Why I Feel Bad for the Pepper-Spraying Policeman, Lt. John Pike - Polidicks

[QUOTE=JaegerMonster;33410010]Those have always been interesting experiments, but they have had so many holes poked in them over the years. People really need to stop using small social experiments with poor control factors as representative of large numbers of people in day to day life. Saying that everyone would do the same thing in his situation, smacks in the face of the decades of whistle blowers who have risked their job - and potentially safety in some cases - to say "Stop, this is wrong".[/QUOTE] Except for every whistle blower there's a thousand conformists.

Gasp! He's a human? He is nearly identical to the rest of us? His line of work effected his decisions while working? God damn, I assumed he was an android sent from the future to pepper spray college kids.

[QUOTE=Lachz0r;33395747]from what i saw in the video the amount of area they were blocked is hardly large enough to warrant them being forcefully removed as fast as possible. if anything most the area blocked was the crowd that had gathered to watch this guy pepper spraying people.[/QUOTE] Yes. I agree that he could have handled the situation much better, but I have sympathy for him and definitely do not think he should lose his job. To be honest, I believe all of us would have done the same under that much pressure.

i certainly don't condone the pepper spraying, but what would you guys have preferred he do when his job is to make them move and they don't?

[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;33423069]Yes. I agree that he could have handled the situation much better, but I have sympathy for him and definitely do not think he should lose his job. To be honest, I believe all of us would have done the same under that much pressure.[/QUOTE] Are you serious? Pepperspraying defenseless people, including a pregnant woman who was telling them she was pregnant? You think all of us would have done the same thing just because our superior told us to? Thanks, but I'd sooner lose my job than be responsible for a woman having a miscarriage. [editline]24th November 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=TBFundy;33424048]i certainly don't condone the pepper spraying, but what would you guys have preferred he do when his job is to make them move and they don't?[/QUOTE] Probably not fucking instantly jumping to pepperspraying them? If you tell someone to move and they don't, your first though shouldn't be 'LET'S PEPPERSPRAY THEM THEN.' I mean shit that isn't even going to make them move. It's going to make them fall to the ground in intense pain.

[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;33423069]Yes. I agree that he could have handled the situation much better, but I have sympathy for him and definitely do not think he should lose his job. To be honest, I believe all of us would have done the same under that much pressure.[/QUOTE] i think he should lose his job and never be allowed in such a position ever again. i can safely say that there is no way i would pepper spray a bunch of college students in the face. i have this thing called human compassion, and it means more to me than a paycheck or the ire of any superiors.

[QUOTE=Lachz0r;33424237]i think he should lose his job and never be allowed in such a position ever again. i can safely say that there is no way i would pepper spray a bunch of college students in the face. i have this thing called human compassion, and it means more to me than a paycheck or the ire of any superiors.[/QUOTE] You all are just watching one video which is the spray and the after effects. I bet most of you haven't even seen the video before. They were warned to move. They tried moving them without the spray. They said they were going to spray them. The pregnant women is the one who is wrong in my opinion, as she is putting herself in a situation which she knows is dangerous and risky. She could have gotten up and walked away, as SHE KNEW they were about to spray! She could have been protesting on the side farther away.

[QUOTE=Lachz0r;33424237]i think he should lose his job and never be allowed in such a position ever again. i can safely say that there is no way i would pepper spray a bunch of college students in the face. i have this thing called human compassion, and it means more to me than a paycheck or the ire of any superiors.[/QUOTE] I'd spray the shit out of them, I like not being fired I don't think what he did was right or anything, but yeah I'd rather not get kicked out of my job and look like shit for disobeying orders. He's a cop, if he didn't want to follow orders he wouldn't be one

[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;33424747]You all are just watching one video which is the spray and the after effects. I bet most of you haven't even seen the video before. They were warned to move. They tried moving them without the spray. They said they were going to spray them. The pregnant women is the one who is wrong in my opinion, as she is putting herself in a situation which she knows is dangerous and risky. She could have gotten up and walked away, as SHE KNEW they were about to spray! She could have been protesting on the side farther away.[/QUOTE] Standing in a public place and warning the police that you're pregnant sure is risky. The police didn't try shit before moving these people. They told them to move, and the people refused, so they walked up and started pepperspraying. That is extremely excessive force. No weapons should be used on people who are just standing around and refuse to move. You're trying to justify a horrible action, and it's dumb. [editline]24th November 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=IlikeHL2;33424770]I'd spray the shit out of them, I like not being fired I don't think what he did was right or anything, but yeah I'd rather not get kicked out of my job and look like shit for disobeying orders. He's a cop, if he didn't want to follow orders he wouldn't be one[/QUOTE] So, if you want to be a cop, you're totally cool with pepperspraying pregnant women? You heard it here first, folks.

[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;33424747]You all are just watching one video which is the spray and the after effects. I bet most of you haven't even seen the video before. They were warned to move. They tried moving them without the spray. They said they were going to spray them. The pregnant women is the one who is wrong in my opinion, as she is putting herself in a situation which she knows is dangerous and risky. She could have gotten up and walked away, as SHE KNEW they were about to spray! She could have been protesting on the side farther away.[/QUOTE] well like i said, they could have just left them and just talked it out rather than use violence. [editline]25th November 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=IlikeHL2;33424770]I'd spray the shit out of them, I like not being fired I don't think what he did was right or anything, but yeah I'd rather not get kicked out of my job and look like shit for disobeying orders. He's a cop, if he didn't want to follow orders he wouldn't be one[/QUOTE] lol. i guess that's the difference between people who care about their fellow man and people who care only about themselves huh? a cops job is to protect and serve, not follow orders.

[QUOTE=Grim Joker;33425028] So, if you want to be a cop, you're totally cool with pepperspraying pregnant women? You heard it here first, folks.[/QUOTE] No that's fucked don't know where you got that from bro

[QUOTE=IlikeHL2;33425252]No that's fucked don't know where you got that from bro[/QUOTE] That's what he did. You said he was just following orders, and that cops become cops because they can follow orders, and that you'd do the same to not get fired. What he did was fucked up, and he wasn't told to pepperspray everyone. He was told to move them, and he's the one who took that as 'pepperspray a pregnant woman, an old lady, and a bunch of other people'. There were people vomiting in the streets, and two of the people peppersprayed actually had to go to the emergency room.

[QUOTE=Grim Joker;33425028]Standing in a public place and warning the police that you're pregnant sure is risky. The police didn't try shit before moving these people. They told them to move, and the people refused, so they walked up and started pepperspraying. That is extremely excessive force. No weapons should be used on people who are just standing around and refuse to move. You're trying to justify a horrible action, and it's dumb. [editline]24th November 2011[/editline] So, if you want to be a cop, you're totally cool with pepperspraying pregnant women? You heard it here first, folks.[/QUOTE] There's a difference between one person standing around, and about 20 people clamping arms refusing to move. I'm saying that she shouldn't even be there, especially in the clamp, if she is pregnant. Those actions are bold in protest, and usually spur some sort of police retaliation.

[QUOTE=Grim Joker;33425317]That's what he did. You said he was just following orders, and that cops become cops because they can follow orders, and that you'd do the same to not get fired. What he did was fucked up, and he wasn't told to pepperspray everyone. He was told to move them, and he's the one who took that as 'pepperspray a pregnant woman, an old lady, and a bunch of other people'. There were people vomiting in the streets, and two of the people peppersprayed actually had to go to the emergency room.[/QUOTE] Okay. I agree if he wasn't told to use pepper spray it's pretty messed up, I also would like to point out [i]I'm not talking about the pregnant woman,old lady whatever, wasn't that completely different cops?[/i]

[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;33425362]There's a difference between one person standing around, and about 20 people clamping arms refusing to move. I'm saying that she shouldn't even be there, especially in the clamp, if she is pregnant. Those actions are bold in protest, and usually spur some sort of police retaliation.[/QUOTE] This was at a UC campus, a public university. You're telling me if the police ask people to move and they don't, they're completely justified in using whatever force they deem necessary to move them? Hell, at UC Berkeley the police literally took to them with batons, and then claimed that standing together is not passive. [editline]24th November 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=IlikeHL2;33425420]Okay. I agree if he wasn't told to use pepper spray it's pretty messed up, I also would like to point out [i]I'm not talking about the pregnant woman,old lady whatever, wasn't that completely different cops?[/i][/QUOTE] The UC Davis incident specifically involved the police pepper-spraying protesters that were [I]sitting down.[/I] I live in Davis myself, and I can tell you people on campus were very upset.

[QUOTE=Megafanx13;33425429] The UC Davis incident specifically involved the police pepper-spraying protesters that were [I]sitting down.[/I] I live in Davis myself, and I can tell you people on campus were very upset.[/QUOTE] This thread is about an article about Lt. John Pike, not the whole police force at UC, that's why I'm a tad confused at why we're talking about everyone. Honest mistake, my bad

[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;33425362]There's a difference between one person standing around, and about 20 people clamping arms refusing to move. I'm saying that she shouldn't even be there, especially in the clamp, if she is pregnant. Those actions are bold in protest, and usually spur some sort of police retaliation.[/QUOTE] Yeah man. I know back when I was a kid and we used to play Red Rover, we were always told to stop, because clamping arms is just about the most threatening thing one can do. Are you seriously saying the pregnant woman shouldn't have been there because she should have been ready for the possibility of police brutality? Okay then. I guess I should never leave my house because there's the possibility I could trip and break my neck. You're essentially saying nobody should do anything that has the slightest possibility of getting them hurt, and if they do get hurt (really badly, in this case), it's their own fault. Great reasoning.

[img]http://i.imgur.com/UFIHV.png[/img]

[QUOTE=Grim Joker;33425652]Yeah man. I know back when I was a kid and we used to play Red Rover, we were always told to stop, because clamping arms is just about the most threatening thing one can do. Are you seriously saying the pregnant woman shouldn't have been there because she should have been ready for the possibility of police brutality? Okay then. I guess I should never leave my house because there's the possibility I could trip and break my neck. You're essentially saying nobody should do anything that has the slightest possibility of getting them hurt, and if they do get hurt (really badly, in this case), it's their own fault. Great reasoning.[/QUOTE] this isn't about the pregnant chick that got sprayed it's about the peacefully protesting uni students that all got sprayed in the face. [editline]25th November 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=IlikeHL2;33425420]Okay. I agree if he wasn't told to use pepper spray it's pretty messed up, I also would like to point out [i]I'm not talking about the pregnant woman,old lady whatever, wasn't that completely different cops?[/i][/QUOTE] so where do you draw the line? you wouldn't mind pepper spraying a bunch of (in comparison) kids who are sitting down clamping arms to protect your pay check, but you would mind pepper spraying pregnant chicks or old ones?

[QUOTE=Lachz0r;33425693]this isn't about the pregnant chick that got sprayed it's about the peacefully protesting uni students that all got sprayed in the face.[/QUOTE] Oh holy shit that's even worse. They were seriously just sitting there, Jesus Christ.

[QUOTE=Grim Joker;33425769]Oh holy shit that's even worse. They were seriously just sitting there, Jesus Christ.[/QUOTE] yeah lol. i like how people say it's cause they were blocking the path when there wasn't nearly enough people sitting there to have caused any serious inconvenience, unless the extra 10 seconds it takes to walk around them would be considered serious. there is no way in my mind that what this jackass did could be justified and ilikehl2's arguement of doing it to preserve his job & paycheck seems worse to me than any other justification.

When there is a risk of getting injured at what is supposed to be a PEACEFUL protest, you have a serious serious problem.

[QUOTE=Grim Joker;33425652]Yeah man. I know back when I was a kid and we used to play Red Rover, we were always told to stop, because clamping arms is just about the most threatening thing one can do. Are you seriously saying the pregnant woman shouldn't have been there because she should have been ready for the possibility of police brutality? Okay then. I guess I should never leave my house because there's the possibility I could trip and break my neck. You're essentially saying nobody should do anything that has the slightest possibility of getting them hurt, and if they do get hurt (really badly, in this case), it's their own fault. Great reasoning.[/QUOTE] Sort of like that. Except imagine if there was a big flashing sign that said "You're going to trip on the rock 10 feet ahead of you and break your neck." and you keep walking and don't go away. That's basically what happened. The police warned "We're going to use pepper spray." and she just continued to do what she was doing.

[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;33425993]Sort of like that. Except imagine if there was a big flashing sign that said "You're going to trip on the rock 10 feet ahead of you and break your neck." and you keep walking and don't go away. That's basically what happened. The police warned "We're going to use pepper spray." and she just continued to do what she was doing.[/QUOTE] you're getting confused now. when the pregnant woman was pepper sprayed (and allegedly kicked in the stomach) she was attempting to leave the protest and told the police that. at this university yes they were told they would be pepper sprayed, but what's the point in protesting if you're gonna just give up when the people you're protesting against threaten violence?

[QUOTE=TheTalon;33392746]Pepperspray isn't even the bad stuff that some departments (Like Nashville) get to use. They got stuff that makes pepperspray seem like water[/QUOTE] Except they don't Because unless gaseous napalm has been approved for standard use by police forces there is currently no official spray worse than pepper spray

They should have demonized that police who kicked pregnant mothers stomach so that baby died inside.

[QUOTE=W00tbeer1;33425993]Sort of like that. Except imagine if there was a big flashing sign that said "You're going to trip on the rock 10 feet ahead of you and break your neck." and you keep walking and don't go away. That's basically what happened. The police warned "We're going to use pepper spray." and she just continued to do what she was doing.[/QUOTE] The police that peppersprayed the pregnant chick didn't warn her. In fact, she was try to get out of the protest when they peppersprayed her. They then kicked her in the stomach while she was down. Yeah man I mean how did she not see that coming it seems pretty obvious that police are going to pepperspray you and kick you in the stomach without warning while you're trying to get out of their way.

[B]New video.[/B] They were all properly warned when they didn't comply. [URL]http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=88a_1322258639[/URL] I fully respect the act of pepper spraying them now, they were ordered to do it and they did it in a proper manor. I fucking hope this will stop being propaganda bullshit from protesters now.

[QUOTE=Memobot;33392350]I can't call him a scumbag. I don't know the guy but I doubt he's 'evil' through and through. He did something extremely stupid in the heat of the moment and probably thought that as pepper spray only has effects that last 30-45 mins, nobody would make a fuss. How wrong he was.[/QUOTE] That was barely 'heat of the moment', the fucking dude did it twice. [I]Twiiiicceeeeee.[/I] [editline]26th November 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=Careld;33426547]They should have demonized that police who kicked pregnant mothers stomach so that baby died inside.[/QUOTE] What the fuck.

Get over it guys, the pepper spray didn't kill nobody it's all good.