[QUOTE=gudman;42332197]Femen actively seeks an opportunity to get punched, locked up, get injured or w/e. This way they can receive funding from gullible people.
That's the only reason I can come up with to explain all the idiotic shit they pull.[/QUOTE]
So they're basically the Westboro Baptist Church of feminism? They go and stir up shit just to get a reaction in the hopes of getting money?
[QUOTE=En Ex;42336315]I could totally see Femen as a terrorist faction in Counter-Strike, bombing a fashion show or taking models hostage.
The counter-terrorists would, of course, be the fashion police.[/QUOTE]
[img]http://horobox.co.uk/u/Reag_1380393435.jpg[/img]
I think terrorists win.
[QUOTE=Zyler;42333027]I find it highly unlikely there are no women in those individual and particular companies, to even suggest that women don't work in those companies just because the 'face' of the company is a man seems misogynistic.[/QUOTE]
male-dominated, not male exclusive
[QUOTE=Zyler;42333027]If that isn't what you mean, then that's fine, you just need to be a little bit more clear about what you mean in the future.[/QUOTE]
i think its terribly unfair that i have to be more clear about things i never talked about in the first place. you leveled accusations at me.
[QUOTE=Zyler;42333027]I think it has everything to do with what we're arguing here because it proves what I'm saying, which is that the issue of conforming to impossible to reach ideals is a human one, and not exclusively feminist because it doesn't just have to do with women.[/QUOTE]
ill concede that its not exclusively feminist but i dont know what exclusivity has to do with what i said.
[QUOTE=Zyler;42333027]You don't have to be skinny to be healthy and vice versa, but the problem with eating nothing but crap fast food is a health one, not a fashion one.[/QUOTE]
my post was in response to a non-sequitor
[QUOTE=thelurker1234;42336085]Can the images be linked, as they are NSFW?[/QUOTE]
Did you really come into this thread not expecting pictures of boobs? Even with the little picture icon next to the thread?
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;42334551]Well its the same thing but it doesn't have female interests in mind. It focuses on men instead.[/QUOTE]
everything that MRA has talked about was talked about first by feminists including male feminists
some of the people that were supposedly influential in MRA thought were poached from feminism in the first place. keep in mind that feminism was the concept behind the creation of gender studies, which includes studies of masculinity
MRA itself as a term is decidedly anti-feminist because it predisposes that men have less rights than women
[QUOTE=thisispain;42336697]everything that MRA has talked about was talked about first by feminists including male feminists
some of the people that were supposedly influential in MRA thought were poached from feminism in the first place. keep in mind that feminism was the concept behind the creation of gender studies, which includes studies of masculinity
MRA itself as a term is decidedly anti-feminist because it predisposes that men have less rights than women[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=A_Pigeon;42336300]
I think the issue with feminists is that the word has become associated with the extremists like FEMEN
It's almost like people think that feminists are feminine extremists.[/QUOTE]
Give this a read [URL="http://ccostello.blogspot.ca/2007/05/feminism-vs-womens-rights.html?m=1"]http://ccostello.blogspot.ca/2007/05/feminism-vs-womens-rights.html?m=1[/URL]
[QUOTE=Crazy;42332218]Sorry, but FEMEN has ruined feminists as a whole. Sucks for those non-crazy feminists, but what can you do.[/QUOTE]
Just like PETA completely ruins all credibility for every other animal rights group.
[QUOTE=Archonos 2;42336824]Just like PETA completely ruins all credibility for every other animal rights group.[/QUOTE]
If only it was just PETA.
[QUOTE=A_Pigeon;42336771]Give this a read [URL="http://ccostello.blogspot.ca/2007/05/feminism-vs-womens-rights.html?m=1"]http://ccostello.blogspot.ca/2007/05/feminism-vs-womens-rights.html?m=1[/URL][/QUOTE]
what trash
[QUOTE=thisispain;42336976]what trash[/QUOTE]
Let someone else have an opinion why don't yah?
Just because they think differently from you doesn't mean that they're garbage. It just means they have a different outlook on life.
Sometimes people want to be fashion models or take care of children. What does it matter if it's a man or a woman on the boardwalk? It's not like it's only women posing half naked for calendars.
You calling what was written trash sorta proves the argument put up against feminism in the article. The writer wants a choice and just because it's the one that feminism thinks is wrong means it's garbage.
GJ equality
[B]edit [/B]
We REALLY need an ironic rating
[QUOTE=A_Pigeon;42337028]Let someone else have an opinion why don't yah?
Just because they think differently from you doesn't mean that they're garbage. It just means they have a different outlook on life.
Sometimes people want to be fashion models or take care of children. What does it matter if it's a man or a woman on the boardwalk? It's not like it's only women posing half naked for calendars.
You calling what was written trash sorta proves the argument put up against feminism in the article. The writer wants a choice and just because it's the one that feminism thinks is wrong means it's garbage.
GJ equality
[B]edit [/B]
We REALLY need an ironic rating[/QUOTE]
the whole sky is falling bit is completely untrue. "AHH TEENAGE MOTHERS AHHH..." nope sorry.
whoever wrote that basically backed up their arguments with hearsay and anecdotes, it's not very well written.
[QUOTE=sloppy_joes;42337155]the whole sky is falling bit is completely untrue. "AHH SINGLE MOTHERS AHHH..." nope sorry.
whoever wrote that basically backed up their arguments with hearsay and anecdotes, it's not very well written.[/QUOTE]
Well no it was a terribly written article, but it does have a point.
Thing is that extremists of ideals go both ways and simply assuming that no woman wants to be a fashion model and that all women in the world of fashion are weak and oppressed is pretty sexist in itself. It's quite obvious that the model was a strong individual who was confident in their job and their self. It's almost as if her gender and male oppression didn't force her into the fashion business
WELL ALL WOMEN WERE OBVIOUSLY WELL EDUCATED IF MY GREAT GRANDMOTHER WAS WELL EDUCATED
[editline]28th September 2013[/editline]
why would they back out of doing their GOD GIVEN ROLE as HOUSEKEEPERS??!? fukcing WOMEN
[editline]28th September 2013[/editline]
i mean there are probably some downsides to the feminist movement but that article is just bad.
[QUOTE=A_Pigeon;42337028]Let someone else have an opinion why don't yah?
Just because they think differently from you doesn't mean that they're garbage. It just means they have a different outlook on life.[/QUOTE]
thanks for the update
[QUOTE=A_Pigeon;42337028]You calling what was written trash sorta proves the argument put up against feminism in the article. The writer wants a choice and just because it's the one that feminism thinks is wrong means it's garbage. [/QUOTE]
[quote]Over 40 years after the beginning of the modern feminist movement of the 1960's, we have unrestricted sex, the Pill, abortion on demand, an astronomically increased number of single mothers, teenage mothers and women in their 40's struggling with infertility; we have a fatherless generation who hasn't seen a better example; chastity is mocked, women are sexualized and coerced into selling themselves cheap; we have no-fault divorce, deterioration of family values – and I could go on and on.[/quote]
not only is the idea that feminism is somehow behind women struggling win infertility ridiculous, but theres nothing wrong with birth control and reproductive health.
its trash, pure trash. you dont have to be a feminist to think that chastity is a stupid concept because it is.
[editline]28th September 2013[/editline]
and youre very quick to pat yourself on the back arent you
imagine: some people claiming to be video game players shoot some dude in a parking lot.
next day all the newspaper headlines read "VIDEO GAMERS KILL AGAIN" and then a bunch of non video gamers complain about how terrible video games are. a bunch of NORMAL PEOPLE come over and say "hey, come on guys, these people don't represent everyone who plays video games" but the anti-video game circlejerk has already started.
this is it. this is what youve done.
[QUOTE=thisispain;42337210]thanks for the update
not only is the idea that feminism is somehow behind women struggling win infertility ridiculous, but theres nothing wrong with birth control and reproductive health.
its trash, pure trash. you dont have to be a feminist to think that chastity is a stupid concept because it is.
[editline]28th September 2013[/editline]
and youre very quick to pat yourself on the back arent you[/QUOTE]
As a strong and oppressive male individual I felt no need to pat myself on tube back as every day of my life rewards me for having a penis
And as you think the idea of feminism is responsible for women struggling is ridiculous I think that the idea that the fashion industry is a super power house of evil women presets is ridiculous too. Some of the things she thinks feminism caused are obviously false, but her ideas of feminism are somewhat proved by your posts.
I'm just saying maybe you should listen to someone else's opinion before steamrolling your massive ego on top of it. Sometimes someone who is mostly wrong can be right
[QUOTE=A_Pigeon;42337327]As a strong and oppressive male individual I felt no need to pat myself on tube back as every day of my life rewards me for having a penis
And as you think the idea of feminism is responsible for women struggling is ridiculous I think that the idea that the fashion industry is a super power house of evil women presets is ridiculous too. Some of the things she thinks feminism caused are obviously false, but her ideas of feminism are somewhat proved by your posts.
I'm just saying maybe you should listen to someone else's opinion before steamrolling your massive ego on top of it. Sometimes someone who is mostly wrong can be right[/QUOTE]
k
you didnt respond to anything i said.
you just patted yourself on the back some more
if the concept is choice then why is this person decidedly anti-choice by being against birth control, which is not only one of the most important choices a woman can have to make but also the most important economic factor on an individual and societal level
no feminist has ever said doing housework or being a mother is wrong. quoting beauvior completely out of context means nothing if you dont understand the crux of her argument from the book that was quoted from
we also know scientifically that the best family is one of egalitarian values. one where there isnt simply a mother doing housework, but rather where both parents share equal responsibilities. you're free to make that choice but its not something that we should prop up in society as the ideal. of course the author would disagree because theyre all about "family values".
and im not a feminist nor do i represent feminism. don't co-opt me to prove your dumb arguments tia
[QUOTE=thisispain;42337396]
and im not a feminist nor do i represent feminism. don't co-opt me to prove your dumb arguments tia[/QUOTE]
And I'm not an MRA nor do I represent men's rights. I simply believe that to be for "equality" means you have to be accepting of others and respect their opinions.
The only arguments you are doing false are those of a stupid article, one which you have been quick to dismiss as something of the works of some sort of MRA hitler.
Do unto others as you want done unto you
[QUOTE=thisispain;42337396]no feminist has ever said doing housework or being a mother is wrong. quoting beauvior completely out of context means nothing if you dont understand the crux of her argument from the book that was quoted from.[/QUOTE]
Exactly, I don't know why you didn't just say this in the first place.
[QUOTE=A_Pigeon;42336771]Give this a read [URL="http://ccostello.blogspot.ca/2007/05/feminism-vs-womens-rights.html?m=1"]http://ccostello.blogspot.ca/2007/05/feminism-vs-womens-rights.html?m=1[/URL][/QUOTE]
While there are smaller opinions in here we seem to be agreeing are dumb, the article is also assuming that Feminism is actually telling women to be a certain way, which is ridiculous. If you go and read what some other people who call themselves Feminists have to say, you'll hear a lot that think it's about equality and this bullshit about homemaking being wrong isn't Feminism. Every Feminist I've spoken to personally feels this way.
[QUOTE=A_Pigeon;42337471]And I'm not an MRA nor do I represent men's rights. I simply believe that to be for "equality" means you have to be accepting of others and respect their opinions.[/QUOTE]
i dont care at all
stop lecturing me on equality
[QUOTE=A_Pigeon;42337471]The only arguments you are doing false are those of a stupid article, one which you have been quick to dismiss as something of the works of some sort of MRA hitler.[/QUOTE]
i never said the words MRA hitler
i read it and thought it was poorly written and poorly thought out so i called it trash
i dont know what your point is, if you even had one in the first place
[QUOTE=A_Pigeon;42336771]Give this a read [URL="http://ccostello.blogspot.ca/2007/05/feminism-vs-womens-rights.html?m=1"]http://ccostello.blogspot.ca/2007/05/feminism-vs-womens-rights.html?m=1[/URL][/QUOTE]
That's pretty much factually wrong in a lot of ways actually.
[QUOTE=thisispain;42337605]i dont care at all
stop lecturing me on equality
i never said the words MRA hitler
i read it and thought it was poorly written and poorly thought out so i called it trash
i dont know what your point is, if you even had one in the first place[/QUOTE]
Tbh I wanted to see how long of a post I could get you to write and whore ratings.
[highlight](User was banned for this post ("Trolling" - Megafan))[/highlight]
[QUOTE=A_Pigeon;42338057]Tbh I wanted to see how long of a post I could get you to write and whore ratings.[/QUOTE]
well tbh did you ever find Bugs Bunny attractive when he put on a dress and played a girl bunny?
[QUOTE=thisispain;42338092]well tbh did you ever find Bugs Bunny attractive when he put on a dress and played a girl bunny?[/QUOTE]
Dude wtf?
What do cartoon rabbits have to do with shit all?
idgaf what feminists do but this is assault and illegal lol
nothing justifiable about that
[QUOTE=Crazy;42332218]Sorry, but FEMEN has ruined feminists as a whole. Sucks for those non-crazy feminists, but what can you do.[/QUOTE]
yeah this makes total sense
[editline]29th September 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=A_Pigeon;42338057]Tbh I wanted to see how long of a post I could get you to write and whore ratings.[/QUOTE]
ah the 'hahah i trol u excuse' - you've been backpedaling for this entire page, why don't you just stop
[QUOTE=CoolKingKaso;42335579]It blatant that men aren't subject to the same pressures as women. I would be lying if I claimed that I starved myself and glanced at the weight scale in order to fit in the clothes I've bought.[/QUOTE]
Women are mostly pressured into being super-slim and men are mostly pressured into being super-fit
However one involves working out and doing stuff that's good for you and the other one involves starving out on purpose so you fit in a smaller size of clothings, so yeah there's a significantly bigger pressure on women compared to men.
Reminds me of that girl I know that just panics when she takes the slightest weight but actually pushes her boyfriend to eat more because she finds chubby bellies cute. It's pretty weird.
[I][/I][QUOTE=Generic Monk;42339047]
ah the 'hahah i trol u excuse' - you've been backpedaling for this entire page, why don't you just stop[/QUOTE]
Why else would anyone try to have a debate with thisispain?
[QUOTE=A_Pigeon;42337172]Well no it was a terribly written article, but it does have a point.
Thing is that extremists of ideals go both ways and simply assuming that no woman wants to be a fashion model and that all women in the world of fashion are weak and oppressed is pretty sexist in itself. It's quite obvious that the model was a strong individual who was confident in their job and their self. It's almost as if her gender and male oppression didn't force her into the fashion business[/QUOTE]
This guy has a point, and it's the same point I've been trying to make which is that women CHOOSE to work in the fashion industry, women can also BE IN VERY HIGH RANKING in the fashion industry. Why can't women be in charge of the fashion industry, it isn't a male dominated market because the vast majority of people that work in the fashion industry are women and gay men, it isn't a male dominated industry because there are more women than men working in it.
Why aren't women allowed to work in the industry without being called out for being anti-feminist? They are just doing their goddamn jobs that they choose to do because they enjoy it. They aren't being forced to do anything, or ordered to do anything and if they are, it's usually by someone of either gender because there is no huge predisposition for men working in the fashion industry.
The person who was harassed by FEMEN while walking down the catwalk was a strong and independant woman, the MAN who started and runs FEMEN hand-picked girls just because he thought they were pretty and then he proceeded to send them off to dangerous places just so they could be arrested and he could get publicity. He orders women around, forces them to do things and makes them go half-naked and get arrested for him without any care for their well-being. Anyone who supports FEMEN has their morals sufficiently skewed.
This is the problem I'm afraid of when it comes to any extreme view on an issue, when people go too far with the support of something they actively go AGAINST what they're supposed to be supporting.
[QUOTE=thisispain]and im not a feminist nor do i represent feminism. don't co-opt me to prove your dumb arguments tia[/QUOTE]
What is your actual stance on the issue? You argued earlier that you don't support FEMEN and now you say you're not a feminist (do you mean you don't go to rallies or something, or that you don't believe in it?). Are you just arguing for the sake of arguing then?
[QUOTE=thisispain]no feminist has ever said doing housework or being a mother is wrong. quoting beauvior completely out of context means nothing if you dont understand the crux of her argument from the book that was quoted from.[/QUOTE]
If you believe this then what FEMEN is doing must be ideologically wrong. There's nothing wrong with a woman who does housework and/or works in fashion, as long as they're not forced to do it.
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