Female accused of sexual violence after world hails iconic photo of her kissing Italian riot officer - Polidicks

[QUOTE=yawmwen;43277600]maybe, idk. the reason we use it is because it is easy to make. it's one of the only tools available.[/QUOTE] So you DO admit that you have no fucking clue what you're doing when throwing a molotov cocktail around. Then why do you still pretend that molotovs are harmless if you have obviously no idea of what's going to happen ?

[QUOTE=RetaDepa;43277622]If you're promoting anarchy due to beliefs of brutality then you must have a really fucking high hope for humanity if you're willing to believe that anarchy will not spawn other forms of brutality. And that's being very generous with your idea that police brutality is the status quo.[/QUOTE] the idea that police brutality is the status quo is because our current systems are built on using violence as a means to and end, anarchism is about using cooperation as the means i guess

[QUOTE=Ganerumo;43277647]So you DO admit that you have no fucking clue what you're doing when throwing a molotov cocktail around. Then why do you still pretend that molotovs are harmless if you have obviously no idea of what's going to happen ?[/QUOTE] i never said they are harmless. i'm saying that they are overblown. they aren't nearly as bad as the way police systematically brutalize protests when they protester doesn't show up with their "free speech permit".

[QUOTE=yawmwen;43277659]i never said they are harmless. i'm saying that they are overblown. they aren't nearly as bad as the way police systematically brutalize protests when they protester doesn't show up with their "free speech permit".[/QUOTE] How about when rioters flip cars, smash stores and torch trashcans?

i think more people have been killed by guns batons tazers and pepper spray wielded by police than have been killed by molotovs. but whatever, if anything i think their lack of effectiveness makes them pointless

I think you are really mixing up riot and protest here. Protesters protest, rioters set shit on fire and steal stuff.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;43277638]i promote anarchism because i accept the premise that "freedom is preferable to authority" and "all forms of authority must be justified".[/QUOTE] how is law enforcement to protect the rights of the people not justified authority?

dollar for dollar, correctly made firebombs are probably more cost effective than fragmentation grenades against full riot gear.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;43277659]i never said they are harmless. i'm saying that they are overblown. they aren't nearly as bad as the way police systematically brutalize protests when they protester doesn't show up with their "free speech permit".[/QUOTE] So what's your opinion on what a "protest" is and what a "riot" is? Do protesters just try and change the status quo with discussion and raising awareness of issues? or are protesters the ones who throw molotovs without provocation?

[QUOTE=yawmwen;43277659]i never said they are harmless. i'm saying that they are overblown. they aren't nearly as bad as the way police systematically brutalize protests when they protester doesn't show up with their "free speech permit".[/QUOTE] If you think they're overblown go look at the pictures someone posted a few pages back.

[QUOTE=JustGman;43277691]If you think they're overblown go look at the pictures someone posted a few pages back.[/QUOTE] government propaganda maaaan!

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;43277615]when you need a community of people to decide if someone is guilty of a crime or not, it comes down to how well those people end up knowing each other, no? I think it's entirely reasonable to assume committee decisions in smaller communities would result in bad decisions due to the inability to divorce emotion from justice.[/QUOTE] (according to recent recaps of internet arguments) you should be able to trust a mix of societal indoctrination towards kindness and a supposedly moral human nature to do 'the right thing'

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;43277689]So what's your opinion on what a "protest" is and what a "riot" is? Do protesters just try and change the status quo with discussion and raising awareness of issues? or are protesters the ones who throw molotovs without provocation?[/QUOTE] a riot is a more spontaneous and violent affair. it's generally because of a specific act of oppression perpetrated against a large group of people. protests turn into riots when cops move in, for example. a protest is a peaceful gathering for w/e reason. [QUOTE=Simski;43277686]how is law enforcement to protect the rights of the people not justified?[/QUOTE] they don't do that. they violate the rights of others. [editline]23rd December 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=JustGman;43277691]If you think they're overblown go look at the pictures someone posted a few pages back.[/QUOTE] i did.

Molotov Cocktails have greatly reduced harm due to the fact that it's hard as shit to even hit someone from a large distance with a bottle full of flammable liquid but if they DO hit then it's a fucking massacre that can get out of hand really fast. And even without molotovs rioters have a tendency of setting shit on fire and really persisting until the target is actually on fire, blazing and scorching, regardless of who may be hurt. In France when some riots happen there always is a case of a bus full of people and several apartments (also full of people, who are also generally asleep) getting doused in gasoline and set on fire, killing or badly burning everyone inside.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;43277716]a riot is a more spontaneous and violent affair. it's generally because of a specific act of oppression perpetrated against a large group of people. protests turn into riots when cops move in, for example. a protest is a peaceful gathering for w/e reason. [B]they don't do that. they violate the rights of others.[/B] [editline]23rd December 2013[/editline] i did.[/QUOTE] question so there is no instance of a peace officer ever protecting rights???

[QUOTE=Ganerumo;43277677]I think you are really mixing up riot and protest here. Protesters protest, rioters set shit on fire and steal stuff.[/QUOTE] Whenever a "protester" starts throwing stuff at a police line, smashing storefronts and flipping cars, it becomes a riot. Protests are supposed to be civilized.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;43277716]a riot is a more spontaneous and violent affair. it's generally because of a specific act of oppression perpetrated against a large group of people. protests turn into riots when cops move in, for example. a protest is a peaceful gathering for w/e reason. they don't do that. they violate the rights of others. [editline]23rd December 2013[/editline] i did.[/QUOTE] just as you don't include rioters in the general scheme of protesting, you shouldn't include police brutality in the scheme of law enforcement

[QUOTE=yawmwen;43277716]they don't do that. they violate the rights of others.[/QUOTE] I can't wait for you to show up in some riot and get stabbed by a bunch of dudes who want your jacket and your wallet, leaving you down and bleeding in the middle of a crowd of angry dipshits looking for shit to burn. Maybe that'd set your ideas back up a bit.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;43277716]a riot is a more spontaneous and violent affair. it's generally because of a specific act of oppression perpetrated against a large group of people. protests turn into riots when cops move in, for example. a protest is a peaceful gathering for w/e reason. they don't do that. they violate the rights of others. [editline]23rd December 2013[/editline] i did.[/QUOTE] So why would a protest ever need fire bombs? they're being peaceful and making a point. A riot is according to you, something that "all of a sudden" happens but people have firebombs already? Seems a bit pre meditated. IF, and only if they violate those rights, the people with the fucking firebombs are by your own rules, infringing on the rights of others. Unless you think you have a right to be lit on fire by fucking assholes.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;43277638]i promote anarchism because i accept the premise that "freedom is preferable to authority" and "all forms of authority must be justified".[/QUOTE] First things first. I appreciate the core of your beliefs because I too would prefer absolute freedom to authority. If everyone was an idealistic slate where there would be no abuse of the system then anarchy would work perfectly well. But people are diverse in magnificient and horrible ways. I'm all for you living a personal mantra in which if you believe you are a genuinely good person, you should fear no authority, but the actual logistics and application of such ideals is impossible to implement, even if there was a growing conscious movement for it. People are just too dissimilar, in personality and cultural upbringings, to follow an ideal without any personal variation or interpretation. These variations will inevitably lead to shifting social structures and class divisions. The whole cycle will repeat itself.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;43277716]they don't do that. they violate the rights of others.[/QUOTE] right, okay, so if i enroll, will i turn power abusive?? all your posts are embarassing to read, and you view on law enforcement is fucking awful and far from the truth

[IMG]http://publicshamingeternus.files.wordpress.com/2011/06/nathan-kotylak1.jpg[/IMG] This is a riot. Is this justifiable action by a rioter?

[QUOTE=Ganerumo;43277744]I can't wait for you to show up in some riot and get stabbed by a bunch of dudes who want your jacket and your wallet, leaving you down and bleeding in the middle of a crowd of angry dipshits looking for shit to burn. Maybe that'd set your ideas back up a bit.[/QUOTE] so you wish death and robbery upon me due to my disagreement? btw i've been robbed at gunpoint before so idk maybe put a trigger warning on that or something because i might suffer ptsd from it idk i haven't been diagnosed properly yet.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;43277716]i did.[/QUOTE] So how is that preferable to gas? Your own videos showing the brutality of tear gas just show the protestors moving out of the way.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;43277769]so you wish death and robbery upon me due to my disagreement? btw i've been robbed at gunpoint before so idk maybe put a trigger warning on that or something because i might suffer ptsd from it idk i haven't been diagnosed properly yet.[/QUOTE] I didn't say death. But since you seem to have a really hard time grasping the fact that people can be assholes (despite having been robbed at gunpoint already) and won't understand it when people tell you otherwise, it really seems like getting in a shitty situation involving a knife, your guts and a wallet would give you a better perception of what it means to be in the middle of a massive riot where people are here to stir shit up. I mean at this point you are so disconnected from reality and unable to cope with it that the only thing that could wake you up would be getting your ass kicked by one of the people you are so keen on defending for no apparent reason. For someone who got fucking robbed at gunpoint and apparently almost got set on fire by some "friends" you sure are unwilling to see how dumb people can get.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;43277769]so you wish death and robbery upon me due to my disagreement? btw i've been robbed at gunpoint before so idk maybe put a trigger warning on that or something because i might suffer ptsd from it idk i haven't been diagnosed properly yet.[/QUOTE] I would like for you to stop responding to anecdotal posts with equally anecdotal replies. I am sorry that you've been through that situation, but this is not something everyone goes through and it is accepted within our culture as a wholly bad experience. If you could please move on from counter arguing specific posts and detail me what your beliefs are and how you think your ideals would work in our current environment then I can at least see if there are any points that have validity and maybe help you to understand what can and cannot work.

[QUOTE=Lachz0r;43277627]i think what the lady done was pretty gross and i'd be pissed off if someone done it to me, but i wouldn't call it sexual violence really, although i can see how it could be construed as that. personally though, i'm a bit torn because lots of what protestors do during a protest are not things i would normally condone but in the context of a protest it becomes a bit different, and i mean, i'm completely against double standards concerning cops, yeah it was wrong and gross what she done, but it's wrong and gross that cops beat the shit out of protestors with batons and all that too[/QUOTE] personally, i'd classify it. put it this way, if a creepy stranger put his saliva in a little girl's mouth, would it be classified as sexual violence? i would.

[QUOTE=RetaDepa;43277801]I would like for you to stop responding to anecdotal posts with equally anecdotal replies. I am sorry that you've been through that situation, but this is not something everyone goes through and it is accepted within our culture as a wholly bad experience. If you could please move on from counter arguing specific posts and detail me what your beliefs are and how you think your ideals would work in our current environment then I can at least see if there are any points that have validity and maybe help you to understand what can and cannot work.[/QUOTE] i'd suggest you read whatever interests you in this: [url]http://anarchism.pageabode.com/afaq/index.html[/url] anarchism requires a lot of explanation and i am not smart or articulate enough to write it all out myself. if you find anything contentious or lacking proper explanation you can pm me and i can do my best to explain it. [editline]23rd December 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Ganerumo;43277800]I didn't say death. But since you seem to have a really hard time grasping the fact that people can be assholes (despite having been robbed at gunpoint already) and won't understand it when people tell you otherwise, it really seems like getting in a shitty situation involving a knife, your guts and a wallet would give you a better perception of what it means to be in the middle of a massive riot where people are here to stir shit up. I mean at this point you are so disconnected from reality and unable to cope with it that the only thing that could wake you up would be getting your ass kicked by one of the people you are so keen on defending for no apparent reason. For someone who got fucking robbed at gunpoint and apparently almost got set on fire by some "friends" you sure are unwilling to see how dumb people can get.[/QUOTE] i know damn well how dumb people can be. that's why i oppose giving dumb people guns and badges.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;43277857]i'd suggest you read whatever interests you in this: [url]http://anarchism.pageabode.com/afaq/index.html[/url] anarchism requires a lot of explanation and i am not smart or articulate enough to write it all out myself. if you find anything contentious or lacking proper explanation you can pm me and i can do my best to explain it.[/QUOTE] literally none of that deals with the logical problems in anarchism that many of us users have brought up in other arguments.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;43277857]i'd suggest you read whatever interests you in this: [url]http://anarchism.pageabode.com/afaq/index.html[/url] anarchism requires a lot of explanation and i am not smart or articulate enough to write it all out myself. if you find anything contentious or lacking proper explanation you can pm me and i can do my best to explain it. [editline]23rd December 2013[/editline] i know damn well how dumb people can be. that's why i oppose giving dumb people guns and badges.[/QUOTE] yet approve of giving the same dumb people molotovs and a freedom to use them? if some people are too dumb to be cops, then surely some people are too dumb to be protesters and instead become rioters.