France's 75% tax rate approved by top court after revisions
513 replies, posted
[QUOTE=ilikecorn;43346633]Going to play devils advocate here: that while the work isnt "hard" physically, it certainly requires skills and talent that the vast majority of people simply don't have, nor do they want to take the time to learn.[/QUOTE]
An MBA takes two years. That's not skill. running a business is time consuming, but it isn't hard.
[QUOTE=SigmaLambda;43346582]Wtf is a culture? I'm going to leave the land my family has lived in for countless generations along with my manor and friends and extended family because these taxes are too high. woe is me
[editline]29th December 2013[/editline]
Maybe I'll move to somewhere else in the EU where the taxes are marginally lower...[/QUOTE]
And that's not even the biggest issue with the "HURRR BUT THEY WILL RUN AWAY WITH DA MONIES :C" stupid shit so many pseudoeducated internet economists who failed to pay attention in fucking high school economy classes like to spout.
[QUOTE=Aidan_088;43346598]Do you really think most rich people work hard? Do you think the ceo of a company works literally hundred of times harder than his average employee because that's how much more he gets paid. What about all the people who inherited their fortunes or bankers and stockbrokers who made money through interest and luck. Working hard is no guarantee of having lots of money.[/QUOTE]
I don't think he became a CEO without a lot of hard work.
Lot of people seem to have some strange assumption that people just instantly become CEO's of multibillion companies.
No, they work hard to get there. Well, most of the time.
[QUOTE=ilikecorn;43346655]An MBA does not a rich man make. One has to understand HOW to apply the skills learned at school, and furthermore has to understand how to manage and work with people (which is harder than it sounds)[/QUOTE]
It's not hard.
(Hint: I do it for a living)
[QUOTE=Aidan_088;43346598]Do you really think most rich people work hard? Do you think the ceo of a company works literally hundred of times harder than his average employee because that's how much more he gets paid. What about all the people who inherited their fortunes or bankers and stockbrokers who made money through interest and luck. Working hard is no guarantee of having lots of money.[/QUOTE]
You say that as if CEOs an bankers don't work at all and just sit on their asses and do nothing. It takes skill, you know. One wrong decision and you could lose everything. And there are already taxes on inheritance or winnings.
I guess it really is not enough to work hard, my fault, you also need to work smart and know where and when to apply your skills.
[QUOTE=OogalaBoogal;43346663]It's not hard.
(Hint: I do it for a living)[/QUOTE]
If everyone could do what you do, we would all be entreprenours and CEO's.
What is easy for you might be very difficult for others.
[QUOTE=ilikecorn;43346633]Going to play devils advocate here: that while the work isnt "hard" physically, it certainly requires skills and talent that the vast majority of people simply don't have, nor do they want to take the time to learn.[/QUOTE]
In some cases maybe but the point is that its not consistent or logical. Does a chat show host work harder or have more skills than a doctor or a soldier? They get paid a lot more. As another example it takes a lot of skill to be a top footballer but I don't think that justifies some of them having higher net-worths than small countries.
[QUOTE=Ezhik;43346671]You say that as if CEOs an bankers don't work at all and just sit on their asses and do nothing. It takes skill, you know. One wrong decision and you could lose everything. And there are already taxes on inheritance or winnings.
I guess it really is not enough to work hard, my fault, you also need to work smart and know where and when to apply your skills.[/QUOTE]
Are you kidding me? In most publicly traded company, the CEO is entirely at the mercy of the board of directors. They say jump, CEO asks how high.
[editline]29th December 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=ilikecorn;43346685]So your rich then? If yes, then I concede my argument. If no, then why not? If all you need is an MBA, then surely you must be wealthy?[/QUOTE]
I'll probably be going into first stage investment rounds come January, we've got some buzz so we don't think it should be to hard, we've got stories in the newspaper ect.
I'm not rich though. Why? University.
[QUOTE=OogalaBoogal;43346703]Are you kidding me? In most publicly traded company, the CEO is entirely at the mercy of the board of directors. They say jump, CEO asks how high.[/QUOTE]
Well might as well say that Obama is not responsible for anything, since he has Congress to answer to.
[QUOTE=Crazy;43346697]If everyone could do what you do, we would all be entreprenours and CEO's.
What is easy for you might be very difficult for others.[/QUOTE]
I'm a pretty awkward guy, I'm just half decent at programming embedded hardware.
[editline]29th December 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=Ezhik;43346740]Well might as well say that Obama is not responsible for anything, since he has Congress to answer to.[/QUOTE]
....
that's kind of how the states works tho
[QUOTE=OogalaBoogal;43346703]Are you kidding me? In most publicly traded company, the CEO is entirely at the mercy of the board of directors. They say jump, CEO asks how high.
[editline]29th December 2013[/editline]
I'll probably be going into first stage investment rounds come January, we've got some buzz so we don't think it should be to hard, we've got stories in the newspaper ect.
I'm not rich though. [B]Why? University.[/B][/QUOTE]
Migrate to a country with free university education and migrate back home.
Genious.
[QUOTE=Crazy;43346759]Migrate to a country with free university education and migrate back home.
Genious.[/QUOTE]
i love canada too much
[QUOTE=onebit;43346735]The problem with money is that people hog it.[/QUOTE]
Yes, when you put money in a bank account, the literal cash sits in a vault untouched until you withdraw it.
Why, pray tell, do banks pay interest?
[QUOTE=Ezhik;43346671]You say that as if CEOs an bankers don't work at all and just sit on their asses and do nothing. It takes skill, you know. One wrong decision and you could lose everything. And there are already taxes on inheritance or winnings.
I guess it really is not enough to work hard, my fault, you also need to work smart and know where and when to apply your skills.[/QUOTE]
I'm not saying they don't work hard only that they don't work hundreds or even thousands of times harder than most of their employees,as their pay would suggest. They get paid far more than anyone could possibly deserve or ever need and as such I don't it is unreasonable to tax them harshly. They would still be able to live lives of luxury far beyond anything the average hard working person could dream of even if the top tax rate was 95%.
[QUOTE=ilikecorn;43346781]I've invested pretty well, and always laugh when my junior guys walk up and say "gee, how can you afford that nice car?" Well.. I invested wisely, took a few gambles, and saved my pennies. Usually upon
hearing that, they go "oh well.. that takes too long" then go about buying everything they can with their paycheck, then proceed to go 2 weeks bitching about how they cant buy anything.[/QUOTE]
most of my money goes to absurdly priced textbooks and living expenses, im pretty good with my money and i budget well
i know how to manage my money :v:
[QUOTE=OogalaBoogal;43346743]
....
that's kind of how the states works tho[/QUOTE]
Are you being serious right now? Just because the CEO has a board to answer to doesn't mean that he is not responsible for anything. It's a fail safe, true, but there are still many things hat he could do that could ruin everything.
On one hand I think it's dumb to tax above 50% because it would imply that the government did half the work that made you successful, but on the other hand they're only taxing what's over 1 million so it seems fair to me, from my perspective.
[QUOTE=Aidan_088;43346790]I'm not saying they don't work hard only that they don't work hundreds or even thousands of times harder than most of their employees,as their pay would suggest. They get paid far more than anyone could possibly deserve or ever need and as such I don't it is unreasonable to tax them harshly. They would still be able to live lives of luxury far beyond anything the average hard working person could dream of even if the top tax rate was 95%.[/QUOTE]if they are being paid hat much, then the people who hired them think they're worth it. And again, who are you to decide what somebody deserves or needs?
[QUOTE=ilikecorn;43346482]If I lived in a socialized country (IE Most of Europe) I'd be perfectly fine with giving 50%-75% tax, on the other hand, if the US told me "hey pay 75% tax" I'd probably leave the country. European governments actually have services, unlike the US government with its "OH HEY, WE'RE DROPPING A FUCKTON ON DEFENSE, AND THE REST IS GOING TO BIG BUSINESS".[/QUOTE]
My dad is in a 65% tax bracket since he owns a fairly successful business that he's worked 20+ years to make. He hardly cleared 1 million profit this year as a company and took home a lot less than that. After giving all his employees bonuses and paying their regular salaries, he had to give away 65% of his money. Its not even right, we're not rich in the least bit.
[QUOTE=Ezhik;43346810]Are you being serious right now? Just because the CEO has a board to answer to doesn't mean that he is not responsible for anything. It's a fail safe, true, but there are still many things hat he could do that could ruin everything.[/QUOTE]
yeah sure, but when a company gets large enough the advisers to chair/ceo/president the thing basically pilots its self, all that the ceo can do is be another set of eyes in the executive bubble as well as be a megaphone to the company.
[QUOTE=SPESSMEHREN;43346241]Taxing high earners more is still unfair because it punishes people for being successful though.[/QUOTE]
When the top earners that make 31 times as much as Average Joe don't also order 31 times as many pizzas as Average Joe, they just screw over the economy. Jobs are created depending on demand, and demand will only consistently rise if Average Joe is making a good amount of money. Otherwise you just end up with hoarders that expand into other countries to find more demand elsewhere.
[QUOTE=ilikecorn;43346824]You can make a lot of money if you start reviewing the stock market now and save up 1000$ of "seed" money, and invest that. Doing that, in about.. 2 years, I could afford a new car, paid in cash, now i'm back to saving up my next 1000$ for more seed money, and doing the research.[/QUOTE]
im an entrepreneur, not an investor, but i'll probably start looking at investing soon.
[QUOTE=OogalaBoogal;43346847]yeah sure, but when a company gets large enough the advisers to chair/ceo/president the thing basically pilots its self, all that the ceo can do is be another set of eyes in the executive bubble as well as be a megaphone to the company.[/QUOTE]
It all depends on the CEO, the board, etc. True, you could basically just be a puppet, but there are cases like Apple, where it was pretty much Jobs and his team that were in charge.
[QUOTE=SPESSMEHREN;43346241]Taxing high earners more is still unfair because it punishes people for being successful though.[/QUOTE]
I always thought "punishing people for being successful" was a hilarious phrase. As if it made being rich worse off than people with less money, or as if pushing someone for being successful was worse than pushing someone for being unsuccessful.
omg 75% tax? but i f i amek 100 billien then tey take awey 75 bilion? omg WTF FRNACE
[editline]29th December 2013[/editline]
france don need 74 billion
[highlight](User was banned for this post ("Don't type like a dipshit" - Starpluck))[/highlight]
[QUOTE=Deadman123;43346842]Its not even right, we're not rich in the least bit.[/QUOTE]
okay, how much personal income does he get per year after taxes? now I'm curious to know
[QUOTE=bravehat;43346252]So folk who can barely afford to live should take the brunt of the taxes as opposed to people who can actually afford to pay the taxes?
Fucking.
Genius.[/QUOTE]
Why not give everyone a flat tax rate?
[QUOTE=Ezhik;43346833]if they are being paid hat much, then the people who hired them think they're worth it. And again, who are you to decide what somebody deserves or needs?[/QUOTE]
I know people are paid as much as whoever paying them thinks they should be paid, that much goes without saying. I do however think it is absurd to seriously suggest that a top banker needs or deserves thousands of times more than a doctor. I cannot believe that anyone would genuinely disagree with this but you are right it is not my decision and it is not yours either but that does not invalidate the discussion. But to try and turn this around and make it look like you are the one defending fairness by defending enormous income inequality is ridiculous. You do not have to become a communist to recognize that such extremes wealth disparity are unnecessary.
[QUOTE=Eudoxia;43346247]Please reelect this man. I want to see France continue in this direction.[/QUOTE]
Who, François Hollande? Not a chance, he's the French president with the lowest popularity score for over 50 years or something.
[QUOTE=Aidan_088;43346922]I know people are paid as much as whoever paying them thinks they should be paid, that much goes without saying. I do however think it is absurd to seriously suggest that a top banker needs or deserves thousands of times more than a doctor. I cannot believe that anyone would genuinely disagree with this but you are right it is not my decision and it is not yours either but that does not invalidate the discussion. But to try and turn this around and make it look like you are the one defending fairness by defending enormous income inequality is ridiculous. You do not have to become a communist to recognize that such extremes wealth disparity are unnecessary.[/QUOTE]
Well I don't think that just taking away the money like that is the way to fix things.
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