Tesla’s new range of Supercharger stations will be allowed to other manufacturers, so long as they k
94 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Banhfunbags;45805911]Why not?[/QUOTE]
Haven't you watched The Simpsons? According to the Gasoline Producers of America, they don't go very fast or very far. And if you drive one people will think that you're gay. Those guys make a lot of money, I'm inclined to trust their opinion.
[QUOTE=Shogoll;45809077]This is actually a very good point - I'm pretty sure most collisions requiring structural repair to the Tesla is going to necessitate replacement of the battery pack, since any damage to the lithium batteries could have some pretty catastrophic consequences further down the line. I don't imagine that kind of replacement is very cheap.[/QUOTE]
Isn't there also one motor per wheel? Meaning it's a possibility that a side impact to a wheel could send the driveshaft into the motor, or at least cause some damage to it, warranting a replacement?
I would imagine that these repairs won't be cheap for the first few years, if not longer. This would be reflected in your insurance costs. HOWEVER, I'm sure once they become more prevalent, and parts become cheaper, these costs will go down, and therefore coverage prices would go down.
It just seems like common sense to me to wait and see how it turns out. I don't have to have a tesla. I would like one for its practicality, but I'm not an enthusiast about them like I am with ICE muscle/sports cars. I'm also not trying to discourage anyone from them. If it excites you, then by all means, get one and share your experience with it. For me, it's not worth the unknown risks at the moment.
[QUOTE=Silence I Kill You;45809253]Isn't there also one motor per wheel? Meaning it's a possibility that a side impact to a wheel could send the driveshaft into the motor, or at least cause some damage to it, warranting a replacement?
I would imagine that these repairs won't be cheap for the first few years, if not longer. This would be reflected in your insurance costs. HOWEVER, I'm sure once they become more prevalent, and parts become cheaper, these costs will go down, and therefore coverage prices would go down.
It just seems like common sense to me to wait and see how it turns out. I don't have to have a tesla. I would like one for its practicality, but I'm not an enthusiast about them like I am with ICE muscle/sports cars. I'm also not trying to discourage anyone from them. If it excites you, then by all means, get one and share your experience with it. For me, it's not worth the unknown risks at the moment.[/QUOTE]
One motor for rear axle. One in front too only if you have awd package which you can't get yet.
[editline]26th August 2014[/editline]
I'm not sure what the current rate of production is for motor units, but it's getting faster each month. It's also a thing they make replacement stock for, though I think there's still a wait list. I'm not sure abou collision but for malfunctioning parts, Tesla will come pick up your car, send it to nearest Tesla shop and fix it, then ship it back. I'd assume it's the same for collision repair unless the structure is fubar. Not sure on average time in shop.
I remember when people said an all electric car would be impossible because of the battery size.
Look whos laughing now.
[QUOTE=Zeke129;45809172]Haven't you watched The Simpsons? According to the Gasoline Producers of America, they don't go very fast or very far. And if you drive one people will think that you're gay. Those guys make a lot of money, I'm inclined to trust their opinion.[/QUOTE]
I've driven my brother-in-law's Model S and I have to say, I wouldn't mind if people though I was gay for owning one because they're amazing. Then again, I wouldn't mind being gay in general.
[QUOTE=ironman17;45804441]A very rare breed in this kind of world. Hopefully he won't end up like Tesla did, and instead more like Jonas Venture, but more fortunate.[/QUOTE]
You mean Rusty Venture right?
[QUOTE=OvB;45809652]One motor for rear axle. One in front too only if you have awd package which you can't get yet.
[editline]26th August 2014[/editline]
I'm not sure what the current rate of production is for motor units, but it's getting faster each month. It's also a thing they make replacement stock for, though I think there's still a wait list. I'm not sure abou collision but for malfunctioning parts, Tesla will come pick up your car, send it to nearest Tesla shop and fix it, then ship it back. I'd assume it's the same for collision repair unless the structure is fubar. Not sure on average time in shop.[/QUOTE]
I see. But you still get my point. I would like to see how these costs come out to play when they are more mainstream, because the increase in production will drive costs down, but by how much is the question. Also, it will be seeing how far they will go before "totaling" the Tesla. I'm just waiting to see how the costs are going to play out once they are as common as your everyday vehicles. It's the same reason I NEVER buy a car that has the "NEW" engine design in it. You always wait a few years until they've produced them enough for A) part costs to go down and B) all the bugs to be worked out.
[QUOTE=Zeke129;45809172]Haven't you watched The Simpsons? According to the Gasoline Producers of America, they don't go very fast or very far. And if you drive one people will think that you're gay. Those guys make a lot of money, I'm inclined to trust their opinion.[/QUOTE]
[URL="http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-07-29/elon-musk-battles-montgomery-burns-in-simpsons-episode.html"]Speaking of the Simpsons, Elon Musk is literally going to bankrupt Mr. Burns.[/URL]
Really just wating for their battery pack swapper stations to go in
I dunno about you but a supercharger station isn't going to be useful to me at all if I'm actually driving cross country or a few states over.
Having to stop every 3 hours for 30 minutes on a trip isn't great. Means for every 8-9 hours you drive, you'd need to burn at least and hour/hour and a half sitting waiting for your car to charge. Would be much nicer if the range was larger on the Teslas or it took much quicker. Coast-to-coast driving would take almost an extra days worth of driving in a tesla just from waiting around for your car to charge.
[QUOTE=Mister_Jack;45805781]I still won't drive an EV.[/QUOTE]
I'd totally drive a Tesla as my everyday car. I'd never have one as my only car though, not just because of range and top speed, and weight being better in ICE cars but because it's a different experience. The gears, the sound, etc. are things that really make driving an enjoyable experience for me, and if you asked me to choose between EV and ICE I'd have to go with ICE. Mostly because of "muh feels", I admit.
But if someone gave me a Tesla Roadster or a Model S, you think I'd complain? You crazy. It'd be perfect for my daily commute. Travelling 35km every day in a non-turbo 1.5 gasoline Lancer gets expensive.
Although, for Portugal, EV's aren't really viable at the moment. Especially if you can't charge it at home (if you're city folk and live in an apartment).
[QUOTE=KorJax;45810224]Really just wating for their battery pack swapper stations to go in
I dunno about you but a supercharger station isn't going to be useful to me at all if I'm actually driving cross country or a few states over.
Having to stop every 3 hours for 30 minutes on a trip isn't great. Means for every 8-9 hours you drive, you'd need to burn at least and hour/hour and a half sitting waiting for your car to charge. Would be much nicer if the range was larger on the Teslas or it took much quicker. Coast-to-coast driving would take almost an extra days worth of driving in a tesla just from waiting around for your car to charge.[/QUOTE]
Battery swapping won't actually be a thing. It was an idea and they showcased it but it's obvious that it won't work out.
Also I wouldn't mind a road trip taking a bit longer if I could do it for free.
Don't know about you, but whenever I'm on a roadtrip 3 hours or longer I stop on the way to eat lunch/dinner and take a leak. That's easily 30 mins of stop time.
[QUOTE=Im Crimson;45813068]Don't know about you, but whenever I'm on a roadtrip 3 hours or longer I stop on the way to eat lunch/dinner and take a leak. That's easily 30 mins of stop time.[/QUOTE]
You do make a good point. Being forced to stop after every 3 hours or so isn't that bad since a lot of people would probably do so anyways.
[QUOTE=Im Crimson;45813068]Don't know about you, but whenever I'm on a roadtrip 3 hours or longer I stop on the way to eat lunch/dinner and take a leak. That's easily 30 mins of stop time.[/QUOTE]
Keep in mind its likely closer to 2-3 hours. You'd get about 200-225 miles of range going highway speeds. If you've ever done a roadtrip before where you are travelling 5000+ miles round trip, you do not want to be stopping every 225 miles for more than a few minutes to stretch the legs, take a leak and fill the tank. Sure, have lunch or whatever on one of those pitstops - that'll easily take up 30min-1hr of time. But generally when traveling longer distances you want to keep all but "main" stops to a minimum. On road trips I want to do at least 300-450 miles before taking a longer break. If you swap drivers you can increase that even more - driving from Ohio to Nevada this is what we did. 36 hour drive, mostly straight shotting it but swapping drivers at every fill up. 8 hours worth of driving per day would take so much longer if I had to wait 30 minutes every 225 miles I drove. And this is assuming wherever you are staying for the night is going to have a hookup for you as well, otherwise you have to drive first thing in the morning to a supercharger and wait 30 minutes before you can even start the next leg of your trip.
The latter point is a big thing when travelling just out of state for a day to get something/do something/etc - Driving 200 miles isn't a big deal to do in one shot on a full tank of gas, but where you are going is not likely to have a charging station right next to it if you are doing an EV. So you have to add an extra 30-45 minutes of round trip travel time to get to a charging station and charge on your drive back, instead of just driving straight back when you are done with whatever you are doing out of state.
Point is, Tesla's aren't really practical at all for out of state driving right now. I'm really hoping they increase the charge speed or the range to a point where it becomes convenient. Imagine if your charge station was full too - you'd have to wait FAR more than 30 minutes for a spot to open up and for you to complete your charge. You simply can't have that. Imagine if every gas station required people to spend 30 minutes at the pump, they would be backed up for hours if there was any real demand for gas.
[QUOTE=KorJax;45815696]Keep in mind its likely closer to 2-3 hours. You'd get about 200-225 miles of range going highway speeds. If you've ever done a roadtrip before where you are travelling 5000+ miles round trip, you do not want to be stopping every 225 miles for more than a few minutes to stretch the legs, take a leak and fill the tank. Sure, have lunch or whatever on one of those pitstops - that'll easily take up 30min-1hr of time. But generally when traveling longer distances you want to keep all but "main" stops to a minimum. On road trips I want to do at least 300-450 miles before taking a longer break. If you swap drivers you can increase that even more - driving from Ohio to Nevada this is what we did. 36 hour drive, mostly straight shotting it but swapping drivers at every fill up. 8 hours worth of driving per day would take so much longer if I had to wait 30 minutes every 225 miles I drove. And this is assuming wherever you are staying for the night is going to have a hookup for you as well, otherwise you have to drive first thing in the morning to a supercharger and wait 30 minutes before you can even start the next leg of your trip.
The latter point is a big thing when travelling just out of state for a day to get something/do something/etc - Driving 200 miles isn't a big deal to do in one shot on a full tank of gas, but where you are going is not likely to have a charging station right next to it if you are doing an EV. So you have to add an extra 30-45 minutes of round trip travel time to get to a charging station and charge on your drive back, instead of just driving straight back when you are done with whatever you are doing out of state.
Point is, Tesla's aren't really practical at all for out of state driving right now. I'm really hoping they increase the charge speed or the range to a point where it becomes convenient. Imagine if your charge station was full too - you'd have to wait FAR more than 30 minutes for a spot to open up and for you to complete your charge. You simply can't have that. Imagine if every gas station required people to spend 30 minutes at the pump, they would be backed up for hours if there was any real demand for gas.[/QUOTE]
Just because it'd take a bit longer to drive 5000 miles or whatever doesn't make it impractical at all. You're just being overdramatic.
[QUOTE=KorJax;45815696]
Point is, Tesla's aren't really practical at all for out of state driving right now. I'm really hoping they increase the charge speed or the range to a point where it becomes convenient. Imagine if your charge station was full too - you'd have to wait FAR more than 30 minutes for a spot to open up and for you to complete your charge. You simply can't have that. Imagine if every gas station required people to spend 30 minutes at the pump, they would be backed up for hours if there was any real demand for gas.[/QUOTE]
While you are certainly right in that driving extreme distances are not practical with our current range of electric cars, I get the impression that this is kind of like saying sedans aren't very practical because it's hard use one to transport a stove or refrigerator - We should be using trucks. 100% valid concern, but perhaps not very relevant to the vast majority of trips made by car.
You could say it's a problem that electric cars cannot currently act as a substitute for IC cars in all cases in an infrastructure built entirely around IC cars. The important question is however if we think this undermines the point in adoption of electric cars or if it's acceptable that we can find work-arounds for those cases until technology catches up.
[QUOTE=KorJax;45815696]Keep in mind its likely closer to 2-3 hours. You'd get about 200-225 miles of range going highway speeds. If you've ever done a roadtrip before where you are travelling 5000+ miles round trip, you do not want to be stopping every 225 miles for more than a few minutes to stretch the legs, take a leak and fill the tank. Sure, have lunch or whatever on one of those pitstops - that'll easily take up 30min-1hr of time. But generally when traveling longer distances you want to keep all but "main" stops to a minimum. On road trips I want to do at least 300-450 miles before taking a longer break. If you swap drivers you can increase that even more - driving from Ohio to Nevada this is what we did. 36 hour drive, mostly straight shotting it but swapping drivers at every fill up. 8 hours worth of driving per day would take so much longer if I had to wait 30 minutes every 225 miles I drove. And this is assuming wherever you are staying for the night is going to have a hookup for you as well, otherwise you have to drive first thing in the morning to a supercharger and wait 30 minutes before you can even start the next leg of your trip.
The latter point is a big thing when travelling just out of state for a day to get something/do something/etc - Driving 200 miles isn't a big deal to do in one shot on a full tank of gas, but where you are going is not likely to have a charging station right next to it if you are doing an EV. So you have to add an extra 30-45 minutes of round trip travel time to get to a charging station and charge on your drive back, instead of just driving straight back when you are done with whatever you are doing out of state.
Point is, Tesla's aren't really practical at all for out of state driving right now. I'm really hoping they increase the charge speed or the range to a point where it becomes convenient. Imagine if your charge station was full too - you'd have to wait FAR more than 30 minutes for a spot to open up and for you to complete your charge. You simply can't have that. Imagine if every gas station required people to spend 30 minutes at the pump, they would be backed up for hours if there was any real demand for gas.[/QUOTE]
The 30 minute mark is, IIRC, for a 100% charge. If I remember right, up to 80% is 15 minutes then another 15 to 100% because of how the batteries need to be charged.
Could have the #s wrong though.
Also: what a lot of people that are pointing out fuel economy are forgetting is that the huge roof over the supercharger stations is covered in solar panels to help reduce the station and car's carbon footprint.
[QUOTE=draugur;45809866]You mean Rusty Venture right?[/QUOTE]
Well Rusty was generally more of a failure than his father Jonas Venture. He was a great boy adventurer but wasn't too good at the science part, expect for the genetic engineering side of things. Hell one of the show's main themes is the failure of the characters, like the Monarch failing to defeat and destroy Rusty on countless occasions, the aforementioned failings of Rusty in terms of his super-science career, Dr Orpheus being so dedicated to his duty of cosmic preservation that he lost his wife to his layabout student known as the Outrider, the list goes on.
Hell even Jonas wasn't immune to failure, wherein he wasn't a very good father. One of his greatest inventions, the learning beds, were built as a way to educate his son without needing to take time away from super-science and adventures around the world.
Speaking of Jonas Venture, he was indeed the premier superscientist of his time, but in the end he was killed while Rusty was still in college. That's what I meant by "like Jonas Venture only more fortunate", in that Musk wouldn't be killed by an unknown party at the height of his career, as opposed to Nikola Tesla who had all these great ideas, but in the end history caused him to die in poverty with debts, despite selling his A/C patents.
[QUOTE=Telepethi;45817042]The 30 minute mark is, IIRC, for a 100% charge. If I remember right, up to 80% is 15 minutes then another 15 to 100% because of how the batteries need to be charged.
Could have the #s wrong though.
Also: what a lot of people that are pointing out fuel economy are forgetting is that the huge roof over the supercharger stations is covered in solar panels to help reduce the station and car's carbon footprint.[/QUOTE]
Actually it takes around 40 minutes to hit the 80% mark, which is the recommended max that you should charge your car to preserve battery capacity and life.
[url]http://www.teslamotors.com/supercharger[/url]
Yeah I said it might have been wrong. There's also the battery swap option too.
[url]http://www.teslamotors.com/batteryswap[/url]
And let's be honest if you're on a long road trip and you can afford a Tesla you'll probably have a spare battery or two.
[QUOTE=Telepethi;45819591]Yeah I said it might have been wrong. There's also the battery swap option too.
[url]http://www.teslamotors.com/batteryswap[/url]
And let's be honest if you're on a long road trip and you can afford a Tesla you'll probably have a spare battery or two.[/QUOTE]
Notice how that page is underdeveloped though. I remember reading an article awhile back with Tesla saying the battery swap probably won't be a thing.
Also I don't think you quite understand how big the battery in the Model S is if you think you could drive with a spare battery.
You could probably get it swapped out at a dealer.
[QUOTE=Telepethi;45821230]You could probably get it swapped out at a dealer.[/QUOTE]
I'm not exactly sure if that is how that works but I don't know too much about the battery swaps to dispute that.
If battery swap works as advertised, they will be installed at existing supercharger stations to make "Tesla Stations." You would swap your battery for a replacement and pick your original up later. Personally I think it should work like Propane tanks but then you got damage and maintenance to worry about.
[QUOTE=OvB;45825977]If battery swap works as advertised, they will be installed at existing supercharger stations to make "Tesla Stations." You would swap your battery for a replacement and pick your original up later. Personally I think it should work like Propane tanks but then you got damage and maintenance to worry about.[/QUOTE]
Why pick up your original?
Just have one universal battery type, have a bunch of them at a station charging and people can have them switched out.
I don't know. Probably something to do with ownership of the battery and maintenance. Also, only the Model S and Model X will be on that chassis with that battery. The Model III is going to have a smaller chassis.I'm not sure how that's going to work.
Battery Swap won't work because the capacity of a battery depends on how good the owner takes care of it. People could easily treat their battery like shit and swap it out for a better one and some unlucky guy who takes good care of his battery is given the shit battery.
Obviously there are more reasons why it won't work but that's just one reason.
[QUOTE=Banhfunbags;45826740]Battery Swap won't work because the capacity of a battery depends on how good the owner takes care of it. People could easily treat their battery like shit and swap it out for a better one and some unlucky guy who takes good care of his battery is given the shit battery.
Obviously there are more reasons why it won't work but that's just one reason.[/QUOTE]
That's why as of right now you have to come back for your battery or they send you the bill for the one you took.
[QUOTE=EcksDee;45826018]Why pick up your original?
Just have one universal battery type, have a bunch of them at a station charging and people can have them switched out.[/QUOTE]
Because someone else probably doesn't want your 3 year old battery
[QUOTE=OvB;45827059]That's why as of right now you have to come back for your battery or they send you the bill for the one you took.[/QUOTE]
That wouldn't exactly be plausible for road trips then. Also it should already cost money to swap battery packs. According to the video, you could charge for free, or pay money to swap batteries for faster.
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