[QUOTE=Warhol;23019412][editline]02:22AM[/editline]
i'd fucking support the DPRK in the second korean war.[/QUOTE]
You'd support a totalitarian regime that has created a literal nation-wide cult around a single man so huge that so much as not having a picture of him in his home is punishable by life in a work camp? One where something as common as electricity is almost unheard of outside the capitol? One that tortures, imprisons, kills, and enslaves it's citizens for things that would be considered minor infractions and land nothing more than community service or a fine in developed nations?
And yet you're calling people savages for implying that they would defend themselves, with deadly force if need be, in an event that would call upon no other realistic solution?
So basically, you're a hypocrite who only cares about human life if the situation is within certain pretexts that would allow you to stroke your ego and flaunt around your unwarranted sense of self importance while simultaneously striking down any attempts at someone presenting a different point of view, responding only to arguments that you can muster some feeble attempt at a witty reply to while avoiding anything that you can't, because you know deep in the back of your head that they may just be [I]right[/I]?
[QUOTE=mastermaul;23024940]You'd support a totalitarian regime that has created a literal nation-wide cult around a single man so huge that so much as not having a picture of him in his home is punishable by life in a work camp? One where something as common as electricity is almost unheard of outside the capitol? One that tortures, imprisons, kills, and enslaves it's citizens for things that would be considered minor infractions and land nothing more than community service or a fine in developed nations?
And yet you're calling people savages for implying that they would defend themselves, with deadly force if need be, in an event that would call upon no other realistic solution?
So basically, you're a hypocrite who only cares about human life if the situation is within certain pretexts that would allow you to stroke your ego and flaunt around your unwarranted sense of self importance while simultaneously striking down any attempts at someone presenting a different point of view, responding only to arguments that you can muster some feeble attempt at a witty reply to while avoiding anything that you can't, because you know deep in the back of your head that they may just be [I]right[/I]?[/QUOTE]
Annnnndddd Warhol just got destroyed.
Self defence laws are complicated, he should have assessed how threatening the burglar was and whether he was carrying any weapons first.
[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;23013968]Good job. This is why guns are good.
:golfclap:[/QUOTE]
Too bad this incident will go unknown to the general public, yet somehow every year I see nothing but "Guns and kids are evil"
TV isn't worth dieing for.
Even if I did have I gun I'd be much more inclined just to run and claim back everything on insurance.
[QUOTE=RoBaDoB;23025390]Self defence laws are complicated, he should have assessed how threatening the burglar was and whether he was carrying any weapons first.[/QUOTE]
Because a panicking 15 year old has combat assessment experience.
[editline]04:08AM[/editline]
[QUOTE=A.C.I.D;23025525]TV isn't worth dieing for.
Even if I did have I gun I'd be much more inclined just to run and claim back everything on insurance.[/QUOTE]
Insurance doesn't pay for everything. More so, they were attacked by at least two men, at the front and back of the house. They had no way to run out of the house, and hiding inside the house would have been very bad, because if they were found, they could potentially become hostages or be killed. Also, since there was a firearm in the house, a criminal could simply take that and use that for any reason.
[QUOTE=Swilly;23023869]Are trying to kill the fucker?! And my next point would be...this kid is 15...I don't think he would know the vital organs or arteries...If I was in his shoes I would shoot the bastard in the shoulder or leg several times so the cops can detain the bastard. NOT kill him![/QUOTE]
By legal standards, shooting anyone... or even shooting AT them, for that matter, is shooting to kill. Do yourself a favor, and empty half your mag into their chest.
A wounded animal is only more dangerous.
It was more of a general principle.
Self defence to me should always be a last resort- assuming you and your family may be able to escape its better to do that rather than taking the risk of confronting the robbers. Theres nothing in my house thats worth putting me and my relatives lives at risk over.
Pff, guns are smalltime, in England we men fight intruders off with blunt instruments, kitchen blades or our bare hands.
I wish i had a gun.
[QUOTE=A.C.I.D;23025746]It was more of a general principle.
Self defence to me should always be a last resort- assuming you and your family may be able to escape its better to do that rather than taking the risk of confronting the robbers. Theres nothing in my house thats worth putting me and my relatives lives at risk over.[/QUOTE]
That's an incredibly naive view. Don't confront them unprepared. If you have a firearm and ammo. Ready it and be prepared to fire. If you don't kill them, let the justice system try to handle them. If you do kill them, you removed a person who clearly has little regard for the law and are ultimately making the world a tiny bit safer.
[QUOTE=radioactive;23014159]A grumbling Korean War Veteran that coughs and grumbles to Koreans and then dies unarmed and sings badly over the credits?[/QUOTE]
Godamnit i havn't seen that movie yet
What?
I'm advocating not confronting them at all. Once more how is saying that you should run away from a possibly armed and violent robber naive?
[QUOTE=Lambadvanced;23013815]When we lived in New Jersey, a cop told my grandpa "You have every right to shoot a man breaking into your home, but you make damn sure you drag him back into your house when he tries to get away."[/QUOTE]
A cop in Jackson told me "If you ever shoot someone at your door, be as sure as you can that he lands inside your house."
[editline]09:41AM[/editline]
[QUOTE=RoBaDoB;23025390]Self defence laws are complicated, he should have assessed how threatening the burglar was and whether he was carrying any weapons first.[/QUOTE]
In the American legal system: if the guy is bigger than you, you can legally shoot to kill under any circumstances so long as you feel your life is in danger.
[QUOTE=mastermaul;23024940]You'd support a totalitarian regime that has created a literal nation-wide cult around a single man so huge that so much as not having a picture of him in his home is punishable by life in a work camp? One where something as common as electricity is almost unheard of outside the capitol? One that tortures, imprisons, kills, and enslaves it's citizens for things that would be considered minor infractions and land nothing more than community service or a fine in developed nations?
And yet you're calling people savages for implying that they would defend themselves, with deadly force if need be, in an event that would call upon no other realistic solution?
So basically, you're a hypocrite who only cares about human life if the situation is within certain pretexts that would allow you to stroke your ego and flaunt around your unwarranted sense of self importance while simultaneously striking down any attempts at someone presenting a different point of view, responding only to arguments that you can muster some feeble attempt at a witty reply to while avoiding anything that you can't, because you know deep in the back of your head that they may just be [I]right[/I]?[/QUOTE]
you missed the part where i said "just to spite you"
way
2
go
bro
[editline]11:00AM[/editline]
[QUOTE=massn7;23025314]Annnnndddd Warhol just got destroyed.[/QUOTE]
not really, i was being a dick to whoever that grandfather molton slug what the fuck ever guy was
[editline]11:00AM[/editline]
learn to fucking read, people.
fuck
[editline]11:01AM[/editline]
[QUOTE=Zeddy;23025671]Because a panicking 15 year old has combat assessment experience.
[editline]04:08AM[/editline]
Insurance doesn't pay for everything. More so, they were attacked by at least two men, at the front and back of the house. They had no way to run out of the house, and hiding inside the house would have been very bad, because if they were found, they could potentially become hostages or be killed. Also, since there was a firearm in the house, a criminal could simply take that and use that for any reason.[/QUOTE]
i'm stealing your shit, zeddy, not looking for another fucking waco incident
[editline]11:07AM[/editline]
and mastermaul, i see a plot hole in your argument. How could i openly support the DPRK WHILE presenting my moral code? HM
ever think of that?
[QUOTE=Mingebox;23014855]innerfire34: "Hey you, cut that out!"
Burglar kicking down front door: "Oh, okay."[/QUOTE]
Ohgod, I laughed so hard after reading this post, thank you
[QUOTE=Warhol;23026373]you missed the part where i said "just to spite you"
way
2
go
bro[/quote]
[quote]while simultaneously striking down any attempts at someone presenting a different point of view, responding only to arguments that you can muster some feeble attempt at a witty reply to while avoiding anything that you can't, because you know deep in the back of your head that they may just be [I]right[/I]?[/quote]
[quote=Warhol]and mastermaul, i see a plot hole in your argument. How could i openly support the DPRK WHILE presenting my moral code? HM
ever think of that?[/QUOTE]
[quote]you're a hypocrite who only cares about human life if the situation is within certain pretexts that would allow you to stroke your ego and flaunt around your unwarranted sense of self importance[/quote]
[QUOTE=Zeddy;23025671]Because a panicking 15 year old has combat assessment experience.
[editline]04:08AM[/editline]
Insurance doesn't pay for everything. More so, they were attacked by at least two men, at the front and back of the house. They had no way to run out of the house, and hiding inside the house would have been very bad, because if they were found, they could potentially become hostages or be killed. Also, since there was a firearm in the house, a criminal could simply take that and use that for any reason.[/QUOTE]
They're burglars for god sake not professional hostage takers, if the kids ran off the burglars would've took the shit they could sell then go on their merry little thieving ways not go "oh let's rummage through the house so we can take hostages!"
[QUOTE=Montroze;23025391]Too bad this incident will go unknown to the general public, yet somehow every year I see nothing but "Guns and kids are evil"[/QUOTE]
Sure you have this, then you have the story lower down the page of two police officers being shot to death.
And while you brag about guns defending yourselves from the government, you have the story that your president gets the power to turn off the internet.
and though you'd like to believe guns protect people more than they kill innocents, you have 20 times the homicides we have, at only five times the population.
Warhol mentioned living in Dublin, I live in the UK. Naturally there is a different perspective when you are from the UK or Southern Ireland since we don't have guns in our homes and there is no written in stone legal defence of "self defence". Although the amount of threat a person feels they are under in such a situation may be accepted as mitigation, it's by no means automatically a get out of jail free card. On this side of the Atlantic people are raised to think that homeowners shouldn't attack intruders, instead the homeowner should hide or run away and call 999 as soon as possible.
[QUOTE=verynicelady;23028210]Warhol mentioned living in Dublin, I live in the UK. Naturally there is a different perspective when you are from the UK or Southern Ireland since we don't have guns in our homes and there is no written in stone legal defence of "self defence". Although the amount of threat a person feels they are under in such a situation may be accepted as mitigation, it's by no means automatically a get out of jail free card. On this side of the Atlantic people are raised to think that homeowners shouldn't attack intruders, instead the homeowner should hide or run away and call 999 as soon as possible.[/QUOTE]
You're entitled to self defence and defence of property within reason.
If you pick up a knife and stab them, you have to prove that you were so terrified and in such a panicked state of mind that you grabbed the nearest object and tried to defend yourself.
Typically, juries refuse to convict people who have harmed burglars in self defence.
[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;23028167]Sure you have this, then you have the story lower down the page of two police officers being shot to death.
And while you brag about guns defending yourselves from the government, you have the story that your president gets the power to turn off the internet.
and though you'd like to believe guns protect people more than they kill innocents, you have 20 times the homicides we have, at only five times the population.[/QUOTE]
UK has more general crime than the US, the US just has more guncrime because there's more in circulation.
Of course you never hear about guns protecting people because it either doesn't get reported or it's not newsworthy.
Okay yes because bad people use guns means guns = bad this makes no sense at all.
Badass kid.
I remember when my grandpa shoot me with a BB gun while I tried to get in through the basement at night. :v:
Here in the UK if a burglar breaks into your house you are not allowed to make any physical contact with him or harm him in any way otherwise you will be in a lot more trouble than the burglar is.
Fucking bullshit man.
[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;23028167]Sure you have this, then you have the story lower down the page of two police officers being shot to death.
And while you brag about guns defending yourselves from the government, you have the story that your president gets the power to turn off the internet.
and though you'd like to believe guns protect people more than they kill innocents, you have 20 times the homicides we have, at only five times the population.[/QUOTE]
The idea behind turning off the internet is for situations where martial law is in order.
Or in the event of a massive cyber attack to prevent the spread of infection and prevent the entire nation's computers from being destroyed.
It is actually a valid idea.
If he abuses the power then we have him brought up on charges and preferably hanged (Yes "hanged" is the proper word) for treason. Failing that we assassinate him. Failing that we simply riot uncontrollably. It's not like we are without recourse here.
You know all those guns? It makes us unbelievably dangerous when we riot. If we start to riot then the problems have to be addressed immediately or all hell will break loose.
[QUOTE=SgtCr4zyAlt;23028776]UK has more general crime than the US, the US just has more guncrime because there's more in circulation.
Of course you never hear about guns protecting people because it either doesn't get reported or it's not newsworthy.
Okay yes because bad people use guns means guns = bad this makes no sense at all.[/QUOTE]
General crime is far from being as bad as homicides.
What do you mean you never hear of guns protecting people, you're in a news story about that.
everyone seems to think that guns are brilliant and fantastic. They're weapons, designed to take lives. Calling them bad is attributing a human trait to an object, but they're not good either.
[editline]03:55PM[/editline]
[QUOTE=GunFox;23029569]The idea behind turning off the internet is for situations where martial law is in order.
Or in the event of a massive cyber attack to prevent the spread of infection and prevent the entire nation's computers from being destroyed.
It is actually a valid idea.
If he abuses the power then we have him brought up on charges and preferably hanged (Yes "hanged" is the proper word) for treason. Failing that we assassinate him. Failing that we simply riot uncontrollably. It's not like we are without recourse here.
You know all those guns? It makes us unbelievably dangerous when we riot. If we start to riot then the problems have to be addressed immediately or all hell will break loose.[/QUOTE]
Fantastic. You riot, you've got guns, meaning civilians die, and the police response will be even greater and more indiscriminate.
The great irony here is that you claim your guns protect you from the government, and yet the government has to protect them for you. And how many do you think will be willing to take up arms.
I'm making the assumption here that the government is evil, which is inaccurate, however if the US government needed to form some sort of totalitarian government, paper and words aren't going to stop it.
[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;23029919]General crime is far from being as bad as homicides.
What do you mean you never hear of guns protecting people, you're in a news story about that.
everyone seems to think that guns are brilliant and fantastic. They're weapons, designed to take lives. Calling them bad is attributing a human trait to an object, but they're not good either.[/QUOTE]
Just because things are designed a certain way doesn't mean you have to use them that way,
Guns are cool like any other hobby, skeet shooting is fun.
[editline]10:57AM[/editline]
If we riot with guns it's probably going to be for a damn good reason.
There's about 80 million gun owners in America, lets say 1% take up arms. That's 800,000 people.
Riot police can barely hold off riots /without/ an armed populace.
[QUOTE=SgtCr4zyAlt;23029958]Just because things are designed a certain way doesn't mean you have to use them that way,
Guns are cool like any other hobby, skeet shooting is fun.
[editline]10:57AM[/editline]
If we riot with guns it's probably going to be for a damn good reason.
There's about 80 million gun owners in America, lets say 1% take up arms. That's 800,000 people.[/QUOTE]
I understand, but calling them tools and other euphamisms is missing the point. Their primary use is a weapon.
What I don't understand is that you have this distrust of the government, you don't trust them with your guns, you don't trust them with your information, yet you trust them to fight your wars, keep order and the system running.
And riot police can hold off riots. I mean the detroit protests you had, despite being entirely legitimate, you were basically battered down, gassed and forced off by legions of shield wielding black clothed riot police.
Was it detroit? I can't remember what it was for either.
No it was Pittsburgh
[QUOTE=joshdasmif;23029361]Here in the UK if a burglar breaks into your house you are not allowed to make any physical contact with him or harm him in any way otherwise you will be in a lot more trouble than the burglar is.
Fucking bullshit man.[/QUOTE]
You sound like the daily mail. Yes its true that home owners that defend their property technically commit assault to do it, you also commit common assault every time you brush past someone in the street.
Just cause you commit a crime doesn't mean that the CPS is going to be dumb enough to bring a prosecution against you. They'll only consider doing so if there is some question as to whether the force used was reasonable, and even then the evidence would have to be very stacked against the homeowner for any jury to convict.
Hmm, if all I got is the baseball bat, or my brothers guitar.
Would depend what mood I'd be in with my brother to use which one.
[QUOTE=Swilly;23023869]Are trying to kill the fucker?! And my next point would be...this kid is 15...I don't think he would know the vital organs or arteries...If I was in his shoes I would shoot the bastard in the shoulder or leg several times so the cops can detain the bastard. NOT kill him![/QUOTE]
Dude, the guy he shot is alive, why do you make it sound like he killed him
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