European goal to eliminate measles by 2015 will likely fail; you can guess why. - Polidicks

Obviously the anti-vaxxers are idiots and put alot of people in danger. But there is something incredible creepy about a law forcing your children to be injected with medicine and if you deny it, they take your children away. That could never be abused by authorian/totalitarian asshole which have a tendency to find their way into politics.

the Anti-vaccination mentality is more harmful than vaccinations themselves Even if it TRULY caused autism, I'd rather have an autistic child than a child sick of something I knew I could have prevented. but you know what? it doesn't, so fuck off. [editline]3rd September 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=mrpirate;45879187]Obviously the anti-vaxxers are idiots and put alot of people in danger. But there is something incredible creepy about a law forcing your children to be injected with medicine and if you deny it, they take your children away. That could never be abused by authorian/totalitarian asshole which have a tendency to find their way into politics.[/QUOTE] but if they don't get it, the child will likely die if you seriously can't handle preventing your kid from dying of some horrible easily preventable disease, you probably can't handle the kid

anti vaccers with children are really gross people

[QUOTE=lazyguy;45878043]1) I'm not against it 2) Again, a cursory glance at the statistics will tell you that getting into a car is much more likely to both kill you and make you a killer than not being vaccinated, no matter how well you can drive. 3) It's not your place to tell me whether or not to have kids[/QUOTE] Getting wrapped up in comparing the magnitude of deaths caused by disease and deaths caused by driving is a fucking worthless waste of time and utterly irrelevant to the discussion at hand. Comparing driving to vaccination is fucking STUPID. Not vaccinating a child is not like taking a child on car ride - it's like not putting a seat belt on a child during a car ride. Diseases don't fucking disappear because you decided not to take precautionary measures against them, the risk doesn't go away. Refusing to vaccinate a kid is like letting a 3 year old child crawl around in the co-pilot seat without a seat belt on while driving down the highway. It's fucking dumb, it creates unnecessary danger and is complete, willful, negligence for the health and safety of the child. There is no possible defense which would justify not vaccinating a child, and therefore there is no defense which would justify society accepting parents who are willing to expose their children to the dangers of foregoing vaccinations. Your argument that taking children on drives is more dangerous or negligent than not-vaccinating them is disgusting and only serves to guide the discussion in a non-productive direction. Get the fuck out and never have kids.

[QUOTE=mrpirate;45879187]Obviously the anti-vaxxers are idiots and put alot of people in danger. But there is something incredible creepy about a law forcing your children to be injected with medicine and if you deny it, they take your children away. That could never be abused by authorian/totalitarian asshole which have a tendency to find their way into politics.[/QUOTE] How is it creepy? Diseases aren't a fucking joke and we've done a pretty good job at fighting a lot of the major ones thanks to vaccinations and improving public health but vaccinations only work when everyone gets them. Not getting your kids vaccinated is nothing but endangerment not only to your kids lives but the lives of those around them, you're not just fucking with your kids life, but everyone elses kids. That's why it's a major deal.

[QUOTE=lazyguy;45878043]1) I'm not against it 2) Again, a cursory glance at the statistics will tell you that getting into a car is much more likely to both kill you and make you a killer than not being vaccinated, no matter how well you can drive. 3) It's not your place to tell me whether or not to have kids[/QUOTE] people are more likely to die in a car crash than getting diseases when you are unvaccinated, is purely BECAUSE those diseases were vaccinated, therefore, they're only active in people who are not vaccinated, and can't even spread BECAUSE so many are vaccinated Many diseases that have been vaccinated against are virtually, if not entirely non existent in areas that were properly vaccinated. How do you expect there to be victims?

My sister is one of the types people that are against vaccination :v: she has 4 kids

My mum is a Huge fan of Andrew wakefield, she is convinced the reason i have Asperger's (also ADHD and multiple other conditions that have fuck all to do with vaccines) is because of the MMR vaccine i was given as a babby. She has refused to vaccinate my younger brother completely and has told me she thinks giving kids autism was part of some government conspiracy, and that my DLA payments are there to keep my mouth shut about this. The anti-vax crowd, ladies and gentlemen.

[QUOTE=lazyguy;45870413][IMG]http://resources3.news.com.au/images/2009/05/09/1225710/593855-daryl-norris-skydives-with-his-son-jay.jpg[/IMG] Take him away! [IMG]http://cdni.condenast.co.uk/646x430/g_j/horse_child_girl_cnt_22mar11_istock_b.jpg[/IMG] The state sees all, the state knows all, the state owns all! [IMG]http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Travel/Late_offers/pictures/2010/8/13/1281693154578/Children-in-car-006.jpg[/IMG] Good Lord, this is worse than if the parents were UKIP voters![/QUOTE] It still can pretty much be a run in for criminal negligence. Not for the healthy kids who aren't vaccinated (though stuff like measles tend to return in adulthood for people who just went trough the disease and not vaccinated) but it's mostly dangerous for the few that cannot get vaccinated for susceptibility. [QUOTE=LVL FACTORY;45878707]Most of Eastern Europe is like this[/QUOTE] I think that is perhaps one of the few good things that communism gave us. Because human rights were pushed aside somewhat stuff like mandatory vaccinations an a couple of other things got into standard culture to the point where people don't really question them, because the benefits are obviously felt troughout society. And now that full human right recognition returned, this positive step remained. The first step to do is much harder in western nations.

[QUOTE=J!NX;45879595]people are more likely to die in a car crash than getting diseases when you are unvaccinated, is purely BECAUSE those diseases were vaccinated, therefore, they're only active in people who are not vaccinated, and can't even spread BECAUSE so many are vaccinated Many diseases that have been vaccinated against are virtually, if not entirely non existent in areas that were properly vaccinated. How do you expect there to be victims?[/QUOTE] NO I've already shown this to be false.

[QUOTE=lazyguy;45880359]NO I've already shown this to be false.[/QUOTE] The entire world population was also MUCH less significant back then [t]http://development.thinkaboutit.eu/scripts/tinymce/jscripts/tiny_mce/plugins/imagemanager/files/Vihar/ScreenShot003.jpg[/t] From 1958 to 1962 [The year before the vaccine was invented], the United States had an average of 503,282 cases and 432 deaths each year. and 55 cases these days? per year versus that, in addition to having a far greater population? for all you know, the only deaths and reports of the disease could be ones who aren't vaccinated, and likely are MASSIVE spike downwards.

"Well nobody gets these diseases anyway so my kids dont need no vaccines :downs:"

[QUOTE=J!NX;45880457]The entire world population was also MUCH less significant back then [t]http://development.thinkaboutit.eu/scripts/tinymce/jscripts/tiny_mce/plugins/imagemanager/files/Vihar/ScreenShot003.jpg[/t] From 1958 to 1962 [The year before the vaccine was invented], the United States had an average of 503,282 cases and 432 deaths each year. and 55 cases these days? per year versus that, in addition to having a far greater population? for all you know, the only deaths and reports of the disease could be ones who aren't vaccinated, and likely are MASSIVE spike downwards.[/QUOTE] ??? Now you're talking about something else entirely. This has nothing to do with the number of people killed by cars being fifty times higher than those killed by the measles. And for the last time - [highlight]THESE STATISTICS ARE FROM BEFORE THE VACCINE[/highlight].

lazyguy, please don't procreate

[QUOTE=Eric95;45881247]lazyguy, please don't procreate[/QUOTE] I wouldn't be too worried about that :rolleyes:

[QUOTE=FalconKrunch;45864852]It's not just autism though, most of the people that don't get their children vaccinated are hardcore christians.[/QUOTE] Well I'm Christian and i took Vaccines so whats with that then.

[QUOTE=lazyguy;45880697]??? Now you're talking about something else entirely. This has nothing to do with the number of people killed by cars being fifty times higher than those killed by the measles. And for the last time - [highlight]THESE STATISTICS ARE FROM BEFORE THE VACCINE[/highlight].[/QUOTE] You sound pretty pissed over nothing, and act as if what you're saying is totally true from like 1 case, besides, there are going to be a very small amount of deaths from even diseases like Ebola in America, this is because we can properly quarantine the issues, exactly like we can prevent deaths by not being a jackass in a car this is also ONE disease you're exemplifying, lets not forget the shit polio did [QUOTE]Small localized paralytic polio epidemics began to appear in Europe and the United States around 1900.[6] Outbreaks reached pandemic proportions in Europe, North America, Australia, and New Zealand during the first half of the 20th century. By 1950 the peak age incidence of paralytic poliomyelitis in the United States had shifted from infants to children aged five to nine years, when the risk of paralysis is greater; about one-third of the cases were reported in persons over 15 years of age.[106] Accordingly, the rate of paralysis and death due to polio infection also increased during this time.[6] In the United States, the 1952 polio epidemic became the worst outbreak in the nation's history. Of nearly 58,000 cases reported that year 3,145 died and 21,269 were left with mild to disabling paralysis.[107] Intensive care medicine has its origin in the fight against polio.[108] Most hospitals in the 1950s had limited access to iron lungs for patients unable to breathe without mechanical assistance. Respiratory centers designed to assist the most severe polio patients, first established in 1952 at the Blegdam Hospital of Copenhagen by Danish anesthesiologist Bjørn Ibsen, were the harbingers of subsequent intensive care units (ICU). (A year later, Ibsen would establish the world's first dedicated ICU.)[109] [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poliomyelitis[/url][/QUOTE] are you purposely picking a disease that had a low death rate or something? Imagine if no one vaccinated against polio, it'd still be a MASSIVE issue today. This is why vaccinations should be mandatory and why you're a shit parent if you think otherwise. Because by not vaccinating your kid you're disagreeing with what prevented the disease to boot. this is effectively the same thing as using turn signals, and using a seat belt, only it has an even GREATER impact on percentages of cases, because it basically makes it impossible to get polio/ebola/measles/insert anal discharge virus here because you are vaccinated. If those 55 people vaccinated / had good immune systems they would not have been a statistic at all. 500 cases a year and now down to 55 a year with a far higher population, you'd have to be an idiot to not see why that's important to enforce, and an even bigger idiot to go "YEAH BUT CARS ARE MORE DANGEROUS!!!!! SO THAT MEANS VACCINATIONS SHOULDN'T BE MANDATORY! COULD HAVE BEEN WORSE!", Seriously, that argument is fucking completely silly. It's called "Preventive measures" [QUOTE=Deathtrooper2;45881845]Well I'm Christian and i took Vaccines so whats with that then.[/QUOTE] yeah but he said hardcore Christians, so, not the completely sane and cool Christians, like you

[QUOTE=Awesomecaek;45881799]I wouldn't be too worried about that :rolleyes:[/QUOTE] Fuck you too. [editline]3rd September 2014[/editline] I don't have to deal with this.

[QUOTE=lazyguy;45882501]Fuck you too. [editline]3rd September 2014[/editline] I don't have to deal with this.[/QUOTE] You really don't; I don't understand why you keep pushing forth pointless irrelevant arguments and defending negligent parenting while repeatedly failing to provide any counter points to any of the arguments made against you. Giving out boxes unfortunately does not substitute building logical arguments and intelligent discussion. It's almost like you decided to make a picture filled, condescending, jackass post without even beginning to consider the rationality of your own point of view! [img]https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/6035324/box-man-stranded_large.jpg[/img] Good lord, this is worse than if the UKIP tried to make a coherent argument! :downs:

[QUOTE=lazyguy;45882501]Fuck you too. [editline]3rd September 2014[/editline] I don't have to deal with this.[/QUOTE] Yes, nice job not even defending your 'facts' and purposely selecting key examples to suit your argument. diseases other than measles have been eliminated with vaccinations that have done far worse. The same vaccinations that people hate for stupid reasons. If no one vaccinated, polio would still be a massive issue