CIA abducted anti-Gaddafi militants in early 2000s and handed them over to Tripoli - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Boba_Fett;32117578]I don't think he deserves one, considering how much we have stuck out necks out for him lately. We've given him missile and air support and we've invested millions of dollars into the rebellion. That more than makes up for it.[/QUOTE] It doesn't take much to say "sorry for illegally abducting you".

[QUOTE=Jsm;32118899]It doesn't take much to say "sorry for illegally abducting you".[/QUOTE] Perhaps, but it also doesn't take much to move on about the past. The fact that we came to his aid to help him overthrow his government should be enough of an apology. It was a very risky move for us to take, because if the rebels failed, we would have made ourselves another international enemy.

[QUOTE=Mr. Sun;32117681]Well I am surprised. I know the bush administration gets a lot of shit but I doubt all the other people and representatives that make up our government would let something like this slide especially way back when when we first tried to take down Ghadaffi. I'm sketchy over this source BBC has gotten. Or maybe my brain is just compensating because I cannot believe the US and UK would condone something like this :/[/QUOTE] The US have been doing this for years, its what all the extraordinary rendition stuff is about. Person gets abducted (I won't use the word arrested here, because it isn't an arrest), flown to a country that has no problem torturing prisoners and is friendly with the US, prisoner gets interrogated with questions provided by the CIA and then afterwards the US takes the prisoner somewhere else. Its alleged by various people that MI6 have done it as well, but there isn't as much evidence of it was with the CIA stuff (From what I can tell, most of the knowledge of this stuff comes from people who experience it and then take the US to court)

[QUOTE=Jsm;32118980]The US have been doing this for years, its what all the extraordinary rendition stuff is about. Person gets abducted (I won't use the word arrested here, because it isn't an arrest), flown to a country that has no problem torturing prisoners and is friendly with the US, prisoner gets interrogated with questions provided by the CIA and then afterwards the US takes the prisoner somewhere else. Its alleged by various people that MI6 have done it as well, but there isn't as much evidence of it was with the CIA stuff (From what I can tell, most of the knowledge of this stuff comes from people who experience it and then take the US to court)[/QUOTE] I forget the name of the guy, but I used his case as an example in a school paper last year, but there was a man abducted by the CIA and isolated/tortured for a few weeks or months, and was then dropped off in a completely different country from where he was from when they realized they had the wrong man. He had a similar name, and they made a spelling mistake. German citizen, I believe, muslim. Italy and Germany have also brought cases against the US and CIA for abducting their citizens. None of them have ever come to an end, though, since some other deal was always made. There's also the case for that one major gun runner that they based Lord of War off of, where the Thai courts refused to hand him over to US custody and wanted to try him in Thailand, so we illegally exfiltrated him from prison in Thailand and flew him out of the country. And iirc, close to half or more of Guantanamo's occupants have been seized (abducted) without permission of the nation they resided or the nation of their citizenship, and I believe the UK actually made an issue over there being 2 or 3 British citizens in Gitmo without British permission to be imprisoned by the US. We do this alot, actually. None of this is even during the Cold War, where this shit probably ran rampant.

[QUOTE='[Seed Eater];32119191']I forget the name of the guy, but I used his case as an example in a school paper last year, but there was a man abducted by the CIA and isolated/tortured for a few weeks or months, and was then dropped off in a completely different country from where he was from when they realized they had the wrong man. He had a similar name, and they made a spelling mistake. German citizen, I believe, muslim. [/QUOTE] That's just terrible, but not uncommon it seems there is a person mentioned on Wikipedia who was abducted by the CIA because they mistranslated something. [quote]In 2003, an Algerian named Laid Saidi was abducted in Tanzania and taken to Afghanistan, where he was imprisoned and tortured along with Khalid El-Masri.[84] His detention appears to have arisen through a mistranslation of a telephone conversation, in which U.S. officials believed he was speaking about airplanes (tairat in Arabic) when he had in fact been speaking about tires (tirat in Arabic). [/quote]

[QUOTE=Jsm;32119465]That's just terrible, but not uncommon it seems there is a person mentioned on Wikipedia who was abducted by the CIA because they mistranslated something.[/QUOTE] This is the guy. I got the nationality wrong and it wasn't that name, but a word mistranslated. My mistake, it's been a while since I read about it.

Come on, [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libyan_Islamic_Fighting_Group]Libyan Islamic Fighting Group[/url] are Al Qaeda.

[QUOTE=eight-zero-one;32119772]Come on, [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libyan_Islamic_Fighting_Group]Libyan Islamic Fighting Group[/url] are Al Qaeda.[/QUOTE] Are you being sarcastic? Because the article sees to point towards the opposite conclusion.

[QUOTE='[Seed Eater];32119833']Are you being sarcastic? Because the article sees to point towards the opposite conclusion.[/QUOTE] Officially they claim not to be involved, but that's a load of shit. They serve the same purpose of al Qaeda, establishing an Islamist state. Libya under these fuckers would be no different than Afghanistan under the Taliban. According to the article, 2 al Qaeda members (one of which is in the group) said they had joined them, and the al Qaeda still imply this. Leaders of the LIFG have been quite involved with the al Qaeda. Even if they're not with al Qaeda, they're still Islamist and backwards as fuck.

[img]http://i.imgur.com/mUugN.jpg[/img] (Thanks SA)

[QUOTE=smurfy;32094490][url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-14774533[/url] • Documents found at the Libyan spy chief's office show that from 2002-04 the CIA abducted several militants and handed them over to Tripoli, provided questions for the Libyan interrogators to ask, and were actually present at some interrogations. • One of those abducted was Abdel Hakim Belhaj, a key member of the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group who now commands anti-Gaddafi forces in Tripoli. He says he was indeed abducted but 'holds no grudge' to the Americans. • Additionally, MI6 apparently handed Tripoli details of a Libyan dissident recently released from a UK prison, and helped him write a speech for his 2004 meeting with Tony Blair.[/QUOTE] time changes, we used to like Osama aswell. We also had good relations with the middle east in the past

You're missing the point. This article shows how aggressive US foreign policy can be. If they no longer see you as necessary, or if you aren't doing enough for NATO and their lapdogs, they'll let you be overthrown. We didn't have good relations with the Middle East (except for Jordan, Saudi Arabia for the most part, and Kuwait after the US-Iraqi Gulf War)... We supported Israel, labeled the PLO freedom fighters as terrorists, supported Turkey's inhumane treatment of the Kurds while condeming Saddam's, and a load of other shit.

Ahh, the clusterfuck that is our foreign policy...

This is why I'm wondering if we shouldn't close our borders, break off all ties with the world and just have a strict policy of isolationism. It's not a great idea, but it might solve a lot of our worst problems. Oh well, the CIA's done a whole hell of a lot worse than this, that's for sure. Plus, this really isn't that big of a deal, there's more important things going on in the world.

[QUOTE=eight-zero-one;32120196]You're missing the point. This article shows how aggressive US foreign policy can be. If they no longer see you as necessary, or if you aren't doing enough for NATO and their lapdogs, they'll let you be overthrown. We didn't have good relations with the Middle East (except for Jordan, Saudi Arabia for the most part, and Kuwait after the US-Iraqi Gulf War)... We supported Israel, labeled the PLO freedom fighters as terrorists, supported Turkey's inhumane treatment of the Kurds while condeming Saddam's, and a load of other shit.[/QUOTE] True, but it's not like it's anything new. We've know that this has been the US policy for over half a century. The enemy of your enemy is your friend, but who the enemy happens to be can shift pretty quickly.

uh yeah hasn't the CIA been doing this kind of thing for about forever?

[QUOTE='[Seed Eater];32119191']I forget the name of the guy, but I used his case as an example in a school paper last year, but there was a man abducted by the CIA and isolated/tortured for a few weeks or months, and was then dropped off in a completely different country from where he was from when they realized they had the wrong man. He had a similar name, and they made a spelling mistake. German citizen, I believe, muslim.[/QUOTE] That's [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khalid_El-Masri]Khamid El-Masri[/url]

[QUOTE=Derubermensch;32120329]Ahh, the clusterfuck that is our foreign policy...[/QUOTE] "Ahh, the clusterfuck that is foreign policy..." Would be better, every country runs into problems like this.

Turns out the world isn't black and white, and attitudes change over the years. How is this a surprise to anyone.

David Cameron has said this is "some bad shit" and there will be an inquiry [url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-14786924[/url]

[QUOTE=smurfy;32132153]David Cameron has said this is "some bad shit" and there will be an inquiry [url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-14786924[/url][/QUOTE] Well alright then.

Uhhuh so this is why UK and US took their time :v: [QUOTE=Matriax;32129431]Turns out the world isn't black and white, and attitudes change over the years. How is this a surprise to anyone.[/QUOTE] Advocating torture is allright if we do it collectively and all repeat it's OK ten times.

[QUOTE=Falchion;32142644]Uhhuh so this is why UK and US took their time :v: [/QUOTE] Also explains why the British embassy (which according to Libyan people on the news had various spies in it) was cleared out quite quickly when the uprising became serious.

Yeah, this tends to be the same "We like people no matter what they do as long as it doesn't harm us" attitude that seems to be going around.