[QUOTE=Pierrewithahat;37411822]I wholeheartedly disagree.[/QUOTE]
Well, if everyone was [i]specifically[/i] (not to cause issues with abortion and self defense and the like, unless you're against those too though I doubt it) like you in that aspect I suppose this sort of situation would be quelled and over with much faster.
Why did that happen?
200 bodies. Two hundreds of bodies.
What do you even do with those. What would you do with 200 bodies? Humanely, how do you even handle 200 bodies?
That's insane, that's a lot of bodies. Even one body, I mean, come on, what do you do with that?
[QUOTE=Scarabix;37414086]200 bodies. Two hundreds of bodies.
What do you even do with those. What would you do with 200 bodies? Humanely, how do you even handle 200 bodies?
That's insane, that's a lot of bodies. Even one body, I mean, come on, what do you do with that?[/QUOTE]
the bodies don't matter, I think, ultimately what matters is not that 200 bodies were lost but that 200 minds were lost. the bodies are just things we pilot, nevertheless they are reflections of what is inside
and what do you do when such a staggering number of human souls are lost to the ether? you shed 200 tears, dig 200 graves for those 200 bodies and consider the fact that 200 lives, each with their own uniqueness, light, love, personality, potential and intellect, were extinguished by naught but the folly of fellow men
We should have intervened right at the beginning.
Now both sides are so polarised in this conflict that even after assad there is going to civil strife for a long time.
The real tragedy is going to be the civilians murdered by both sides.
How many murders do you think have amassed in the past 6 months?
[QUOTE=DentalDoctor;37414253]How many murders do you think have amassed in the past 6 months?[/QUOTE]
More than there should be.
[QUOTE=DentalDoctor;37414253]How many murders do you think have amassed in the past 6 months?[/QUOTE]
Too many.
[QUOTE=RichyZ;37414360]3?[/QUOTE]
I was thinking 2 but now that you mention it yeah 3's probably right on the money.
[QUOTE=Furioso;37414241]the bodies don't matter, I think, ultimately what matters is not that 200 bodies were lost but that 200 minds were lost. the bodies are just things we pilot, nevertheless they are reflections of what is inside
and what do you do when such a staggering number of human souls are lost to the ether? you shed 200 tears, dig 200 graves for those 200 bodies and consider the fact that 200 lives, each with their own uniqueness, light, love, personality, potential and intellect, were extinguished by naught but the folly of fellow men[/QUOTE]
The body, though, is a stinky, impractical mass of flesh, which can, in this situation, be interpreted as a reminder of the loss of this soul all due to [B]relatively[/B] meaningless bickering.
How can you accumulate all these reminders and keep a straight face?
[QUOTE=Superwafflez;37410450]Video of a massacre aftermath [B]only 3 days ago.[/B]
[url]http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=be8_1345674088[/url][/QUOTE]
[IMG]http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m3oovqY2aT1qii6tmo1_250.gif[/IMG]
That has made me feel a bit sick
[QUOTE=U.S.S.R;37410573]It isn't that simple, it would be a diplomatic mess. The militia is just as guilty when it comes to massacres like this now, so both parties should be overthrown if there is any intervention even if an intervention isn't likely at all.[/QUOTE]
Actually the UN HCR found that the rebels, although still guilty of some crimes, are not nearly as bad as the regime
[QUOTE=smurfy;37415637]Actually the UN HCR found that the rebels, although still guilty of some crimes, are not nearly as bad as the regime[/QUOTE]
Yep, you're right.
[URL="http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/08/15/us-syria-crisis-un-rights-idUSBRE87E0VW20120815"]http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/08/15/us-syria-crisis-un-rights-idUSBRE87E0VW20120815[/URL]
[QUOTE]"We have identified both parties as guilty of war crimes and of course a greater number and of bigger variety from the government side," Karen AbuZayd, one of two commissioners aided by some 20 investigators, told Reuters in a telephone interview.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Superwafflez;37410450]Video of a massacre aftermath [B]only 3 days ago.[/B]
[url]http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=be8_1345674088[/url][/QUOTE]
It's weird to think that's real...
[QUOTE=Disotrtion;37415684]Yep, you're right.
[URL="http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/08/15/us-syria-crisis-un-rights-idUSBRE87E0VW20120815"]http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/08/15/us-syria-crisis-un-rights-idUSBRE87E0VW20120815[/URL][/QUOTE]
I'm not considering them a lesser of two evils, that factor shouldn't be considered at all, in the case of polarization there are two wrongs and no level of wrongdoing to account for that. And if there is an intervention, it has to be rigged so that no major investor in Syria is harmed because of it. That'd mean overthrowing both the militia and at least reforming or taking control of the state to make it something more acceptable while still continuing imports and exports and such.
The death toll is up to 300 now, fucking hell..
[url]http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/middle_east/more-than-30-civilians-found-dead-in-streets-of-syrian-town-of-daraya-toll-for-week-above-120/2012/08/26/25924f18-ef63-11e1-b74c-84ed55e0300b_story.html[/url]
[QUOTE=smurfy;37415637]Actually the UN HCR found that the rebels, although still guilty of some crimes, are not nearly as bad as the regime[/QUOTE]
So just because they're not as bad they're alright?
Stop that they're both filled with murderers. If the rebels actually regulated their members, like killing those that instigated massacres under the FSA banner, I'd feel a little better, but that's not the case.
I wonder if the rebels know that the U.S. and NATO want to help but Russia and China wont let them
Hell, if I was a rebel and won the war I would have an burning hate for Russia and China for the rest of my life.
[QUOTE=DarkZero135;37419638]I wonder if the rebels know that the U.S. and NATO want to help but Russia and China wont let them
Hell, if I was a rebel and won the war I would have an burning hate for Russia and China for the rest of my life.[/QUOTE]
That's why they can't win now, Russia has their warm water port at stake and China has their oil refineries and such and if the militia wins they may as well kiss it goodbye. That is a good enough cause to go against the West and the U.N and support Assad.
It isn't about the innocent anymore, right now it is a proxy war.
[QUOTE=purvisdavid1;37419579]So just because they're not as bad they're alright?
Stop that they're both filled with murderers. If the rebels actually regulated their members, like killing those that instigated massacres under the FSA banner, I'd feel a little better, but that's not the case.[/QUOTE]
Well according to the HCR's [url=http://www.ohchr.org/Documents/HRBodies/HRCouncil/RegularSession/Session21/A-HRC-21-50.doc]report[/url], the regime has a 'state policy' of attacking against civilians, as well as hiding their military equipment in cities in an attempt to cause the other side to kill them, whereas the rebels commit crimes like killing/torturing regime prisoners. Is there a difference between crimes against the enemy and crimes against civilians? In my opinion there is
[quote]57. There are also reasonable grounds to believe that the documented incidents constituted the crime against humanity of murder. In towns and villages where there was a pattern of blockade, shelling, ground assault and house-to-house searches, the conditions for a widespread or systematic attack against a predominately civilian population were met. The scale of the attacks, their repetitive nature, the level of excessive force consistently used, the indiscriminate nature of the shelling and [B]the coordinated nature of the attacks led the commission to conclude that they had been conducted pursuant to State policy[/B].[/quote]
[quote]60. The commission concluded that information on executions perpetrated by anti-Government armed groups — with or without a “trial” — constituted reasonable grounds to believe that the war crimes of murder or of sentencing or execution without due process had been committed on several occasions. The commission was not able to corroborate alleged attacks directed against individual civilians not participating in hostilities or against a civilian population.[/quote]
[QUOTE=The golden;37409837]Despite the fact that fellow human lives are completely butchered, many people still oppose intervention because it's "not our business".[/QUOTE]
neither were any of the other countries that the US invaded lol
[QUOTE=smurfy;37420160]Well according to the HCR's [url=http://www.ohchr.org/Documents/HRBodies/HRCouncil/RegularSession/Session21/A-HRC-21-50.doc]report[/url], the regime has a 'state policy' of attacking against civilians, as well as hiding their military equipment in cities in an attempt to cause the other side to kill them, whereas the rebels commit crimes like killing/torturing regime prisoners. Is there a difference between crimes against the enemy and crimes against civilians? In my opinion there is[/QUOTE]
There is no difference, the state is torturing murdering defectors for the sake of torturing and murdering defectors as the militia are torturing and murdering supporters for the sake of torturing and murdering supporters. They are both as evil as one another, and they should both be reprimanded and quelled. Evil doesn't justify evil.
[editline]26th August 2012[/editline]
The only justified opposite to my argument is to say that what they are doing is completely justified in that they are waging war, and war is war. Only those who are polarized sit in between.
[editline]26th August 2012[/editline]
And in this case, the civilian populace [i]is[/i] the enemy, so you may as well say that all actions of the state are just as justified.
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