[QUOTE=godfatherk;46501295]That shirt is gonna cost billions by 2200. I'm calling it first.[/QUOTE]
"the shirt that started the war"
What's wrong with promoting sex positivity :v:
[QUOTE=Zeke129;46490103]There's judging someone based on appearance, and then there's judging someone based on what they made an active choice to wear.
It doesn't even matter if the shirt is actually sexist or not, it's fucking embarrassing and I have to question why someone so clearly stupid is operating spacecraft. I'd be saying the same thing if he was wearing a shirt for some stupid grindcore band or whatever - if you're going to be on international television you don't wear something that you know is going to alienate people.[/QUOTE]
it
is
a
[I]fucking[/I]
[B][I][U]shirt[/U][/I][/B]
whatever a person fucking wears does not equal their ability to be intelligent, as this individual clearly shows
by your logic, I bet you wear super-duper casual fucking clothes, because you're clearly stupid and hate standing out in the crowd
[QUOTE=Last or First;46498719]I think there's a fundamental difference between "she deserved to get raped/beaten/whatever because of what she was wearing" and "they deserved to be told that what they're wearing is dumb because of what they were wearing".[/QUOTE]
I don't think I've ever heard anyone from a civilized country say a woman deserved to get raped because she was wearing sexy clothing. Maybe some ass backwards religious extremists, but you can't possibly say that's a dominant opinion in the west.
There's been people that said it wasn't smart, but that falls in the same category as people saying it's not smart to walk in a park late at night, alone, with your wallet half sticking out of your pants. You don't deserve to get robbed, but you make yourself an easy target in an environment where there are terrible people looking to take advantage of it.
The guy wearing that lewd shirt also falls into that same category. It's dumb for him to wear that shirt, but you cannot possibly claim he deserved to be hounded and harassed to tears, saying his team's accomplishments now mean nothing because of a dumb shirt.
It's just typical SJW hypocrisy. I can do it, you can't. If you do it, I will sic my army on you. If I do it and you give me lip about it, it's harassment/misogyny/whatever.
[QUOTE=BrickInHead;46502250]wait though are you actually saying that a professional wearing a highly sexualized shirt in an office environment is acceptable?
this is sexual harassment 101. [B]whether or not you claim it's misogyny is completely irrelevant[/B], it's extremely clear to anyone that wearing a shirt like that can easily make someone feel uncomfortable. especially one that features only one of the sexes.
i'd be fucking uncomfortable if i strolled into work and saw a woman wearing a shirt that featured scantily clad highly sexualized buff dudes.
it doesn't need to escalate to the level that it has, but this sort of thing - the shirt - is this innocent thing that the guy doesn't intend to hurt or make anyone uncomfortable. but this one little innocent thing piles up with a ton of innocent other little things and creates this overarching culture that pushes many women away from the field.[/QUOTE]
False. The uproar wasn't about it being unprofessional. The uproar was about it being sexist and misogynistic, so it's not irrelevant. In fact, it's the very reason for the harassment he received.
[QUOTE=BrickInHead;46502250]wait though are you actually saying that a professional wearing a highly sexualized shirt in an office environment is acceptable?
this is sexual harassment 101. whether or not you claim it's misogyny is completely irrelevant, it's extremely clear to anyone that wearing a shirt like that can easily make someone feel uncomfortable. especially one that features only one of the sexes.
i'd be fucking uncomfortable if i strolled into work and saw a woman wearing a shirt that featured scantily clad highly sexualized buff dudes.
it doesn't need to escalate to the level that it has, but this sort of thing - the shirt - is this innocent thing that the guy doesn't intend to hurt or make anyone uncomfortable. but this one little innocent thing piles up with a ton of innocent other little things and creates this overarching culture that pushes many women away from the field.[/QUOTE]
I'm pretty sure that if someone in that dude's environment asked him to not wear this kind of stuff, he'd put it away immediately, because he apologized after someone far outside of his workplace felt uncomfortable while most other people would just tell them to fuck off, they don't work with him, they can't decide his dress code.
[QUOTE=Silence I Kill You;46502802]False. The uproar wasn't about it being unprofessional. The uproar was about it being sexist and misogynistic, so it's not irrelevant. In fact, it's the very reason for the harassment he received.[/QUOTE]
i don't give a shit about the uproar i said in that post you just read that there was no reason for it to escalate to the level that it has
however that said the shirt is still completely unprofessional and inappropriate for a workplace, and any education in a sexual harassment training would've showed that. as such whether or not it is misogyny or sexism is, again, irrelevant.
I cant believe there is an 11 page argument over a stupid shirt lol.
[QUOTE=BrickInHead;46503141]the shirt is still completely unprofessional and inappropriate for a workplace.[/QUOTE]
Not your place to decide, sorry. His higher-ups and colleagues were okay with the shirt.
[QUOTE=gudman;46503128]I'm pretty sure that if someone in that dude's environment asked him to not wear this kind of stuff, he'd put it away immediately, because he apologized after someone far outside of his workplace felt uncomfortable while most other people would just tell them to fuck off, they don't work with him, they can't decide his dress code.[/QUOTE]
you're quite right. sexual harassment is a very individualized thing; if no one in his workplace felt uncomfortable, then it's fine. but the problem with that is that there's no way you're going to know if it makes anyone feel uncomfortable, because most people aren't going to stop you and tell you that your shirt is making them uncomfortable because that would make them a massive jerk, or they get the sense that you wouldn't care, etc, etc - as such, usually the way to approach it is simply to wear work appropriate attire
[QUOTE=Canuhearme?;46500989]Imagine being this determined to try and justify derailing the entire focus of a monumental scientific accomplishment and drive a scientist to tears over something fucking trivial.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Last or First;46500935]As I said earlier, I do think that they went too far.[/QUOTE]
Imagine having this little reading comprehension. I'm not trying to justify it, I'm saying that they would have been right if they didn't go so far and only said that it was unprofessional.
[QUOTE=Zephyrs;46501618]Don't know if it's been posted already, but you can (potentially) buy the shirt here: [url]http://www.alohaland.com/hawaiian-shirts[/url]
Randomly stumbled across it on a thread on this on another forum. Apparently this is her site, and she designs these things for a living. Personally, I wouldn't pay 60 dollars for it, but someone might be interested.[/QUOTE]
He should have worn [url=http://www.alohaland.com/whats-new/party-time-skulls]this one[/url] or [url=http://www.alohaland.com/pinup-girls-guys/wranglers]this one[/url].
[QUOTE=V12US;46502667]I don't think I've ever heard anyone from a civilized country say a woman deserved to get raped because she was wearing sexy clothing. Maybe some ass backwards religious extremists, but you can't possibly say that's a dominant opinion in the west.
There's been people that said it wasn't smart, but that falls in the same category as people saying it's not smart to walk in a park late at night, alone, with your wallet half sticking out of your pants. You don't deserve to get robbed, but you make yourself an easy target in an environment where there are terrible people looking to take advantage of it.[/QUOTE]
You [url=http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk/4453820.stm]would[/url] [url=http://www.icmresearch.com/media-centre/press/amnesty-international-sexual-abuse]be[/url] [url=http://www.icmresearch.com/data/media/pdf/2005_november_amnesty_international_sexual_abuse.pdf]surprised[/url].
And I'm not sure it's a good idea to compare a woman's body to a wallet.
I can't imagine that attitudes would have changed [I]that[/I] much over only 10 years. I would like to hope that the percentages have gone down, but I doubt they've changed drastically.
[url=http://www.vawpreventionscotland.org.uk/sites/default/files/Havens_Wake_Up_To_Rape_Report_Summary.pdf]Here's[/url] a more recent survey, where it says that there's still roughly 28% who believe dressing provocatively means you're partially responsible for rape. (Scroll down to page 9 near the bottom)
It was an online survey, though, so it's a bit less trustworthy than the previous one, which used phone calls iirc.
There was another survey this year, but it was in Brazil, so I'm not sure if you would count that or not.
[QUOTE=BrickInHead;46503173]you're quite right. sexual harassment is a very individualized thing; if no one in his workplace felt uncomfortable, then it's fine. but the problem with that is that there's no way you're going to know if it makes anyone feel uncomfortable, because most people aren't going to stop you and tell you that your shirt is making them uncomfortable because that would make them a massive jerk, or they get the sense that you wouldn't care, etc, etc - as such, usually the way to approach it is simply to wear work appropriate attire[/QUOTE]
I agree, but look, that guy probably wasn't the first time among people, right? Quite the opposite, he worked in his collective for quite some time on Rosetta. He must've known that sure as hell isn't going to make anyone of his colleagues uncomfortable. Futhermore, he wasn't reprimanded by his superiors for wearing that shirt. I mean, if anyone felt uncomfortable, they would at least tell his superiors to force him? That wasn't the case, evidently.
While I personally really wouldn't wear something like that in a historic moment in front of cameras (unless I could cover it by something else, like a jacket), - because I'm easily embarrassed, - but he certainly didn't break any rules om his particular environment. And if that's the case, I can't find any reason for him not to do it.
Do men flip out and scream misandry when a woman wears a shirt with hunks in speedos?
I've never seen that before but now i want to
[QUOTE=Canuhearme?;46500693]Do you see anything wrong with people getting so ass-blasted at his clothes that he had to tearfully give an apology?[/QUOTE]
I think it's just as justified as the rest of the internet flooding the front pages with hundreds of posts saying "stop being offended, IDIOTS!" or "why don't YOU make a comet-lander!!!" to the point where I haven't even seen any of these "ass-blasted" responses aside from the few highlight screenshots from twitter and tumblr.
Like, this happens on forums like this over any kind of gender/sex related controversy. Vocal minority blows it up, rest of the internet has a fit, people who didn't want the guy's head on a pike are completely ignored or lumped in with the rest of them.
And I'd love to see any reasonable rebuttal to the following question that isn't a typical "its just a shirt lol" or "what have you done with your life" or "wrong" because I haven't seen a reply that isn't accompanied by some kind of insult or hasty generalization.
The shirt was a poor choice to wear on TV. Why or why not?
[editline]16th November 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=Canuhearme?;46500989]Imagine being this determined to try and justify derailing the entire focus of a monumental scientific accomplishment and drive a scientist to tears over something fucking trivial.[/QUOTE]
This is another thing I don't get, holy shit.
How many tabs do you guys have up in your browser right now? How many chat windows?
Surely you guys don't just have one tab and one thread open up at one time and focus on JUST that while you're on the internet. It's completely and ENTIRELY possible for a human being to care about different things at the same time with varying levels of magnitude.
Right now I think the Rosetta science comet stuff is awesome, I'm thinking about what videogame to play, thinking about what I'm going to draw when I'm in school tomorrow, thinking about my hair, and maybe once in a while when I am reminded of it (every second) I think about that dude's tshirt, and a bunch of other equally "meaningless" bullshit. But I guess I can't do that because everyone who criticizes the shirt is a mindless robot that HATES science.
Honestly, if you think my criticism of this dude's tshirt is trying to ~derail the entire focus of a scientific accomplishment~ and was a deliberate attempt to make the dude cry, I don't know what to think.
chill the fuck out milk
[QUOTE=V12US;46502667]It's just typical SJW hypocrisy. I can do it, you can't. If you do it, I will sic my army on you. If I do it and you give me lip about it, it's harassment/misogyny/whatever.[/QUOTE]
You know you say this in pretty much every thread and I've yet to see these types posting here, so who are you arguing against? Am I somehow supposed to represent and account for these people? I'd gladly do that if you're willing to account for every creepy misogynistic online, dude.
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;46503931]I think it's just as justified as the rest of the internet flooding the front pages with hundreds of posts saying "stop being offended, IDIOTS!" or "why don't YOU make a comet-lander!!!" to the point where I haven't even seen any of these "ass-blasted" responses aside from the few highlight screenshots from twitter and tumblr.
Like, this happens on forums like this over any kind of gender/sex related controversy. Vocal minority blows it up, rest of the internet has a fit, people who didn't want the guy's head on a pike are completely ignored or lumped in with the rest of them.
And I'd love to see any reasonable rebuttal to the following question that isn't a typical "its just a shirt lol" or "what have you done with your life" or "wrong" because I haven't seen a reply that isn't accompanied by some kind of insult or hasty generalization.
The shirt was a poor choice to wear on TV. Why or why not?
[editline]16th November 2014[/editline]
This is another thing I don't get, holy shit.
How many tabs do you guys have up in your browser right now? How many chat windows?
Surely you guys don't just have one tab and one thread open up at one time and focus on JUST that while you're on the internet. It's completely and ENTIRELY possible for a human being to care about different things at the same time with varying levels of magnitude.
Right now I think the Rosetta science comet stuff is awesome, I'm thinking about what videogame to play, thinking about what I'm going to draw when I'm in school tomorrow, thinking about my hair, and maybe once in a while when I am reminded of it (every second) I think about that dude's tshirt, and a bunch of other equally "meaningless" bullshit. But I guess I can't do that because everyone who criticizes the shirt is a mindless robot that HATES science.
Honestly, if you think my criticism of this dude's tshirt is trying to ~derail the entire focus of a scientific accomplishment~ and was a deliberate attempt to make the dude cry, I don't know what to think.[/QUOTE]
your 'tism is flaring up again
Why is this still going
snip l8 aas fuck
[editline]16th November 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;46503931]
The shirt was a poor choice to wear
[/QUOTE]
OPINION, jesus christ this whole post is an opinion piece.
His shirt isn't a problem, the outrage over a fucking shirt is.
Is finding woman attractive sexist? Jesus Christ next you're gonna tell me Jack Dawson was a huge dickbag because he drew women naked. It's ridiculous that anything to do with a female body can label you some type of asshole
get a grip milk
[QUOTE=HWECQI;46504129]Why is this still going[/QUOTE]
Because milkandcooki arrived.
It was only a matter of time
again, what separates this incident from any other form of internet harassment?
nobody cares if some teenager on the internet gets trolled and raided into a psychological breakdown, but a scientist cries over self-righteous pricks getting pissy about a shirt and people rush to his defense.
the reason is, again, the political element. this thread would be nowhere near 11 pages if the guy was picked on for something else that was completely unrelated, but because it was committed by ¡the SJWs! it needs an immense amount of attention.
[QUOTE=BrickInHead;46503141]i don't give a shit about the uproar i said in that post you just read that there was no reason for it to escalate to the level that it has
however that said the shirt is still completely unprofessional and inappropriate for a workplace, and any education in a sexual harassment training would've showed that. as such whether or not it is misogyny or sexism is, again, irrelevant.[/QUOTE]
That's not up to you though. Professionalism is context-dependent. For example, If I'm CEO of a company, I'll turn up to work in a fucking onesie for all I care.
[editline]16th November 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=joes33431;46504562]again, what separates this incident from any other form of internet harassment?
nobody cares if some teenager on the internet gets trolled and raided into a psychological breakdown, but a scientist cries over self-righteous pricks getting pissy about a shirt and people rush to his defense.
the reason is, again, the political element. this thread would be nowhere near 11 pages if the guy was picked on for something else that was completely unrelated, but because it was committed by ¡the SJWs! it needs an immense amount of attention.[/QUOTE]
Not really, the reason this has got so much attention is because of how absurd the allegations are, especially on the cusp of a fucking insane development in science.
[QUOTE=joes33431;46504562]again, what separates this incident from any other form of internet harassment?
nobody cares if some teenager on the internet gets trolled and raided into a psychological breakdown, but a scientist cries over self-righteous pricks getting pissy about a shirt and people rush to his defense.
the reason is, again, the political element. this thread would be nowhere near 11 pages if the guy was picked on for something else that was completely unrelated, but because it was committed by ¡the SJWs! it needs an immense amount of attention.[/QUOTE]
no one is talking about "SJW" and your argument is full of hypothesis derailing from what actually happened
[QUOTE]nobody cares if some teenager on the internet gets trolled and raided into a psychological breakdown[/QUOTE]
there's been tons of threads about these situations in the past and everyone cared, stop imagining things to help your flawed logic
Of course people are going to defend him, he did nothing wrong and he still was humiliated over an absurd and unnecessary reason
[QUOTE=joes33431;46504562]again, what separates this incident from any other form of internet harassment?
nobody cares if some teenager on the internet gets trolled and raided into a psychological breakdown, but a scientist cries over self-righteous pricks getting pissy about a shirt and people rush to his defense.
the reason is, again, the political element. this thread would be nowhere near 11 pages if the guy was picked on for something else that was completely unrelated, but because it was committed by ¡the SJWs! it needs an immense amount of attention.[/QUOTE]
Because this scientist has actually done something useful for humanity
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;46503931]
Like, this happens on forums like this over any kind of gender/sex related controversy. Vocal minority blows it up, rest of the internet has a fit, people who didn't want the guy's head on a pike are completely ignored or lumped in with the rest of them.
[/QUOTE]
That's how these things work on the internet I guess. All feminists are obviously crazy many haters who blow up at the slightest opportunity and want him fired for a shirt. Just like everyone who supports gamergate is a crazy misogynist who sends death threats to every woman who makes them the slightest bit angry.
And various elements on both sides just escalate these false caricatures higher and higher until everyone's afraid of each other and nothing positive can be done. I mean it's not even like a real revolution where one side can kill the other (not that I'm saying that's a preferable alternative), we're just stuck in a limbo where everyone feels shitty and hates one another.
[QUOTE=Gwoodman;46504599]no one is talking about "SJW" and your argument is full of hypothesis derailing from what actually happened[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Fatfatfatty;46490171]If [del]women[/del] SJW's dont feel welcome in the science community because of a shirt, the problem is probably more with them rather than the guy wearing the shirt. It's all in their head. I bet he's great guy with a strange fashion sense.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=NeverGoWest;46490180]Can't we just define SJWism as a mental disease already?
They gotta be some flavor of insane to flip their shit over a fucking shirt.
Its not even like it says "I hate all women" or anything like that, it actually [B]celebrates[/B] women.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=V12US;46502667]It's just typical SJW hypocrisy. I can do it, you can't. If you do it, I will sic my army on you. If I do it and you give me lip about it, it's harassment/misogyny/whatever.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=MadPro119;46489091][QUOTE]"feminism is self defeating"[/QUOTE]
Something I read somewhere.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=buro;46489963]-greentext story about tumblr stereotypes-[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Gwoodman;46504599]there's been tons of threads about these situations in the past and everyone cared, stop imagining things to help your flawed logic
Of course people are going to defend him, he did nothing wrong and he still was humiliated over an absurd and unnecessary reason[/QUOTE]
i'm not suggesting that he deserved the harassment he got. it's a shirt. but the stock advice for anyone else on the internet who's harassed is to ignore it, get over it, and move on. and that's for shit like death threats and vitriol, not simply being baselessly called a misogynist.
an individual cannot tell the harassed and bullied to "get over it" and "stop getting so offended", placing the blame on the victim, and then in the same breath indict the people who harassed this guy; it's the same hypocrisy that people accuse "SJWs" of, but hypocrisy is not specific to an ideology, it's specific to being a human being.
[QUOTE=froztshock;46504680]That's how these things work on the internet I guess. All feminists are obviously crazy many haters who blow up at the slightest opportunity and want him fired for a shirt. Just like everyone who supports gamergate is a crazy misogynist who sends death threats to every woman who makes them the slightest bit angry.
And various elements on both sides just escalate these false caricatures higher and higher until everyone's afraid of each other and nothing positive can be done. I mean it's not even like a real revolution where one side can kill the other (not that I'm saying that's a preferable alternative), we're just stuck in a limbo where everyone feels shitty and hates one another.[/QUOTE]
This.
Feel really sorry for this guy right now, first a bunch of lunatic keyboard warriors harass him over his wacky shirt, and now im seeing him celebrated on a bunch of dumb facebook pages as a sexist hero who battles feminism (and considering being accused of sexism really upset him, i doubt he wants to be new face of putting women in their place online).
Youd think everyone would just be excited about the scientific achievement here, but lol nope lets turn this guy's shirt into another excuse to break out the retarded boyz vs girlz shit again.
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