Tens of thousands of prisoners on strike in Georgia since last Thursday. - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Moose;26829772]and thats why prisoners should wait to get something we barely have right now[/QUOTE] So what is a prisoner supposed to do who needs chemotherapy, or breaks his arm

[QUOTE=Zeke129;26829964]So what is a prisoner supposed to do who needs chemotherapy, or breaks his arm[/QUOTE] What's a working class citizen supposed to do when he needs chemotherapy or he fractures his spinal cord?

[QUOTE=bravehat;26782684]Education to stop re offence is fine, I just don't see why being in prison should mean free education though. Frankly tonight I can't be fucked with debate, I've said my piece, I'll be lurking and occasionally chipping in but that's it.[/QUOTE] You are a dumbass. [editline]20th December 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=bravehat;26782809] And before all the angry folk show up I'm going back to lurking.[/QUOTE] Never post again, mkay.

[QUOTE=Moose;26830150]What's a working class citizen supposed to do when he needs chemotherapy or he fractures his spinal cord?[/QUOTE] Hospitals are required to provide necessary treatment whether a person can pay or not. Now answer my question.

[QUOTE=carcarcargo;26784615]In my opinion murderers and rapists do, considering they've already acted like one. However you can't have an entire prison section dedicated to them so they might as well be treated the same as everyone else.[/QUOTE] What would give anyone the right to treat someone as such? Some of you say that these people took the rights of others away when they commited a crime, yet you also say that they should have their rights stripped from them as punishment. Can't you see that would be stooping to their level? We live in a civilized world not ruled by emotions and faith but by logic and I frankly think that some people in here are hypocrites.

There are three options here, assuming healthcare cannot be extended to everyone right now: 1. Let prisoners die of easily treatable ailments and plunge America back into the dark ages 2. Never send anyone to prison and turn American into an anarchist state 3. Steady as she goes

[QUOTE=Zeke129;26829964]So what is a prisoner supposed to do who needs chemotherapy, or breaks his arm[/QUOTE] Petty criminals should be allowed chemo / therapy etc. , even if they're shitbags that probably just stole a car or something, I'd probably support care for them. Life sentence inmates should not, simply because it's a waste of time and effort since they'll never see the light of day or rehabilitate with the current system we have now. Human or not, the world isn't a hole full of infinite resources to dish out like candy. We all need to survive.

Prisoners having a non-violent protest? There's something you don't hear everyday.

[QUOTE=Moose;26830505]Petty criminals should be allowed chemo / therapy etc. , even if they're shitbags that probably just stole a car or something, I'd probably support care for them. Life sentence inmates should not, simply because it's a waste of time and effort since they'll never see the light of day or rehabilitate with the current system we have now. Human or not, the world isn't a hole full of infinite resources to dish out like candy. We all need to survive.[/QUOTE] Life sentence = parole eligible after 25 years

[QUOTE=Zeke129;26830535]Life sentence = parole eligible after 25 years[/QUOTE] Assuming the country lasts another 25 years, and we have enough oil to support the world for another 25 years.

Some of you also seem to think that prison is a place where bad people go to rot and suffer. That couldn't be further from the truth, prisons are places people go who break a set goverment implemented rules to reflect on their wrong doing and get to rehabilitated back into society. Once you get to know that fact you can see why prisoners, even murderers, need their rights and to be treated as equal members of society.

[QUOTE=Moose;26830583]Assuming the country lasts another 25 years, and we have enough oil to support the world for another 25 years.[/QUOTE] The United States is a fairly small supplier of oil, you just have lots of refineries. Most of your raw crude comes from elsewhere, does it not?

I didn't really mean it that way, I meant places like Saudi Arabia not being able to keep up with demand because of the population increasing and the growing industry. Which ties into health care and maintaining correctional facilities indirectly, especially with the decreasing value of the dollar and employment rates still dropping. Government might struggle to pay it's employees if the deficit gets any larger.

I for one, support forced convict labour. It'll do wonders for our industry.

[QUOTE=Moose;26831185] Which ties into health care and maintaining correctional facilities indirectly, especially with the decreasing value of the dollar and employment rates still dropping. Government might struggle to pay it's employees if the deficit gets any larger.[/QUOTE] So raise taxes, especially for the rich. [QUOTE=Splendor;26834024]I for one, support forced convict labour. It'll do wonders for our industry.[/QUOTE] No, that's dumb. Giving the jobs that the convicts would be doing to people who can actually make and spend money would be better for the economy. Not to mention the fact that forced labour produces a shitty product.

[QUOTE=Zeke129;26834677]So raise taxes, especially for the rich. No, that's dumb. Giving the jobs that the convicts would be doing to people who can actually make and spend money would be better for the economy. Not to mention the fact that forced labour produces a shitty product.[/QUOTE] Yeah, let's raise taxes during an inflation of an international currency. Let's make everyone poor again. And for the record, China is a great example of forced labor, and their products are shit.

[QUOTE=bravehat;26782254]Why should prisoners get paid? They aren't free anyway and they committed a crime and have to serve their time for it.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=bravehat;26782473]You committed a crime against another human, why should you retain your rights after that? You are punished for a crime, you should not be allowed to make any money or receive education in prison, these are the prices you pay for breaking the law, why change prison from a prison to a long stay hotel?[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=bravehat;26782576]Hi I'm bravehat, and I think that the OP is butthurt asshole who can't realise I'm simply saying if you commit a crime you know the consequences and these include temporary removal of your rights. :downs: Had this discussion the other day and since I have a migraine right now after two shots of Absinthe and red bul I can officially I will eat a child before I can be fucked with this debate again. [editline]18th December 2010[/editline] Some things shouldn't be a crime, for fuck sake straw men all up in this bitch.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=bravehat;26782684]Education to stop re offence is fine, I just don't see why being in prison should mean free education though. Frankly tonight I can't be fucked with debate, I've said my piece, I'll be lurking and occasionally chipping in but that's it.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=bravehat;26782809]Better idea, instead of making money and using said money to pay for education, they want the education then they work for it. And education is great, but if you commit a crime for example murder, why the fuck should that person deserve it? Fair enough for some unfortunate wanker who got caught with a couple of joints, shame that's a crime really, but that's besides the point, you commit a drastic crime, you should have your rights stripped away. And before all the angry folk show up I'm going back to lurking.[/QUOTE] why are you such a terrible poster not just in this thread but aallllll the fucking tiiiiiime [quote=bravehat]You committed a crime against another human[/quote] [quote=Ryder1337]Possession of drugs is a crime against who exactly?[/quote] [quote=bravehat]Some things shouldn't be a crime, for fuck sake straw men all up in this bitch.[/quote] that's not a strawman ffs god you're dumb

[QUOTE=Moose;26836381]Yeah, let's raise taxes during an inflation of an international currency. Let's make everyone poor again.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Zeke129;26834677]So raise taxes, [u][b]especially for the rich[/b][/u]. [/QUOTE] The rich will still be able to live fine if there tax rates go up a bit, the rates they have now are barely doing anything to them.

The only problem is that you and me, don't mean shit to rich republicans or rich people in general, Nancy Pelosi pretty much made that clear when she bullshitted the country about a week ago. [url]http://henican.com/2010/12/10/its-good-to-be-rich-in-america/[/url] <---- this is how america negotiates with the wealthy Nothing is ever going to change because no one is doing anything, and it pisses me off because everyone just expects things to 'happen' when all they do is sit around and suck up more twinkies through their fucking vaccuum vent mouths and abuse the welfare and unemployment checks given to them by the state. It's like they don't care, because their comfortable lifestyles are always expected to be there for them. Which is exactly the type of mindset I'm trying to avoid right now, cause my ass sure as hell isn't going to be left behind to rot with the cattle. Here's a more recent article that isn't fox news, and is more in-depth about the situation of taxing the rich. [url]http://www.timesnews.net/article.php?id=9028354[/url] [quote]The good news for the rich starts with income tax rates, which for top income groups would remain 35 percent , a rate enacted by former President George W. Bush in 2003. Except for a period from 1988 to 1992, the top tax rate has never been this low since 1931.[/quote]

[QUOTE=Zeke129;26834677]No, that's dumb. Giving the jobs that the convicts would be doing to people who can actually make and spend money would be better for the economy. Not to mention the fact that forced labour produces a shitty product.[/QUOTE] Well, one of the advantages China has on us is that they barely pay their workers. And we wouldn't be using them to make fucking Swiss watches now would we? I'm talking low skill sweatshop jobs, the kind we outsource to the chinks.

[QUOTE=bravehat;26782254]Why should prisoners get paid? They aren't free anyway and they committed a crime and have to serve their time for it.[/QUOTE] For some reason I picture you in a basement, never having any social interaction with people in the outside world. [editline]21st December 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=RBM11;26786321]Where do think criminal rehabilitation takes place in countries which focus on rehabilitation like Norway? Prison. You seem to be confusing prison with a concentration camp. And yes all prisons take away rights. That's why they are prison. Even the Norwegian and Swedish prisons take away rights for a period of time. They don't permanently take away all rights but they do for your period of incarceration. It's like this [B]everywhere[/B]. [editline]18th December 2010[/editline] Our country only supports education for the poor or for people who earn scholarships. Free education as part of going to prison would be retarded. Maybe if they were model prisoners or didn't re offend they should some assistance in order to become productive members of society but not just because they committed a crime.[/QUOTE] Prisons don't take away all your rights. If that were the case, the prisoners could be savagely beaten by guards because they have no rights. These prisoners just want some more liberties.

[QUOTE=Moose;26843454]Nothing is ever going to change because no one is doing anything, and it pisses me off because everyone just expects things to 'happen' when all they do is sit around and suck up more twinkies through their fucking vaccuum vent mouths and abuse the welfare and unemployment checks given to them by the state. It's like they don't care, because their comfortable lifestyles are always expected to be there for them. Which is exactly the type of mindset I'm trying to avoid right now, cause my ass sure as hell isn't going to be left behind to rot with the cattle.[/QUOTE] Most people on unemployment/welfare are in that position because they can't get a job, on account of there being no half-decent jobs.

I love how this thread has turned from a discussion of prisoner's rights to one of economic theory. :rolleyes:

[QUOTE=Zeke129;26865677]Most people on unemployment/welfare are in that position because they can't get a job, on account of there being no half-decent jobs.[/QUOTE] have you ever been to an american ghetto [editline]22nd December 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=Psychokitten;26866814]I love how this thread has turned from a discussion of prisoner's rights to one of economic theory. :rolleyes:[/QUOTE] theres no theory here, have you ever been able to afford a full tank of gas? i havent this week, or the last one, or the one before that

[QUOTE=Zeke129;26830914]The United States is a fairly small supplier of oil, you just have lots of refineries. Most of your raw crude comes from elsewhere, does it not?[/QUOTE] Doesn't it come from Canada?

[QUOTE=Billiam;26870273]Doesn't it come from Canada?[/QUOTE] canada is the top exporter of crude oil to the US :smug:

isnt canada that place that clubs baby seals

[QUOTE=POLOPOZOZO;26801110]That's funny I never thought that forced labor without pay was a twisted definition of slavery.[/QUOTE] [quote][b]The Thirteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution officially abolished and continues to prohibit slavery and involuntary servitude, except as punishment for a crime.[/b] It was passed by the Senate on April 8, 1864, passed by the House on January 31, 1865, and adopted on December 6, 1865. It was then declared in the proclamation of Secretary of State William H. Seward on December 18. It was the first of the Reconstruction Amendments.[/quote] [editline]21st December 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=Fuhrer;26830589]Some of you also seem to think that prison is a place where bad people go to rot and suffer. That couldn't be further from the truth, prisons are places people go who break a set goverment implemented rules to reflect on their wrong doing and get to rehabilitated back into society. Once you get to know that fact you can see why prisoners, even murderers, need their rights and to be treated as equal members of society.[/QUOTE] This, but you don't get paid to be there. You are given food, a bed, and you get to do the chores. [editline]21st December 2010[/editline] Disregard, give me Clocks.

[QUOTE=Moose;26870999]isnt canada that place that clubs baby seals[/QUOTE] It's the aboriginal people in the far north who do that, because it is the only thing that can sustain their society up there. The seal hunt provides food and a source of income.

[QUOTE=Pr0vologne;26830514]Prisoners having a non-violent protest? There's something you don't hear everyday.[/QUOTE] Well, we'll be hearing of this something every day until it's resolved, so that's something, right?