sending billions of dollars a day, that Israel is maintaining a wall so that we may never learn that we could be brothers or friends; not in this life. They are nearly being wiped out by the Israeli government so that hate you perceive is born in fear and for the stereotypes that radicalists have perpetuated about you; and the hate you look at them is with the stereotypes that Israeli radicalists have perpetuated you into thinking. There are Palestinian Jews who have the same fears you do for their own families. "The US has been relatively nice to the Jews" is [B]entirely[/B] in policy and has been entirely misguided by the Christian/Catholic Right-Wing because they feel pity for us Jews, when we do NOT want their misguided pity. If you knew the shit I had to put up with on a near daily basis for being Jewish, you'd understand that while the US may be pandering in it's policies, it's people are still entirely hostile to anything they perceive as "too different" in a whole variety of ways. [editline]14th September 2014[/editline] Sometimes it does mean you have hate bred into you. You seriously think self-hate born out of prejudicial stereotypes about you is not a thing? I have a fine sense of humor; when it's not at the exploitation of stereotypes perpetuated against me being done by someone who has never been on the butt-end of these stereotypes.[/QUOTE] Give me an example of shit you have to put up with?
[QUOTE=Lebowski;45981541] Sometimes it does mean you have hate bred into you. You seriously think self-hate born out of prejudicial stereotypes about you is not a thing? What about all the Uncle Ruckuses and Uncle Toms? I have a fine sense of humor; when it's not at the exploitation of stereotypes perpetuated against me being done by someone who has never been on the butt-end of these stereotypes.[/QUOTE] no it doesn't there's a difference between obviously using a stereotype for humour than using that stereotype as objective truth mel brooks is a jew that makes fun of jews, does that means he hates his jewish heritage?
[QUOTE=Dr.C;45980290]"Rabbi, can I trust this woman?" "She's a shiksa, of course not!" *INCOMING CALL* "Eli! It's your mother! Why haven't you been calling! Are you trying to kill your mother?" "..." "When are you going to get a REAL job?" "How come you ONLY call when you want to save? You never want to talk with your mother!"[/QUOTE] "Snake, you must get the Philosofers Legacy!" "But that's not my main mission. My main mission is to defeat the boss!" "Who cares about her, get the Legacy instead and run!"
/pol/'s dream game
[QUOTE=Zuimzado;45981564]no it doesn't there's a difference between obviously using a stereotype for humour than using that stereotype as objective truth[/QUOTE] And there's a difference between someone who's experienced and understands how that stereotype can affect people using these stereotypes, and a white dude who DOESN'T understand how that stereotype can affect people using it. Self-Hate exists (whether or not YOU personally experience it, because YOUR experience does NOT reflect mine as a Jew, or other Jews, or people of other races or other geological locations) , and your denial of it is simply ignorance of it's existence. It's a very real problem that seriously affects how one looks at themselves. I suggest you read Uncle Tom's Cabin. [editline]14th September 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=Zuimzado;45981564]mel brooks is a jew that makes fun of jews, does that means he hates his jewish heritage?[/QUOTE] Nope, because in my opinion he does it [I]right[/I], and I can make that judgement because [B]I'm Jewish.[/B]
[QUOTE=Lebowski;45981592]And there's a difference between someone who's experienced and understands how that stereotype can affect people using these stereotypes, and a white dude who DOESN'T understand how that stereotype can affect people using it. Self-Hate exists (whether or not YOU personally experience it, because YOUR experience does NOT reflect mine as a Jew, or other Jews, or people of other races or other geological locations) , and your denial of it is simply ignorance of it's existence. It's a very real problem that seriously affects how one looks at themselves. I suggest you read Uncle Tom's Cabin.[/QUOTE] [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZAZhtT-dUyo[/media] [editline]14th September 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=Lebowski;45981592] Nope, because in my opinion he does it [I]right[/I], and I can make that judgement because [B]I'm Jewish.[/B][/QUOTE] so am i, honey
[QUOTE=Zuimzado;45981605][media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZAZhtT-dUyo[/media] [editline]14th September 2014[/editline] so am i, honey[/QUOTE] Good for you? I don't care? Your opinion may not reflect mine? You may be unaware of self-hate because you're a victim of it? Just because you don't believe in it, doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
goddarn americans get offended at anything, go eat a burger or something and let us have fun
Or maybe there are Jews out there, tired of [B]NON-JEWS[/B] using our stereotypes? Your point is already null because Mel Brooks is [B]Jewish[/B], this guy [B]isn't[/B]. He doesn't have the perspective.
[QUOTE=Lebowski;45981628]Or maybe there are Jews out there, tired of [B]NON-JEWS[/B] using our stereotypes? Your point is already null because Mel Brooks is [B]Jewish[/B], this guy [B]isn't[/B]. He doesn't have the perspective.[/QUOTE] How do you know he isn't Jewish?
I'm gonna go ahead and guess you're a white american too, which explains the long speeches about being offended and overreacting to stuff. If you're a conservative too, then it's a bingo! Get out your cards, everyone!
[QUOTE=Svinnik;45981638]How do you know he isn't Jewish?[/QUOTE] Ok, maybe that's a poor assumption. I find nothing anywhere proclaiming he [I]is[/I] Jewish; though he may be. Still doesn't make Self-Hating Jews not a thing, and that as a Jew I have the right to find this abhorrent even if it [I]does[/I] turn out that he's Jewish.
I think if he just cut the jewish out of the stealth game it would get made since a game about someone being a thief due to kleptomania is new to me also the inventory sounds cool
[QUOTE=Zuimzado;45981644]I'm gonna go ahead and guess you're a white american too, which explains the long speeches about being offended and overreacting to stuff. If you're a conservative too, then it's a bingo! Get out your cards, everyone![/QUOTE] Assumptions don't constitute an argument, when you have something that isn't ad-hominem and strawmanning I'll pay attention to you lmao.
[QUOTE=Lebowski;45981660]Assumptions don't constitute an argument, when you have something that isn't ad-hominem and strawmanning I'll pay attention to you lmao.[/QUOTE] That's the sound of the joke going over your head. Thought you'd know what it sounded by now, considering your track record.
[QUOTE=Zuimzado;45981664]That's the sound of the joke going over your head. Thought you'd know what it sounded by now, considering your track record.[/QUOTE] That's the sound of allowing people to contribute to anti-semitism going over your head. Thanks for allowing the continuation of the rot of our people. :~)
[QUOTE=Lebowski;45981653]Ok, maybe that's a poor assumption. I find nothing anywhere proclaiming he [I]is[/I] Jewish; though he may be. Still doesn't make Self-Hating Jews not a thing, and that as a Jew I have the right to find this abhorrent even if it [I]does[/I] turn out that he's Jewish.[/QUOTE] Laughing at a stereotype by using it jokingly makes him a Jew hater according to you?
[QUOTE=Svinnik;45981681]Laughing at a stereotype by using it jokingly makes him a Jew hater according to you?[/QUOTE] If he's not a jew, he shouldn't be laughing in the first place. If he's a jew, he's talking about a game idea that a bunch of goyim are going to play and go "haha greedy jews" EVEN if the character is a kleptomaniac; so he's contributing to the hate of our people. so in all practicality, yes.
[QUOTE=Lebowski;45981676]That's the sound of allowing people to contribute to anti-semitism going over your head. Thanks for allowing the continuation of the rot of our people. :~)[/QUOTE] Jesus, you sound like some of the rabbis at the synagogues I used to visit. The ones that would compare arabs to animals and go on long-winded speeches about why some gay guy they never met shouldn't marry. And in a way, that makes you even more hilarious than the guy who made this joke in the first place. So keep up the great work.
[QUOTE=Lebowski;45981693]If he's not a jew, he shouldn't be laughing in the first place. If he's a jew, he's talking about a game idea that a bunch of goyim are going to play and go "haha greedy jews" EVEN if the character is a kleptomaniac; so he's contributing to the hate of our people. so in all practicality, yes.[/QUOTE] Or maybe he could use this game to do what I said earlier, which is "It could explore the life of Hasidim and how this character struggles to control his kleptomania, knowing that he is supporting a stereotype and feeling ashamed that he is breaking the commandment not to steal." That would be respectful and not offensive.
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