Edward Snowden claims British spooks are spying on your phone - Polidicks

[QUOTE=taipan;48839560]I really dont care if they are spying on me as long as it helps to prevent terrorist attacks and track down criminals.[/QUOTE] This is such a horrible and damaging mindset to have. Like holy fuck. Its also been proven that the NSA has done fuckall to prevent any terrorist attack. They are literally just hoarding as much information on as many people as they can. They arent doing this either to be protective, if you really believe that then god damn. I find it pretty fucked up that their seems to be people just straight up content with this bullshit happening. This isnt a good thing at all and its not going to lead to anything good. [editline]6th October 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=A_Pigeon;48840073]What a racist titlee[/QUOTE] Either a lame joke or you dont know that "spooks" has been a very common term for "FBI" type agents.

[QUOTE=EdvardSchnitz;48839833]Are you you implying Snowden makes up this stuff?[/QUOTE] It's not that far out to assume he does. He's provided nothing to back up or support the majority of his claims and is openly working for Russian propaganda agencies who have a long standing reputation of making up anything they can to support the great and glorious eternal president Putin by smearing his enemies.

[QUOTE=asteroidrules;48840386]It's not that far out to assume he does. He's provided nothing to back up or support the majority of his claims and is openly working for Russian propaganda agencies who have a long standing reputation of making up anything they can to support the great and glorious eternal president Putin by smearing his enemies.[/QUOTE] Yes those documents he leaked where just photoshops, obviously. the government did nothing wrong

[QUOTE=asteroidrules;48840386]It's not that far out to assume he does. He's provided nothing to back up or support the majority of his claims and is openly working for Russian propaganda agencies who have a long standing reputation of making up anything they can to support the great and glorious eternal president Putin by smearing his enemies.[/QUOTE] So Edward Snowden is like you?

[QUOTE=asteroidrules;48840386]It's not that far out to assume he does. He's provided nothing to back up or support the majority of his claims and is openly working for Russian propaganda agencies who have a long standing reputation of making up anything they can to support the great and glorious eternal president Putin by smearing his enemies.[/QUOTE] Umm.. You know that you can access a lot of the leaks and check them out yourself? If you did that, you would maybe see that it's ridiculous to say that it's faked. And please post your source where snowden is openly claiming to work for "Russian propaganda agencies" ?

[QUOTE=Instant Mix;48839652]As a wise man once said, those who sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither Another great philospher once wrote "naughty naught very naughty", but the point still remains. You should not remotely be OK with people snooping on your every move. You are actively allowing 1984 to become a reality.[/QUOTE] I prefer Niven's quotes about it. F × S = k. The product of Freedom and Security is a constant. To gain more freedom of thought and/or action, you must give up some security, and vice versa. and Giving up freedom for security is beginning to look naïve.

I'm not sure they have the time or resources to listen in on all of you that seem worried. My guess is they nly use this technology when they deem it to be necessary. A friend of mine who worked in Telecoms at the time told me about some software that monitors landline calls listening for certain "keywords" and when enough of these "keywords" are used, the user is then elevated for more scrutiny. After he told me I used to randomly say stuff that I thought might be amongst these "keywords" whenever he called me, when he realised he put the phone down. I must stress that I have not had any surprise visits though. [QUOTE]also here's a better source because why is op linking dailymail[/QUOTE] News is news.

Lol I'd like to see the jacks try and spy on my phone.

[QUOTE=Datsun;48839780]I dunno, it seems that every once in awhile he makes a new claim of [insert government] spying on their people via [insert technology]. What's next Russia? Kudos for the whole NSA thing but after awhile, it just boils down to "Everyone is Spying on Everyone".[/QUOTE] And until recently, everyone would turn around and call anyone who said that a crazy conspiracy theorist. We apparently need a steady flow of information to keep mass spying in the public consciousness

[QUOTE=graymic;48839820]Except, they are not mutually exclusive...[/QUOTE]So why is one right okay to care about but the other is irrelevant? Please, explain that, because that goes against everything I believe in. [QUOTE=CrumbleShake;48840933]And until recently, everyone would turn around and call anyone who said that a crazy conspiracy theorist. We apparently need a steady flow of information to keep mass spying in the public consciousness[/QUOTE]Precisely this. If I was Snowden I'd make this perfectly clear too, so people were well aware I wasn't just "trying to stay relevant" and actually slowly reminding them why I did what I did. Then again I'd be a hell of a lot more anonymous than Snowden is, better to remain an interesting shadow than an uninteresting nerd who self-exiled to Russia. People would probably take me more seriously if they could conjure up an image of who I was in their own heads.

[QUOTE=taipan;48839560]I really dont care if they are spying on me as long as it helps to prevent terrorist attacks and track down criminals.[/QUOTE] It doesn't.

Breaching of data privacy should follow the same standards as any search by police. Meaning they shouldn't be allowed to do it unless the target is officially being suspected of something

[QUOTE=HoodedSniper;48840590]So Edward Snowden is like you?[/QUOTE] No. Unlike asteroidrules, Edward Snowden has some actual credibility.

They literally cannot tell you if this system is good because they won't disclose the amount of "terrorist" attacks, thus its either a lot of stopped attacks or its none at all.

[QUOTE=Pvt. Martin;48839564]Seriously Edward now sounds like he just wants to stay relevant.[/QUOTE] I'm more confused on how he gets all this information from being a contractor

at this point he could say anything and we'd believe him and i believe him

[QUOTE=taipan;48839560]I really dont care if they are spying on me as long as it helps to prevent terrorist attacks and track down criminals.[/QUOTE] You should oppose them for two reasons: They have no right to invade your privacy without reason. If you lived in the UK your tax money would be paid to them to invade your privacy. Perhaps you don't care about your own privacy, but surely you care that your money is being paid to fund the invasion of your privacy? This isn't even taking into account that they don't stop terrorism or criminal behaviour with blanket privacy invasion.

I'd be ok with this if they proactively used the information to stop crimes/terrorism before it happens(hello person of interest) Instead it seems they're just building a database of people.

[QUOTE=Map in a box;48848161]I'd be ok with this if they proactively used the information to stop crimes/terrorism before it happens(hello person of interest) Instead it seems they're just building a database of people.[/QUOTE] How do you know they haven't stopped terrorist attempts? I mean there's practically no way of knowing unless someone leaks that kind of info since that shit's classified in the first place.

[QUOTE=CrumbleShake;48840933]And until recently, everyone would turn around and call anyone who said that a crazy conspiracy theorist. We apparently need a steady flow of information to keep mass spying in the public consciousness[/QUOTE] Eh I think that a fairly large portion of people knew that secret service agencies have had similar capability for a fairly long time. The bigger question is how routine said spying is, rather than if it's possible.

[QUOTE=Instant Mix;48839652]As a wise man once said, those who sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither Another great philospher once wrote "naughty naught very naughty", but the point still remains. You should not remotely be OK with people snooping on your every move. You are actively allowing 1984 to become a reality.[/QUOTE] [quote]First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a Socialist. Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a Trade Unionist. Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a Jew. Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.[/quote] It's an old quote, and in the wrong context, but it is easy to adapt to this situation. Also, for people who still don't know much about Snowden, I suggest you watch Citizenfour, it was recorded right after Snowden left Hawaii for China. [media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XiGwAvd5mvM[/media]

[QUOTE=IceBlizzard;48839606]Arguing that you don't care about the right to privacy because you have nothing to hide is no different than saying you don't care about free speech because you have nothing to say.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=HoodedSniper;48840235]This is such a horrible and damaging mindset to have. Like holy fuck. Its also been proven that the NSA has done fuckall to prevent any terrorist attack. They are literally just hoarding as much information on as many people as they can. They arent doing this either to be protective, if you really believe that then god damn. [/QUOTE] I have been spouting this opinion everywhere for years. And everywhere people react the same. I still have never, ever had anyone come up with solid evidence as to why a normal goverment collecting big data or even spying on its subjects is actually a bad thing. Im getting the impression that people dont know, and are just following the general trend which says civilians should despise spying and edward snowden is cool. The only "bad" argument ive ever heard, is the one that in the 1940's the synagogue's had a list of all the jews that where a member of it. Making it easy for the Nazi's to track them down. Then again, every church in the world still has a members list. So apparently we got over it. Im gonna read 1984, maybe that will help understand your point. [editline]7th October 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=Riutet;48847670]You should oppose them for two reasons: They have no right to invade your privacy without reason. If you lived in the UK your tax money would be paid to them to invade your privacy. Perhaps you don't care about your own privacy, but surely you care that your money is being paid to fund the invasion of your privacy? [/QUOTE] No, why would the NSA have a 11 Billion dollar budget, just to invade random people's privacy. What do they have to gain that warrants 11$ dollars in tax payers money. As long as nobody can answer that, I am gonna presume that those 11 billion $'s are actually helping to keep the country safe.

[QUOTE=taipan;48852924]I have been spouting this opinion everywhere for years. And everywhere people react the same. I still have never, ever had anyone come up with solid evidence as to why a normal goverment collecting big data or even spying on its subjects is actually a bad thing. Im getting the impression that people dont know, and are just following the general trend which says civilians should despise spying and edward snowden is cool. The only "bad" argument ive ever heard, is the one that in the 1940's the synagogue's had a list of all the jews that where a member of it. Making it easy for the Nazi's to track them down. Then again, every church in the world still has a members list. So apparently we got over it. Im gonna read 1984, maybe that will help understand your point. [editline]7th October 2015[/editline] No, why would the NSA have a 11 Billion dollar budget, just to invade random people's privacy. What do they have to gain that warrants 11$ dollars in tax payers money. As long as nobody can answer that, I am gonna presume that those 11 billion $'s are actually helping to keep the country safe.[/QUOTE] Specifically talking about the US here, my issue is that it is a breach of a citizens right to privacy, and because the NSA has blatantly lied to congress on multiple occasions about spying on US citizens. In truth I have nothing to hide from the NSA, I'm not a terrorist nor do I have any intention of ever becoming one; But that doesn't change the fact the NSA is unapologetically bulk spying on US Citizens, ignoring wiretap laws, and creating security vulnerabilities in products. They're spending $11,000,000,000 on facilities like the one in my state, where they're bulk storing domestic communications, we have direct evidence (from Snowden) that they are intercepting traffic at common peering points and piping it back to Bluffdale for storage and indexing. It's far worse in the UK, as they don't have as strong legal protections, and according to Snowden, effectively all digital communications in the UK are logged and can be searched through like Google. If you actually care about learning why people are concerned, I don't recommend reading 1984, I recommend these: [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Brother_(Doctorow_novel)"]Little Brother[/URL]: Fictional story based in reality, a good read for understanding the implications for an organization like the NSA. You can also [URL="http://craphound.com/littlebrother/download/"]read it free[/URL] online. [URL="http://amzn.com/0142180491"]This Machine Kills Secrets[/URL]: About Wikileaks and why people leak, it also talks in depth about cryptography and the NSA's extents. [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Snowden_Files"]The Snowden Files[/URL]: Details Snowden's career and why he chose to become a whistleblower, IMO a must read if you're talking about the NSA leaks.