[QUOTE=Big Dumb American;26513608]While the efforts of these people could be called admirable, [B]the methods they've displayed in the past are nothing short of terrorism. They need to tone down their act a bit.[/B]
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qi7KDOAj4Xo[/media][/QUOTE]
Really? Because i always thought they've never done shit. If they really want to prevent the whaling, then they need to somehow sink all of those japanese whaling ships.
Since I dont really give a shit about the whaling industry, its fun to watch the non-lethal battles rage between two "navies" :v:
[quote]the methods they've displayed in the past are nothing short of terrorism. They need to tone down their act a bit.[/quote]That's hardly terrorism. That word really gets thrown around.
Even if they sunk one of those large processing ships, it still wouldn't be terrorism, it'd just be "attack" or "retaliation," people are always edging to label people they don't agree with as terrorists.
[quote=Wikipedia][B]Terrorism[/B] is the systematic use of [URL="http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/terror"]terror[/URL] especially as a means of [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coercion"]coercion[/URL].[URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism#cite_note-0"][1][/URL] No universally agreed, legally binding, criminal law [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definition_of_terrorism#In_international_law"]definition of terrorism[/URL] currently exists.[/quote]
In the most literal sense, terrorism refers to attacking or performing atrocities with the intention of instilling fear in general populace. None of that applies at all to aggressive anti-whaling actions.
[QUOTE=hypno-toad;26538938]That's hardly terrorism. That word really gets thrown around.
Even if they sunk one of those large processing ships, it still wouldn't be terrorism, it'd just be "attack" or "retaliation," people are always edging to label people they don't agree with as terrorists.
In the most literal sense, terrorism refers to attacking or performing atrocities with the intention of instilling fear in general populace. None of that applies at all to aggressive anti-whaling actions.[/QUOTE]
"Terrorist" is thrown around so much these days.
[editline]6th December 2010[/editline]
And if the Japanese can operate legally under the Research loophole, then what Sea Shepherd does is entirely legal under the UN World charter for nature.
[QUOTE=Saxon;26537534]Next year they should get them selves a sexy long range plane for reconnaissance assuming that all there boats come back intact.[/QUOTE]
They could always get a flying boat of some kind, but it would probably be a logistical nightmare to coordinate refueling not to mention a serious target for the Japanese. I can just imagine it running out of fuel during an engagement and having to land, then being run down like the Ady Gil. Would have to be insanely careful about towing it behind a ship too because they can't just keep "leapfrogging" it when the plane needs to land for fuel.
[QUOTE=RR_Raptor65;26539375]They could always get a flying boat of some kind, but it would probably be a logistical nightmare to coordinate refueling not to mention a serious target for the Japanese. I can just imagine it running out of fuel during an engagement and having to land, then being run down like the Ady Gil. Would have to be insanely careful about towing it behind a ship too because they can't just keep "leapfrogging" it when the plane needs to land for fuel.[/QUOTE]
Perhaps they could use a crane and hoist it up and down on the bob barkers empty helipad.
They could, but then it's exposed to the Japanese water cannons and still doesn't solve the problem of the plane having to land and refuel during an engagement, making it vulnerable to attack.
[QUOTE=RR_Raptor65;26539572]They could, but then it's exposed to the Japanese water cannons and still doesn't solve the problem of the plane having to land and refuel during an engagement, making it vulnerable to attack.[/QUOTE]
Last year that almost happened to their helicopter. The Japanese put the Security ship (which has a high powered water cannon where the harpoon should be) on their ass and were trying to spray the helicopter as they were taking of the rotors for storage. (they have to remove/replace the blades each time they take off and land so the thing can fit in the retractable hanger)
Throw stinky butter at them that will show them who's boss
[QUOTE=SwissArmyKnife;26528875]"Sorry kids, we can't afford to buy food because the Thirteenth Amendment prevented us from using slaves to harvest our crops, which is entirely legal thing to do. Now we're going to starve to death, but at least black people are happy and all"
Replace slaves with anything. Economics and a refusal to reinvent their industry is a piss poor argument. Killing less whales or using more humane methods of hunting and killing the whales isn't going to end up with little Sato starving to death.[/QUOTE]
You can't compare whales and black people. Whales are just pieces of meat. They are animals, just like cows and pigs. Black people on the other hand are humans, they have feelings, they can think etc.
[QUOTE=Rautatie;26542036]You can't compare whales and black people. Whales are just pieces of meat. They are animals, just like cows and pigs. Black people on the other hand are humans, they have feelings, they can think etc.[/QUOTE]
Whales have shown remarkable levels of intelligence.
Of course pigs have shown intelligence as well, to a lesser degree, but pigs are not in danger of being extinct. Nor do even the most inhumane of slaughter houses manage to even remotely compare to the pain and suffering caused to a whale when it is harpooned in the water and drug aboard a ship to be butchered alive.
I am 100% on the side of the "Hippies" after seeing documentaries like The Cove.
[QUOTE=Rautatie;26542036]You can't compare whales and black people. Whales are just pieces of meat. They are animals, just like cows and pigs. Black people on the other hand are humans, they have feelings, they can think etc.[/QUOTE]
Whales are arguably the second most intelligent animals on this planet. They have emotions and feelings similar to us. There comes a time when an animal has to be considered more than a piece of meat. What separates us from "animals"? We are just as much of an animal as whales are. What separates some advanced alien race so many people want to come in contact with from just animals? We don't need to look in space to find another intelligent life form, we have multiple in our oceans. (not at the level of humans, but intelligent and capable of carrying out a conversation nonetheless) The communication barrier is so incredibly different that it seems like they are just another animal. But that's exactly how it will be when we come in contact with an alien species, they're not going to speak English, probably not even speak in any comprehensible way at all. Shit, Octopus show more intelligence than primates. Dolphins teach each other and commit acts of murder and random violence, whales live in emotionally bonded families. They are intelligent, sentient animals.
And in that comparison, black people were considered subhuman, inferior to whites, they were bought and sold AS pieces of meat. Which we all know is sick and completely wrong too. Not to compare the years of hatred and mistreatment of humans to the slaughter of non-human sentient life.
This requires its own Animal Planet TV show.
[QUOTE=Blanketspace;26548873]This requires its own Animal Planet TV show.[/QUOTE]
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrlWXP4ZQvY[/media]
This will be season 4. Usually starts around summer.
I wonder will they shoot themselves for the whales.
Screw the whales, harpoon the eco-terrorists.
[QUOTE=certified;26534039]I'm officially on the whalers side now. This is terrorism that sea shepherd is doing.[/QUOTE]
It's some of the most ethical terrorism I've ever seen
[QUOTE=bravehat;26511708]Officially the greatest boat ever.
It also must play this as it charges the japanese whalers.
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XoUbeKKlo8k[/media]
:rock:[/QUOTE]
Too bad The Way of All Flesh was mediocre :smith:
[QUOTE=TH89;26551948]It's some of the most ethical terrorism I've ever seen[/QUOTE]
Though the whole "Terrorist" thing is kinda working out for them. When Pete Bethune boarded the ship, no one wanted to deal with him. On the way back to Japan he talked to the crew members (and even became good friends with one, they still talk today) And they all said they thought they were all hell bent terrorists like Al Qaeda. Bethune said Sea Shepherd all thought the whalers were heartless bastards/etc. and they basically exchanged small talk and realized they were both wrong. They treated him really nice all the way to Japan. Once Bethune got to Japan, they threw him into federal prison as a terrorist. He had an entourage of like 20 officers escorting him to his cell. He said no one even looked him in the eye because all they knew about him was that he was a Terrorist.
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U1AINlrMJc0[/media]
Some of you say they are doing too much.
I say they aren't doing enough.
They need to man up and actually arm their ships with things that can sink ships.
I'm talking deck guns, torpedoes, machineguns. Sink the whalers, and take no prisoners.
[QUOTE=Uberman77883;26553149]Some of you say they are doing too much.
I say they aren't doing enough.
They need to man up and actually arm their ships with things that can sink ships.
I'm talking deck guns, torpedoes, machineguns. Sink the whalers, and take no prisoners.[/QUOTE]
If they did that then they would be interdicted and arrested before you could say fire in the hole
Who the hell cares, christ, fucking hippies. I hope the japanese shoot arsenic onto their ship or they get hi-jacked by Somalian pirates, and held for ransom. I doubt anyone would pay the ransom though
That seems like an awfully irrational and narrow minded thing to say.
Doesn't that seem pretty irrational and narrow minded?
It seems pretty irrational and narrow minded to me.
[QUOTE=Jiyoon;26555139]Who the hell cares, christ, fucking hippies. I hope the japanese shoot arsenic onto their ship or they get hi-jacked by Somalian pirates, and held for ransom. I doubt anyone would pay the ransom though[/QUOTE]
Yeah, they're a lot more active than you will ever be.
And aren't Somalian Pirates in...you know? Somalia?
I would classify tossing acid and sinking civilian ships as terrorism. Attacking civilian ships isn't justifiable, in my opinion. Raising awareness of the cruel methods used in whaling by following ships around and showing the world how they operate is great, but actually sinking those ships isn't just stepping over the line, it's taking a running leap at it. I think it actually hurts their cause.
[editline]7th December 2010[/editline]
[QUOTE=CabooseRvB;26555334]Yeah, they're a lot more active than you will ever be.
And aren't Somalian Pirates in...you know? Somalia?[/QUOTE]
It's a foreign exchange program, the Somalians and whalers traded gifted pupils to learn each others' trade.
[QUOTE=certified;26534039]ITT: Eco-fags and whaling supporters trolling each-other to death / flame war[/QUOTE]
I love how one side is "Eco-fags" and the other is "Whaling supporters". Enjoy your dumb.
A lot of people need to read through the thread before coming in and spouting the "Sea shepherd are terrorists and should thrown in vats of acid" lines. Their methods of protesting aren't the most effective, but they've probably done the best job, short of The Cove, at getting people to notice what's happening and subsequently learning about the Japanese whaling and fishing industries.
Because they're pretty stubborn and arrogant industries, regardless of what side you're on.
[QUOTE=Big Dumb American;26555891]I would classify tossing acid and sinking civilian ships as terrorism. Attacking civilian ships isn't justifiable, in my opinion. Raising awareness of the cruel methods used in whaling by following ships around and showing the world how they operate is great, but actually sinking those ships isn't just stepping over the line, it's taking a running leap at it. I think it actually hurts their cause.
[editline]7th December 2010[/editline]
It's a foreign exchange program, the Somalians and whalers traded gifted pupils to learn each others' trade.[/QUOTE]
Buteric acid is actually less acidic than lemon juice. They stopped using it because the Japanese media would spout: TERRORIST SEA SHEPHERD THROWS ACID AT WHALERS. One season, the whalers were throwing large nuts and bolts at the people in the boat, that's infinity more dangerous than rotten butter. They even shot pepper spray guns at people in a zodiac, if the driver got blinded he could have easily lost control and slammed into the whaling ship. They've also used LRAD's on the helicopter and attempted to shoot their water cannons at it. Sea Shepherd, despite their history has never killed or seriously injured anyone, and that is not their goal.
[editline]7th December 2010[/editline]
And Paul Watson has found loopholes in the law that technically make everything they do legal. He has never been held in jail longer than a month or so. Even when he turned himself in for SINKING A SHIP they kicked him out of the country without jail time.
You could say what they do is just as "technically legal" as what the Japanese do.
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