Trump denounces Cuba, will restrict travel and reinstate embargo - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Melnek;52363915]i hate to be that dude to pull the brakes on the trump-hate-train [/QUOTE] no you don't [QUOTE=Melnek;52363915]but isn't cuba kind of still a massive corrupted shithole that regularly abuses its authority over the population in almost all aspects of life? like yeah i get the notion that befriending cuba might help the democratization process but the country has been right in the thick of it during the cold war and managed to completely reject any and all american influence, political and cultural (even military operations). so im not really sure that lifting the embargo would do anything other than legitimize the shitty cuban government.[/QUOTE] yeah I'm sure this is Trump genuinely caring about the people in Cuba living under a brutal authoritarian regime and has nothing to do with scoring political points. Oh wait [QUOTE]The GAESA concept was proposed in a bill in 2015 by Republican Sen. Marco Rubio, Rep. Mario Diaz-Balart and Florida Gov. Rick Scott. The bill went nowhere but the two, especially Rubio, urged Trump to adopt it as a centerpiece of the policy that he is scheduled to announce Friday at a Miami theater that bears the name of Manuel Artime, a leader of the failed Bay of Pigs invasion to topple Castro. A Bay of Pigs veterans group endorsed Trump a week before the election. In return, people familiar with the president’s decision-making said, Trump wanted to make good on his promise to crack down on Cuba.[/QUOTE] This is bad for American tourists, American businesses, the Cuban government, and the people of Cuba, and it's being done purely to win votes from conservative Cuban expats living in Florida, a key swing state.

[QUOTE]"Prior to that, it was not clear to some if the Obama policy toward Cuba would work; today it is clear that the Obama policy toward Cuba does not.”[/QUOTE] "oh god we're getting weird looks from everybody we just gotta own it OKAY SHUT UP WE'RE DOING A THING HERE. THIS IS WHAT WE'RE GONNA DO SO JUST SHUT UP."

[QUOTE=S31-Syntax;52363894]Jesus christ I was really hoping he'd be too distracted by Comey to actually go through with this. -sigh- are you [I]at least[/I] going to reinstate wet-foot-dry-foot?? Probably not. He doesn't give a fuck about the cuban people. So thanks dude you've put them in an even worse position than they were in before. Fuck you and every rusty cactus you rode in on.[/QUOTE] Nope [QUOTE] The Trump administration also won’t be reinstating the “wet foot, dry foot” policy, which gave safe haven to Cuban refugees who successfully reached American shores, on the basis that it encouraged Cubans to make the perilous journey across the Florida Straits. In January, the Obama administration ended the policy, which faced criticism for giving preferential treatment to Cubans over other immigrants.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Fort83;52363886]Kind of an interesting decision considering he tried to set up a business there while the embargo was in place.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;52364033]This is the man who was caught trying to get around the embargo to open a business there illegally, and now he's reinstating the embargo for no reason other than "I want to erase Obama's legacy!".[/QUOTE] You're talking about the guy who's entire business relies on globalism but ran as an anti-globalist, protectionist candidate. Kicking the ladder out from under everyone else after he reaches the top is Trump's MO.

Why the fuck is he doing this? There is literally no reason for him to shit on the progress Obama made. Stop meddling in shit that doesn't concern you, and stop ruining things that we repaired, bloody twat.

but what about cigars

well there goes my trip later this year

[QUOTE=Raidyr;52364129]no you don't yeah I'm sure this is Trump genuinely caring about the people in Cuba living under a brutal authoritarian regime and has nothing to do with scoring political points. Oh wait This is bad for American tourists, American businesses, the Cuban government, and the people of Cuba, and it's being done purely to win votes from conservative Cuban expats living in Florida, a key swing state.[/QUOTE] it's still a retarded thing to rag on trump about because it's like everyone forgot that cuba is still a shithole and should not be encouraged by lax politics and lifting embargoes that at least held some semblance of a political point, even if it was done out of an agenda of tearing down obama's legacy, instead of humanitarianism it doesnt matter if its bad for american businesses or the cuban government. european businesses also suffered because of the sanctions imposed on russia, the russian government also suffered, yet they were still necessary and you'll be hard pressed to find anyone who disagrees with this. this is the fucking point of embargoes and sanctions.

[QUOTE=butre;52364158]but what about cigars[/QUOTE] Oh dear lord, you are right Not gonna lie, but Trump slowly is on to literally become insane. At the beginning, I tried looking at his positive sides, but the only good thing about him are the memes which already died out. Oh well.

[QUOTE=Melnek;52364172]it's still a retarded thing to rag on trump about because it's like everyone forgot that cuba is still a shithole and should not be encouraged by lax politics and lifting embargoes that at least held some semblance of a political point, even if it was done out of an agenda of tearing down obama's legacy, instead of humanitarianism it doesnt matter if its bad for american businesses or the cuban government. european businesses also suffered because of the sanctions imposed on russia, the russian government also suffered, yet they were still necessary and you'll be hard pressed to find anyone who disagrees with this. this is the fucking point of embargoes and sanctions.[/QUOTE] Lifting the embargo started the slow process of removing the communist leaders from power. It's a way of telling the citizens "hey, we care about you, these chucklefucks don't." Keeping that embargo in place, or reinstating it is telling the citizens that they're trash to their government and everyone else, lowering morale and squashing chances of a revolution, peaceful or otherwise.

[QUOTE=Bird;52363879]I bet he wont do the same to Saudi Arabia which is a much worse offender in my book.[/QUOTE] Or how about Russia which he's very amiable towards. At least Cuba's been taking [I]some[/I] steps to becoming less of a shithole for its people since Fidel Castro stepped down.

[QUOTE=Melnek;52364172]it's still a retarded thing to rag on trump about because it's like everyone forgot that cuba is still a shithole and should not be encouraged by lax politics and lifting embargoes that at least held some semblance of a political point, even if it was done out of an agenda of tearing down obama's legacy, instead of humanitarianism[/QUOTE] The embargo has not fucking worked for over [B]fifty goddamn years[/B] [B][I]FIFTY goddamn years[/I][/B] How about we try a more humanitarian approach that doesn't gives the dictatorship a reason to stay in power, instead?

[QUOTE=FlakTheMighty;52364185]Lifting the embargo started the slow process of removing the communist leaders from power. It's a way of telling the citizens "hey, we care about you, these chucklefucks don't." Keeping that embargo in place, or reinstating it is telling the citizens that they're trash to their government and everyone else, lowering morale and squashing chances of a revolution, peaceful or otherwise.[/QUOTE] literally nothing supports this theory how will people in cuba be encouraged and supported by the lifting of the embargo? in which way will it start the slow process of removing the communist leaders from power? do you even know anything about the socio-political climate of cuba to be making these claims cuba doesn't even have internet access, and what isolated wi-fi hotspots there are, in mostly tourist-y places, are heavily regulated and censored by the government. the embargo has nothing to do with that. the PCC has ruled cuba for decades upon decades, and the people remain thoroughly convinced of its conduct. sort of like russia, even if no embargoes were imposed, the country would still reject democracy even when confronted with the reality of it being factually better in virtually every way to faux-communist authoritarianism.

[QUOTE=Melnek;52363915]i hate to be that dude to pull the brakes on the trump-hate-train but isn't cuba kind of still a massive corrupted shithole that regularly abuses its authority over the population in almost all aspects of life? like yeah i get the notion that befriending cuba might help the democratization process but the country has been right in the thick of it during the cold war and managed to completely reject any and all american influence, political and cultural (even military operations). so im not really sure that lifting the embargo would do anything other than legitimize the shitty cuban government.[/QUOTE] I kinda wonder why the US still does business with saudia arabia then

[QUOTE=T553412;52364235]The embargo has not fucking worked for over [B]fifty goddamn years[/B] [B][I]FIFTY goddamn years[/I][/B] How about we try a more humanitarian approach that doesn't gives the dictatorship a reason to stay in power, instead?[/QUOTE] because that would mean republicans admitting they were wrong, and if there's one thing we know is that they'd rather thousands suffer than admit they were wrong. ever.

Worth noting that yet again this story was first reported based on [URL="http://www.mediaite.com/online/trump-will-reportedly-soon-announce-rollback-of-obamas-cuba-policies/"]anonymous sources[/URL] that even namedropped Rubio.

[QUOTE=Melnek;52364241]literally nothing supports this theory [/QUOTE] [QUOTE]The U.S. embargo on Vietnam was eventually lifted in February 1994. Formal normalization of U.S.-Vietnam diplomatic relations took place in 1995, followed by booming trade volumes between the two countries in the subsequent years[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Melnek;52364241]how will people in cuba be encouraged and supported by the lifting of the embargo? in which way will it start the slow process of removing the communist leaders from power? do you even know anything about the socio-political climate of cuba to be making these claims cuba doesn't even have internet access, and what isolated wi-fi hotspots there are, in mostly tourist-y places, are heavily regulated and censored by the government. the embargo has nothing to do with that. the PCC has ruled cuba for decades upon decades, and the people remain thoroughly convinced of its conduct. sort of like russia, even if no embargoes were imposed, the country would still reject democracy even when confronted with the reality of it being factually better in virtually every way to faux-communist authoritarianism.[/QUOTE] So instead of having a starting point to open up diplomatic and economic relations that might have loosened up the governmental regulation of the markets in Cuba and lead to a more liberal atmosphere, we are back to square one, only now the United States looks like an asshole because decided to back out of yet another diplomatic agreement between nations. How many more decades of the embargo do you think are necessary to have Cuba suddenly become the democracy you want it to be?

[QUOTE=EXPLOOOSIONS!;52364244]because that would mean republicans admitting they were wrong, and if there's one thing we know is that they'd rather thousands suffer than admit they were wrong. ever.[/QUOTE] the embargo was enacted by a democrat (jfk) and strengthened by a democrat (clinton) how would it mean republicans were wrong

[QUOTE=butre;52364284]the embargo was enacted by a democrat (jfk) and strengthened by a democrat (clinton) how would it mean republicans were wrong[/QUOTE] American Foreign policy blows regardless of which party is in office.

For fuck's sake, my parents were going on a cruise there for their thirty fifth anniversary. Fucking shitstain hell.

If anything I hope this gives the Cuban leadership more time to plan on how to preserve their culture and identity. From some documentaries I've watched, the citizens are really excited and happy the embargo was lifted, but are afraid that big american businesses are going to come in and steamroll housing to cover the beachfronts with hotels and resorts and instead of seeing a classic 60s style barbershop and car on a streetcorner you'll see a Starbucks and a Prius. Short term, the influx of American tourism was great for the economy and now that it's gone anyone who banked on it staying for a while is going to be in rough times. Long term Cuba will probably continue as they used to, but knowing that lifting the embargo is something that can happen again in the future. Silver linings at least.

[QUOTE=ImUnstoppable;52364171]well there goes my trip later this year[/QUOTE] You can still fly there connecting through Mexico and/or Canada, even with your American passport. No one will give a shit. iirc they won't stamp your American passport in Havana.

Trump's literally just going through a list of everything Obama did and trying to undo it. He's probably got DARPA trying to resurrect bin Laden right now, just out of spite.

Whooh, Cuba is going to remain a cheap tourist destination for us Canadians.

[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;52364033]This is the man who was caught trying to get around the embargo to open a business there illegally, and now he's reinstating the embargo for no reason other than "I want to erase Obama's legacy!".[/QUOTE] "If I can't open a tacky hotel in Cuba, then NOBODY CAN!"

[QUOTE=Melnek;52363915]i hate to be that dude to pull the brakes on the trump-hate-train but isn't cuba kind of still a massive corrupted shithole that regularly abuses its authority over the population in almost all aspects of life? like yeah i get the notion that befriending cuba might help the democratization process but the country has been right in the thick of it during the cold war and managed to completely reject any and all american influence, political and cultural (even military operations). so im not really sure that lifting the embargo would do anything other than legitimize the shitty cuban government.[/QUOTE] emargoing it just makes it a poorer and shittier place. thats a good thing?

[QUOTE=cis.joshb;52365761]emargoing it just makes it a poorer and shittier place. thats a good thing?[/QUOTE] If it gets sufficiently poor and shitty the people will revolt and there will be a beautiful peaceful stable democracy in it's place. We just need to give time for the embargo to work. Any day now....

[QUOTE=Melnek;52364241]literally nothing supports this theory how will people in cuba be encouraged and supported by the lifting of the embargo? in which way will it start the slow process of removing the communist leaders from power? do you even know anything about the socio-political climate of cuba to be making these claims cuba doesn't even have internet access, and what isolated wi-fi hotspots there are, in mostly tourist-y places, are heavily regulated and censored by the government. the embargo has nothing to do with that. the PCC has ruled cuba for decades upon decades, and the people remain thoroughly convinced of its conduct. sort of like russia, even if no embargoes were imposed, the country would still reject democracy even when confronted with the reality of it being factually better in virtually every way to faux-communist authoritarianism.[/QUOTE] Quite interesting you chose Russia as an example and not: -Czech Republic -Estonia -Lithuania -Letovia -Croatia -Hungary -Poland ... Dude if your family has ties to the rhum or cigars industry in the US I can totally understand your position. However, should that not be the case, it's completely nonsense to back the embargo.

[QUOTE=Melnek;52364026]how is it making shit worse for cubans when they've managed just fine for the past half century of being under embargo, with state-controlled industries and a wide (yet shitty) economical network that primarily relies on self-sufficiency? so why do you disagree with the notion that cuba should be under embargo or at least, punished in one way or another by the US/international community for its abuse of power against cuban citizens, and your only issue is the fact that other authoritarian regimes are still being supported by the US (aka exactly what obama did, and what the american government has been doing ever since the cold war)[/QUOTE] Cubans have been managing forr the past half a century but you can't honestly say that removing the embargo wouldn't make things better. [editline]16th June 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=bootv2;52364252]Trump has more of a regime nowadays than Cuba has right now[/QUOTE] lol [editline]16th June 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Raidyr;52365763]If it gets sufficiently poor and shitty the people will revolt and there will be a beautiful peaceful stable democracy in it's place.[/QUOTE] works every time :downs:

[QUOTE=Raidyr;52365763]If it gets sufficiently poor and shitty the people will revolt and there will be a beautiful peaceful stable democracy in it's place. We just need to give time for the embargo to work. Any day now....[/QUOTE] Venezuela. And it doesn't even have an embargo.

[QUOTE=MarcusSmith;52367350]Venezuela. And it doesn't even have an embargo.[/QUOTE] 99% sure the post you were referring to was sarcastic. Joking that you can just ruin a country until it suddenly horseshoes itself around to being a paradise through violent revolution. History teaches us that that is never the case, the tyrant is replaced with another tyrant in disguise.