• Will.I.Am and Chris Brown Rip-Off EDM Track, Racism & Hateful Comments Inbound
    163 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Hobo4President;40310318]You're right, a lot of artists and labels steal from others. Calvin Harris blatantly ripped-off another song a few years ago and got no flack for it, as did Guetta ripping-off Michael Calfan but that does not excuse this. You can't just put a blanket over popular EDM and say it's all stolen, please explain to me how the original mix of 'Rebound' is a copy of another song.[/QUOTE] all music is stolen in varying degrees, but the idea that william is guilty of some crime by copying parts of an EDM song is ridiculous because thats an everyday thing in that genre and style. it's all operating on the same ground and no-one cares because that's just part of what makes that music style a music style. its really not remarkable at all, just because william is a big star label douche doesnt make him any different from the thousands of other mainsteam EDM people who rip each other off, but because he's not officially part of the little club he's apparently subject to anger. i mean how different is it honestly from what Daft Punk does? I'm a big BIG fan of music made with samples from hip-hop to house music, but let's not play "EDM Fan Club" on the internet please
Will.i.am is a good producer. He knows how to make a proper beat. But lately he's started burning out and he's producing utter shit these days. Sad to see a guy that Michael Jackson, himself a perfectionist, collaborated with stoop so low and start blatantly ripping off others.
[QUOTE=thisispain;40310419]all music is stolen in varying degrees, but [B]the idea that william is guilty of some crime by copying parts of an EDM song is ridiculous because thats an everyday thing in that genre and style.[/B] it's all operating on the same ground and no-one cares because that's just part of what makes that music style a music style. its really not remarkable at all, just because william is a big star label douche doesnt make him any different from the thousands of other mainsteam EDM people who rip each other off, but because he's not officially part of the little club he's apparently subject to anger. i mean how different is it honestly from what Daft Punk does. I'm a big BIG fan of music made with samples from hip-hop to house music, but let's not play "EDM Fan Club" on the internet please[/QUOTE] Umm.. what?? Seriously? There was a huge amount of shit flung over the Coldplay and Joe Satriani bit, and even THAT wasn't as bad as this. The worst ripoff I've heard in the trance scene at all was someone taking a lead and arpeggio style, but using it to a different chord progression. Even then, fans were in an uproar. This is a whole different level, he completely took the track and just drag & dropped it. You obviously are completely disconnected with the modern EDM scene if you think this is the case.
[QUOTE=Silent-Bob;40310458]The worst ripoff I've heard in the trance scene at all was someone taking a lead and arpeggio style, but using it to a different chord progression.[/QUOTE] oh dont tell me they already wore out adagio for strings [QUOTE=Silent-Bob;40310458]You obviously are completely disconnected with the modern EDM scene if you think this is the case.[/QUOTE] i could make the same accusation but im not interested
[QUOTE=thisispain;40310419]all music is stolen in varying degrees, but the idea that william is guilty of some crime by copying parts of an EDM song is ridiculous because thats an everyday thing in that genre and style. it's all operating on the same ground and no-one cares because that's just part of what makes that music style a music style. its really not remarkable at all, just because william is a big star label douche doesnt make him any different from the thousands of other mainsteam EDM people who rip each other off, but because he's not officially part of the little club he's apparently subject to anger. i mean how different is it honestly from what Daft Punk does? I'm a big BIG fan of music made with samples from hip-hop to house music, but let's not play "EDM Fan Club" on the internet please[/QUOTE] It isn't that different to what Daft Punk does sometimes, I was going to bring them up and say how they are sometimes in the wrong for not seeking permission. Are you really claiming that because thievery has happened in EDM in the past it is all just okay and we should live with it? Like, what the fuck. Even if an artist uses something from another song it tends to be a tiny sample of an instrument or a drum, not a significant portion copy and pasted.
[QUOTE=thisispain;40310477]oh dont tell me they already wore out adagio for strings i could make the same accusation but im not interested[/QUOTE] Without flaming you (because you make it very tempting), here's what I meant. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5a3lyyB4vJE[/media] 3:20 [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D7qd2S5v2mY[/media] 3:58 Once again, you're completely disconnected from the scene for even bringing up Adagio for Strings. That hasn't been around the scene since the early Teisto days. Now please stop pretending you know what you're talking about because you're just making yourself look like a dumbass.
Doesn't surprise me one bit. Also that ramsterdam song is one of my favorite songs.
[QUOTE=Hobo4President;40310493]It isn't that different to what Daft Punk does sometimes, I was going to bring them up and say how they are sometimes in the wrong for not seeking permission.[/QUOTE] if house artists had to seek permission the genre would not exist because it would have been utterly impossible for early house artists to secure the funding to get permission. same principle applies to hip-hop. [QUOTE=Hobo4President;40310493]Are you really claiming that because thievery has happened in EDM in the past it is all just okay and we should live with it? Like, what the fuck. Even if an artist uses something from another song it tends to be a tiny sample of an instrument or a drum, not a significant portion copy and pasted.[/QUOTE] no im saying that its hypocritical for fans of dance music to damn people for thievery when music and "EDM" in general has pretty much been built upon it. you dont have to be OK with it im not gonna tell you what to do, but i think its pretty amusing and in very poor taste.
[QUOTE=thisispain;40310533]if house artists had to seek permission the genre would not exist because it would have been utterly impossible for early house artists to secure the funding to get permission. same principle applies to hip-hop.[/QUOTE] That's cool. Now how does that apply to today?
[QUOTE=Silent-Bob;40310504]Without flaming you (because you make it very tempting)[/QUOTE] pfff whatever dude [editline]16th April 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Hobo4President;40310540]That's cool. Now how does that apply to today?[/QUOTE] that applies to today because its a liberating experience for artists to be able to use songs or sections of songs to create a mix or piece without worrying about being sued to oblivion.
[QUOTE=thisispain;40310533]if house artists had to seek permission the genre would not exist because it would have been utterly impossible for early house artists to secure the funding to get permission. same principle applies to hip-hop. no im saying that its hypocritical for fans of dance music to damn people for thievery when music and "EDM" in general has pretty much been built upon it. you dont have to be OK with it im not gonna tell you what to do, but i think its pretty amusing and in very poor taste.[/QUOTE] Once again... what?? You're comparing something like taking a single vocal or instrumental loop, like early vinyl sampling practices, to stealing a complete composition.. sounds, progression and all.
[QUOTE=Silent-Bob;40310583]Once again... what?? You're comparing something like taking a single vocal or instrumental loop, like early vinyl sampling practices, to stealing a complete composition.. sounds, progression and all.[/QUOTE] "early vinyl sampling practices" werent just taking a single vocal or "instrumental loop" because those werent even things back then. early sampling was taking entire sections of songs and adding on stuff to it, or sometimes even just reformatting the song for a more dance-able mix there are some great house tracks based on that, and Daft Punk was following in that tradition when they did Discovery.
[QUOTE=thisispain;40310564] that applies to today because its a liberating experience for artists to be able to use songs or sections of songs to create a mix or piece without worrying about being sued to oblivion.[/QUOTE] I'm fine with this when they: A) Seek permission B) Give credit C) Seek more permission if they want to sell it Otherwise they are just stealing another persons work and claiming it as their own. The roots of house have no bearing in todays scene and rightly so. If you weren't ignorant about current EDM you would know there is a pretty big uproar by a large amount of fans online when blatant ripping off occurs.
[QUOTE=Hobo4President;40310624]The roots of house have no bearing in todays scene and rightly so.[/QUOTE] woah chicago-style house music is like experiencing a huge revival what are you talking about; supposedly its all thats being played in new york atm [QUOTE=Hobo4President;40310624]If you weren't ignorant about current EDM you would know there is a pretty big uproar by a large amount of fans online when blatant ripping off occurs.[/QUOTE] you dont have to call me ignorant when we disagree on something you know. i quite like you and your music so its kind of disheartening when you act mean for no reason :)
[QUOTE=thisispain;40310654]you dont have to call me ignorant when we disagree on something you know. i quite like you and your music so its kind of disheartening when you act mean for no reason :)[/QUOTE] Producers get in a tizzy when you pick at us the wrong way, and I guess you just pushed the wrong buttons. The thing about EDM in general is that fans are very loyal to artists. Shit always hits the fan when things like this happen.
[QUOTE=thisispain;40310654]woah chicago-style house music is like experiencing a huge revival what are you talking about; supposedly its all thats being played in new york atm [/QUOTE] Then be specific and say the old-school chicago house is what often uses large samples of songs, don't blanket it with the current house scene. [QUOTE=thisispain;40310654] you dont have to call me ignorant when we disagree on something you know. i quite like you and your music so its kind of disheartening when you act mean for no reason :) [/QUOTE] It's cool that you like my music but again, don't say all EDM has a staple of sampling when the spectrum has expanded and evolved so much over the years that there are genres that are not known for using samples.
[QUOTE=Hobo4President;40310704]It's cool that you like my music but again, don't say all EDM has a staple of sampling when the spectrum has expanded and evolved so much over the years that [B]there are genres that are not known for using samples[/B].[/QUOTE] EDM has largely evolved into just this. So much of it is instrumental, and I know so many producers who painstakingly create tracks from the ground up, from sound design to composition and a complete mix/master. Brushing that off as cheap ripoff sampling and putting it in the same category as Steal.I.Am's music is a huge insult.
[QUOTE=Silent-Bob;40310680]Producers get in a tizzy when you pick at us the wrong way[/QUOTE] calling me ignorant is cool and all except ive been producing electronic dance music since i was like 14 and im like in my 20s now so you can get in a tizzy and all but acting like an ass on the internet and saying how much youd like to flame me doesnt really get mitigated when you call yourself a producer especially because anyone can download software and be a producer now. [QUOTE=Silent-Bob;40310680]and I guess you just pushed the wrong buttons. The thing about EDM in general is that fans are very loyal to artists. Shit always hits the fan when things like this happen.[/QUOTE] yeah i know [quote]its really not remarkable at all, just because william is a big star label douche doesnt make him any different from the thousands of other mainsteam EDM people who rip each other off, but because he's not officially part of the little club he's apparently subject to anger. [/quote] i know and i find it incredibly distasteful [editline]16th April 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Hobo4President;40310704]Then be specific and say the old-school chicago house is what often uses large samples of songs, don't blanket it with the current house scene.[/QUOTE] i didnt blanket anything, i said the roots and livelihood of EDM are based on upon sampling big amounts of songs and its ridiculous to damn an artist (even a douchey big label artist) for doing it. [QUOTE=Hobo4President;40310704]It's cool that you like my music but again, don't say all EDM has a staple of sampling when the spectrum has expanded and evolved so much over the years that there are genres that are not known for using samples.[/QUOTE] you should automatically assume that i know about acid techno and electro but just because the spectrum has expanded doesn't mean that its not an important part of dance music and its culture.
[QUOTE=thisispain;40310740]calling me ignorant is cool and all except ive been producing electronic dance music since i was like 14 and im like in my 20s now so you can get in a tizzy and all but acting like an ass on the internet and saying how much youd like to flame me doesnt really get mitigated when you call yourself a producer especially because anyone can download software and be a producer now. [/quote] Anyone can buy a canvas and be a painter. Doesn't mean they're Van Gogh. [quote] i know and i find it incredibly distasteful[/QUOTE] Except it is remarkable because of the degree in which it happened. He didn't even try to hide it. This is largely unprecedented mainly because he never contacted anybody or asked for permission, let alone had license/copyright to any of the material. [editline]17th April 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=thisispain;40310740] but just because the spectrum has expanded doesn't mean that its not an important part of dance music and its culture.[/QUOTE] So stealing an entire composition without permission or copyright and claiming it as your own is integral to dance music and its culture?
[QUOTE=Silent-Bob;40310781]Anyone can buy a canvas and be a painter. Doesn't mean they're Van Gogh. [/QUOTE] i dont understand are you comparing yourself to van gogh or are you saying something else you said youre a producer and im saying thats not a good excuse to be an ass on the internet about dance music because anyone can be a producer van gogh aside [QUOTE=Silent-Bob;40310781]Except it is remarkable because of the degree in which it happened. He didn't even try to hide it. This is largely unprecedented mainly because he never contacted anybody or asked for permission, let alone had license/copyright to any of the material.[/QUOTE] no-one asked liquid liquid's permission either. im really sorry but im supporting the right of samplers over any notion of copyright. if that bothers you because you are a producer it shouldnt because sampling culture made some incredible seminal house music possible. once again Daft Punk is the most famous example i can think of; its a part of the EDM culture and i dont think anyone has the right to take the "EDM" banner and declare what should be ok to be sampled and what shouldnt william is a douche who employs misogynist assholes lets hate him for that [editline]16th April 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Silent-Bob;40310781] So stealing an entire composition without permission or copyright and claiming it as your own is integral to dance music and its culture?[/QUOTE] well i wouldnt word it that way
[QUOTE=thisispain;40310815] well i wouldnt word it that way[/QUOTE] Except that's exactly what you're saying. It bothers me as a producer because I have my own music in the scene, I play my own shows.. I don't want some huge label asshole to take the music I created without permission. You keep using Daft Punk as an example but what they do is leagues different from what Will.I.Am is doing. They take bits and add their own artistry and style to it, and they also evolved into creating their own complete and original compositions. Will.I.Am took an MP3 and put Chris Brown's autotuned vocals in it.
[QUOTE=Silent-Bob;40310856]Except that's exactly what you're saying. It bothers me as a producer because I have my own music in the scene, I play my own shows.. I don't want some huge label asshole to take the music I created without permission.[/QUOTE] i can sympathise with u i play my own shows too and i sold some dopes cassettes of acid house when i was a kiddy wink, but either we say that style of sampling is off or we dont make double standards based on whether someone is a huge label asshole or not (one thing to learn from punk; label politics will destroy your scene) and if we say that style of sampling is off then i really cant abide by that because so much of my favourite music is based around that kind of sampling and its been a very important part of dance musics history [QUOTE=Silent-Bob;40310856]You keep using Daft Punk as an example but what they do is leagues different from what Will.I.Am is doing. They take bits and add their own artistry and style to it. Will.I.Am took an MP3 and put Chris Brown's autotuned vocals in it.[/QUOTE] well maybe its perspective but you cant listen to release the beast and then robot rock and tell me there were huge changes the one place that daft punk and william would differ is that robot rock is actually awesome and this track (and its supposed source; sorry) blows really hard
[QUOTE=thisispain;40310897] well maybe its perspective but you cant listen to release the beast and then robot rock and tell me there were huge changes the one place that daft punk and william would differ is that robot rock is actually awesome and this track (and its supposed source; sorry) blows really hard[/QUOTE] The point is Daft Punk had permission, Will.I.Am did not.
fuck music, it sucks
[QUOTE=Silent-Bob;40310954]The point is Daft Punk had permission, Will.I.Am did not.[/QUOTE] well thats because william is a big label douche but thats quite besides the point that im trying to make at least. if house artists had to seek permission a lot of it wouldnt exist; william should do it because he obvsly could afford to, but i dont think people who involve themselves with this supposed community have the right to start telling ANYONE that sampling done in this way is wrong or hurl insults at them because i find it distasteful thats my simple stance if you dont agree with that then we just have disagreements on what is distasteful and what isnt it [editline]16th April 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Hamsterjuice;40310966]fuck music, it sucks[/QUOTE] music fucking sucks ass i agree
[QUOTE=thisispain;40310996]well thats because william is a big label douche but thats quite besides the point that im trying to make at least. if house artists had to seek permission a lot of it wouldnt exist; william should do it because he obvsly could afford to, but i dont think people who involve themselves with this supposed community have the right to start telling ANYONE that sampling done in this way is wrong or hurl insults at them because i find it distasteful thats my simple stance if you dont agree with that then we just have disagreements on what is distasteful and what isnt it[/QUOTE] I feel like I can reserve the right to tell anyone that because my entire music career to this point has been successful without using any kind of sampling. If you're going to make any kind of release, especially with music taken in the amount that Will.I.Am used, then you better have permission.
[QUOTE=Silent-Bob;40311009] If you're going to make any kind of release, especially with music taken in the amount that Will.I.Am used, then you better have permission.[/QUOTE] then again id refer to dis: i really cant abide by that because so much of my favourite music is based around that kind of unauthorised sampling and its been a very important part of dance musics history i see your side of the debate but i cant agree with u based on that reasoning :)
What bugs me is will.i.am is completely capable of making awesome music and he just didn't. He got lazy. That's stupid. Despite all this, I think he does have some humility and nervousness in real life which is why he struggles to speak. I saw his interview on Top Gear and I wasn't expecting him to be like that. [editline]16th April 2013[/editline] Sampling in my mind is completely okay depending on how you use it. Legally, that's not how it works but artistically, that's how I roll.
[QUOTE=thisispain;40311025]then again id refer to dis: i really cant abide by that because so much of my favourite music is based around that kind of unauthorised sampling and its been a very important part of dance musics history i see your side of the debate but i cant agree with u based on that reasoning :)[/QUOTE] Fair enough
[QUOTE=Silent-Bob;40309884]Still, nobody deserves to have their music completely stolen with no permission or licensing whatsoever.[/QUOTE] How do you know this is the case? Its entirely possible its all legit. This could be just like when Kayne West sampled daft punk and for about a day people thought he had horribly stolen from them. Although Will.I.Am does [url=http://www.eatskeet.com/2007/09/william-tries-to-sample-daft-punk-fails-miserably/]have prior form with [/url] this though so I guess its possible. But yeah its entirely possible its just sampling. [editline]17th April 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Silent-Bob;40310954]The point is Daft Punk had permission, Will.I.Am did not.[/QUOTE] Do you have proof that permission has not be sought in this case? This could very well be a case of people acting like twats without getting all the facts. A thing a majority of the Internet seems to be good at doing.
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