Barack Obama vows to pursue gun measures in wake of latest massacre - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Kopimi;36940357]so why did that big spike in homicides go down within a year? were guns made legal again?[/QUOTE] There are fluctuations, the trend is fairly obvious however.

i think its funny when people confuse assault rifle (a legit term used to describe a certain class of weapons) with assault weapon (a bullshit term used to make uninformed people scared) and think people can easily buy assault rifles in the usa. hint: a semi-auto ar-15 is not the same as a burst-fire or full-auto M4.

[QUOTE=Lachz0r;36940351]if someones gonna go shoot up a movie theater odds are you're not getting him as a return customer anyway, and you're gonna have a way larger chance of getting in shit yourself[/QUOTE] Someone selling guns illegally is not going to go to law enforcement to tell them that they sold a gun, illegally.

[QUOTE=dogmachines;36940346]You mean people convicted of a crime using an illegal weapon doesn't show that people commit crimes with illegal weapons? If there isn't a conviction no shit there's no data.[/QUOTE] Cartels are multi-faceted businesses, they launder money, traffic and sell drugs, procure and sell illegal weapons and many other activities. If drugs were legalized, they would merely use their connections to get a cut of the legal selling of it, it would be a hit, but it would not stop them.

[QUOTE=Jo The Shmo;36940361]ugh ive seen this before this includes a lot of different scenarios such as someone legally purchasing a gun to give it to someone else, or someone using a relatives gun that they arent licensed to use, and a lot of other situations that gun control actually [i]would[/i] help with[/QUOTE] So make it illegal to buy a gun without going through a licensed dealer, don't ban the things.

[QUOTE=dogmachines;36940346]You mean people convicted of a crime using an illegal weapon doesn't show that people commit crimes with illegal weapons? If there isn't a conviction no shit there's no data.[/QUOTE] not all crimes are prosecuted and the study doesn't reflect whether crimes were actually committed with the gun, only that inmates possessed a gun. you should be able to come up with a statistic showing that violent crimes are more often than not committed with an illegal weapon, not that inmates are likely to possess an illegal weapon.

[QUOTE=Trooper0315;36940327]Okay all you people can go on about your shitstorm, but for how many years before this were we perfectly fine? 5? 10? 15 years? And all the sudden, this one psychopath comes along and does this, now everyone wants to put down heavier restrictions then there already are when things were perfectly fine before this.[/QUOTE] nope i really dont think theres a good way to stop psychopaths like this, im talking about your average gun owner however, ive always been opposed to gun laws, and i think guns should be much more heavily regulated

[QUOTE=dogmachines;36940362]There are fluctuations, the trend is fairly obvious however.[/QUOTE] not really? it shows a 2 (?) year spike in homicides followed by an immediate decrease returning to the status quo. not a very compelling argument.

[QUOTE=Jo The Shmo;36940374]nope i really dont think theres a good way to stop psychopaths like this, im talking about your average gun owner[/QUOTE] So you don't care about the people who actually kill people you care about the people who don't? I reading that right?

[QUOTE=DarkMonkey;36939792]Better background checks, yes. Assault weapon bans, no. My two cents.[/QUOTE] In before I get an influx of dumb ratings, but seriously why do you need fully automatic assault weapons unless you're in the military or police force? I can understand having firearms for self defence, but something along the lines of a handgun, not a fully automatic rifle. And yes hunting as well, but really you don't need M4A1s to hunt wild animals. I know banning these wont stop criminals from getting their hands on these weapons, but it'd certainly make it a lot harder than just walking into a shop, buying one and going on a rampage--after getting a license of course I know it's not that simple. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

[QUOTE=Ziron;36940363]i think its funny when people confuse assault rifle (a legit term used to describe a certain class of weapons) with assault weapon (a bullshit term used to make uninformed people scared) and think people can easily buy assault rifles in the usa. hint: a semi-auto ar-15 is not the same as a burst-fire or full-auto M4.[/QUOTE] why don't you look it up? assault weapon isn't a bullshit term it's an umbrella term for certain kinds of weapons that have or can be modified in certain ways

[QUOTE=Khaos-23;36940398]In before I get an influx of dumb ratings, but seriously why do you need fully automatic assault weapons unless you're in the military or police force? I can understand having firearms for self defence, but something along the lines of a handgun, not a fully automatic rifle. I know banning these wont stop criminals from getting their hands on these weapons, but it'd certainly make it a lot harder than just walking into a shop, buying one and going on a rampage--after getting a license of course I know it's not that simple. Please correct me if I'm wrong.[/QUOTE] It's not a matter of need. It's a matter of you don't need me not to.

[QUOTE=Pig;36940364]Someone selling guns illegally is not going to go to law enforcement to tell them that they sold a gun, illegally.[/QUOTE] they are if they think they're gonna get in way more shit for causing a massacre like this. or they just wont sell the gun to a nutjob so they don't get more heat

[QUOTE=Khaos-23;36940398]In before I get an influx of dumb ratings, but seriously why do you need fully automatic assault weapons unless you're in the military or police force? I can understand having firearms for self defence, but something along the lines of a handgun, not a fully automatic rifle. I know banning these wont stop criminals from getting their hands on these weapons, but it'd certainly make it a lot harder than just walking into a shop, buying one and going on a rampage--after getting a license of course I know it's not that simple. Please correct me if I'm wrong.[/QUOTE] FULL AUTO WEAPONS ARE NOT BEING SOLD IN GUN STORES. seriously people, if you going to talk about how guns are bad, at least learn about them before you go off and spout shit that's based on a few counter-strike sessions.

Assault weapon does not mean automatic weapon, nor assault rifle. Assault weapon is a term used in politics and the media mostly for scares but, it just denotes weapons with features such as pistol grips, collapsible stocks, optics, detachable magazines, etc. An assault weapon is not a fully automatic weapon, fully automatic weapons are difficult to obtain in the US.

[QUOTE=DarkMonkey;36940394]So you don't care about the people who actually kill people you care about the people who don't? I reading that right?[/QUOTE] "hm.. how can i misinterpret this post as much as possible.." p sure it means we can't find a perfect solution to insane tradgedies but we can help curb everyday gun violence [QUOTE=DarkMonkey;36940410]It's not a matter of need. It's a matter of you don't need me not to.[/QUOTE] why can't i have an armed tank to drive around with? its not like i'm gonna hurt anyone with it

[QUOTE=DarkMonkey;36940394]So you don't care about the people who actually kill people you care about the people who don't? I reading that right?[/QUOTE] nope youre not reading it right i dont think theres much you can do about mass murdering sprees but i do want to decrease the number of domestic violence cases, homicides, suicides, etc that normal gun owners contribute to [quote] Having a gun facilitates suicide. According to a California study, suicide by handgun is the leading cause of death in the first year after people buy one. Many don’t wait that long. In the first week after the purchase of a handgun, the suicide rate among firearm purchasers was 57 times as high as the adjusted rate in the general population. More than 75 percent of guns used in suicide attempts and accidental injuries of people under 20 were stored in the home of the victim, a relative, or friend. Would all these people have committed suicide if a gun had not been easily available? Some would have, of course, but the easier (and faster) it is to kill one’s self, the more likely a person is to do it. [/quote] i can get other statistics about non-suicide violence if you want

[quote]why don't you look it up? assault weapon isn't a bullshit term it's an umbrella term for certain kinds of weapons that have or can be modified in certain ways [/quote] assault weapon is a completely political term designed to make weapons with certain "scary" features (like pistol grips) sound even more upsetting. nobody in gun cultures actually uses it as a term except to mock it as a political tool.

[QUOTE=Ziron;36940437]assault weapon is a completely political term designed to make weapons with certain "scary" features (like pistol grips) sound even more upsetting. nobody in gun cultures actually uses it as a term except to mock it as a political tool.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Pig;36940414]Assault weapon does not mean automatic weapon, nor assault rifle. Assault weapon is a term used in politics and the media mostly for scares but, it just denotes weapons with features such as pistol grips, collapsible stocks, optics, detachable magazines, etc. An assault weapon is not a fully automatic weapon, fully automatic weapons are difficult to obtain in the US.[/QUOTE] "assault weapon" denotes features that make it a more efficient killing machine and nothing more how does your collapsible stock/pistol grip help you with target shooting

[QUOTE=Kopimi;36940421]why can't i have an armed tank to drive around with? its not like i'm gonna hurt anyone with it[/QUOTE] Ah, the good 'ol slippery slope. Besides, they'd probably damage the roads.

[QUOTE=Jo The Shmo;36940374]nope i really dont think theres a good way to stop psychopaths like this, im talking about your average gun owner however, ive always been opposed to gun laws, and i think guns should be much more heavily regulated[/QUOTE] You're opposed to gun laws... but for gun regulation? How does that work exactly?

[QUOTE=DarkMonkey;36940442]Ah, the good 'ol slippery slope. Besides, they'd probably damage the roads.[/QUOTE] "guess ill just exit on a joke instead of responding to how stupid everything ive said in this thread is"

[QUOTE=Jo The Shmo;36940432]nope youre not reading it right i dont think theres much you can do about mass murdering sprees but i do want to decrease the number of domestic violence cases, homicides, suicides, etc that normal gun owners contribute to i can get other statistics about non-suicide violence if you want[/QUOTE] This is completely irrelevant, and it's probably the only piece of information you can find. Those people buying the guns are probably buying them to kill themselves, they're not buying the guns and then wanting to kill themselves because of it, I don't know if that's what you're implying but if you're not that just makes posting that even more senseless. Regardless, if those people couldn't buy those guns they would just kill themselves another way. Ban roofs because people can jump off them! The government shouldn't tell you that you have to live, if you want to die it's a choice you make, not one the government makes for you.

[QUOTE=Kopimi;36940421]why can't i have an armed tank to drive around with?[/QUOTE] That's a dumb question, you can, but they are ridiculously expensive. (and good look finding even empty shells to reload and use in it)

[QUOTE=Kopimi;36940441]"assault weapon" denotes features that make it a more efficient killing machine and nothing more how does your collapsible stock/pistol grip help you with target shooting[/QUOTE] How does it make it a more effective killing tool? Firing with a folded stock is less accurate, and pistol grip is purely ergonomic, and even then it makes little difference, if any. It just looks scary.

[QUOTE=Kopimi;36940441]"assault weapon" denotes features that make it a more efficient killing machine and nothing more how does your collapsible stock/pistol grip help you with target shooting[/QUOTE] hahaha are you kidding. collapsible stocks are handy for making a gun fit just right on your shoulder so the gun doesn't feel like shit when you're using it. that helps you aim at targets better since your arm isn't cramped all the time. pistol grips make it easier to hold the damn thing, making it easier to shoot targets.

[QUOTE=Ziron;36940465]hahaha are you kidding. collapsible stocks are handy for making a gun fit just right on your shoulder so the gun doesn't feel like shit when you're using it. that helps you aim at targets better since your arm isn't cramped all the time. pistol grips make it easier to hold the damn thing, making it easier to shoot targets.[/QUOTE] If you're going to argue about folding stocks at least claim it makes them easier to conceal

[QUOTE=Rastadogg5;36940446]You're opposed to gun laws... but for gun regulation? How does that work exactly?[/QUOTE] i worded it wrong, sue me

[QUOTE=DarkMonkey;36940472]If you're going to argue about folding stocks at least claim it makes them easier to conceal[/QUOTE] yeah dude good luck trying to conceal an ar-15 or ak with folding stocks in your jacket without people getting suspicious asap real life is not a movie.

[QUOTE=dogmachines;36940453]How does it make it a more effective killing tool? Firing with a folded stock is less accurate, and pistol grip is purely ergonomic, and even then it makes little difference, if any. It just looks scary.[/QUOTE] folding stocks are designed for better mobility and movement on the battlefield, hopping in and out of vehicles and being able to maneuver your weapon more easily. seems a bit useless if you're just shooting targets pistol grip is to "ergonomically" help you control your spray when you're firing rapidly, it's much easier to grip a vertical pipe than try to pull a gun back down after recoil while you're holding it's underside