Current wars deserve a general ranking with best from WWII - Petraeus may get a 5th star - Polidicks

No, it wouldn't have, they would have continued operating training camps in afghanistan, continued to train cells there and set up plans to make attacks on US soil and the soil of its allies, and in case you didn't notice that's a bad thing, what the fuck are we all supposed to do? bend over and take the next attack up our arse and just lube up and make it all a bit easier, or fight to destroy the organisation that's performing the attacks, training and planning? It's an obvious answer.

You are forgetting that the Pakistani government is very cooperative with trying to hunt down Al Qaeda. It's the independent tribes near the border that are hiding Osama and Al Qaeda.

[QUOTE=bravehat;27451882]No, it wouldn't have, they would have continued operating training camps in afghanistan, continued to train cells there and set up plans to make attacks on US soil and the soil of its allies, and in case you didn't notice that's a bad thing, what the fuck are we all supposed to do? bend over and take the next attack up our arse and just lube up and make it all a bit easier, or fight to destroy the organisation that's performing the attacks, training and planning? It's an obvious answer.[/QUOTE] ok so we attack them in afghanistan and they just keep operating in pakistan. what have we accomplished? nothing except for causing a ten year war with no end in sight and a hell of a lot of civilian casualties.

[QUOTE=Lachz0r;27452009]ok so we attack them in afghanistan and they just keep operating in pakistan. what have we accomplished? nothing except for causing a ten year war with no end in sight and a hell of a lot of civilian casualties.[/QUOTE] But we are attacking them in Pakistan, drone strikes man.

[QUOTE=yawmwen;27451927]You are forgetting that the Pakistani government is very cooperative with trying to hunt down Al Qaeda. It's the independent tribes near the border that are hiding Osama and Al Qaeda.[/QUOTE] you're forgetting that al qaeda still operates in many other countries throughout the east anyway.

[QUOTE=Lachz0r;27452020]you're forgetting that al qaeda still operates in many other countries throughout the east anyway.[/QUOTE] Not near to the extent as Pakistan and Afghanistan. These are their major strongholds because Afghanistan gave them sanctuary and many tribes in Pakistan give them sanctuary. Other countries(any government that wants a stable country) don't want that shit in there. Al Qaeda operates in secret in other countries, and not even near a major level.

The thing a big part of FP seems to have a problem with is that other people don't have the same mindset as them. The people who sign up for the military usually believes that they are protecting their country and that they are doing good things over there in Afghanistan. Doesn't the fact that they are trying to do some good deserve some respect? Everyone doesn't think the same way as you do and thats how it's going to be as long as humanity exists. So try to talk to a soldier that is in Afghanistan and you will see that they usually have pretty solid reasons to be there, even though you might not think those reasons are good but please understand that some people do and that doesn't make them bad people.

[QUOTE=kaven;27452118]The thing a big part of FP seems to have a problem with is that other people don't have the same mindset as them. The people who sign up for the military usually believes that they are protecting their country and that they are doing good things over there in Afghanistan. Doesn't the fact that they are trying to do some good deserve some respect? Everyone doesn't think the same way as you do and thats how it's going to be as long as humanity exists. So try to talk to a soldier that is in Afghanistan and you will see that they usually have pretty solid reasons to be there, even though you might not think those reasons are good but please understand that some people do and that doesn't make them bad people.[/QUOTE] No point even trying man, it's like trying to have an in depth conversation with a brick wall.

[QUOTE=kaven;27452118]The thing a big part of FP seems to have a problem with is that other people don't have the same mindset as them. The people who sign up for the military usually believes that they are protecting their country and that they are doing good things over there in Afghanistan. Doesn't the fact that they are trying to do some good deserve some respect? Everyone doesn't think the same way as you do and thats how it's going to be as long as humanity exists. So try to talk to a soldier that is in Afghanistan and you will see that they usually have pretty solid reasons to be there, even though you might not think those reasons are good but please understand that some people do and that doesn't make them bad people.[/QUOTE] generally i don't have a problem with people in the military. i just have a problem when people seem to think that someone being in the military somehow makes them more important than anybody else because they are "defending their country". i personally find it patronizing and insulting when people suggest that people join the military to defend me and mine. [editline]17th January 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=bravehat;27452129]No point even trying man, it's like trying to have an in depth conversation with a brick wall.[/QUOTE] oh shut up. you are the first person to resort to petty insults therefore you are the last person who should act like he has in depth conversation.

You seem to have that quite personally man, odd considering it wasn't directed at you.

like i care who it was directed at. doesn't make it any less bullshit to say in regards to your conduct.

[QUOTE=Lachz0r;27452185]generally i don't have a problem with people in the military. i just have a problem when people seem to think that someone being in the military somehow makes them more important than anybody else because they are "defending their country". i personally find it patronizing and insulting when people suggest that people join the military to defend me and mine. [editline]17th January 2011[/editline] oh shut up. you are the first person to resort to petty insults therefore you are the last person who should act like he has in depth conversation.[/QUOTE] Well...they probably join believing that they are defending their country and it's citizens, but i'll leave it up to you to decide if they really do that. I wouldn't say joining the military makes you more important than everyone else but it shows they have a commitment to their country and are willing to die(And sometimes kill, which isn't too good) for what they believe, so I respect them for that, but I respect regular citizens as much.

[QUOTE=Lachz0r;27452185]generally i don't have a problem with people in the military. i just have a problem when people seem to think that someone being in the military somehow makes them more important than anybody else because they are "defending their country". i personally find it patronizing and insulting when people suggest that people join the military to defend me and mine. [editline]17th January 2011[/editline] oh shut up. you are the first person to resort to petty insults therefore you are the last person who should act like he has in depth conversation.[/QUOTE] dude are you mad?

[QUOTE=Lachz0r;27452250]like i care who it was directed at. doesn't make it any less bullshit to say in regards to your conduct.[/QUOTE] Jesus man you're so fucking tense, you need to relax. Back on topic, I've said my piece, you all can see how I feel, soldiers should be respected, they aren't just unthinking sheeple.

[QUOTE=kaven;27452286]Well...they probably join believing that they are defending their country and it's citizens, but i'll leave it up to you to decide if they really do that. I wouldn't say joining the military makes you more important than everyone else but it shows they have a commitment to their country and are willing to die(And sometimes kill, which isn't too good) for what they believe, so I respect them for that, but I respect regular citizens as much.[/QUOTE] yeah but see, when you say it like that it's like you're suggesting that regular citizens are somehow unwillingly to protect their country which is ridiculous, especially considering that america has a large history of militias. so although i am not willing to join my countries armed forces, if my country was attacked (and i mean an invader not some random attack by some terrorist group) i would certainly be willing to fight to defend it. [editline]17th January 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=bravehat;27452310]Jesus man you're so fucking tense, you need to relax. Back on topic, I've said my piece, you all can see how I feel, soldiers should be respected, they aren't just unthinking sheeple.[/QUOTE] haha yeah i get real tense around self diagnosed sociopaths (read: autistics) [editline]17th January 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=yawmwen;27452309]dude are you mad?[/QUOTE] lol.

Okay dude, you really sound agitated, go lie down, have a wank, have a cup of tea whatever, just calm down dude.

[QUOTE=Lachz0r;27452404]yeah but see, when you say it like that it's like you're suggesting that regular citizens are somehow unwillingly to protect their country which is ridiculous, especially considering that america has a large history of militias. so although i am not willing to join my countries armed forces, if my country was attacked (and i mean an invader not some random attack by some terrorist group) i would certainly be willing to fight to defend it. [editline]17th January 2011[/editline] haha yeah i get real tense around self diagnosed sociopaths (read: autistics)[/QUOTE] See now this is good, now we are starting to understand how the other person is thinking which makes the conversation more intelligent! Anyways, yes I do understand that many people would sacrifice themselves for their country despite them not serving in the armed forces but if you don't tell us how are we supposed to know?

[QUOTE=bravehat;27452463]Okay dude, you really sound agitated, go lie down, have a wank, have a cup of tea whatever, just calm down dude.[/QUOTE] wow i'm drinking a cup of tea.... stay on topic please???? i don't want to have to report u....

[QUOTE=Lachz0r;27452482]wow i'm drinking a cup of tea.... stay on topic please???? i don't want to have to report u....[/QUOTE] what are you doing drinking tea you have had too much caffeine today mister!

[QUOTE=yawmwen;27452498]what are you doing drinking tea you have had too much caffeine today mister![/QUOTE] omg i'm 14 i'm fully capable of knowing when i have had enough caffeine!!!!!!

[QUOTE=Lachz0r;27452517]omg i'm 14 i'm fully capable of knowing when i have had enough caffeine!!!!!![/QUOTE] thats it straight to bed with you and no more hanging out with that bravehat kid anymore i think hes a bad influence

[QUOTE=yawmwen;27452523]thats it straight to bed with you and no more hanging out with that bravehat kid anymore i think hes a bad influence[/QUOTE] this is getting so random :xd:

Perfect thread derailment

[QUOTE=bravehat;27452705]Perfect thread derailment[/QUOTE] It's scary how fast it can happen.

But oh so beautiful at the same time :v:

[QUOTE=kaven;27452777]It's scary how fast it can happen.[/QUOTE] By page 5 I declare we will either be talking about trains or the tea party.

[QUOTE=W0w00t;27445786]McCrystal was the one that got booted.[/QUOTE] He resigned.

[QUOTE=Itsjustguy;27453100]He resigned.[/QUOTE] Forced to resign. It's like saying Nixon wasn't forced out of office. Though he technically resigned, he was forced out of office.

To be honest, it makes sense. Although the scale of the war doesn't come close to matching that of WWII, the fact is that Patraeus has essentially taken on the role of Supreme Allied Commander - he is in overall command over a large force made up of men and equipment from various different countries in exactly the same way Eisenhower was. [QUOTE=PvtCupcakes;27451242]Second of all, how can you say isolationism doesn't work? How often do you see Canada intervening militarily? You know, the only country to ever invade Canada was the United States in 1812. I think their foreign policy is working really fucking well. I'm all for diplomacy and global economics, but we don't need to use our military all the damn time.[/QUOTE] I would just like to point out, that isn't a very good argument. The UK is much less isolationist than Canada but has been invaded less - that is, never.

[QUOTE=PvtCupcakes;27451242]I'm pretty sure Afghanistan wasn't ever plotting against us without a good reason. I wonder why the Taliban didn't like us. Maybe it had to do with decades of military interventionism in the MIddle East? Maybe they felt threatened? According to you, feeling threatened is a good reason to attack somebody else. We need to stop bullying other countries because once in a while somebody is gonna fight back. Second of all, how can you say isolationism doesn't work? How often do you see Canada intervening militarily? You know, the only country to ever invade Canada was the United States in 1812. I think their foreign policy is working really fucking well. I'm all for diplomacy and global economics, but we don't need to use our military all the damn time. [editline]16th January 2011[/editline] I mean fuck, we're the only country to have invaded Mexico too.[/QUOTE] we gave afghanistan a billion dollars worth of military tech to repel the soviets in the 80s, and remained strong allies from there on out but we fucked up in the end and now we're over there searching for 'terrorists' and trying to isolate the taliban cell activity or at least hand the problem of the taliban over to the afghan military so we can pull out our troops and focus our money on more important things second of all, canada is not the US. we did not 'invade' canada because britain invaded canada first so i dont fucking understand how you think we're related to americas hat when they all speak oui oui oui up there (canada are also in afghanistan, as well as germany and britain) and no we are not the only country to have invaded mexico, see the 'battle of puebla' where the french attacked mexico before the alamo (at least i think it was before the alamo) you made some terrible points man, too eager to pin the US as the bad guy. your history is like 8th grade level