Disgusting net event of the Month: Flash Game Makes Players Beat Up "Tropes vs. Women" Creator - Polidicks

[QUOTE=EpikEnvy2.0;36683985][sp]And, to me, this sounds like radical feminism.[/sp][/QUOTE] hahah no not really

[QUOTE=EpikEnvy2.0;36683985]No, I don't hate feminists or feminism, I hate the radical feminists who blow shit way out of proportion. And, to me, this sounds like radical feminism. If you think there's something wrong with how women are portrayed in games today, that's fine, but don't swindle 16+k out of people to change absolutely nothing about it. Now, if you'll pardon me, this thread has left a bad taste in my mouth.[/QUOTE] I don't think this is what you use spoilers for She didn't "swindle" anyone. She asked for money, she said [I]exactly[/I] what people would get (videos), and people gave her 25 times more than she asked for. Because they wanted to, and knew what they were getting. I'm not seeing the "swindling" here. If she had [I]tricked[/I] people about it, then yeah, you would have a point. But you don't. I don't think she needs 160k. I don't think she even needs 6k. But just because someone gets more money than they deserve doesn't mean that they tricked people. Oh no, a bad taste too bad them feminists got toothpaste banned

[QUOTE=EpikEnvy2.0;36683985]And, to me, this sounds like radical feminism.[/quote] making a bunch of videos about sexist tropes. SO RADICAL. if you want radical feminism, go read the SCUM manifesto [quote]don't swindle 16+k out of people to change absolutely nothing about it[/QUOTE] people volunteered their money knowing full well what it'd be used for. if they get "swindled" they have nobody but themselves to blame unless she actually runs off with the money (upon which, y'know, she'll be arrested)

[QUOTE=Dori;36683604]why are you posting if you don't care and have nothing worth reading to contribute[/QUOTE] because he's saying your argument isn't strong enough to make him see the problem

[QUOTE=AJisAwesome15;36682845]Because opinions can be wrong.[/QUOTE] Yes like nickelback is a good band, intelligent design is a legitimate science, global warming does not exist

[QUOTE=Last or First;36683889]But... is she [I]talking[/I] about Dead Space? Because I have a feeling that people made a bigger fuss about Duke Nukem than Dead Space for feminist issues. So I'm guessing she probably will too.[/QUOTE] But Duke Nukem is parody. Terrible parody, but parody nontheless.

[quote]"She claims to want gender equality in video games, but in reality, she just wants to use the fact that she was born with a vagina to get free money and sympathy from everyone who crosses her path."[/quote] Zing.

[QUOTE=EpikEnvy2.0;36683985][sp]No, I don't hate feminists or feminism, I hate the radical feminists who blow shit way out of proportion. And, to me, this sounds like radical feminism. If you think there's something wrong with how women are portrayed in games today, that's fine, but don't swindle 16+k out of people to change absolutely nothing about it. Now, if you'll pardon me, this thread has left a bad taste in my mouth.[/sp][/QUOTE] Can I ask why the fuck you're spoilering all of this? [editline]8th July 2012[/editline] are you ashamed of your own opinions?

[QUOTE=EpikEnvy2.0;36683985][sp]No, I don't hate feminists or feminism, I hate the radical feminists who blow shit way out of proportion. And, to me, this sounds like radical feminism. If you think there's something wrong with how women are portrayed in games today, that's fine, but don't swindle 16+k out of people to change absolutely nothing about it. Now, if you'll pardon me, this thread has left a bad taste in my mouth.[/sp][/QUOTE] Do you happen to have read forum rules? Because I can tell straight away that you haven't.

one thing that i gleaned from this series of presentations that's irrelevant to the guy who made the dumb flash game is the contradictory nature of this girl's feminist videos on video games i don't care if she made a lot of money to fund her video series, i care about the core argument a true feminist is supportive of complete sexual freedom of women, but this girl seems to be against that. she says that scantily-clad girls are oversexualized and that's wrong because it's like throwing meat to a hungry consumer base, but in all reality, a true feminist message would value the strong, independent nature of these women and their equally strong sexual identities maybe i'm mistaken, but i think that a lot of video game characters are pretty positive by feminist standards

[QUOTE=SystemGS;36686044]maybe i'm mistaken, but i think that a lot of video game characters are pretty positive by feminist standards[/QUOTE] Name a couple of "strong and independent" female characters that aren't a "dual-gender" character (Shepard, Hawke) or made by Valve (because we already know how awesome they are).

[QUOTE=SystemGS;36686044] a true feminist is supportive of complete sexual freedom of women[/QUOTE] you mean a true feminist supports a view-point you like

[QUOTE=Jack Trades;36686069]Name a couple of "strong and independent" female characters that aren't a "dual-gender" character (Shepard, Hawke) or made by Valve (because we already know how awesome they are).[/QUOTE] aerith from ff7, samus from metroid, faith from mirror's edge, jade from beyond good and evil

[QUOTE=Jack Trades;36686069]Name a couple of "strong and independent" female characters that aren't a "dual-gender" character (Shepard, Hawke) or made by Valve (because we already know how awesome they are).[/QUOTE] I don't think it really matters because even strong independent women just reinforce the stereotype by being the exception to the rule.

[QUOTE=thisispain;36686079]you mean a true feminist supports a view-point you like[/QUOTE] no, i mean a lot of feminists support the idea that sexual freedom is good for women look at the movement against slut shaming

I don't see why people are complaining about what other people do with THEIR money. She received 160k dollars from people that were willing to give her the money, to make a documentary about their OPINION. Yeah a lot of people probably don't like the idea. But start you're own fucking kick starter then.

[QUOTE=Jack Trades;36686069]Name a couple of "strong and independent" female characters that aren't a "dual-gender" character (Shepard, Hawke) or made by Valve (because we already know how awesome they are).[/QUOTE] Lara Croft, Samus.

[QUOTE=SystemGS;36686086]aerith from ff7, samus from metroid, faith from mirror's edge, jade from beyond good and evil[/QUOTE] I haven't played any Final Fantasy games beyond tactics so I can't really say anything about her. If you're talking about Samus from Other M then you're as wrong as you can be, but I assume that you aren't, in which case she didn't really have any personality at all beyond "bounty hunter girl". She was a "blank slate" character, like Link or Gordon Freeman. Jade is an exception from the rule. She is a strong female character, though frankly I'm not sure if Beyond Good & Evil would pass the Bechdel Test(look it up!) or not. I doubt that there are even a handful of games that would pass the Bechdel Test. [editline]9th July 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=Mr. Smartass;36686137]Lara Croft.[/QUOTE] Same deal as with Samus. In older games she didn't have much of a personality at all and in newer games they fucked with it all over the place. [editline]9th July 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=zakedodead;36686091]I don't think it really matters because even strong independent women just reinforce the stereotype by being the exception to the rule.[/QUOTE] That's actually correct, if you compare the amount of decent female characters with the amount of empty headed wank material, you'd get a miniscule ratio and the dozen or so decent female video game character won't change that fact.

[QUOTE=Mr. Smartass;36686137]Lara Croft[/QUOTE] over-sized cone breasts

[QUOTE=thisispain;36686170]over-sized cone breasts[/QUOTE] That was actually a mistake, look it up. And her physique doesn't matter, what's matters is that she was a strong, solo female main character.

[QUOTE=Mr. Smartass;36686230]That was actually a mistake, look it up.[/QUOTE] i know it was a mistake, but they decided that's the kind of character they wanted anyway. [QUOTE=Mr. Smartass;36686230]And her physique doesn't matter, what's matters is that she was a strong, solo female main character.[/QUOTE] i love tomb raider but you're really overplaying the character development here. the only thing that has changed or developed over games when it comes to lara croft has been her clothes and bust size.

is being physically attractive intrinsically sexist i mean for example, bayonetta is extremely oversexualized. absolutely everything about the character's appearance is in some way fetishistic. does that automatically make her a sexist stereotype, regardless of the fact that she's the mover and shaker in her story who gets shit done? i mean what made Other M sexist(and such a shitty fucking game) was that it was not only about how samus was weak and emotional, but that she was weak and emotional because of her femininity. by the same card, bayonetta is a character who's power comes from her sexuality, so to speak.

you could argue it's sexist if it's the redemptive or primary trait of a character. i mean reading up on bayonetta it's essentially a masturbatory aid. [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bayonetta#Development[/url] her having to do things and not being passive in the game is a direct result of the player playing her, not necessarily the character if you know what i mean.

[QUOTE=thisispain;36686378]you could argue it's sexist if it's the redemptive or primary trait of a character. i mean reading up on bayonetta it's essentially a masturbatory aid. [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bayonetta#Development[/url] her having to do things and not being passive in the game is a direct result of the player playing her, not necessarily the character if you know what i mean.[/QUOTE] You play Samus in Other M and she still didn't do anything. Video games do have plots and writers and stuff you know. I mean it's easy to not notice, but it's true. Someone has to sit down and write what happens in a story. Just being the main character isn't a sure fire way to not be useless in a video game. See, Bayonetta is a simple game. And as such the characters are simple. They took the defining trait for her character, sexuality, amped it to 11 and then ran with it. Design wise she has every single "sexy" trait that you can describe, to the point of absurdity. But does that make her character sexist? Is her drawing strength from sexuality any different from Kratos drawing strength from megahate? Or JRPG characters drawing strength from angst and depression?

So just because it's the main character, it doesn't count? I thought we were also talking about how few main characters are actually women - if we say that main characters don't count, we count out a lot of stuff.

From my perspective, sexuality is a dimension, just like any other emotion. Sexuality can be defining trait, a strength, or a weakness. Just as hate, love, depression, and all the other colors of the emotive rainbow can be. I do really hate the whole anti-sex vibes coming from general media. A woman can look and act like Kratos and still be sexist, and a woman can look like a sex robot from future Japan and still be a worthy character. Anything can be done well.

[QUOTE=Spooter;36679726][URL]http://www.shacknews.com/article/74683/dead-or-alive-5-collectors-edition-includes-bikinis-of-course[/URL] The fact that the headline of this article is just "well of course Team Ninja did that they're so kooky" instead of "Team Ninja again exemplify/amplify everything that's wrong with the video game industry's treatment of women" is literally a perfect example of how the games industry as a whole (including games "journalists") needs to have it's shit straightened out in dealing with Women and their portrayal.[URL="http://www.shacknews.com/article/74683/dead-or-alive-5-collectors-edition-includes-bikinis-of-course"] [/URL] However, no one, and I mean NO ONE needs $6,000 to make YouTube videos about video games. She doesn't need to play or own the games she's talking about. She's not reviewing them, and the direct gameplay styles of the games don't matter to this problem. The problem with portrayal of women lies almost solely in the visual and narrative realms, and you can watch and/or read about those problems and report your views on them accurately. She doesn't need production values to drive home a decisive point. She shouldn't have made this Kickstarter, not because of it's content, but simply because she doesn't need the money. She should totally go out and make a documentary about Women's portrayal in video games, but she is in no way entitled to $6,000 to do it.[/QUOTE] Good to see five people rating me dumb with no explanation as to why from a single one. I know I'm not entitled to have my ratings explained, but I'm just asking, why is what I said dumb?

[QUOTE=Spooter;36686578]Good to see five people rating me dumb with no explanation as to why from a single one. I know I'm not entitled to have my ratings explained, but I'm just asking, why is what I said dumb?[/QUOTE] Why do people like you like to count other peoples money? Let's say I give a hobo 30 bucks to buy some booze. Did he earn these money or as you said is he "entitled" to them? Maybe not. Is it your god damn business what I do with my money? Absolutely fucking not. A couple of thousands people thought that giving her money to do something was a good idea. Who the hell are you to decide what they do with their money?

[QUOTE=Spooter;36686578]Good to see five people rating me dumb with no explanation as to why from a single one. I know I'm not entitled to have my ratings explained, but I'm just asking, why is what I said dumb?[/QUOTE] because it doesn't matter whether or not she was entitled to the money she asked, and people gave. there's no deception here, unless you call every donation button on every artist website in the world a deception. maybe if she got the money from like a government grant or something you could be pissed, but this was all given willingly by other people Seriously, just drop that shit. It's a complete non sequitor argument that consists of you making arbitrary and uninformed judgements of worth. Even if you were right, you would gain nothing by proving so.

[QUOTE=Jack Trades;36686603]Why do people like you like to count other peoples money? If I gave a hobo 30 bucks to buy some booze, did he earn these money or as you said is he "entitled" to them? Maybe not. Is it your god damn business what I do with my money? Absolutely fucking not.[/QUOTE] I wasn't judging the people who donated to her, though I disagree with their choice. I'm saying she shouldn't have asked for the money in the first place. [QUOTE=Mr. Scorpio;36686614]because it doesn't matter whether or not she was entitled to the money she asked, and people gave. there's no deception here, unless you call every donation button on every artist website in the world a deception. maybe if she got the money from like a government grant or something you could be pissed, but this was all given willingly by other people Seriously, just drop that shit. It's a complete non sequitor argument that consists of you making arbitrary and uninformed judgements of worth. Even if you were right, you would gain nothing by proving so.[/QUOTE] I never claimed she deceived people. I'm saying she shouldn't have asked because she is a well off white woman with an existing web show and an existing donation based website who could have easily made the videos without an extra cent on Kickstarter. And I'm not trying to "gain" anything. I was stating my view as stated above, and now you two have explained why you think it's dumb. Thank you for that.