U.S. sanctions FSB and GRU as it expels 35 Russian diplomats and closes 2 compounds - Polidicks

[QUOTE=dark soul;51598684]Yeah let's put sanctions on Russia without any evidence of them actually hacking anything. I'm sure that will help relations.[/QUOTE] But the U.S Goverment does have evidence, atleast that's what they say: [QUOTE]The U.S. Government confirms that two different RIS (Russian civilian and military intelligence Services) actors participated in the intrusion into a U.S. political party. The first actor group, known as Advanced Persistent Threat (APT) 29, entered into the party’s systems in summer 2015, while the second, known as APT28, entered in spring 2016. Both groups have historically targeted government organizations, think tanks, universities, and corporations around the world. APT29 has been observed crafting targeted spearphishing campaigns leveraging web links to a malicious dropper; once executed, the code delivers Remote Access Tools (RATs) and evades detection using a range of techniques. APT28 is known for Leveraging domains that closely mimic those of targeted organizations and tricking potential victims into entering legitimate credentials. APT28 actors relied heavily on shortened URLs intheir spearphishing email campaigns. Once APT28 and APT29 have access to victims, bothgroups exfiltrate and analyze information to gain intelligence value. These groups use this information to craft highly targeted spearphishing campaigns. These actors set up operational infrastructure to obfuscate their source infrastructure, host domains and malware for targeting organizations, establish command and control nodes, and harvest credentials and other valuable information from their targets. In summer 2015, an APT29 spearphishing campaign directed emails containing a malicious link to over 1,000 recipients, including multiple U.S. Government victims. APT29 used legitimate domains, to include domains associated with U.S. organizations and educational institutions, to host malware and send spearphishing emails. In the course of that campaign, APT29 successfully compromised a U.S. political party. At least one targeted individual activated links to malware hosted on operational infrastructure of opened attachments containing malware. APT29 delivered malware to the political party’s systems, established persistence, escalated privileges, enumerated active directory accounts, and exfiltrated email from several accounts through encrypted connections back through operational infrastructure. In spring 2016, APT28 compromised the same political party, again via targeted spearphishing. This time, the spearphishing email tricked recipients into changing their passwords through a fake webmail domain hosted on APT28 operational infrastructure. Using the harvested credentials, APT28 was able to gain access and steal content, likely leading to the exfiltration of information from multiple senior party members. The U.S. Government assesses that information was leaked to the press and publicly disclosed. Actors likely associated with RIS are continuing to engage in spearphishing campaigns, including one launched as recently as November 2016, just days after the U.S. election.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=1239the;51598708][URL="https://www.bloomberg.com/politics/articles/2016-12-29/u-s-said-to-plan-release-of-evidence-showing-russian-hacking"]https://www.bloomberg.com/politics/articles/2016-12-29/u-s-said-to-plan-release-of-evidence-showing-russian-hacking[/URL] Keep eyes out for today.[/QUOTE] They just did. [URL="http://thehill.com/policy/national-security/312132-fbi-dhs-release-report-on-russia-hacking"]http://thehill.com/policy/national-security/312132-fbi-dhs-release-report-on-russia-hacking[/URL]

[QUOTE=Taepodong-2;51598706]Is there really any purpose to all this shit Obama's been doing the last few weeks other than trying to leave a mess for Trump to clean up?[/QUOTE] I would assume create outrage against Russia so that Trump has a harder time repealing sanctions against them.

[QUOTE=Teddybeer;51598743]You simply will never get that information. Intelligence informations sit on piles and piles of information they can't use because it would reveal from whom the got it or how they go it. So pretty vague stuff is all that will ever get released to the public (and you have crowds that will find it never enough anyway).[/QUOTE] This is such a bullshit excuse then. This report is no "proof" but another piece of "high confidence" accusations except this time it was considred to be enough to use as excuse for sanctions on Russia. You just gotta [i]believe[/i] man. I just want FSB to publish some vague "counter report" that would indicate that high profile US establishment persons participated in mass shit eating contest. And ask to believe in it out of "high confidence".

[QUOTE=karimatrix;51598765]This is such a bullshit excuse then. This report is no "proof" but another piece of "high confidence" accusations except this time it was considred to be enough to use as excuse for sanctions on Russia. You just gotta [i]believe[/i] man. I just want FSB to publish some vague "counter report" that would indicate that high profile US establishment persons participated in mass shit eating contest. And ask to believe in it out of "high confidence".[/QUOTE] The same thing would be happening of the countries roles were reversed.

If the FBI released a picture of a text document left behind on compromised systems that called "pwnedbyputin.txt" that contained an ASCII hammer and sickle karimatrix would be convinced it was a forgery.

k trump will just undo it all

So this has been happening for 10 years and no one did anything? And Clinton set up an unsecure private server to handle her government work despite 10 years of "Russian" intrusion? The Obama administration was aware of the political hacks back in 2015 and it wasn't an issue until Clinton lost? Hmm

They also apparently forgot WIKILEAKS...?

[QUOTE=karimatrix;51598668]I gave a report a good read and here are few questions: it is dedicated to explaining how these two "hack groups" operated yet it never provided any explanation of attribiting them to russian intelligence. It just goes "in the end it all leads to FSB and GRU"... well, how about you release a report that explains a connection to your accusations than giving a two page lore for hacking thriller and 11 pages of internet security manual?! Also some nicknames in document quite hillarious. Perhabs there is someone in threadmore capable to analyse report's information, please share your thoughts.[/QUOTE] Could you please stop being such an hysterical whining dude? Yes, we know they didn't provide any conclusive evidence. No. It would be completely STUPID if they gave your government any clue whatsoever from where the are getting the information. Are you thinking that they would do this without any concrete evidence? We had the same scenario when the rebels downed the civilian plane "mu mu muh evidence shows that it was ukrops and their air force!" ....

[QUOTE=Raidyr;51598791]If the FBI released a picture of a text document left behind on compromised systems that called "pwnedbyputin.txt" that contained an ASCII hammer and sickle karimatrix would be convinced it was a forgery.[/QUOTE] And you would probably think USSR was behind it.

[QUOTE=Pantz Master;51598361]Thinking that Trump will get into a war over a tweet, or let his ego start world war 3 is rediculous. That is Saturday Night Live politics, that's not how the real world works.[/QUOTE] and yet we now have an incomming president who seemingly has no filter and will rant on twitter globally for everyone to see whenever he feels the slightest bit of negative pressure and is going to take the highest pressure job in the world

[QUOTE=karimatrix;51598828]And you would probably think USSR was behind it.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=-nesto-;51598812]So this has been happening for 10 years and no one did anything? And Clinton set up an unsecure private server to handle her government work despite 10 years of "Russian" intrusion? The Obama administration was aware of the political hacks back in 2015 and it wasn't an issue until Clinton lost? Hmm[/QUOTE] I just don't know what sort of proof would be conclusive enough to convince yall that couldn't be accused of forgery. It just seems like some people have their heels dug in to the idea that Russia could never do something like this.

Meh. CIA should've hacked Russian gov and released some more Putin's money-carriers' names for the public to know. That would've been entertaining considering how Putin himself had to awkwardly make excuses for his pal Roldugin the last time it happened. Plus I would enjoy some more extreme hypocrisy in our gov going "oh that's Americans doing shit, CIA and FBI, don't believe the forgery!" mere months after them saying the opposite over DNC leaks. Some diplomats having to find a new place to work probably concerns no one at all. And wasn't FSB and GRU already sanctioned over the whole Ukraine thing?

Both parties were hacked. When it was used as a tool to manipulate our elections is when Russia crossed the line. The Republican Congress is in agreement. This isn't just some random unsupported move by Obama like Putin is trying to make it out to be. But of course it helps Russia if they make it a partisan issue here. I'm still wondering if Trump will ever actually stand up for the US rather than just saying we should "move on".

[QUOTE=Raidyr;51598837]I just don't know what sort of proof would be conclusive enough to convince yall that couldn't be accused of forgery. It just seems like some people have their heels dug in to the idea that Russia could never do something like this.[/QUOTE] It would be a lot more convincing if Obama gave a bit more than just a plain appeal to authority. It really was weak when he said "if you think you know better than our intelligence agencies..." when we've had the last two decades to ruminate on that.

[QUOTE=Raidyr probably at 2001]I just don't know what sort of proof would be conclusive enough to convince yall that couldn't be accused of forgery. It just seems like some people have their heels dug in to the idea that Iraq could never do something like this.[/QUOTE] cause you know, history shows. Current administration had their fair share of scandals in regard of cyber espionage, soo it's only logical that in a case where [B]ANYTHING BUT[/B] the leaked information itself is aproached with such a zealous effort, that their actions are questioned.

[QUOTE=Raidyr;51598837]I just don't know what sort of proof would be conclusive enough to convince yall that couldn't be accused of forgery. It just seems like some people have their heels dug in to the idea that Russia could never do something like this.[/QUOTE] The fact that Russia could do something or other doesn't really mean that no evidence is required. I fully believe that FSB is behind DNC leaks, yet I won't be 100% sure of it until I see some [i]conclusive[/i] evidence. Some reports basically saying "believe me, I saw what you don't get to see" won't cut it in subjects affected by politics to such a degree, I fully agree with Kari here.

[QUOTE=Thlis;51598854]It would be a lot more convincing if Obama gave a bit more than just a plain appeal to authority.[/QUOTE] What constitutes a bit more? The line I'm seeing elsewhere is asking for proof that ATP28 and 29 are Russian linked but I don't know what Obama (btw its not just Obama saying this) could show that you wouldn't assume is faked, forged, edited, or otherwise tampered with to make Russia look guilty

[QUOTE=shadow_oap;51598849]Both parties were hacked. [/QUOTE] Please, WHERE did you get that one from? [QUOTE=Raidyr;51598872] I don't know what Obama (btw its not just Obama saying this) could show that you wouldn't assume is faked, forged, edited, or otherwise tampered with to make Russia look guilty[/QUOTE] something that they should've shown to Obama when he could ask the same thing. If it was convincing to a president enough to make a statement, i am sure everybody else in a world would wholly agree on that. Unless you think they just said "Trust us Mr. President, Russians did this" and he totally bailed with that too.

[QUOTE=Raidyr;51598872]What constitutes a bit more? The line I'm seeing elsewhere is asking for proof that ATP28 and 29 are Russian linked but I don't know what Obama (btw its not just Obama saying this) could show that you wouldn't assume is faked, forged, edited, or otherwise tampered with to make Russia look guilty[/QUOTE] Any evidence would be better than "trust us, by the way we are acting on it now before you get to see the proof"

[QUOTE=Raidyr;51598791]If the FBI released a picture of a text document left behind on compromised systems that called "pwnedbyputin.txt" that contained an ASCII hammer and sickle karimatrix would be convinced it was a forgery.[/QUOTE] Actually it's kinda funny how people so desperately demanded to release solid proof that it was Russia behind the hack, obviously not understanding that a reader of that proof must have access to all the information gathered by the investigation as well as enough qualification and knowledge to simply understand what's going on. And even then, it would still be really hard to prove that the whole thing was not fabricated. So while what they released certainly doesn't prove anything( they basically just showed a single metadata snippet and a lot of vague text around it), you guys should not expect them to release anything "solid". It's not like there would be a russian text all over the data or something.

They would deny any evidence anyways since it would make them look bad.

[QUOTE=karimatrix;51598765]This is such a bullshit excuse then. This report is no "proof" but another piece of "high confidence" accusations except this time it was considred to be enough to use as excuse for sanctions on Russia. You just gotta [i]believe[/i] man. I just want FSB to publish some vague "counter report" that would indicate that high profile US establishment persons participated in mass shit eating contest. And ask to believe in it out of "high confidence".[/QUOTE] Yet you're willing to believe whatever Russia says is right. You refuse to believe that Russian Special Forces were operating in Eastern Ukraine, even when photos of men with GM-94's (a weapon used exclusively by the Spetsnaz, FSB, and MVD) were taken in Ukraine. You refuse to believe Russia is sending equipment and claim all equipment is captured from the Ukrainian Army, even when photos depict vehicles that are not in service in Ukraine but the Russian Military. You refuse to believe Russia-backed rebels used a Russian Buk to shoot down MH 17 even though several investigators concluded they did, and the rebels even bragged on social media about shooting down an airplane, and posted images of the Buk, and later the Buk missing one missile. But we're the fools for believing our government when they accuse your government of interfering with our country.

[QUOTE=antianan;51598904]Actually it's kinda funny how people so desperately demanded to release solid proof that it was Russia behind the hack, obviously not understanding that a reader of that proof must have access to all the information gathered by the investigation as well as enough qualification and knowledge to even understand what's going on. And even then, it would still be really hard to prove that the whole thing was not fabricated. So while what they released certainly doesn't prove anything( they basically just showed a single metadata snippet and a lot of vague text around it), you guys should not expect them to release anything "solid". It's not like there would be a russian text all over the data or something.[/QUOTE] report claims those groups operated for YEARS. Atleast some of those cases must've been backtracked and figured out, or how they would be able to connect all those cases? Internal information, witness cases, counter exposure of mails, money tracing back to kremlin, ANYTHING! This isn't some hack overlords! We talking about same goverment that can't properly close torrent sites or prevent selfies from rusty airships for fuck sakes!

Response from Russian Embassy UK: [media]https://twitter.com/russianembassy/status/814564127230271489[/media]

[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;51598915]Yet you're willing to believe whatever Russia says is right. You refuse to believe that Russian Special Forces were operating in Eastern Ukraine, even when photos of men with GM-94's (a weapon used exclusively by the Spetsnaz, FSB, and MVD) were taken in Ukraine. You refuse to believe Russia is sending equipment and claim all equipment is captured from the Ukrainian Army, even when photos depict vehicles that are not in service in Ukraine but the Russian Military. You refuse to believe Russia-backed rebels used a Russian Buk to shoot down MH 17 even though several investigators concluded they did, and the rebels even bragged on social media about shooting down an airplane, and posted images of the Buk, and later the Buk missing one missile. But we're the fools for believing our government when they accuse your government of interfering with our country.[/QUOTE] if all you can do is attribute to my previous posts as defence of your opinion, i'd like to remind you that i am not a single person in this thread to question the report.

[QUOTE=karimatrix;51598857]cause you know, history shows.[/QUOTE] I like when people bring up the whole WMDS-in-Iraq thing without really knowing the context- the CIA was directed by Washington to interpret their intelligence in a way that supported the narrative of Saddam having imminent access to WMDs. The report, despite this direction, was inconclusive, but still suggestive enough that the HPSCI and SSCI were able to hold it up as incontrovertible proof of Saddam having WMDs. It was such a huge failure in retrospect that the agency was taken to task and their analysis-producing process overhauled to involve greater detachment from Washington and more oversight from other agencies. It is literally why the DNI now exists, to provide an additional layer of isolation between the intelligence agencies and policymakers, so they can do their jobs objectively without politicians breathing down their necks. Now, when the entire intelligence community is saying the same message, without being goaded or directed to by Congress, you can be reasonably certain that they're not skewing facts or bullshitting for political reasons, thanks to the events of 2001.

[QUOTE=karimatrix;51598926]This isn't some hack overlords! We talking about same goverment that can't properly close torrent sites or prevent selfies from rusty airships for fuck sakes![/QUOTE] For real though Russia has a history of some pretty badass intelligence gathering, I would very much rate them a major intelligence threat.

[QUOTE=karimatrix;51598926]report claims those group operated for YEARS. Atleast some of those cases must've been backtracked and figured out, unless how they would be able to connect all those cases? Internal information, witness cases, counter exposure of e mails, money tracks leading ot kremlin, ANYTHING![/QUOTE] What witness cases? What money tracking? Anyway, I myself said that the report doesn't prove anything, the point of my post was that it's a pure nightmare to prove things when it comes to something from the technical field because it requires people to basically be a part of an investigation(to assure that the data was not forged) and be versed in cyber security, which is obviously impossible. [QUOTE=karimatrix;51598926] This isn't some hack overlords! We talking about same goverment that can't properly close torrent sites or prevent selfies from rusty airships for fuck sakes![/QUOTE] You do understand there's a difference between those shitheads and people from our intelligence agencies, right?