Maricopa Co. Sheriff's Office: "9 points of forgery" in Obama's birth certificate - Polidicks

[QUOTE=zombini;51537157]Keep in mind, if this is true then it means that the President of the United States forged a document that is vital to one's identity and lied to the entire United States of America. Regardless of if he actually is a citizen or not, it's still a lie and a felony offense. It casts a lot of doubt on just who he is and why he'd do this. I didn't believe it at first when a friend linked me to the r/the_donald thread about it. I checked through some of the "sources" there and dismissed it as total bullshit. I then dug around a bit deeper and found the actual news conference. I watched it entirely, and that's some pretty solid proof that they found something wrong with it. I hate to say this, but they're probably right. It's too much wrong with the document to not be intentional. Also if people would actually read/watch the sources instead of automatically dismissing it as bullshit without digging into it at all, or repeat "He's only got a month left, leave him alone, he's still a citizen" like a broken record, we wouldn't have problems with fake news or corporate meddling in this fucking country.[/QUOTE] There is also the possibility that the documents [B]are[/B] forged, but the other way around. That is, that Obama's certificate is legitimate, and that the "original" certificate has been, in fact, the one that was tampered with. [B]That is[/B] assuming that they can back this nonsense with something more solid that a Powerpoint presentation. Furthermore, the timing of this whole thing is just...off. Like, they had about eight years, eight [U]goddamn[/U] years, to make this stuff public, and they decide to make the big reveal when Obama has less than [I]three months[/I] in office? So either they have terrible [B]terrible[/B] timing (if so they better have some solid 24k gold to blow us all away. This year being 2016, I wouldn't bat an eyelash), [B][I]OR[/I][/B] they have just dug out the carcass of a long-dead horse, hung it in the middle of a plaza and began to play pinata with it (And that's just pathetic)

[QUOTE=T553412;51537299]There is also the possibility that the documents [B]are[/B] forged, but the other way around. That is, that Obama's certificate is legitimate, and that the "original" certificate has been, in fact, the one that was tampered with.[/QUOTE] Ok this is some ace attorney shit

[QUOTE=T553412;51537299] Furthermore, the timing of this whole thing is just...off. Like, they had about eight years, eight [U]goddamn[/U] years, to make this stuff public, and they decide to make the big reveal when Obama has less than [I]three months[/I] in office? So either they have terrible [B]terrible[/B] timing (if so they better have some solid 24k gold to blow us all away. This year being 2016, I wouldn't bat an eyelash), [B][I]OR[/I][/B] they have just dug out the carcass of a long-dead horse, hung it in the middle of a plaza and began to play pinata with it (And that's just pathetic)[/QUOTE] Timing doesn't seem really relevant to whether or not something is true or false. If the aforementioned video is honest and not pulling some Photoshop revisionism, then there are some things that are undeniably odd. Just supposition but I also don't really see how Obama's birth certificate being used to create a forgery makes sense. It would be a thousand times more cooincidental having the POTUS, whom is acussed of faking his birth certificate, having his birth certificate used to create a forgery for some random person.

[QUOTE=MadPro119;51537165]Either intentional straw man fallacy or you didn't bother to really watch any of this. [media]http://youtu.be/jk3KRxTfkLM[/media][/QUOTE] One look at the source material will tell you that the video is fucking garbage. No one can peer review it because it's on a projector and it's quality is raped to hell when you have people filming it with a camera and later uploaded on youtube as a bootleg. Like I noticed that two words that are claimed to be the same are not,but I can't say for sure because it could be due to low quality jpeg raped caused by the creator's poor handling of documents. [img]http://i.imgur.com/1u55m03.png[/img] Source video used: [url]http://www.wnd.com/2016/12/investigators-find-source-for-obamas-online-birth-certification-image/[/url] (Under "THE EVIDENCE") Unless there is a crystal clear copy of both Obama's and Ah'Nee's birth certificate with comparisons, you can't say for sure. [editline]16th December 2016[/editline] [img]http://i.imgur.com/dV0uzs6.png[/img] Like just look at the quality of Obama's birth certificate on the white house website. Compare to the blurred trash that I just posted. Source: [url]https://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/rss_viewer/birth-certificate-long-form.pdf[/url]

[QUOTE=MadPro119;51537253]Watch this [URL]https://youtu.be/8frqVINnQjc?t=1m16s[/URL] and tell me again they are making things up.[/QUOTE] Ok, watched it to completion for the 3rd time now. They are making things up.

Woah man you blew that sheriffs department out of the water! What was I thinking, they didn't even have proper image quality!! (Where did you even get that "mistake" from?) [img]http://i.imgur.com/CZfeHf7.jpg[/img]

[QUOTE=MadPro119;51537450]Woah man you blew that sheriffs department out of the water! What was I thinking, they didn't even have proper image quality!! (Where did you even get that "mistake" from?) [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/CZfeHf7.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE] [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/OSYA8cN.png[/IMG] Thanks for the better image quality, it really points out how different these two are. Especially the H's.

[QUOTE=ROFLBURGER;51537339] [img]http://i.imgur.com/1u55m03.png[/img] [/QUOTE] Its about relevant positioning. There are 5 instances that when transferred over as a group, line up all together with Obama's. The likelihood of that happening by human hand (even when stamped) is near zero. [editline]16th December 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=1/4 Life;51537459][IMG]http://i.imgur.com/OSYA8cN.png[/IMG] Thanks for the better image quality, it really points out how different these two are. Especially the H's.[/QUOTE] Obviously, we here at Facepunch are not forensic document analysts. Unless you are? Anyway, you clearly don't understand anything about compression or images if you think that proves anything compared to the case presented in the video.

[QUOTE=MadPro119;51537460]Its about relevant positioning. There are 5 instances that when transferred over as a group, line up all together with Obama's. The likelihood of that happening by human hand (even when stamped) is near zero. [/QUOTE] only 5 instances out of who knows how many that aren't lining up on the document, it sounds like cherrypicking confirmation bias to me

[QUOTE=MadPro119;51537450]Woah man you blew that sheriffs department out of the water! What was I thinking, they didn't even have proper image quality!! (Where did you even get that "mistake" from?) [img]http://i.imgur.com/CZfeHf7.jpg[/img][/QUOTE] Which things exactly are supposed to be copied over?

[QUOTE=MadPro119;51537460]you clearly don't understand anything about compression or images[/QUOTE] Nope, just work with images, compression, and fonts/kerning for a living. Total layman, don't mind me.

[QUOTE=Naught;51537464]only 5 instances out of who knows how many that aren't lining up on the document, it sounds like cherrypicking confirmation bias to me[/QUOTE] That's the first 5 indicators as they say. There are 4 more. Do you honestly think, if this is a forgery, that they would really lift all the required assets from one document? Its not cherrypicking when it is statistically impossible.

[QUOTE=MadPro119;51537473] Do you honestly think, if this is a forgery, that they would really lift all the required assets from one document?[/QUOTE] Do you honestly think if they went through all the effort of making the individual elements look different to the source one, to the point that the text isn't even the same width, that they would also ensure everything they placed match positioning to one of their source documents despite how easy it would be to shift around a couple words? Either they're the most professional AND the most incompetent document forgers ever, or you're reaching conspiratard levels of stretch.

[QUOTE=1/4 Life;51537471]Nope, just work with images, compression, and fonts/kerning for a living. Total layman, don't mind me.[/QUOTE] Than you should know by the fact alone that these are not the originals and have been possibly uploaded, compressed, downloaded, compressed, unknowable amounts of times so its useless to try and conduct a forensic investigation using them.

[QUOTE=MadPro119;51537460]Its about relevant positioning. There are 5 instances that when transferred over as a group, line up all together with Obama's. The likelihood of that happening by human hand (even when stamped) is near zero.[/QUOTE] Upon further investigation, they didn't use stamps. They used typewriters apparently.

[QUOTE=MadPro119;51537473]That's the first 5 indicators as they say. There are 4 more. Do you honestly think, if this is a forgery, that they would really lift all the required assets from one document? Its not cherrypicking when it is statistically impossible.[/QUOTE] if you look at everyone that's born and has birth certificates, you'll likely find a bunch that have a good bit in common, in terms of placement of writing and things like that. This applies to pretty much anything. Why would they even bother being so incompetent to replace almost everything but leave a few things in there for...no real reason? It isn't statistically impossible whatsoever for some things to be lined up the same.

[QUOTE=1/4 Life;51537476]Do you honestly think if they went through all the effort of making the individual elements look different to the source one, to the point that the text isn't even the same width, that they would also ensure everything they placed match positioning to one of their source documents despite how easy it would be to shift around a couple words? Either they're the most professional AND the most incompetent document forgers ever, or you're reaching conspiratard levels of stretch.[/QUOTE] I don't believe the claim that the sheriffs are making. I will wait for further scrutiny that I'm sure will follow after this. However I will defend the sheriff's claims for the sake of devils advocate and to spur further inquiries for both sides. Arpaio is batshit and I hope this is too.

[QUOTE=MadPro119;51537486]However I will defend the sheriff's claims [B]for the sake of devils advocate [/B]and to spur further inquiries for both sides.[/QUOTE] oh goodness gracious. the quest for balance will be the downfall of man.

[QUOTE=MadPro119;51537480]Than you should know by the fact alone that these are not the originals and have been possibly uploaded, compressed, downloaded, compressed, unknowable amounts of times so its useless to try and conduct a forensic investigation using them.[/QUOTE] [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/utMl4ek.png[/IMG] If you can make Obama's H look anything like the nasty looking one on the right there by resizing or compressing, I'll shut up and buy your story. [QUOTE=MadPro119;51537480]the originals and have been possibly uploaded, compressed, downloaded, compressed, unknowable amounts of times so its useless to try and conduct a forensic investigation using them.[/QUOTE] All the more reason why this entire investigation is a sham.

[QUOTE=1/4 Life;51537493][IMG]http://i.imgur.com/utMl4ek.png[/IMG] If you can make Obama's H look anything like the nasty looking one on the right there by resizing or compressing, I'll shut up and buy your story. All the more reason why this entire investigation is a sham.[/QUOTE] But your now ignoring their original point of relevant positioning.

I have trouble taking anything relating to the birther theory seriously, because it began with no factual grounding, just dubious extrapolation. As far as I understand, there was nothing to suggest that Obama wasn't a native born American, other than "His father is Kenyan, so he might be too." Also, you tend to need to show people your birth certificate for things, a passport or a driver's license for instance. So he would have had to forge an American birth certificate when he was young, or he just happened to make his way to be a government worker without having to show it to anyone. Otherwise there would be people out there who may have seen his "real" birth certificate who could have come forward. If it turned out to be true, that Obama wasn't a natural born citizen, then it would have been incredible luck on the birther's part that their baseless guess was accurate.

[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;51536863]Even if it was fake, at this point, does it matter? Has he destroyed the country? Did he sell out to China and Russia? No. He was a fine president overall. Better than what's about to happen. Honestly, this just sounds like more bullshit leftover from when he first ran in 2008. It won't amount to anything.[/QUOTE] How was he a fine President? He signed laws that were absolutely shitty. The national debt is insanely high and Obamacare doesn't even work well. The black community is completely disappointed in his "change" and "hope" agenda. He completely ignored these communities and didn't address the real problems that America faces.

[QUOTE=MadPro119;51537496]But your now ignoring their original point of relevant positioning.[/QUOTE] Relevant positioning can easily be dismissed if you understand how typewriters and monospacing works. Think of scanning a form you need to fill out, going into your paint program, and filling in information using just 1 text box using a monospace font. Chances are, a lot of the shit is going to be in the same position because a typewriter is just 1 big custom stamp on a page. Do you want to know how they found this woman's birth certificate? They didn't just ask the government to hand over all birth certificates for that hospital. They looked for all people born at the same hospital as Obama, the same year as Obama, and the same month as Obama. They wanted to find as many similarities as possible because they know that typewriters are well formated to the point where if you compared two people's birth certificates together, you're going to find some similarities in position. It's the kind of logic that crazies use to validify the stories of UFO abductions. [media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEaucytiEwM[/media] I'm willing to bet good money that there are several other birth certificates that look near the same as obama's birth certificate. They don't present those because they only need one.

obama could be from the ass end of mars, i'd still prefer 8 more years of him over 4 years of trump

lmao do we get one of these every time trump does some more dumb shit. all I can do is laugh at this point. I'm so sorry for all of you.

This isn't news tudd, it's a nonsense conspiracy theory and I legitimately don't understand why you posted it.

[QUOTE=Lambeth;51537941]This isn't news tudd, it's a nonsense conspiracy theory and I legitimately don't understand why you posted it.[/QUOTE] Well it was a press event that did happen. Had some other person posted it, people would just complain on why the birther thing is still going on or what is the evidence. Which is what the real debate is ultimately. Instead it's, "Tudd posted it, he must be trying to subvert us!" for simply posting news some of yall don't like. Coming from the guy who announced that he completely believed a fake assault story, even with no actual evidence, it's not like you are an arbiter of what is real or fake anyways.

No one else posted though, I don't think most people have thought about the birther conspiracy in years. [QUOTE=Tudd;51538000]Coming from the guy who announced that he completely believed a fake assault story, even with no actual evidence, it's not like you are an arbiter of what is real or fake anyways.[/QUOTE] congratulations for being right that one time.

[QUOTE=Lambeth;51538016]No one else posted though, I don't think most people have thought about the birther conspiracy in years.[/QUOTE] As in sources? [url]http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-joe-arpaio-obama-20161214-story.html[/url] [url]https://www.theatlantic.com/news/archive/2016/12/sheriff-joe-arpaio-the-birther/510857/[/url] People can argue the actual content though. That is sort of the reason why I posted this story. Not because of your fantasy that I actually am trying to convert people to the birther movement. Otherwise if you mean just people who post in SH this. It's just whoever posts the content generally first and then the occasional accidental 2nd copy of that headline. As simple as that really. [editline]16th December 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Lambeth;51538016] congratulations for being right that one time.[/QUOTE] Well you looked like an utter fool criticizing people for questioning illogical circumstances and then boast who needs evidence unless it is contrary.

[QUOTE=Tudd;51538000]Instead it's, "Tudd posted it, he must be trying to subvert us!" for simply posting news some of yall don't like.[/QUOTE] it's conspiracy bollocks that was refuted a fucking decade ago - its a waste of space and time and I don't get why you would post it unless you planned on riling up people if you want to do that just post articles about 9/11 attacks being planned by bush or global warming being a myth or some shit