SETI has the results for the survey of star KIC 8462852, and they found... - Polidicks

[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;49065862]Okay but nothing you said actually has anything to do with, See, all you did was give some rhetoric without even addressing the actual question DiBBs27 raised, you simply didn't answer it at all. Let's run with what you said, let's assume that religion is just self-hypnosis or whatever. I don't have my fedora so forgive me, but how does that actively make religious belief and the existence of alien species incompatible? Why does there need to be one or the other anyway? I mean I don't prescribe to the idea of "IT IS EITHER RELIGION OR IT'S SCIENCE, PICK ONE" because I'm not insane, but I am curious about the line of thought that gets people to that point.[/QUOTE] 2Joints brought it up. Ask him. What I am saying they are not compatible. He implied God is to be found in matter. It is not. Its all in your head. Most people search for god in the material world through materialistic means so they can have an objective proof of an after life of a certain religion, thus an objective morality or least a reason to lord over people. No, its not that. It just talking to your monkey mind in its own irrational language to work with the rational mind and cease causing trouble for you. Thats it.

[QUOTE=DiBBs27;49063564] Maybe everybody thinks we are a bunch of assholes. [/QUOTE] It wouldn't surprise me if we're basically the galaxy's Somalia and nobody wants anything to do with us because of that.

[QUOTE=Passing;49064328]I've always been more interested in this. [t]http://i.space.com/images/i/000/018/772/i02/wow-signal.jpg?1340655163[/t][/QUOTE] I swear I heard somewhere that the wow signal came from roughly the same direction? Like within the same region or something, I dunno the exact linguo

[QUOTE=CrumbleShake;49069754]I swear I heard somewhere that the wow signal came from roughly the same direction? Like within the same region or something, I dunno the exact linguo[/QUOTE] I haven't heard anything about that, however its an interesting theory as i think the signal stopped shortly after it was discovered.

[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;49068188]Okay, but you're assuming that they need their own alien Jesus to begin with. Going by Christian theology, if Christ died on the cross for nondescript sins that God had felt the puny mortals were committing all the time then the lamb's sacrifice (God's son being the lamb) would put [I]all[/I] those to rest. In fact if there were an alien delegation that went to the pope [I]right now[/I] and asked where they stood and where their ancestors stood, they'd likely fall under the same rules as prehistoric man because Judaism (and by extension Christianity) did not ever spread there. Then there's the issue of monotheism in extraterrestrial cultures, if they had a religion and it had a singular deity that coincided with Christian belief I'm pretty sure nearly all Christians would recognize that as God's presence. Also going back to the subject of Jesus, if there's a martyr figure in this hypothetical religion it would pretty be seen as irrefutable proof of a Judeo-Christian deity existing. So how does his comments raise questions exactly? I'm certain an actual practicing Christian could probably do it better, but I think I answered what you pulled from that pretty well.[/QUOTE] Knowing about and believing in his sacrifice is kind of an important part of that whole salvation thing. Also it's kinda implied this whole humanity thing is God's first mortal-making experiment, and even if it weren't, one would think he would have gotten the hang of it by now. Not that I don't think the major religions can't just recon and reinterpret just like they've been doing for hundreds or thousands of years, no matter how little it resembles the original beliefs.

[QUOTE=CrumbleShake;49069754]I swear I heard somewhere that the wow signal came from roughly the same direction? Like within the same region or something, I dunno the exact linguo[/QUOTE] Nah, they're pretty far apart from each other.

[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;49068188]Okay, but you're assuming that they need their own alien Jesus to begin with. Going by Christian theology, if Christ died on the cross for nondescript sins that God had felt the puny mortals were committing all the time then the lamb's sacrifice (God's son being the lamb) would put [I]all[/I] those to rest. In fact if there were an alien delegation that went to the pope [I]right now[/I] and asked where they stood and where their ancestors stood, they'd likely fall under the same rules as prehistoric man because Judaism (and by extension Christianity) did not ever spread there. Then there's the issue of monotheism in extraterrestrial cultures, if they had a religion and it had a singular deity that coincided with Christian belief I'm pretty sure nearly all Christians would recognize that as God's presence. Also going back to the subject of Jesus, if there's a martyr figure in this hypothetical religion it would pretty be seen as irrefutable proof of a Judeo-Christian deity existing. So how does his comments raise questions exactly? I'm certain an actual practicing Christian could probably do it better, but I think I answered what you pulled from that pretty well.[/QUOTE] [t]http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/en.futurama/images/6/6b/SpacePope.png/revision/latest?cb=20071229224536[/t] but seriously, if aliens wanted to join the catholic church, that'd make for one hell of an interesting re-interpritation of the role of man in the bible

[QUOTE=JohhnyCarson;49069641]2Joints brought it up. Ask him. What I am saying they are not compatible. He implied God is to be found in matter. It is not. Its all in your head. Most people search for god in the material world through materialistic means so they can have an objective proof of an after life of a certain religion, thus an objective morality or least a reason to lord over people. No, its not that. It just talking to your monkey mind in its own irrational language to work with the rational mind and cease causing trouble for you. Thats it.[/QUOTE]Sounds like a bunch of sanctimonious bullshit to me that essentially boils down to, "it doesn't work because I say so." Sure, I'll give you that faith is belief in something without evidence but you are asserting indirectly (barely) that there is evidence that God/gods/goddesses/stuff doesn't exist at all by saying "it's all in your head." How the fuck do you know? This is why I cannot stand staunch atheists because at the end of the day even the most stubborn bible thumper will concede that no, there isn't any physical, scientific proof of God; while the most stubborn atheist acts like he has irrefutable proof. See, that's what really burns my ass about this whole thing because religious people are thoroughly predictable and don't hide their beliefs no matter how delusional they are. Atheists like you are perpetually threatened by the fact that people [I]believe in shit[/I] and you just have to set them straight, they're on the wrong path, the wrong thing is in their heart damn it! From my perspective you aren't any different than somebody who preaches on the street or goes door to door pitching their religion. So let's pick that apart a bit, let's cut up your zealous nature and analyze it. Firstly you're asserting that it's the monkey mind (woah shit, watch out with that scathing wit! You could take somebody's eye out with that) that's talking with your rational mind.. and it ceases causing trouble? I don't fully understand what you're saying because I haven't dropped fifty tabs of acid, but I think you're trying to say that there's a subconscious need for divinity to fill in the gaps of reality that don't quite make sense. Well, if that's the case then you should really visit a mental health professional [I]because your brain is broken to shit with it's atheism.[/I] Hey, your words not mine buddy! Secondly how can you even say any theist is absolutely and completely wrong when you likely don't even know the difference between different scholarly positions on divinity anyway? You're essentially the guy saying we can't land on the moon because the earth is flat, you're arguing from a position of ignorance about things you know nothing about and worse you refuse to study them. I have a fierce, intense dislike of Islam but I know [I]a lot[/I] about the Islamic faith and I have studied (and continue to study) the Qur'an precisely because I am opposed to it. So example aside, do you even know the difference between [I]theism[/I] and [I]deism[/I] anyway? Let's run with Christianity since that seems to be the de-facto religious example everyone's using. Christians believe that God does things directly and makes things happen and generally plans everything out, cool, pretty common idea that's simple to understand. Deism approaches it from a different angle, there is (was?) a "God" who created all the everythings but doesn't actually [I]do[/I] anything in the created universe. So far we really haven't encountered anything to clash with the existence of "science" as some vague entity that's often pitted against religion in the court of public opinion but whatever. Finally comes [I]atheism[/I] which is the lack of belief due to lack of proof, and thus we have come full circle and back to why you piss me off. Lack of proof is not the same as disproof, and so until you have some sort of way to actively [I]disprove[/I] the existence of divinity then science and religion will forever remain compatible. I'm sure this deeply upsets your little turbo-atheist heart, but frankly I don't give a fuck. [QUOTE=Mingebox;49070319]Knowing about and believing in his sacrifice is kind of an important part of that whole salvation thing. Also it's kinda implied this whole humanity thing is God's first mortal-making experiment, and even if it weren't, one would think he would have gotten the hang of it by now. Not that I don't think the major religions can't just recon and reinterpret just like they've been doing for hundreds or thousands of years, no matter how little it resembles the original beliefs.[/QUOTE]Not necessarily, the existence of Christ as an entity only requires that you (as a mortal person with a soul) accept Him as your personal savior and depending on the interpretations (read: all but the most fringe and crazy) you can even do this while you are suffering eternal damnation in Hell. Truly accepting Jesus into your heart means your sins are absolved and you have a place in God's kingdom, i.e. the afterlife with the angels and shit. All that would really have to be answered is "do aliens have souls?" If the answer is "ayy lmao yes" then they're good to go. Of course this is just "Christianity" in general, there's different interpretations and theological viewpoints that would need to be hashed out but mostly the general idea is if they got souls then they can get saved. [QUOTE=Sableye;49072675]but seriously, if aliens wanted to join the catholic church, that'd make for one hell of an interesting re-interpritation of the role of man in the bible[/QUOTE]Space pope aside, I did have a long, long discussion with a pretty well-known pastor (I will not name him) about this very thing and we sort of came down to the idea that the Bible as a document was written by men with humans as the sole audience and no knowledge of alien creatures of any kind. So, with that said, the role of "man" and "woman" in the bible is an ambiguous one, he (and I) felt that if aliens did convert to Christianity they could infer every reference to humans with an extension to themselves. I was curious about what a prominent Christian "authority" or whatever thought about it, meanwhile everyone else within earshot was had this look like they were thinking, "what in the fuck is this liberal bullshit this is a CHURCH."

[quote]Not necessarily, the existence of Christ as an entity only requires that you (as a mortal person with a soul) accept Him as your personal savior and depending on the interpretations (read: all but the most fringe and crazy) you can even do this while you are suffering eternal damnation in Hell.[/quote] This is just plain incorrect. The vast majority of Evangelicals, at least American Evangelicals, believe that once you're in Hell, it's too late. That's what makes Evangelism so important (in their belief).

[QUOTE=Helix Snake;49073669]This is just plain incorrect. The vast majority of Evangelicals, at least American Evangelicals, believe that once you're in Hell, it's too late. That's what makes Evangelism so important (in their belief).[/QUOTE]Honestly I consider Evangelicals to be on the crazy fringe, but hey, that's subjective anyway. My statement isn't incorrect though, (aside from the salvation from hell part which is, again, completely dependent on the sect/branch of Christianity in question) the little bit of clarification I added should have made it perfectly clear that not [I]all[/I] varieties of Christian faith believe the same thing which I did address specifically in the next sentence.

[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;49073713]Honestly I consider evangelicals to be on the crazy fringe, but hey, that's subjective anyway. My statement isn't incorrect though aside from the salvation from hell part, the little bit of clarification I added should have made it perfectly clear that not [I]all[/I] varieties of Christian faith believe the same thing which I did address specifically in the next sentence.[/QUOTE] Evangelicals make up like more than half of the Christians in America. "Fringe" implies a very small minority.

[QUOTE=Helix Snake;49073720]Evangelicals make up like more than half of the Christians in America. "Fringe" implies a very small minority.[/QUOTE]Stop this silly shit. [url]http://www.pewforum.org/uploadedFiles/Topics/Religious_Affiliation/Christian/Christianity-fullreport-web.pdf[/url] [url]http://www.operationworld.org/north-america[/url] A whopping thirteen percent of all Christians total are Evangelical and less than a third in the US are Evangelicals. Sorry buddy but that is a fucking fringe, and you're just nitpicking my posts at this point. [editline]7th November 2015[/editline] Also, why are we limiting our discussion just to the US anyway when the original subject was about [U]aliens[/U] from [U]outer[/U] [U]fucking[/U] [U]space[/U] being able to be Christians. This is so fucking far beyond one singular country it isn't funny.

[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;49073581]Sounds like a bunch of sanctimonious bullshit to me that essentially boils down to, "it doesn't work because I say so." Sure, I'll give you that faith is belief in something without evidence but you are asserting indirectly (barely) that there is evidence that God/gods/goddesses/stuff doesn't exist at all by saying "it's all in your head." How the fuck do you know? This is why I cannot stand staunch atheists because at the end of the day even the most stubborn bible thumper will concede that no, there isn't any physical, scientific proof of God; while the most stubborn atheist acts like he has irrefutable proof. See, that's what really burns my ass about this whole thing because religious people are thoroughly predictable and don't hide their beliefs no matter how delusional they are. Atheists like you are perpetually threatened by the fact that people [I]believe in shit[/I] and you just have to set them straight, they're on the wrong path, the wrong thing is in their heart damn it! From my perspective you aren't any different than somebody who preaches on the street or goes door to door pitching their religion. So let's pick that apart a bit, let's cut up your zealous nature and analyze it. Firstly you're asserting that it's the monkey mind (woah shit, watch out with that scathing wit! You could take somebody's eye out with that) that's talking with your rational mind.. and it ceases causing trouble? I don't fully understand what you're saying because I haven't dropped fifty tabs of acid, but I think you're trying to say that there's a subconscious need for divinity to fill in the gaps of reality that don't quite make sense. Well, if that's the case then you should really visit a mental health professional [I]because your brain is broken to shit with it's atheism.[/I] Hey, your words not mine buddy! Secondly how can you even say any theist is absolutely and completely wrong when you likely don't even know the difference between different scholarly positions on divinity anyway? You're essentially the guy saying we can't land on the moon because the earth is flat, you're arguing from a position of ignorance about things you know nothing about and worse you refuse to study them. I have a fierce, intense dislike of Islam but I know [I]a lot[/I] about the Islamic faith and I have studied (and continue to study) the Qur'an precisely because I am opposed to it. So example aside, do you even know the difference between [I]theism[/I] and [I]deism[/I] anyway? Let's run with Christianity since that seems to be the de-facto religious example everyone's using. Christians believe that God does things directly and makes things happen and generally plans everything out, cool, pretty common idea that's simple to understand. Deism approaches it from a different angle, there is (was?) a "God" who created all the everythings but doesn't actually [I]do[/I] anything in the created universe. So far we really haven't encountered anything to clash with the existence of "science" as some vague entity that's often pitted against religion in the court of public opinion but whatever. Finally comes [I]atheism[/I] which is the lack of belief due to lack of proof, and thus we have come full circle and back to why you piss me off. Lack of proof is not the same as disproof, and so until you have some sort of way to actively [I]disprove[/I] the existence of divinity then science and religion will forever remain compatible. I'm sure this deeply upsets your little turbo-atheist heart, but frankly I don't give a fuck. Not necessarily, the existence of Christ as an entity only requires that you (as a mortal person with a soul) accept Him as your personal savior and depending on the interpretations (read: all but the most fringe and crazy) you can even do this while you are suffering eternal damnation in Hell. Truly accepting Jesus into your heart means your sins are absolved and you have a place in God's kingdom, i.e. the afterlife with the angels and shit. All that would really have to be answered is "do aliens have souls?" If the answer is "ayy lmao yes" then they're good to go. Of course this is just "Christianity" in general, there's different interpretations and theological viewpoints that would need to be hashed out but mostly the general idea is if they got souls then they can get saved. Space pope aside, I did have a long, long discussion with a pretty well-known pastor (I will not name him) about this very thing and we sort of came down to the idea that the Bible as a document was written by men with humans as the sole audience and no knowledge of alien creatures of any kind. So, with that said, the role of "man" and "woman" in the bible is an ambiguous one, he (and I) felt that if aliens did convert to Christianity they could infer every reference to humans with an extension to themselves. I was curious about what a prominent Christian "authority" or whatever thought about it, meanwhile everyone else within earshot was had this look like they were thinking, "what in the fuck is this liberal bullshit this is a CHURCH."[/QUOTE] Alright, you are worthy of a response. First of all, the reason that any sort of person believes in a deity, is because they believe that there exists beings with a supernatural nature that are far superior to ourselves. Correct me if I'm wrong. That being said, people believe their deities are capable of doing things that human beings are completely incapable of doing. If you look in the Old Testament, then you will find plenty of evidence of Yahweh interacting with people's lives. This is not unusual for the time the book was written, the first instance of such a book appearing was sometime in the 2nd Millennium BC, long before the Greeks and Romans were capable of determining that, and I quote them: [QUOTE] Care should be taken where there are swamps in the neighborhood, because certain tiny creatures which cannot be seen by the eyes breed there. These float through the air and enter the body by the mouth and nose and cause serious disease.[/QUOTE] That being said, there exists a lot of evidence in the Bible that plagues and diseases were supernatural curses ascribed from God. [QUOTE]The blood shall be a sign for you, on the houses where you are. And when I see the blood, I will pass over you, and no plague will befall you to destroy you, when I strike the land of Egypt.[/QUOTE] The date itself is critical, because this means that this is also around the time that people believe that their deity, Yahweh. I don't even need to do the research to look up the exact date. Why does this matter? Because before this time, with the exception of the believers in Aten, the Sun God in Egypt, monotheism did not exist in a major sense. Partly for the reason that is the case is due to the fact that people have a tendency to believe that things they don't understand are controlled by something they don't fully understand. People didn't know what exactly the sun was - rather than believing that it's a gigantic ball of plasma millions of miles away that emits radiation that heats our planet and began its life due to the sheer size of it's mass that ignited due to the amount of mass causing enormous amounts of pressure and thus heat igniting the star, they believed that it was someone up there making light with magic or something. They didn't even have flush toilets or a concept of gravity, how the fuck are the ancient Egyptians going to conceive something like that? Thus, they did what everyone - just like people who believe that a star dimming is a massive space ship - do and attributed it to someone else consciously doing it. Why do people do that? Maybe caveman found their food missing in a cave and it was more selective to believe someone did it? Or something? Who the hell knows? But the fact of the matter is it's something that people do, ascribe reasons for things happening do to someone else. That's just the way we are, we see the wind blowing, we think that someone's exhaling. Now this monkey mind that we have that has plenty of evidence of being evolved, such as from the reason you get a flu shot every year, does this all the fucking time. It's supersitious bullshit. You hear a noise? Ghost. You hear leaves moving? Person? That's how it works. So what can you conclude from this? [B]The reason we believe in Gods, is because we don't know what the fuck is going on.[/B] Now that being said, here's some sacrilege: I'm going to jump to the point that Yahweh is no different that any other fucking God. No better than Allah (who contrary to popular belief, is actually an ancient Arabian God ascribed to identity of Yahweh), no different than Aten, no different than Cronus. Why? Because the reason that people believe in him is the same fucking reason they believe in any other god. They think something else is controlled by something they don't understand. And if you don't understand why this is the case, then reread this post again. You need to look past the bible bullshit and see the truth - that the reason people believe that God exists is because the same reason everyone believed that Moloch existed. [B]People believe someone controls something because they don't understand it.[/B] The only reason that anyone would believe no other god exists, is because of this: [QUOTE]Thus says the Lord, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the Lord of hosts: “I am the first and I am the last; besides me there is no god.[/QUOTE] But wait, there's more! It looks like the people who invented the God you believe so much in at one point believed in other gods as well! [QUOTE]Ascribe to Yahweh, [you] gods, ascribe to Yahweh glory and strength [Note: This is retconned in later releases like the King James Bible to be angels instead of Gods], sons of the Mighty[/QUOTE] That means that people back in that time believed that their supernatural deity was literally better than theirs. One can only imagine that they started to believe the other ones didn't exist because everything was attributable to Yahweh. Even better yet, the Assyrians believed that other gods existed, but that their god Ashur was superior if they managed to conquer and enslave other peoples - their god was mightier. Now I'm not about to suggest that a people who were persecuted by another ancient people adopted the beliefs of their conquerors because they won the wars - oh wait, that's exactly what happened. One can only surmise that at one point people believed that Yahweh was superior to other gods. Somehow they started to believe that Yaweh was the only god - why did this happen? Go figure it out. Now, let's go into the reason why you're a Deist. The reason people believe in a that reason and observation of the natural world are sufficient to determine the existence of a single creator of the universe, is probably because people believed he did a lot more than just create the fucking universe. Why is that? Well it's simple. The belief in a being that created the universe was passed down from generation from generation, from when [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Council_of_Nicaea"]the Roman Fucking Empire wrote the fucking New Testament[/URL], to when the Founding Fathers drafted the constitution, and so on. They still believed in a creator that built the universe, even though they started to realize that their book was contradictory. So they ascribed to Deism, where the believed that God was real, but the book just [I]might[/I] be wrong, which is what leads you here believing that someone in another higher dimension created the universe that we exist in today. So what does all that mean? [B]The reason you believe in God at all is because a bunch of Jews 2,000-3,000 years ago attributed things that happened to a God that controlled the universe.[/B] Now I don't need to tell you why people about to be gassed in 1942 called out to God to save the Chosen People during the Holocaust and he did jack shit to help them, but it's probably because there isn't someone controlling the universe and/or cares enough to stop the persecution of people willing to kill off the people that fucking invented him. But wait, then who created the universe? Maybe it was someone with magic heating the world in the sky? I guarantee you that when people find out why the fuck the Big Bang happened, or why anything exists at all, it's not because someone "made it". [B]It's more likely that you're attributing a perfectly natural fucking event like a star dimming thousands of light years away to someone controlling it. [/B] Now I hope you understand why I don't believe that God exists, it's not that I dropped 50 tabs of acid, it's[B] because I did the fucking research before I posted[/B].

Damn son big balls of plasma in space sure get people riled up

[QUOTE=Xystus234;49074063] Now I hope you understand why I don't believe that God exists, it's not that I dropped 50 tabs of acid, it's[B] because I did the fucking research before I posted[/B].[/QUOTE] I got a more simple, Russell's Teapot-ish reason for not believing in any god: sure, you might not be able to find any [I]proof [/I]there is no god, but the amount of other things you can't in any way disproof is countless and limited only by human imagination. Why is believing in God any more reasonable than any dead religion, UFO cult, imaginary friend, or orbiting teapot? So while the the existence of God might have no less proof for than it has against, I think it's irrational to even give it any more consideration than any other invisible, unfalsifiable entity you could conceivably imagine, much less develop any sort of philosophy or belief system around it.

[QUOTE=mecaguy03;49064951]I think that while we can speculate on the abilities of a hypothetical civilization, we should not assume that they can break the laws of physics as we know them. While it can be a possibility it is more likely that their technology obeys the same set of rules that we do. It is also more productive to speculate based on evidence.[/QUOTE] their technology will obey the same set of rules as we do, however we also cannot rule out the possibility that we don't know all the rules. 300 years ago, radio was unknown. as far as it concerned us, it did not exist. the idea of being able to communicate vast distances in an instant would be a magical idea, not grounded in any scientific reality, yet we now use it constantly. it does not seem unreasonable to me to keep an open mind that there may be forces out there we cannot detect yet, and thus cannot understand. we do not know what and how much we do not know and we have to take that into account when discussing something like aliens. they very well could have a better understanding of the universe than us, could perform feats which are not possible according to our scientific understanding, purely because they've been knocking about longer than we have.

[QUOTE=DiBBs27;49063939]Why would it make the bible false? The bible says god created the universe, it doesn't say god created earth and we are alone in a black hole. Where is this logic?[/QUOTE] Actually it does indeed say God created the Earth. God creating the universe came later as we found out more about the universe.

[QUOTE=Fayez;49064041]Sure buddy, NASA would withhold one of the most important discoveries in the history of mankind because they're afraid of "crazies".[/QUOTE] Nasa? no. US govt? hell yes they would. something something religious rioting dumb rednecks bla bla

[QUOTE=Mingebox;49075239]I got a more simple, Russell's Teapot-ish reason for not believing in any god: sure, you might not be able to find any [I]proof [/I]there is no god, but the amount of other things you can't in any way disproof is countless and limited only by human imagination. Why is believing in God any more reasonable than any dead religion, UFO cult, imaginary friend, or orbiting teapot? So while the the existence of God might have no less proof for than it has against, I think it's irrational to even give it any more consideration than any other invisible, unfalsifiable entity you could conceivably imagine, much less develop any sort of philosophy or belief system around it.[/QUOTE] I think it should be given more consideration because of the simple fact that there's history to it. The Bible dates back a few thousand years and references things we cannot validate today. And for some reason it persisted all those years to become the largest religion in the world. My imaginary friend I thought up when I was 6 has absolutely to weight in comparison.

As much as I would love to find alien life when you realize how incredibly hard it is for a planet to host life and how many variables and disasters that can prevent it(even self destruction look at how close we came not 40 years ago). It is nothing short of a miracle that we have been able to come this far. trying to actually find it will be weird

I take it nobody here has heard of the Cosmic Trilogy? You know, the trilogy of science fiction books written by one of the most significant Christian theologians of the 20th century, whose whole premise is that aliens and the bible can coexist? Stop assuming that every religious person is like your redneck nextdoor neighbor who discounts the possibility of E.T. because "Herp derp, God create human special, jesus not die for alien's sins."

[QUOTE=CyclonatorZ;49077641]I take it nobody here has heard of the Cosmic Trilogy? You know, the trilogy of science fiction books written by one of the most significant Christian theologians of the 20th century, whose whole premise is that aliens and the bible can coexist? Stop assuming that every religious person is like your redneck nextdoor neighbor who discounts the possibility of E.T. because "Herp derp, God create human special, jesus not die for alien's sins."[/QUOTE] I don't know if you live in the southern United States, but you should probably give it a try to get a real good grasp on just how big of a majority that stereotype you're trying to defend is. It's not a joke really; what you're defending is a serious amount of absent-minded religious zealots that have [i]completely and utterly fucked[/i] scientific progress in first-world countries such as the United States.

[QUOTE]Now this monkey mind[/QUOTE] You might want to look up what monkey mind means in a non christian context. It is a term from Buddhism.

[QUOTE=Da Big Man;49077706]I don't know if you live in the southern United States, but you should probably give it a try to get a real good grasp on just how big of a majority that stereotype you're trying to defend is. It's not a joke really; what you're defending is a serious amount of absent-minded religious zealous that have [i]completely and utterly fucked[/i] scientific progress in first-world countries such as the United States.[/QUOTE] Funny you should mention that, because I did in fact move to the south about six years ago, and most of the religious people I know personally would argue that stereotype - the reason being that a large number of them are involved in scientific fields. At least one of them has worked at frickin' NASA. A number of them have been working on their master thesis since I got to know them.

[QUOTE=CyclonatorZ;49077865]Funny you should mention that, because I did in fact move to the south about six years ago, and most of the religious people I know personally would argue that stereotype - the reason being that a large number of them are involved in scientific fields. At least one of them has worked at frickin' NASA. A number of them have been working on their master thesis since I got to know them.[/QUOTE] Most of them are engineers or scientists?

[QUOTE=No_Excuses;49076560]I think it should be given more consideration because of the simple fact that there's history to it. The Bible dates back a few thousand years and references things we cannot validate today. And for some reason it persisted all those years to become the largest religion in the world. My imaginary friend I thought up when I was 6 has absolutely to weight in comparison.[/QUOTE] It's got history to it because the people who believed in it were good at killing or converting people who didn't. Of course, if you want to talk about history, there's indigenous creation myths that make Christianity look like a recent fad.

[QUOTE=Falubii;49077971]Most of them are engineers or scientists?[/QUOTE] I believe that is what I said, yes. There's a notable institute nearby, and somehow my core group of friends ended up being made up of people who studied there. I guess I just gravitate towards people like that - I know I definitely don't enjoy being around dimwits whose only references to the higher studies are that scientists are evil and evolution and climate change are lies from the devil. Regardless, my friends have definitely given me an appreciation of science that I didn't always have, mostly because I struggled with the subject when I was in high school. That they managed to accomplish this while also being very devout has challenged my perceptions about Christianity and religion in general - which is precisely why I posted in this thread in the first place. I don't deny there is plenty of stupidity down here - my comment about backwards redneck neighbors was from experience - but to be frank, I also encountered plenty of dumb up north, where I lived for almost twice as long.

If he doesn't post a reply I am changing my title to "Slayer of Idiots".

[QUOTE=CyclonatorZ;49077641]I take it nobody here has heard of the Cosmic Trilogy? You know, the trilogy of science fiction books written by one of the most significant Christian theologians of the 20th century, whose whole premise is that aliens and the bible can coexist? Stop assuming that every religious person is like your redneck nextdoor neighbor who discounts the possibility of E.T. because "Herp derp, God create human special, jesus not die for alien's sins."[/QUOTE] Yet the premise of the trilogy is still that human is a special snowflake planet because god decided to become human on it to save humanity. Also remember that Lewis argued, that as long as we're unclean, extraplanetary exploration will do us more harm than good. I wouldn't really cite him as someone's that's really good at reconciling fundamentalist christians and NASA

[QUOTE=Xystus234;49074063]Alright, you are worthy of a response.[/QUOTE]Wow, I feel so privileged. I'm going to just skip to the end if you don't mind though, [QUOTE=Xystus234;49074063]Now I hope you understand why I don't believe that God exists, it's not that I dropped 50 tabs of acid, it's[B] because I did the fucking research before I posted[/B].[/QUOTE]Cool, you did research. Thing is though, this is [I]your[/I] belief, or rather lack of one, so thanks for the clarification of why you're an atheist but it really has [u]nothing[/u] to do with [I]that other guy.[/I] What he asserted was religious belief was incompatible with believing in science, so let me just make this completely fucking simple so you can't fuck this up again: religion and science are independent of each other, they are apples and oranges. [B]Science is [u]not[/u] a religion.[/B]